Bernardougf
Member
Exactly
-
Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
Gaming will become more expensive (again)
- Thread starter Critical Hit
- Start date
dispensergoinup
Member
I can finally catch up to my backlog.
yurinka
Member
Nobody forced them, each gamedev studio is the one who pitch their own games they want to make.
Yes, the same one that due to big inflation, tariffs, costs increases and currency exchange had to increase prices to compensate it.
Which is the same that is breaking records this generation in almost every single metric.
Last edited:
demigod
Gold Member
Why do i need to explain something that is HYPOTHETICAL?
Critical Hit
Member
Fess
Member
Any1 still think Xbox Magnus will be $1200? Lol
Tobimacoss
Member
I never thought it would be $1200 to begin with. An RTX 5080 costs Nvidia something like $400 to manufacture, then it sells for $999. Huge profit margins.
$599 for S and $999 for X, just like the Xbox Ally handhelds, that is what I would guess as things stand, especially if tariffs get taken down.
Xbox PC with AT1 at $1500+.
keefged4
Member
Honestly, outside of Prime 4 in a couple of weeks I think i'm going to spend the next while doing the same. I have mountains and mountains of Steam games to go through. My 4070 will see me through for a long time methinks.
kiphalfton
Member
I always ask myself how those who influence product and/or services costs at these huge companies can play these stupid games, when ultimately it ends up also affecting them.
However, they're making way more than they should and it doesn't affect them anywhere close to the same extent it affects everybody else who isnt as fortunate.
yurinka
Member
I was talking about the Sony studios. And these two aren't owned by Sony
Last edited:
Critical Hit
Member
So you don't find it strange at all that suddenly all Sony's studios started making live service games when management wanted live service games? Ok.
yurinka
Member
This is only happened in your dreams. In the real world this didn't happen at all.
Sony announced back in 2021 that they were aiming to put GaaS titles of dozen IP in the market by (later removed that deadline because a handful were going to be released later) March 2026.
- Gran Turismo 7 already was under development, and their previous title GT Sport (released in 2017, so started years before) already was GaaS, and less focused in the SP side than GT7
- Helldivers 2 development started in 2016
- They started to work in Concord in 2018, and their devs before made GaaS like Destiny
- Guerrilla started to work in Horizon Online in 2018, but since the first Horizon they wanted to make it a multiplayer game. They continued making the mainline Horizon games, plus supporting and overviewing Horizon CoM, Lego Horizon and the Horizon mobile game
- Firewall Ultra was made by a non-Sony studio and was a sequel of a FPS VR MP game, released in 2018, when they started to work in the sequel. In current daysFPS MP means GaaS, so obviously Firewall Ultra was GaaS
- TLOU Online existed because ND wasn't going to have the MP mode of TLOU2 and ND decided in 2019 to branch it off to make it a standalone MP game (which in modern days means GaaS), in the same way that was also ND who decided to cancel it, and to focus in the other SP games they were also working on
- The studio head of Bend (not Hermen or Jim Ryan) decided to don't make Days Gone 2 after releasing the first one in 2019 and decided to make instead a "new IP that includes multiplayer and builds upon the open-world systems of Days Gone" after working with ND during a year or two on TLOU Online and the preproduction of a new Uncharted spinoff (ND and Bend support each other since the PS1 days, often between main projects)
- Deviation Games started early 2020 with a team that came from GaaS teams, mostly CoD and other shooters. It got cancelled and part of Deviation is now in a new Sony team (Dark Outlaw) making a game that apparently isn't GaaS
- Just before announcing the GaaS push they signed Fairgame$ with Haven, super successful people in GaaS games like Rainbow Six Siege, Star Wars Battlefront II and several top seller Ubisoft AAA games
- When they announced that GaaS thing in 2021 very likely were in talks to acquire Bungie, who already were known to be making Destiny 2 and Destiny Rising
- Bungie was also already making Marathon
- Bungie was also incubating Team LFG and their game
- MLB continued being MLB, already had MP and GaaS elements and just started to push them a bit more, in line with the other big sports games
- Marvel Tokon very likely was signed around 2021, but all Arc System Works fighting games released this and the previous generation are GaaS
- Convallaria is a non-Sony team and was announced two years ago as a China Hero Project
Firesprite's Twisted Metal was in super early stages, so pretty likely only just had a pitch that didn't get greenlighted and a couple prototypes. They released Horizon CoM and now are focusing on a SP horror narrative adventure.
Bluepoint is a support team that doesn't have and never had anybody in the roles of leading a game, and doesn't have and never had anybody in the GaaS specific areas. So they never have been leading any GoW game and even less a GoW GaaS game. If something, they could have been in a support role for a GoW GaaS title leaded by somebody else (probably was just an outsourced mobile game), apparently not SSM because they are busy in the next SP GoW set in a new mythology, Cory's new IP, the GoW non-gaming adaptation and other things.
Around 2020 Japan Studio was making mobile games, in 2021 Hermen cancelled the mobile games, fired the ones who did put them to make mobile games, restructured them giving XDEV Japan (for who other than Tokon and Convallaria signed Stellar Blade, Lost Soul Aside, Death Stranding 2 and Physint) their own office and tasked them to also publish non-Japanese Asian games and greenlighted Astro Bot to their internal development team.
Media Molecule made GaaS before like the LBP series and Dreams, but very likely the game they are working on may be a non-GaaS smaller title like Tearaway was.
TLDR: Since around the GaaS push announcement in 2021 they only bought Bungie, made MLB a bit more GaaS and signed Fairgame$, Tokon and Convallaria. Not a single Sony team was forced to make GaaS or started to make GaaS titles since then.
It's also worth mentioning that Hermen Hulst became head of PS Studios in November 2019 and Jim Ryan became CEO of SIE in April 2019. Meaning, most of these dozen+ GaaS weren't started by them (same with Dreams and Destruction All Stars, GaaS released just before announcing this push). They and the GaaS push came from before and they just continued it. Something normal because GaaS generating the majority of the game revenue isn't new, it's something that already was big in the previous generation so the previous bosses were the ones who realized that they had to grow to GaaS (and PC btw).
Last edited:
Sand Dan Glokta
Member
My friend Edward Kenway says otherwise.
Bernkastel
Ask me about my fanboy energy!
Sony is competing with Nintendo, why would they make a 599 $ handheld?
Kepler already said it would be 599 $. Why would Sony sell a 799 $ console and why would people buy it?
Another useless digital only underpowered machine. No reason people won't just buy a PS6.
Is the Series S only 20-30 % weaker than PS5?
You really inflated all Playstation console price predictions and undercut all Xbox console prices predictions.
Tobimacoss
Member
Nothing Sony can do will take away a Switch 2 purchase for Nintendo fans because 90% of the people buying Switches are for Nintendo games. Sony handheld is simply for already playstation users in the ecosystem who want a handheld.
That was Keplers guesses based on the situation at the time. He said Magnus could be $800-$900 too if subsidized.
Sony already sells a $749 console. PS6 Orion is not the entry point, they're doing a two SKU strategy like Series X|S. Totoki doesn't want to subsidize hardware either.
An Xbox S would be for the Xbox userbase. It serves a purpose. You think a 40 CU RDNA5 console is useless and underpowered but a 15 CU RDNA5 console is not? MLID said Sony wants to do a home variant of Canis handheld but without the screen and battery.
Series S is much weaker than the PS5. But a 40 CU Magnus S wouldn't be that much weaker than a 52 CU Orion.
I am guessing based on the number of CUs the proportionate power and price points of each console.
15 vs possible 40 vs 52 vs 68, price accordingly. Assuming they all do high clocks, especially the home consoles.
The reason why MS could do an S tier console is because that's their style, Magnus SOC can be paired up with any of the GPU dies, and they need 1440 profile builds for xCloud.
Bernkastel
Ask me about my fanboy energy!
And yet the PSP sold 80 million units. There is a lot of overlap between Playstation and Switch users. Many people own both.
Is your ass the source?
Canis won't play all PS6 games. Orion is the entry point of PS6. Kepler also said that Sony does not subsidize PS5 Pro. Funny that you are trying so hard to inflate PS6 price from what Kepler said (from 599 $ to 800 $) and undercut Magnus price (from 1200 $ to 800-900 $).
It would be like the Series S, heavily underpowered that no one paying 600 $ wants when they can just get the PS6 which is way more powerful.
Kepler has not said anything about a 40 CU Magnus S though.
Unknown Soldier
Member
TL;DR - This is a truly desperate option and you should just buy dual-channel memory kits
Tobimacoss
Member
Did you even read this thread? His post is quoted above.
A 40 CU RDNA5 console targeting 1440/120 wouldn't be underpowered.
Kepler stated he isn't sure regarding a S tier console but the way Magnus works, it IS possible.
Magnus is the CPU SOC with the media die and NPU included. It can be paired up with any of the RDNA5 GPU dies. Magnus AT2, the midrange die is the next Xbox Console. They could pair it up with AT3 for a 40-48 CU console.
On one hand you say there won't be games optimized for the Magnus hardware. But if that was the case, and MS didn't need to mandate specific Console SKU optimized for the hardware, then they could easily release multiple consoles at various price points. 24 CU for $500, 48 CU for $800, 68 CU for $1200.
So first you decide if it will have optimized games or not.
Bernkastel
Ask me about my fanboy energy!
So you pulled the 40 CU out of your ass?
I love it when people make up stuff about stuff they don't understand.
Yeah just like Series S was advertised for 1440/120 and Series X for 8K/120.
You are talking like Microsoft has amazing foresight.
Microsoft Originally Aimed For 200 Million Sales Of The Xbox One
In a new interview with Phil Spencer, he talks about how Microsoft had originally aimed for 200 million sales of the Xbox One.
www.forbes.com
Last edited:
Tobimacoss
Member
I love how you completely ignored the $800-900 number after shown proof.So you pulled the 40 CU out of your ass?
I love it when people make up stuff about stuff they don't understand.
Yeah just like Series S was advertised for 1440/120 and Series X for 8K/120.
You are talking like Microsoft has amazing foresight.
Ofcourse Microsoft thinks Magnus will sell and devs will optimize their games for it. But thats what Microsoft and the remaining die hard fans think.Microsoft Originally Aimed For 200 Million Sales Of The Xbox One
In a new interview with Phil Spencer, he talks about how Microsoft had originally aimed for 200 million sales of the Xbox One.
Magnus is a Chiplet design, the CPU SOC connected to AT2 GPU die using a bridge die.
They can pair Magnus with any of the 5 GPU GMDs.
Xbox and AMD: Advancing the Next Generation of Gaming Together - Xbox Wire
This week, Xbox announced it is actively building its next-generation lineup across console, handheld, PC, cloud, and accessories. Find out more inside.
news.xbox.com
"future first party Consoles" as in PLURAL.
"portfolio of devices" as in multiple devices from different form factors. Xbox PCs (includes Laptops), Xbox Consoles, Xbox Handhelds, Xbox Cloud. The 5 AMD RDNA5 GPU dies are for that portfolio of devices. Magnus is the just the CPU SOC.
So according to you, a 40-48 CU console would be underpowered but a 52 CU console won't be? Is that correct?
Will next gen have Xbox ecosystem versions of EA and Ubisoft games? Epic added FortNite to the Xbox PC store, will EA and Ubisoft do the same? Or will they have separate Console SKUs for the Xbox Ecosystem?
Either way, Magnus will have games optimized to its fixed spec, or they will have unified the Xbox ecosystem licensing. It works out fine either way for Xbox users.
EverydayBeast
ChatShitGPT Alpha 0.001
Bernkastel
Ask me about my fanboy energy!
I never denied the existence of underpowered Series S like useless system. Again where are you pulling the 48 CU from? You are just making up random numbers that didn't come from any reliable source. Microsoft thinks another Series S that costs like the PS6 will sell paired with a 1000-1200 $ machine. Third parties will seriously consider if they should optimize for Magnus.I love how you completely ignored the $800-900 number after shown proof.
Magnus is a Chiplet design, the CPU SOC connected to AT2 GPU die using a bridge die.
They can pair Magnus with any of the 5 GPU GMDs.
Xbox and AMD: Advancing the Next Generation of Gaming Together - Xbox Wire
This week, Xbox announced it is actively building its next-generation lineup across console, handheld, PC, cloud, and accessories. Find out more inside.
"future first party Consoles" as in PLURAL.
"portfolio of devices" as in multiple devices from different form factors. Xbox PCs (includes Laptops), Xbox Consoles, Xbox Handhelds, Xbox Cloud. The 5 AMD RDNA5 GPU dies are for that portfolio of devices. Magnus is the just the CPU SOC.
So according to you, a 40-48 CU console would be underpowered but a 52 CU console won't be? Is that correct?
Will next gen have Xbox ecosystem versions of EA and Ubisoft games? Epic added FortNite to the Xbox PC store, will EA and Ubisoft do the same? Or will they have separate Console SKUs for the Xbox Ecosystem?
Either way, Magnus will have games optimized to its fixed spec, or they will have unified the Xbox ecosystem licensing. It works out fine either way for Xbox users.
Tobimacoss
Member
It seems you missed all the leaks in August/September period.
Though this is speculation from ChipHell based on MLiD, this makes the most sense.
Even Kepler is not to sure about the CU being equal to WGPs.
There are 5 RDNA5 GPU GCDs
AT0 = 192 CUs
AT1 = 96 CUs
AT2 = 72 CUs
AT3 = 48 CUs
AT4 = 24 CUs
Every1 including Kepler suspects AT0 is for Xbox Cloud Gaming or general purpose Cloud. MS would likely partition that GPU similar to how Nvidia partitions Blackwell 5000 Enterprise GPU into one 5080 tier instance or two 4060 tier instances.
AT2 = that is the GPU die for what you know as Xbox Magnus, which is RTX 5080 tier according to K KeplerL2 . 70 CUs according to MLID, with 2 disabled. PS6 Orion is 54 CUs with 2 disabled, so 68 vs 52 CUs. PS6 Handheld Canis is 16 CUs.
AT3 can be 40-48 CUs, depending on how many they disable.
So what's likely to happen is:
AT0 = Xbox Cloud
AT1 = Xbox PC
AT2 = Xbox Console
AT3 = Xbox Laptops, and maybe possibly a S tier Console
AT4 = Xbox Handhelds
All these GPU GCDs are dual purpose, the top 3 are meant to be used for discrete graphics too.
AT0 = 6090 Tier Discrete
AT1 = 6080 Tier Discrete
AT2 = 6070 Tier Discrete
AT3 is Medusa Point Halo, AT4 is Medusa Point, for AMD APUs for Desktops, Mini PCs, Laptops, and Handhelds
So I will ask you again, a 40-48 CU console is underpowered yet a 52 CU PS6 Orion is not?
Critical Hit
Member
I'm not sure that most of these resources won't end up being used for 'Windows agents' and other trash chatbots.
simpatico
Gold Member
I think most everyone reading this is already locked into the hardware that will carry them the next decade. Anyone expecting a "next gen" in the next 2-3 years isn't paying attention. Sure, Sony might drop something called a PS6 to ask you guys for a small cash infusion, but how could it do anything a 5 Pro doesn't? The chips simply do not exist at a realistic price point. Plus, with Switch 2 and Steam Womb being spec'd how they are, the die is cast.
Bernkastel
Ask me about my fanboy energy!
That does not say anything about the Series S2 being 48 CU or even RDNA5.It seems you missed all the leaks in August/September period.
There are 5 RDNA5 GPU GCDs
AT0 = 192 CUs
AT1 = 96 CUs
AT2 = 72 CUs
AT3 = 48 CUs
AT4 = 24 CUs
Every1 including Kepler suspects AT0 is for Xbox Cloud Gaming or general purpose Cloud. MS would likely partition that GPU similar to how Nvidia partitions Blackwell 5000 Enterprise GPU into one 5080 tier instance or two 4060 tier instances.
AT2 = that is the GPU die for what you know as Xbox Magnus, which is RTX 5080 tier according to K KeplerL2 . 70 CUs according to MLID, with 2 disabled. PS6 Orion is 54 CUs with 2 disabled, so 68 vs 52 CUs. PS6 Handheld Canis is 16 CUs.
AT3 can be 40-48 CUs, depending on how many they disable.
So what's likely to happen is:
AT0 = Xbox Cloud
AT1 = Xbox PC
AT2 = Xbox Console
AT3 = Xbox Laptops, and maybe possibly a S tier Console
AT4 = Xbox Handhelds
All these GPU GCDs are dual purpose, the top 3 are meant to be used for discrete graphics too.
AT0 = 6090 Tier Discrete
AT1 = 6080 Tier Discrete
AT2 = 6070 Tier Discrete
AT3 is Medusa Point Halo, AT4 is Medusa Point, for AMD APUs for Desktops, Mini PCs, Laptops, and Handhelds
So I will ask you again, a 40-48 CU console is underpowered yet a 52 CU PS6 Orion is not?
diffusionx
Gold Member
There's also the fact that die shrinks aren't what they used to be, and what is there is so massively expensive (and sucked up by Apple) that it's impossible to put them in an affordable game hardware. The high end hardware we have is largely getting there by sucking up so much power and even that is reaching its limits. Intels chips are exploding because of it.
It used to be that you could basically double performance every year for free by just shrinking the die and putting more transistors in the saved space. It's not like that anymore.
Last edited:
ShadyAcshuns
Member
I still have that bundle.Gaming traditionally is expensive
veterangamerUK
Member
From the UK too and I'm sure food has gone up in price again each time I go out. Never though there'd be a day where joints of beef have security tags on as they cost so much now. Grabbing a takeaway has become a luxury too. Very bleak
IDKFA
I am Become Bilbo Baggins
Yep. Beef is one of those foods that have skyrocketed in price. So much so that, as you pointed out, beef now has security tags. Beef is now a luxury in my house hold and we're consuming mostly pork and chicken.
I'm worried about this budget. The gov are not stupid enough to raise income or NI tax, but the money needs to be raised from somewhere. There was a rumour that they wanted to change road tax so you're charged 20p per mile! A few days ago Transport secretary Heidi Alexander denied this, but you just know this idea has been floated about.
We're about to be squeezed some more, but the problem is people are already at breaking point. There isn't much more blood you can squeeze out of this stone.
veterangamerUK
Member
Same with our household regarding what meats we consume. Occasionally will go to the local carvery which has barely put its prices up, somehow, to have beef. Even fish is a crazy price now
Unknown Soldier
Member
If you are thinking of building, NOW is the time to get a GPU. Prices of GPU's are currently at or below MSRP but are also expected to rise in line with skyrocketing DDR memory costs in the next few months
Similarly, NOW is the time to buy a new SSD. Flash memory pricing is also going up, though not at the eye-watering speed and rate of DDR memory
DDR memory has already gone up a lot but if you are thinking of building, understand the price will not drop tomorrow or in a month. With CPU and motherboard pricing holding steady near yearly lows, right now is the best time to build a new PC if you're planning on it in the near future
I wasn't planning on replacing my 5800X3D so soon but the rising memory prices forced my hand and I was able to get some good BF deals: 9800X3D for $455 with a free AIO cooler from Newegg, an MSI X870E motherboard with a BF discount and a bundled $30 Steam gift card, and I'm looking at maybe picking up another 2 TB NVMe SSD while they are still (relatively) cheap. Fortunately I got in on a BF deal on 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL30 for $170 on Newegg and while that's nearly double what prices were just 2 months ago it's less than what they are selling for on the open market right now if you can even find some in stock
The 9800X3D deal is live right now at Newegg:
Last edited:
ResetEraVetVIP
Member
I think next gen consoles should come around 2028 to 2029 and the 6000 series should be 2027.