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George Lucas would have killed Luke in Ep VIII if he made the recent trilogy
- Thread starter Maxwell Jacob Friedman
- Start date
Dr Bass
Member
Why does this feel like a way to draw heat away from the sequel trilogy?
They make it sound similar to what Lucas intended but he was publicly pretty pissed at what they did with the movies, so I’m not buying it (in every sense of the word) at all. At least not in the way they seem to be framing it.
They make it sound similar to what Lucas intended but he was publicly pretty pissed at what they did with the movies, so I’m not buying it (in every sense of the word) at all. At least not in the way they seem to be framing it.
sol_bad
Member
Show me where he was publicly pissed?
All I remember him saying is that there are no new designs and that "everything is the same".
People today are acting like Lucas is a god unto Star Wars but if Lucas had made his own sequel trilogy the same people would just be ripping him a new arsehole anyway. All these so called "Star Wars fans" just constantly bringing hatred to the table is annoying. It's not a joy to discuss Star Wars because of all the negativity. The hatred towards Kennedy is unjust, people shit all over her when movies 8 and 9 are discussed but forget she exists when movie 7, Rogue One and Mandalorian are discussed.
LegendOfKage
Member
It's not who lives or dies, it's how they're treated as characters, and how they do or do not ring true to the original trilogy. That's all this has ever been about for me.
BigBooper
Member
They needed a change. Maybe the sequel trilogy would have been better if Lucas had made them, but it's not like the prequel trilogy were masterpieces.
It's been a long time to try to recapture that magic. Even movies that try hard to after such a long gap stumble, ie Doctor Sleep, Blade Runner 2049. IMO they are still better movies than most though.
It's been a long time to try to recapture that magic. Even movies that try hard to after such a long gap stumble, ie Doctor Sleep, Blade Runner 2049. IMO they are still better movies than most though.
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sol_bad
Member
This makes no sense. You are romanticising and imagining that the galaxy stayed at peace and everyone lived happy forever lives. Even looking at the expanded universe of old this isn't true. If someone like Obi-Wan Kenobi can become a dried up outcast on a desert planet doing absolutely nothing with his life I can't see why people find it so hard the same can happen to Luke.
Dr Bass
Member
Geez just go read the news about his reactions to the sequel movies. It’s not exactly secret info. He hates what they did with them along with most Star Wars fans. Why do you think the franchise is essentially dead?
I was a life long fan since I was very young and could even kinda ignore the prequels, but I don’t think you could hardly make worse Star Wars movies than the sequels if you set out to purposefully bury the series. Rogue one “movie 7” and the mandalorian are hardly good either btw. I’d categorize all of them between mediocre to terrible. There are simply no good characters or storylines in any of it.
Again just a little time spent searching on Lucas’ reaction to the new movies will bring up what you’re asking about.
#Phonepunk#
Banned
I thought we knew this years ago?
The idea of an aged Luke with a robot hand who the characters meet at the end of the movie is also a very old idea, from before the first Star Wars came out. It was in one of the early drafts.
It’s really funny that these guys had access to all of George’s old ideas and they still completely fucked it up in the worst possible way lol
The idea of an aged Luke with a robot hand who the characters meet at the end of the movie is also a very old idea, from before the first Star Wars came out. It was in one of the early drafts.
It’s really funny that these guys had access to all of George’s old ideas and they still completely fucked it up in the worst possible way lol
#Phonepunk#
Banned
I don’t know about pissed but he did not attend the premiere to the final movie. With how many billions he had invested in that property that speaks volumes. How hard would it have been to just put on a smile for a few hours?
Maxwell Jacob Friedman
leads to fear. Fear leads to xbox.
Because 1-3 were trash and disney tried to catch lightning in a bottle ala 4-6 and failed like georgeGeez just go read the news about his reactions to the sequel movies. It’s not exactly secret info. He hates what they did with them along with most Star Wars fans. Why do you think the franchise is essentially dead?
I was a life long fan since I was very young and could even kinda ignore the prequels, but I don’t think you could hardly make worse Star Wars movies than the sequels if you set out to purposefully bury the series. Rogue one “movie 7” and the mandalorian are hardly good either btw. I’d categorize all of them between mediocre to terrible. There are simply no good characters or storylines in any of it.
Again just a little time spent searching on Lucas’ reaction to the new movies will bring up what you’re asking about.
Maxwell Jacob Friedman
leads to fear. Fear leads to xbox.
To be fair he fucked up his own creation lonnnggggg before disney took over
Bolivar687
Banned
They want to pre-emptively stop you from thinking these movies would have been better if Lucas had just done them.
Because it's true.
Because it's true.
Dr Bass
Member
People were dying for new movies when 7 hit. It made almost a billion domestically.
Another point for my above post.
Lucas did not attend the episode 9 premiere. What do you think that says about his thoughts at that point?
None of this is worth discussing anyway so I’m out.
GoldenEye Samurai
Gold Member
Killing off Luke made me hate Star Wars. I still haven’t watched the last movie.
sol_bad
Member
Geez just go read the news about his reactions to the sequel movies. It’s not exactly secret info. He hates what they did with them along with most Star Wars fans. Why do you think the franchise is essentially dead?
I was a life long fan since I was very young and could even kinda ignore the prequels, but I don’t think you could hardly make worse Star Wars movies than the sequels if you set out to purposefully bury the series. Rogue one “movie 7” and the mandalorian are hardly good either btw. I’d categorize all of them between mediocre to terrible. There are simply no good characters or storylines in any of it.
Again just a little time spent searching on Lucas’ reaction to the new movies will bring up what you’re asking about.
Like I said, I mentioned what I remember him saying. Thank you for not providing anything to back up what you said.
If you think movie 7 and Mandalorian are "terrible to mediocre", I'm not sure how you could be a life long fan of the originals. Movie 4 is basic is feck, the hero needs to rescue to princess, absolutely nothing revolutionary on a story level, not even in the 70's. I can admit this about movie 4 and still love the film.
No one set out to bury the series.
Imagine an alternate reality where the prequel films released first and original films released second. What we have now would be the same if people whinged and whined about "what they did to Obi-Wan" and the other characters from the prequels.
HOW DARE THEY CHARACTER ASSASINATE OBI-WAN, HE WOULD NEVER JUST SIT THERE AND LET THE EMPIRE TAKE OVER.
WHAT THE FUCK HAVE THEY DONE TO YODA? HE SHOULD BE KICKING ARSE ALL WEEK LONG, NOW THEY TURNED HIM INTO A SHITTY SIDE JOKE CHARACTER IN A SWAMP.
WHAT BULLSHIT, WHY DOES ONLY LUKE GET POWERS AND LEIA DOESN'T, THEY ARE BOTH PADMES' CHILDREN!
STILL CAN'T BELIEVE THEY TURNED ANAKIN INTO A BAD GUY, DISRESPECTING HIS CHARACTER LIKE THAT, HE IS THE CHOSEN ONE.
Beyond ridiculous.
Futaleufu
Member
He publicly called Disney "white slavers"
#Phonepunk#
Banned
im sure he meant that well tho!
lol i see sol is resorting to mah luke strawmen already. time to put yet another SW thread on ignore?
lol i see sol is resorting to mah luke strawmen already. time to put yet another SW thread on ignore?
sol_bad
Member
Have you seen the whole clip or just those 20 seconds?
He has been on set for Mandalorian, why would he be there if he hates Disney and is pissed off? Chances are, at the time he probably regretted selling Star Wars. He probably fantasized that he would still have some sort of control
Futaleufu
Member
diffusionx
Gold Member
sol_bad
Member
I'm not spinning anything.
Why would he be on the set of Mandalorian if he was pissed off at Disney?
Lionel Richie
Member
Same here. It's not just that they killed him, it's the way it happened. He faded away in a rock and it never felt right, like I clearly remember thinking "what the fuck, he died?" and not out of sadness or surprise, but sheer confusion. They were going for something and it landed ridiculously far from where it was intended. I wasn't even mad, I was and still am perplexed at the poor execution.
-Arcadia-
Banned
Yep. Nobody cares that he died. They care that we were given a random old man on a rock with zero relation to Luke and zero likability, who then proceeded to die in the most awkward, meaningless way.
Compare to Force Awakens, where people really liked that movie, and felt Han had impact. I also doubt Lucas would have killed the original cast off one by one, never even giving them a chance to reunite.
Lionel Richie
Member
Lucas did some stupid shit and it felt like he was this close to naming bad guys as Sucky Fucky and the prequel trilogy was not great, but it wasn't this sterile piece of shit done only to punch money out of suckers. Of course Disney never thought about the reunion, they thought people would go starry eyes with great new characters like Finn and Oscar Isaac.
West Texas CEO
GAF's Nicest Lunch Thief and Nosiest Dildo Archeologist
man, how does Lucas maintain that hairline?
Outstanding.
Outstanding.
Evangelion Unit-01
Master Chief
I don't doubt that Lucas would have killed Luke as he did Obi-Wan but lets not pretend like his story outline resembled what JJ/Rian created. What is most offensive to me as a fan is the fact that they not only threw out Lucas' outline but proceeded to produce three movies that treated Luke poorly without having a complete story written.
Were the prequels (and ROTJ) a bit of a mess? Certainly. Lucas is full of great ideas but needs help editing them down and paring back what isn't important. There is a lot of good info out there on how Star Wars got saved by some pretty great editing. The story in prequels is really solid-clone army, civil war, secret marriage and child, father figure getting killed with a younger inexperienced Jedi as a mentor, crumbling republic replaced with dictatorship-fantastic. The execution not so much.
Were the prequels (and ROTJ) a bit of a mess? Certainly. Lucas is full of great ideas but needs help editing them down and paring back what isn't important. There is a lot of good info out there on how Star Wars got saved by some pretty great editing. The story in prequels is really solid-clone army, civil war, secret marriage and child, father figure getting killed with a younger inexperienced Jedi as a mentor, crumbling republic replaced with dictatorship-fantastic. The execution not so much.
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Stiflers Mom
Banned
Sorry, but the prequels were shit as well and Star Wars was already a dumpster fire.
I would have had no hopes for a Lucas led sequel trilogy and everybody who thinks that would have been something are deluding themselves.
I would have had no hopes for a Lucas led sequel trilogy and everybody who thinks that would have been something are deluding themselves.
bender
What time is it?
Star Wars was never good.
sol_bad
Member
Again, imagine if prequel movies released first. The same thing was done to Obi-Wan. What's the difference?
Stiflers Mom
Banned
Naah, it was amazing from 1977 to 1983.
And it was still cool after that with the EU, some computer games and the Tabletop RPG by WestEnd games.
With the release of Phantom Menace, the dream died.
ZehDon
Member
It all comes down to execution. A disturbed Luke Skywalker, haunted by the seemingly-unending cycle of Jedi and Sith, searching for a way to end it once and for all, is an interesting angle and immediately compelling. There were shades of this in The Sith Lords, and it was fucking brilliant. But a green-titty-milk drinking do-nothing Luke Skywalker? That's a terrible angle, and will be rightly mocked for all eternity. It's clear that this was just fundamentally not where the story was intended to go, and it killed any chance the Disney Trilogy had. Why leave a map if you didn't want to be found? It's painfully clear Luke was intended to have a purpose on that island; Johnson through it away so he could make his movie. And it killed the series, and damn near the entire brand, in the process.
-Arcadia-
Banned
Yes. Episode 4 Obi-Wan is known for his lack of likeability, lack of character cohesion, and death scene that didn’t emotionally move generations.
Are you some kind of bot that spits out false equivalences that take a second to debunk, to defend terrible movies?
DunDunDunpachi
Banned
Lucas didn't exactly have a firm hand on the rudder of the franchise anyway. He was openly mocked for years prior to the Disney takeover.
(2008)
(2008)
Dirk Benedict
Gold Member
sol_bad
Member
My example is not a false equivalence. It's the same scenario, spend 3 movies with a beloved character and then have them murdered and vanish in thin air unceremoniously in the 4th film.
Another thing stolen from the OT. It worked in ANH but didn’t in TLJ because of execution. There just wasn’t any build up and it felt confusing. At least we know with Obi-Wan that he fell heroically in battle, Luke just fizzled out after a Skype call because he wasn’t heroic enough to face Kylo in person. Very poorly done.
JimmyRustler
Member
IMO Mark Hamill himself had the best idea for Luke... and that is him falling for the Dark Side in the end. That would have been really cool.
Hudo
Gold Member
So much this. Disney's approach to this whole fiasco was to take a story and put it in a Star Wars setting. The new trilogy sucks because while it looks like Star Wars (most of the time) and sounds like Star Wars, it doesn't feel like Star Wars.
One can criticise (or even hate) the prequel trilogy for a lot of things but those movies felt like Star Wars (for me).
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sol_bad
Member
Not confusing in the original film? Fell heroically in battle?
After the low energy light saber fight he just stood there holding his light saber, Darth Vader swings at him and Obi-wan just vanishes before Vader can connect. Clothes fall to the ground in a heap. Even Darth Vader looked confused with the way he steps on the clothes. Obi-Wan doesn't die during the fight, it's after the fight while he stands there doing nothing.
D
Deleted member 1159
Unconfirmed Member
Here’s a secret to writing: it’s really frustrating to the audience to have everything that leads up to new developments seem to not matter. TFA starts off and...basically nothing that happened in RotJ matters anymore because the empire is back in charge with a new super weapon and a new big bad and somehow the good guys are the “resistance” again. It’s a complete retread. You could continue on a conflict with remnant forces or some other new evil and not have it be a carbon copy of the first trilogy, but they went the lazy route. In TLJ nothing seems to matter anymore because now we’ve got kamikaze light speed jumps and space gas considerations on top of the real big bad being weapons dealers? What? And in RoS nothing that came before matters because Palpatine never actually died and has this death cult?
It’s just insulting dreck. No payoffs from what came before, no original ideas, stupefyingly dumb choices...Daisy is hot tho
It’s just insulting dreck. No payoffs from what came before, no original ideas, stupefyingly dumb choices...Daisy is hot tho
I think you are looking too deeply into it. Obi-Wan could see that Luke had made it to the Falcon safely, and perhaps knew that Vader was going to utterly destroy him, so he smiled and let himself go. He just accepted his fate and his role in the story. It makes for a cool scene, adds to the lore and is a respectable end to the physical form of the character. I’ve never had an issue with that scene, it is used to illustrate the mystical side of the Force in action.
However after the prequels it doesn’t sit well that Vader wouldn’t know that Jedi vanish after they accept their death, he must have seen many of his brethren suffer the same fate during the Clone Wars. Revisionist storytelling once again.
Sorcerer
Member
I think its plausible that Vader being on the Dark side has no concept of Jedi Vanishing. That may not have applied to him. Evil destroys everything, eventually itself, because its a means to an end. Also the Emperor has an obsession with living forever (at least in the EU) so death is not something a Sith would embrace as as a Jedi might.
Obi-Wan knew his time was up, he clung on to life to see Luke to his destiny. As for Vader being confused about Obi-Wans vanishing, well Obi-Wan himself got the news from Qui-Gon much later after his passing. It was something new and not well know among Jedi I imagine, something that Qui-Gon figured out personally. I would say Vader was probably terrified about what the ramifications of what Obi-Wans vanishing would mean for him and the Empire in the long run.
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Balducci30
Member
How was he “colonel Kurtz-ish” in the sequel trilogy? Just the isolation? I feel like that could actually be awesome with him completely delusional about his powers
O.v.e.rlord
Banned
Fuck that movie, Luke would never give up, or try to kill his fucking nephew.
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