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[LectureMaster]

George R. R. Martin Isn't Sure He'll Ever Finish The Winds of Winter, 'but That's Still a Priority' - IGN

George R. R. Martin has acknowledged the possibility that he might never finish The Winds of Winter, but says it's "still a priority."

www.ign.com

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Fans of George R. R. Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire fantasy novels have long, long, long, awaited the planned sixth entry in the series, The Winds of Winter. But after more than a decade of delays, even Martin is acknowledging the possibility that it may never come to be.

Martin spoke about the book in a recent interview with THR, mostly focused on the four films he's self-financed based on the short stories of science-fiction writer Howard Waldrop. But, of course, the subject of The Winds of Winter — and how Martin is managing to balance that highly anticipated novel with his other pursuits — inevitably came up.

“Unfortunately, I am 13 years late,” he told the outlet. “Every time I say that, I’m [like], ‘How could I be 13 years late?’ I don’t know, it happens a day at a time.”


“But that’s still a priority," he continued. "A lot of people are already writing obituaries for me. [They’re saying] ‘Oh, he’ll never be finished.’ Maybe they’re right. I don’t know. I’m alive right now! I seem pretty vital!”

It's only the latest in what's been an increasingly bleak wait for The Winds of Winter, with the most recent entry in the series, A Dance With Dragons, publishing in 2011. That's the same year that HBO premiered the insanely popular TV series Game of Thrones, which is based on the A Song of Ice and Fire series and drew a lot more eyes to the world of Westeros.

Martin made the reveal in November 2023 that he's written 1,100 pages of The Winds of Winter, which wouldn't be so disappointing if it weren't the same number of pages he had written a year prior. Before that, in 2022, he said he was "about three-quarters of the way done," and that the book would likely be more than 1,500 pages.

"A lot of people are already writing obituaries for me. [They’re saying] ‘Oh, he’ll never be finished.’ Maybe they’re right."

“
Most recently, this past September, Martin admitted that he hadn't made as much progress as he would've liked to, as his various TV shows "ate up" much of his time. It's also worth mentioning that The Winds of Winter isn't even set to be the final book in A Song of Ice and Fire. A seventh novel, A Dream of Spring, was set to close out the series, although many fans have all but given up hope for that. (Note: The THR article calls The Winds of Winter the "sixth and final book" in the A Song of Ice and Fire series, but we're assuming that's just a mistake; Martin's never formally canceled A Dream of Spring publicly).

Still, in a glimmer of hope, Martin did note in the interview that he could never retire, as he's "not a golfer." So hey, there's that!

Even if we never get The Winds of Winter, there's plenty happening in Westeros on the TV side. House of the Dragon is still on track for four seasons, with the third expected to start production early next year. Another spinoff, A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms, is set to arrive sometime in late 2025, and there's even been early talk of a Game of Thrones movie.

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[rm082e]

I gave up on this dude before the HBO show was even out with Season 1...

Those first three books were amazing though.

 

[ADiTAR]

He will never finish it, and I don't understand why not just give it to someone else at this point.

 

[Drake]

He probably needs to blog more on how much he hates Trump. I'm sure that'll make him finish the Winds of Winter faster.

 

[Madflavor]

He should admit the situation. There'd be more dignity in it.

 

[diffusionx]

 

[EverydayBeast]

Writers know what they can or can’t do.

 

[V1LÆM]

He’s saying shit we knew 10 years ago

 

[Rentahamster]

I've already lost hope. It's been a good run.

 

[Pegasus Actual]

He probably needs to blog more on how much he hates Trump. I'm sure that'll make him finish the Winds of Winter faster.

A bit disappointed that his last politics post was pre-election.
"I could see Staten Island from the windows of our apartment in the projects. From the Hook on the northeast shore of Bayonne, however, you could see the skyscrapers of Manhattan, Ellis Island, and the Statue of Liberty.

I wonder, can you see the Statue from Trump Tower? Somehow I doubt it."

As for him not finishing the books... I really don't care anymore. He ruined his great franchise in a way I didn't understand was possible. Like, I can rewatch the original Star Wars movies and have a good time. I can always watch a classic Trek movie or episode and it's fine, despite how awful some of the new stuff has been. But just... stopping mid-story and starving a couple of hacks of the very necessary source material to stick the landing like that? No thanks to your spinoffs, no thanks to rewatching even the good seasons as I know they go nowhere.

These topics are good for a laugh tough.

 

[IDKFA]

There is still another book to come after Winds. George isn't finishing this series. He's been stringing along his fans for years and now needs to admit defeat. Just hand it over to another writer and let them finish.

Amazingly, he used to be able to crack out these books in two years. I remember his apologies for taking 5 years to write Feast. Then it was 6 years for Dance. We're now coming close to 14 years and not another book in site!

What the fuck happened? Was it the fame and the massive increase in money? Was it taking on a massive number of additional projects for HBO? Did he just lose the passion?

Either way, people deserve a real ending. Not that shit from the show, but an ending to the massive cliff hangers in the books that the show never addressed. If George can't do that then he needs to swallow his pride and hand it off to someone who can.

 

[diffusionx]

Im surprised he is still alive, quite frankly.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Fortunately the new Witcher book just came out and Sapkowski already said he is writing a next one.

 

[taizuke]

To those saying "give it to another writer" i'd say careful what you wish for, given the number of writers today gleefully ready to make things their "own".

 

[Soodanim]

That’s one serious case of writer’s block.

 

[Lunarorbit]

One of the biggest pieces of shit in the entertainment industry that hasn't diddled a kid.

Just go away you lazy fuck.

 

[DKehoe]

If George can't do that then he needs to swallow his pride and hand it off to someone who can.

Why would he need to do that? He has said before he doesn’t want someone else to finish the books if he can’t. They’re his books so if that’s how he wants it to be then it’s his call to make.

 

[IDKFA]

Why would he need to do that? He has said before he doesn’t want someone else to finish the books if he can’t. They’re his books so if that’s how he wants it to be then it’s his call to make.

Disagree. That would be a massive slap in the face to everyone who has invested time and money into this series.

While the specifics of Martin's contracts may vary, there's a general expectation that authors fulfill their commitments to publishers and readers. Why would anybody start a series that may not ever be finished?

Lets also talk about legacy. An unfinished series means publishers would need to stop selling the books. Also a failure to complete the series would negatively affect Martin's reputation.

He has a moral obligation to finish or ensure somebody does it for him.

 

[Jinzo Prime]

Either way, people deserve a real ending.

People don't deserve anything. He's the writer, it's his world, it's his words, he gets to do whatever the fuck he wants to with it.

I read the first three books and enjoyed them for what they are, but I know this asshole will never finish it, which is fine by me.

 

[DKehoe]

Disagree. That would be a massive slap in the face to everyone who has invested time and money into this series.

While the specifics of Martin's contracts may vary, there's a general expectation that authors fulfill their commitments to publishers and readers. Why would anybody start a series that may not ever be finished?

Lets also talk about legacy. An unfinished series means publishers would need to stop selling the books. Also a failure to complete the series would negatively affect Martin's reputation.

He has a moral obligation to finish or ensure somebody does it for him.

Whether or not it's a massive slap in the face to the readers is irrelevant. Some people wanting him to have someone else finish the series does not mean he needs to do so.

If that's the case with his publishing contract then that's up to the publisher to take action about it. It certainly doesn't look like they are looking to force that kind of issue. Martin saying he doesn't want someone else finishing the books would suggest that they can't make it happen.

Why would they need to stop selling them if the series isn't finished? People can still enjoy reading the books even if they don't get a proper conclusion. The series has sold millions of copies in numerous languages across the world. There's not some law that says they can't sell the books if the series is left unfinished. So there is no need to stop. The demand might not be there as much as it would for a finished series but there will probably still be people who want to read them for years to come.

In terms of legacy, maybe someone else would absolutely shit the bed while writing them. Could that not also affect the legacy? He's also allowed to not give a shit about his legacy even if it were to be impacted by it. A friend of his had their series finished by someone else after they died, so it's probably something he's considered a fair bit. He's entitled to say how his work should be handled. It doesn't become public property because a lot of people are fans of it.

He has said he doesn't want someone else writing the books in his place. It's his decision to make. He does not have a moral obligation to have someone else finish it if he's unable to. You can want him to have someone else finish it if he can't but he doesn't need to do that.

 

[BlackTron]

I watched the show only sporadically as family insisted and didn't start the books. I had a strong suspicion I was getting invested in something that wouldn't go anywhere. Sure enough everyone got suckered into paying HBO for a drip feed of episodes followed by a bad ending that killed the franchise.

I will start reading the books if it ever gets completed.

 

[DKehoe]

I watched the show only sporadically as family insisted and didn't start the books. I had a strong suspicion I was getting invested in something that wouldn't go anywhere. Sure enough everyone got suckered into paying HBO for a drip feed of episodes followed by a bad ending that killed the franchise.

I will start reading the books if it ever gets completed.

It didn't kill the franchise. There's a prequel show that's two seasons in with other spinoffs filming or in development right now.

 

[Mistake]

I bet if you made AI in his image, it still wouldn't finish it

 

[Tertullian]

"But that’s still a priority"

FFS George, if it were a priority you wouldn't be busy self-financing four films, you'd be writing the damn book.

I mean, it's annoying that he wasn't disciplined enough to keep the story and the number of POV characters under control, and so now he's not disciplined enough to finish the thing. But it would be less galling if he would stop lying to himself about it.

 

[IDKFA]

People don't deserve anything. He's the writer, it's his world, it's his words, he gets to do whatever the fuck he wants to with it.

I read the first three books and enjoyed them for what they are, but I know this asshole will never finish it, which is fine by me.

Whether or not it's a massive slap in the face to the readers is irrelevant. Some people wanting him to have someone else finish the series does not mean he needs to do so.

If that's the case with his publishing contract then that's up to the publisher to take action about it. It certainly doesn't look like they are looking to force that kind of issue. Martin saying he doesn't want someone else finishing the books would suggest that they can't make it happen.

Why would they need to stop selling them if the series isn't finished? People can still enjoy reading the books even if they don't get a proper conclusion. The series has sold millions of copies in numerous languages across the world. There's not some law that says they can't sell the books if the series is left unfinished. So there is no need to stop. The demand might not be there as much as it would for a finished series but there will probably still be people who want to read them for years to come.

In terms of legacy, maybe someone else would absolutely shit the bed while writing them. Could that not also affect the legacy? He's also allowed to not give a shit about his legacy even if it were to be impacted by it. A friend of his had their series finished by someone else after they died, so it's probably something he's considered a fair bit. He's entitled to say how his work should be handled. It doesn't become public property because a lot of people are fans of it.

He has said he doesn't want someone else writing the books in his place. It's his decision to make. He does not have a moral obligation to have someone else finish it if he's unable to. You can want him to have someone else finish it if he can't but he doesn't need to do that.

Let's not ride his dick too much.

Please. He's been stringing people along for years. It may be his creation, but he's got people to invest time and money into these books with a promise of an endin. Not a TV show, but a book ending. Bit of a dick move to get people to spend money on your work by promising an end, then turning around and saying "fuck you. I'm not obliged to give you anything, but thanks for the money"

And yeah, publishers could carry on selling ASOIAF, but they'd need to make it clear the series is unfinished. Who is really going to spend tens of hours reading a story that will have no conclusion?

Get real. He is morally obliged to give people an ending. We've made him rich, now he needs to follow through with his end of the deal.

 

[Trogdor1123]

How many years has it been? I always wonder what the exact issue is? Can’t he assemble a team of writers to help him? Loads of good fantasy writers out there that would love to help him.

 

[poppabk]

He meant it's a priority that he never finish it.

 

[jason10mm]

To those saying "give it to another writer" i'd say careful what you wish for, given the number of writers today gleefully ready to make things their "own".

Nah, there are PLENTY of writers out there that could do ASOIAF justice.

What GRRM really brings (or used to) is a keen screenwriters eye for cliffhangers and when to switch stories, a masterful touch for leaving juuuuust enough unsaid the reader can speculate, and a delightful bit of dialogue here and there. His actual plotting and stuff isn't particularly difficult. So another writer could easily flesh out his notes, or write with his input. Heck, those history books have been doing just that for years.

The S.A. Corey duo (the Expanse guys) are the most logical choice. They live near him, have worked with him for decades, and are solid writers in their own rights. They could easily put out stuff like the leaner first 3 books before the bloat set in.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

Give it to Jay Abercrombie

 

[Paltheos]

"But that’s still a priority"

FFS George, if it were a priority you wouldn't be busy self-financing four films, you'd be writing the damn book.

I mean, it's annoying that he wasn't disciplined enough to keep the story and the number of POV characters under control, and so now he's not disciplined enough to finish the thing. But it would be less galling if he would stop lying to himself about it.

Well, at least he's slowly pivoting to the truth we've all known for years. Somehow I doubt he'll ever admit it, but seeing any change in his statements about how he's not doing anything is... progress? Kind of? In a way.

 

[AJUMP23]

Maybe he will be a ghost writer.

He just needs to look up some French or English history and add a dragon and copy.

 

[DKehoe]

Let's not ride his dick too much.

Please. He's been stringing people along for years. It may be his creation, but he's got people to invest time and money into these books with a promise of an endin. Not a TV show, but a book ending. Bit of a dick move to get people to spend money on your work by promising an end, then turning around and saying "fuck you. I'm not obliged to give you anything, but thanks for the money"

And yeah, publishers could carry on selling ASOIAF, but they'd need to make it clear the series is unfinished. Who is really going to spend tens of hours reading a story that will have no conclusion?

Get real. He is morally obliged to give people an ending. We've made him rich, now he needs to follow through with his end of the deal.

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People have received books for the price they paid for them and have gotten hours of enjoyment from those. He hasn't been fleecing people for huge sums of money. Considering what we, the audience, have gotten out of it versus what we put in, I think it's a pretty good arrangement in our favour.

As I mentioned, I definitely think demand wouldn't be the same if the series was never finished, but people would still want to read it. There's enjoyment in the act of reading itself; it can be about the journey, not just the destination. Many people who watched the show were dissatisfied with how it handled things and have heard that the books did those aspects better, so they might want to check them out. There's probably someone somewhere today starting the series for the first time or watching the first episode, which may lead them to read the books. Millions of copies have been sold. The demand isn't going to suddenly disappear if he dies without finishing the series.

Also, he is working on the book. He says in that interview that it's his priority. He also says that he doesn't plan on ever retiring. So he's going to be working on it for the rest of his life if that's what it takes. Isn't that enough for this moral obligation we're apparently owed? He's not just saying "fuck it" and relaxing by a pool filled with money for the rest of his life. Does he really not get a say in what happens to his work after his death if he hasn't fulfilled some criteria that others have decided on? The artist's ownership of their work is dependent on the flow of that sweet, sweet content? We can't do without getting our franchise fix? If we don't get those books then it's a pity but life goes on. We don't need them.

You mention "his end of the deal." What are the specific terms of this deal? When was it agreed upon? What do we, as the audience, owe him as part of this deal? Or are we only putting in the price of the books? Has "our" side of the deal been compromised by people sending him abuse?

He made himself rich by creating a world millions of people have enjoyed. Buying his previous books entitled me to just that, those books. Of course, I want future instalments, but I'm not entitled to them.

The S.A. Corey duo (the Expanse guys) are the most logical choice. They live near him, have worked with him for decades, and are solid writers in their own rights. They could easily put out stuff like the leaner first 3 books before the bloat set in.

I would guess that they wouldn't go against his wishes since they are friends of his.

 

[Griffon]

Just don't give it to Brandon Sanderson once he's dead.

 

[6502]

Surely if he genuinley has 1100 pages he can get the first 800 or so and release "part 1" of the book. A bit of positivity may rekindle his enthusiasm. It would at least give him a year of peace.

Otherwise he risks postumous releases like MJ albums that savaged what quality he had invested.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

This is not a priority for him. It’s the direct opposite of a priority - he took dozens if not hundreds of projects in the years since the last book instead of working on WoW.

 

[IDKFA]

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People have received books for the price they paid for them and have gotten hours of enjoyment from those. He hasn't been fleecing people for huge sums of money. Considering what we, the audience, have gotten out of it versus what we put in, I think it's a pretty good arrangement in our favour.

Agreed, although he has been stringing his customers along.

As I mentioned, I definitely think demand wouldn't be the same if the series was never finished, but people would still want to read it. There's enjoyment in the act of reading itself; it can be about the journey, not just the destination. Many people who watched the show were dissatisfied with how it handled things and have heard that the books did those aspects better, so they might want to check them out. There's probably someone somewhere today starting the series for the first time or watching the first episode, which may lead them to read the books. Millions of copies have been sold. The demand isn't going to suddenly disappear if he dies without finishing the series.

Nope. Cannot agree with this at all. Who in their right mind would spend tens of hours reading a story with no conclusion and left with major cliff hangers? What a waste of time. I agree reading is about the journey, but the journey needs to have a beginning, middle and end.

Also, he is working on the book. He says in that interview that it's his priority. He also says that he doesn't plan on ever retiring. So he's going to be working on it for the rest of his life if that's what it takes. Isn't that enough for this moral obligation we're apparently owed? He's not just saying "fuck it" and relaxing by a pool filled with money for the rest of his life. Does he really not get a say in what happens to his work after his death if he hasn't fulfilled some criteria that others have decided on? The artist's ownership of their work is dependent on the flow of that sweet, sweet content? We can't do without getting our franchise fix? If we don't get those books then it's a pity but life goes on. We don't need them.

Steady on, chap. I agree that as an artist he can agree what happens to his work if the worst happens before he finishes it. No problem there at all. He has the final say. My argument is one of morality. He has, and on a number of occasions, promised his readers that they will have an end to ASOIAF. As he has made this promise a number of times, he should ensure that this promise is kept to the people who made him rich and famous in the first place. Of course, he can change his mind and refuse for someone to finish the series, but that would be a dick move. Also, based on his recent talks about his own legacy, I have a feeling he'll be fine with somebody of his choice finishing the series for him if he isn't able to, regardless of comments he's made in the past.

He made himself rich by creating a world millions of people have enjoyed. Buying his previous books entitled me to just that, those books. Of course, I want future instalments, but I'm not entitled to them.

If they were free then you wouldn't be, but you've spent time and money on a series that you expected to be completed.

Let's leave it at that and agree to disagree.

 

[DKehoe]

Let's leave it at that and agree to disagree.

That's fair, I think we just have a different perspective on this so better to agree to disagree.

 

[Redneckerz]

Dude has become the Duke Nukem Forever of writers.

 

[Big Baller]

He's too busy with Elden Ring 2

 

[winjer]

Maybe ChatGPT can finish his books.

 

[jason10mm]

Maybe ChatGPT can finish his books.

I've little doubt that AI will be serving us up Shakespeare, Tolkien, Austin, and god knows whom else in time. Anyone with enough stuff out there for the algorithm to imitate it will be fair game. Something like additional stories "in the vein of" R.E. Howard (Conan) or H.P. Lovecraft (Cthulhu) could be very interesting. Certainly other humans have done pastiches of these types of guys, I'm curious of an AI can somehow crack it better.