Miles Quaritch
Member
Is it bad that they don't want to be marginalised and pushed to the fringes of society where they will struggle to access services?
Germany reinstates Border Controls - Temporarily exits from Schengen
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Is it bad that they don't want to be marginalised and pushed to the fringes of society where they will struggle to access services?
Do you actually believe this?
It's bad that they don't appreciate the help they are given. They are supposed to be "refugees" seeking for peace and help. They are given homes, they should be grateful, instead they have demands.
Some people here are just nuts.
ClosingADoor
Member
Countries can't handle the current stream of refugees / immigrants. So of course they can't all get a good location. Complaining about that now is totally useless and out of touch with reality.
They have a safe space, they are provided for. The journalist says there is a school for the kids. What more do you want, especially now? The guy starts complaining when he says he just arrived and hasn't even seen everything yet. Talk about disrespecting your host country that is helping your family out.
And struggle to access services... It's Sweden. Country is large, so you have to travel a bit sometimes.
Must be the amount of civil wars currently going on in the EU. Oh, wait... If you can't accept to live in Spain, Italy, Belgium, Poland, Austria, Czech Republic, etc, etc, then by all means, please leave. Those are perfectly fine countries where millions of people live in peace and you can built a new life. If that isn't enough, your reasons for coming here are not because you have no other safe place to go.
Hypnotoad
Member
Germany should sent every asylum applicant a message:
"Your request for asylum is accepted. Under the new quota system, you will be relocated to country XXX" (XXX being a country other than Sweden, but not Bulgaria/Romania either).
Those who protest this decision will be denied asylum. One and done. Sounds like trolling, but it would actually be a more effective policy than the current one.
"Your request for asylum is accepted. Under the new quota system, you will be relocated to country XXX" (XXX being a country other than Sweden, but not Bulgaria/Romania either).
Those who protest this decision will be denied asylum. One and done. Sounds like trolling, but it would actually be a more effective policy than the current one.
Miles Quaritch
Member
Yes?
How will he and his family be treated in a country like Hungary? Or the Czech republic? Or Romania?
He and his family are escaping a place that's hostile to them, why would they want to settle somewhere that's also hostile to them? Locks them up in detention centres, forces them to scramble for food?
This is like arguing starving people should be happy eating your scraps.
They aren't worth more? They aren't as human as you or me?
Are you for real here? These are refugees and their first priority should be accommodation and safety. Fact is a lot of the camps are outside of large population centers because, surprise surprise, large population centers are already at their limits or near their limits.
ClosingADoor
Member
They will be just fine in those countries, just not as good as in Germany or Sweden (although apparently Sweden is also not good enough for some now). Problem is, Hungary is a border country (and a poorer one at that), so they can't handle the amount of people. When things quiet down, they'll be fine.
The whole "they aren't human" argument is nonsense. By that logic, we should provide everyone in the world with a place in a first-world country, but we all know that isn't possible.
Can you come up with greater hiperbole analogy? This one is not enough.
They supposed to be refugees, there are lot's of them, a foreign country is giving them homes and first thing you do is complain about not living in a f***ing city center?
Maybe natives should leave their homes to make place for "refugees"?
Seriously, wtf?
You are actually saying Hungary, Romania, Czech republic, UK, Sweden, Austria and all other countries besides Germany are as dangerous for refugees as Syria is at the moment and only Germany is a safe EU country for refugees i hope you realize this.
I also hope you know that no one can take you seriously especially the native populations of these "unsafe" EU countries.
TatteredHat
Member
They're worth the same as you and me, and I don't deserve free shelter and food either. Fact is, they're a negative drain on whichever country graciously decides to provide them with free shelter and food. If they can't appreciate that, then they can get out.
iceatcs
Junior Member
Wow so selfish. That building looks so well accommodation, better than my school. Damn he want mansion or what?
Miles Quaritch
Member
Will they? What's just fine? Detention centres? Stuck behind barbed wire? Forced to scramble and fight for food?
Why ignore these issues? Because at least their safe?
If you were fleeing for your life, would you be happy with that treatment?
And there's nothing wrong with us lowering our living standards a little to help others. Why treat others like they aren't worth as much?
And yes, I'd happily take in some refugees. I have two empty rooms and it's not a problem for me.
It might impact my living standards in the short to medium term, but rather than leave them suffering.
I don't see what's wrong with asking to be closer to population centres. It makes them feel safer, less exposed to attack from far right extremists.
Miles Quaritch
Member
Nowhere did I mention the UK, but the fact remains a number of EU countries are hostile in how they treat refugees.
And that's fine. I can't help people from being blinded by propaganda.
ClosingADoor
Member
Do you really think these people will be stuck there in detention centers for the rest of their lives? Of course not. The people coming in with this quota will be just fine.
Hungary is not doing very well in this situation, but are they supposed to just let hundreds of thousands of people pass through their country without doing anything?
Stop the dramatics and be real for a bit. You are advocating these people should get everything handed to them, preferably in a nice rich country and living in a city center. That is not realistic at all.
Go ahead, take a few refugees in. So easy to say if you know it is not even a realistic nor good situation. You don't take in people from a war zone in your home that might be dealing with traumas, you leave that to professionals.
And yes, if I was fleeing for my life, I would be very happy a country is taking me in and providing a safe place.
This is such a non issue at the moment. You are pretending people are going out at the moment and attacking refugees. That is just not reality.
You know you are being just as blinded as you blame others for? You are ignoring real issues and come up with impossible and unrealistic solutions.
Of course I'd be, because it's drastic improvement from "might get killed today" to "I'm safe and have roof over my head".
Miles Quaritch
Member
Well, I look at the detention centres in Australia and don't see much of a difference. Apart from the systemic sexual abuse by those in charge, but it's still early days.
Miles Quaritch
Member
Safe in a detention centre where you don't know when you're next meal will be. Where you're herded into large cages and treated like garbage.
At least you for a roof over your head though.
Machspeed007
Member
Hear, hear. I'm Romanian..
Also, the refugees will be taken care as humanly as possible here, despite our vote. We didn't agree with imposing a quota and not with not helping or no solidarity.
Regardless, the quotas will have to be updated pretty soon, I think.
ClosingADoor
Member
You think it is realistic for Hungary to provide a nice house for a few hundred thousand people coming through their borders over the last few months, when the country was in no way prepared for that and the other EU countries looked away?
You are incredibly naive and unrealistic, giving no actual solution besides saying "this is bad, do better!"
Blinded? Dude i explicitly asked you if you actually believe this delusion and you said yes i even quoted everything.
What are you even blathering about you just defended a dude that set ridiculous demands after he got in social housing so fast the native populations can only wonder why they have to wait for years!
Any homeless dude in this country seeing this quite frankly can only wonder wtf is going on!
And you pretend and actually paint a picture that this dude that gets better treatment than some of the natives is somehow abused and has an actually a point?
So what do you propose? Do you have some magic gun that shoots houses?
Also don't forget that in that video we are discussing, there is normal building apropriate for living.
Miles Quaritch
Member
Nowhere did I say they should be provided with a nice house. Treat them with respect and integrate them into large population centres now rather than marginalise them and create problems decades down the line.
It's happened before in Europe, what makes it's so different this time?
Wrong kind of people?
Do you think that in "large population centres" there are some magic areas where there are thousands of uninhabited houses just waiting for refugees?
Sorry pal, but you're just mental, no point in talking to you.
ClosingADoor
Member
Sure, put it on racism instead of the actual logistics and numbers involved. How do you expect to house tens of thousands of new people overnight in large population centers that are already dealing with housing shortages? Have you tried getting an apartment in cities like Munich, Stockholm, Amsterdam, etc? It's not easy.
Uh, the amount of them?
Doczu
Member
Stop it boys, were just one step away from the "you want to see them all die" argument.
QuicheFontaine
Member
CloverCarr
Banned
And that's why you can be so idealistic and glib about the situation. People like you don't actually bear the brunt of these issues. It's the working class that are marginalised and displaced, not Billy Two Spare Rooms.
Alabamaman
Banned
What the hell are you rambling about? They get food regularly and they are not prisons, not in Finland at least.
You make it sound like they were thrown in concentration camps and had to fight for a loaf of bread.
Machspeed007
Member
What would you say if Germany will have to accommodate refugees in tents because they will be overwhelmed by the amount of people coming in? Would that be dignifying for them?
Because that's precisely why forcing quotas would not work at all with the notion of human treatment. Up until we have the infrastructure build up, we can host so much of them in the up to standards conditions you are requiring.
Miles Quaritch
Member
It's interesting to see people leap to assuming I'm referring to racism. Didn't know you could be racist against Muslims...
There's a clear problem with logistics, I never suggested there wasn't. Adding statements to my posts to try and make a point is just silly.
The idea behind housing them in population centres is to build any accommodation for them very close to or inside population centres. It's not about emptying out apartments or nice houses. Don't be ridiculous.
And yes, there's footage of refugees herded into large cages and forced to scramble for food as those in charge throw them sandwiches as you would to a dog.
In this very thread. Not sure how it's wrong to bring that up in a discussion about why refugees wouldn't want to end up in one and would see their home country as a better alternative.
There's a clear problem with logistics, I never suggested there wasn't. Adding statements to my posts to try and make a point is just silly.
The idea behind housing them in population centres is to build any accommodation for them very close to or inside population centres. It's not about emptying out apartments or nice houses. Don't be ridiculous.
And yes, there's footage of refugees herded into large cages and forced to scramble for food as those in charge throw them sandwiches as you would to a dog.
In this very thread. Not sure how it's wrong to bring that up in a discussion about why refugees wouldn't want to end up in one and would see their home country as a better alternative.
And this is just absolutely ridiculous
That's an apartment building, not a bloody prison. The man says that the nearest supermarket (store?) is 30 minutes away walking. That's... 2,5 km or so by average adult walking speed.
Absolutely disgraceful, right?
ClosingADoor
Member
Call it whatever you want, but you were hinting at discrimination and/or racism.
Sure, they would all want to end up in Germany if it is better there. But the reality is, Germany can't handle that and it would be unjust to ask them to do that. Everybody in the world would love to end up in Western Europe or North America. But there is good reason we don't open the borders and let everyone just come.
If building accommodations close to population centers was so easy, why are most larger European cities having trouble with housing? You can't just built a new neighborhood in those places out of nothing, those projects take years and years. So for now, we use what we have, and that is mostly in neighborhoods that aren't as popular.
And I have seen footage of refugees being unreasonable and using violence. Are we basing discussions now on cherry picked footage that support your argument?
Miles Quaritch
Member
And this is just absolutely ridiculous
That's an apartment building, not a bloody prison. The man says that the nearest supermarket (store?) is 30 minutes away walking. That's... 2,5 km or so by average adult walking speed.
Absolutely disgraceful, right?
I wasn't referring to this guy, but then you knew that.
ClosingADoor
Member
The whole discussion was about that and how you would have people closer to population centers. So yes, you were referring to him and how you agree with his complaints.
Miles Quaritch
Member
Do you deny there's discrimination? Often blatant discrimination?
Sure, but the location for these accommodations is usually based on ensuring the refugees aren't too close to native population centres and that's an issue.
Is it cherry picking to bring it up in a context of why someone wouldn't want to go there and sees only Germany as the place to treat people like human beings?
Got a source for that?
Miles Quaritch
Member
Follow the conversation back instead of pitching a tent and thinking you're right.
That was in relation to the story about the Syrian man who said he'd rather go home if he couldn't stay in Germany.
ClosingADoor
Member
There is surely discrimination, but despite that there are tons of people helping out these refugees and the government is spending tons of money and effort, while a part of their population complains.
Do you have any proof about these accommodations? Because what I know, is that there are tons of centers close to population centers. Just two blocks from me we have about 700 people coming for example. Middle of a city. Some will be outside population centers, because there are free buildings there.
And you are constantly arguing only Germany is a good place. What is wrong with the UK, Netherlands, Sweden, Finland, Austria, France, Spain, etc, etc. You are basing your argument on some footage you have seen from Hungary and then deciding everything must be just as bad.
I see both as the same issue, where people are complaining about stupid things while not taking into account the countries are doing a lot of work to help these people.
Anyway, I just clicked through that discussion and yes, it started with the video. So you are in the wrong anyway.
Mate, you were replying to a video of a refugee in Sweden complaining about his accommodation being in the sticks.
iceatcs
Junior Member
I think all of them are getting paid while awaiting an asylum decision, but its coming from UK system. I know a guy have cousin on £110 a week for his family with 2 children few days after they arrived in UK.
They seem cope but want to get a job soon. They hope stay for while till right to work.
They seem cope but want to get a job soon. They hope stay for while till right to work.
Kill Your Masters
Member
Yeah, you won't get any views and visits for doing boring interviews with grateful people.
Refugees can be asshole idiots too just like the rest of us, news at 11.
TatteredHat
Member
Those refugees are welcome to stick around, the ones complaining can go back.
Windom Earle
Member
RoadHazard
Gold Member
In what apartments? The ones that already have people living in them? Because there basically aren't any others (at least here in Sweden). Should I move back with my parents (which would mean quitting my job, giving up my entire life and moving to a different city) so that an immigrant family can have my apartment?
See, it's not as easy as you make it out to be. These "detention centers" are the best we can do with this massive influx of refugees.
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