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[Flabagast]

Zero physics? Jesus that is actually a huge bummer

Video is timestamped

This is actually very disappointing

 

[GymWolf]

Yep. Teardown, an indie game, has completely destructible environments with dynamic physics simulation, volumetric physics-driven smoke, dynamic lighting/shadows, fluid simulation, realistic fire/flame escalation with environmental destruction, etc.. etc.. and it all looks better than DK Bananza

Yo the smoke\foam\dust physics look bananas (pun intended)

 

[Mephisto40]

DK Bananza is (unironically) the most impressive game this generation, it prioritizes destructibility that is integral to its core design philosophy, it flipped the script of limited, predictable platforming & punching foes by implementing those same philosophies but with a substantial layer of skill expression, player freedom & deep interactivity, this pushes the player to experiment rather than focus on one way to beat a level, this is the Nintendo that I wish Sony & Microsoft would become or at least take a note from.

They proactively look for ways to build a game with extremely high-resolution thinking & brainstorming, and now that is their idea that utilizes next-gen tech, Voxel-based Destructibility, it's a supremely impressive tech that is ingrained within the game's design philosophy itself rather than a cake dressing (looking at you Rift Apart...)

This is more impressive

than this.

You have to be joking surely...

I'm genuinely not trolling here, that gif you've posted of Donkey Kong looks like a PS3 game, or am I just not understanding what you are trying to say

Baffled

 

[RodriGames40]

To think the last possible chance of Nintendo delivering a true Switch 2 game this year is fucking Kirby Air Riders...

 

[SlimySnake]

Zero physics? Jesus that is actually a huge bummer

John actually defends this saying that adding a robust physics system would be too expensive. Too expensive? You mean like $70 expensive? or $450 expensive? Like wtf is wrong with these tech journos making lame excuses for these games. Zelda is built on a 10x weaker handheld and had those 'robust physics'.

And btw, none of this destruction is persistent. Everything you destroy magically comes back if you leave the level and come back. John once again defends this as a design choice. But i thought the design choice was to give players freedom and destroy everything???

This is why people dont like him despite him being the most normal of the DF lot. his excuses are just too retarded.

 

[March Climber]

John actually defends this saying that adding a robust physics system would be too expensive. Too expensive? You mean like $70 expensive? or $450 expensive? Like wtf is wrong with these tech journos making lame excuses for these games. Zelda is built on a 10x weaker handheld and had those 'robust physics'.

Wait, are you sure he was speaking of monetary cost and not the cost of the framerate/system? I could see this game being a mess and dipping into the 20s if they added it.

This is why people dont like him despite him being the most normal of the DF lot. his excuses are just too retarded.

I thought Alex was the guy people here didn't like. It changed to John?

 

[winjer]

John actually defends this saying that adding a robust physics system would be too expensive. Too expensive? You mean like $70 expensive? or $450 expensive? Like wtf is wrong with these tech journos making lame excuses for these games. Zelda is built on a 10x weaker handheld and had those 'robust physics'.

And btw, none of this destruction is persistent. Everything you destroy magically comes back if you leave the level and come back. John once again defends this as a design choice. But i thought the design choice was to give players freedom and destroy everything???

This is why people dont like him despite him being the most normal of the DF lot. his excuses are just too retarded.

And the funny part is that Nvidia's hardware has hardware acceleration for PhysX. And there is a whole library of support for it, an SDK and open source code.
These guys at DF sometimes say the dumbest things.

 

[SlimySnake]

Wait, are you sure he was speaking of monetary cost and not the cost of the framerate/system? I could see this game being a mess and dipping into the 20s if they added it.

I thought Alex was the guy people here didn't like. It changed to John?

Of course i know he's talking about the framerate cost. My point is that a game that expensive on a brand new expensive piece of hardware should be able to handle it. Especially when its much weaker predecessor had one.

And Alex gets hate for being a blind PC fanboy, but he doesnt jerk off devs like John does.

 

[Pharaoh 117]

It was very clear from the first trailer that the destruction in the DK game was like the Worms games where you just "eat" away chunks of the environments but they don't have any actual physics.

 

[Xtib81]

Anyways, Still can't believe AC Unity is over a decade old. I wonder if the Switch 2 could pump out something this impressive

I hope this game gets a remake at some point. With path tracing, it would look gorgeous.

 

[Flabagast]

Dear Graphics fellows, what is the best mode to play on PS5 Pro for Star Wars Outlaw ? the 40fps one I'd wager ?

 

[Trilobit]

It was very clear from the first trailer that the destruction in the DK game was like the Worms games where you just "eat" away chunks of the environments but they don't have any actual physics.

I'm actually lost as to why people are being surprised by that now. It has been evident from the start.

 

[PeteBull]

John actually defends this saying that adding a robust physics system would be too expensive. Too expensive? You mean like $70 expensive? or $450 expensive? Like wtf is wrong with these tech journos making lame excuses for these games. Zelda is built on a 10x weaker handheld and had those 'robust physics'.

And btw, none of this destruction is persistent. Everything you destroy magically comes back if you leave the level and come back. John once again defends this as a design choice. But i thought the design choice was to give players freedom and destroy everything???

This is why people dont like him despite him being the most normal of the DF lot. his excuses are just too retarded.

Defending DKB is like defending WNBA, we all know its crap technically yet we are told to pay for this shit full price while getting subpar product ;/

 

[rofif]

attacking dk bananza is so strange. It's a nintendo game for kids.
and they do great fun stuff with the destruction.
I watched some gameplay and it looks good and fun.
It's a handheld 60fps game. only so much they can really do

 

[Senua]

attacking dk bananza is so strange. It's a nintendo game for kids.
and they do great fun stuff with the destruction.
I watched some gameplay and it looks good and fun.
It's a handheld 60fps game. only so much they can really do

Attacking? Lol

 

[rofif]

Attacking? Lol

criticizing? I dont care.
words man. what do they mean

 

[Senua]

criticizing? I dont care.
words man. what do they mean

 

[Luipadre]

attacking dk bananza is so strange. It's a nintendo game for kids.
and they do great fun stuff with the destruction.
I watched some gameplay and it looks good and fun.
It's a handheld 60fps game. only so much they can really do

Say that to my 39 year old ass. Nintendo games are not for kids

 

[rofif]

Say that to my 39 year old ass. Nintendo games are not for kids

I should probably get switch 2. Maybe when oled comes out!
I never had a nintendo... since fake nes back in the 90s

 

[PeteBull]

attacking dk bananza is so strange. It's a nintendo game for kids.
and they do great fun stuff with the destruction.
I watched some gameplay and it looks good and fun.
It's a handheld 60fps game. only so much they can really do

I dont attack it from quality/gameplay/fun standpoint, thats top notch otherwise game wouldnt get 90 metacritic score(84 reviewers)
I can attack its technical aspects tho, especially if we take into consideration its 7years dev time from internal ninny team previously responsible for mario odyssey

 

[RodriGames40]

attacking dk bananza is so strange. It's a nintendo game for kids.
and they do great fun stuff with the destruction.
I watched some gameplay and it looks good and fun.
It's a handheld 60fps game. only so much they can really do

No way you are going to defend this one too? Don't go down that path Rofif, people are warning you...

 

[SlimySnake]

Attacking? Lol

This thread: DK Bananza doesn't have physics.
What Rofif sees:

 

[rofif]

I dont attack it from quality/gameplay/fun standpoint, thats top notch otherwise game wouldnt get 90 metacritic score(84 reviewers)
I can attack its technical aspects tho, especially if we take into consideration its 7years dev time from internal ninny team previously responsible for mario odyssey

The only issue I am seeing with this is the 30fps vsync. Should just be triple buffered.
Other than that? looks like pretty impressive nintendo game for a handheld

No way you are going to defend this one too? Don't go down that path Rofif, people are warning you...

not really no

 

[analog_future]

Played about an hour of DK Bananza.


Good news: The game is super fun

Bad news: The frame rate is not stable at all. Constant drops to 30fps. And visually it looks like a slightly higher res Switch 1 game.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

John actually defends this saying that adding a robust physics system would be too expensive. Too expensive? You mean like $70 expensive? or $450 expensive? Like wtf is wrong with these tech journos making lame excuses for these games. Zelda is built on a 10x weaker handheld and had those 'robust physics'.

And btw, none of this destruction is persistent. Everything you destroy magically comes back if you leave the level and come back. John once again defends this as a design choice. But i thought the design choice was to give players freedom and destroy everything???

This is why people dont like him despite him being the most normal of the DF lot. his excuses are just too retarded.

Nailed it. I went from liking him to not being able to stand the sound of his voice. But I feel that way about every DFer.

I'm re-living my own personal PS5 Pro hell with the Switch 2. Not enough Switch 2 patches and Nintendo is 0 for 2 with games that actually take advantage of the expensive new console we just bought. All while the games media, Youtubers, and fanboys have set the narrative of "great piece of hardware and wow these games look Great!" "Bravo". "Im happy with my purchase its just YOU who had CRAZY expectations- go away we don't want your wrong opinions and negativity"

I think console gaming is simply doomed to never deliver on graphical expectations the way it used to.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

Dear Graphics fellows, what is the best mode to play on PS5 Pro for Star Wars Outlaw ? the 40fps one I'd wager ?

Yeah probably as thats the only real improvement along with a slightly higher res. Beautiful game, disappointing update imo. Avatar is worse on Pro.

 

[analog_future]

So Bananza is not impressive on a technical level, but there's definitely a unified direction connecting the art, destruction, animations, and music that make for a nice cohesive package as a whole.

Just goes to show what I was saying earlier, in that properly structured, visionary leadership is so damn important in creating modern games.

A few quick grabs I took:

 

[CGNoire]

lol.
It's kinda funny that we skipped the games ever looking like pre rendered 90s cutscenes, which is what I would imagine games would look like in the future as a kid

Thats what the default look of Dreams(ps4) produces. Its perfect for quickly creating nostalgic 90s CGI.

 

[CGNoire]

I actually wonder why we skipped those kind of graphics…

Zbrush dropped is why. Yes half the look comes from simple phong shaders but another thing not talked about is before zbrush creating believable organic forms like humans ect was extremely hard and time consuming not to mention the polygon/memory requirements. Zbrush solved so many issues at once.

 

[CGNoire]

DK Bananza is (unironically) the most impressive game this generation, it prioritizes destructibility that is integral to its core design philosophy, it flipped the script of limited, predictable platforming & punching foes by implementing those same philosophies but with a substantial layer of skill expression, player freedom & deep interactivity, this pushes the player to experiment rather than focus on one way to beat a level, this is the Nintendo that I wish Sony & Microsoft would become or at least take a note from.

They proactively look for ways to build a game with extremely high-resolution thinking & brainstorming, and now that is their idea that utilizes next-gen tech, Voxel-based Destructibility, it's a supremely impressive tech that is ingrained within the game's design philosophy itself rather than a cake dressing (looking at you Rift Apart...)

This is more impressive

than this.

I'm sorry but I can't take anyone serious who uses the phrase "Flipped the Script" unironicly.

 

[CGNoire]

Yo the smoke\foam\dust physics look bananas (pun intended)

Game is pretty fun too.

 

[anyasok]

So Bananza is not impressive on a technical level, but there's definitely a unified direction connecting the art, destruction, animations, and music that make for a nice cohesive package as a whole.

Just goes to show what I was saying earlier, in that properly structured, visionary leadership is so damn important in creating modern games.

A few quick grabs I took:

I really hate how it lacks the teardown physics system. Shit is just hanging there with no physics to support it and you hit the non breakable level foundation way too quick...Switch 2 offers a very limited voxel experience

 

[GymWolf]

So Bananza is not impressive on a technical level, but there's definitely a unified direction connecting the art, destruction, animations, and music that make for a nice cohesive package as a whole.

Just goes to show what I was saying earlier, in that properly structured, visionary leadership is so damn important in creating modern games.

A few quick grabs I took:

New donkey kong face look a bit retarded, ngl

 

[Jesb]

So I started getting back into Stalker 2 and it's really such an underwhelming looking game. You could've told me it's HL2 and I'd believe you. Is this one of the biggest frauds this gen? Even in the GFN game description they show you bullshot screenshots. How is this even allowed? The game looks nowhere close to this.

 

[mrMUR_96]

So I started getting back into Stalker 2 and it's really such an underwhelming looking game. You could've told me it's HL2 and I'd believe you. Is this one of the biggest frauds this gen? Even in the GFN game description they show you bullshot screenshots. How is this even allowed? The game looks nowhere close to this.

On ultra settings? I think it looks pretty decent, performance a bit hit and miss, but it looks decent overall.

 

[AeonGaidenRaiden]

People seriously posting screenshots of Bananza as a graphical showcase

 

[analog_future]

People seriously posting screenshots of Bananza as a graphical showcase

I literally opened my post by saying that DK is not impressive on a technical level. The fuck you talking about?

 

[Edellus]

And the funny part is that Nvidia's hardware has hardware acceleration for PhysX. And there is a whole library of support for it, an SDK and open source code.
These guys at DF sometimes say the dumbest things.

Nvidia is phasing out 32 bit CUDA operations, which includes Physx, starting with the 50x series. Perhaps it's the right choice to not use it if you'd be expecting future compatibility issues. I'm not sure if there are recent games that have implemented PhysX.

 

[winjer]

Nvidia is phasing out 32 bit CUDA operations, which includes Physx, starting with the 50x series. Perhaps it's the right choice to not use it if you'd be expecting future compatibility issues. I'm not sure if there are recent games that have implemented PhysX.

The Switch is not using Blackwell.

 

[Buggy Loop]

It's easy to break everything and add destruction when everything looks like a basic ps2 texture. Other studios have standards. if ND released a game with destruction like Donkey Kong and visuals like Donkey Kong, they would literally be laughed out of the industry. You think CD project, Rockstar, GG cant do basic shit like this? Of course they can. They just have to follow industry standards which means A) they cant keep making kiddie platformers and B) they have to release something that doesnt look like a ps2 game.

And btw, there are zero physics applied to destruction in this game. Zero. John pointed this out when he destroyed everything under a rock and the rock just stayed floating like they are in space. What Zelda ToTK did with its physics system was far more impressive and that was on a last gen handled as powerful as a PS3. Switch 2 is roughly twice as powerful as a PS4 and this is the best nintendo can do for launch? For a $70 game? For a $450 handheld? Same price as a digital PS5? They need to be laughed out of this industry. Not praised.

"looks like a PS2 game" Well that's off to a good start. Nothing says more "I'm open to discussion" than a take like that /s. Clearly epitome of the beginning of a GDC discussion topic.

It's incredible you manage to sum pretty much everything that is wrong with the industry chasing the fucking coat of paints for the past 2 decades while they put physics and AI aside from the early 2000's.

Pretty candies that taste bad

Naughty Dog is indeed being laughed at but not because they chased DK games

Only 1 game has ever had voxel physics without remaining floating bits in the air and actually falling around, one, and its teardown, a game about just destruction and no verticality that has to remain there to get to an objective. Deeprock galactic would just pop out of existence with entire geometry out of existence and confetti particles that will transition from geometry to nothingness for the illusion once it detects no support, not really physics and again, totally different goal of gameplay mechanic in that game than a platformer. How do you design platformer levels when you can make the whole goddamn thing collapse? Make it make sense without breaking the game. You have teardown on PS5 dropping to ~15 FPS during big destruction sequences and you think a dev with an ounce of brain would say this is a good approach for Switch 2?

But here comes like what, the 3rd or 4th game with decent voxel destruction in nearly 25 years, but also one that is actually designed for the first time as a platformer/adventure and let's shit on it, pummel it to the ground and laugh at it, while we lick the balls of the devs continuing to make the 20th layers of paint on the same PS3 baseline game recipes.

Also never seen a ray-marched or dual-contouring or other smoothing techniques of voxels having falling physics, but feel free to find
winjer I doubt you would find that a solution for that in physx either, they're all cubic voxel solutions. You can't have per voxel physics and smoothing, there's 0 cases of it that I can find.

You would have teardown graphic Donkey Kong and you would just shit on it by saying it looks like Amiga pixel art brought to 3D.

 

[Edellus]

The Switch is not using Blackwell.

I know. My point was a probable concern for future compatibility issues. If future hardware won't support PhysX and if you want your new games to run in future hardware, then you don't want to support PhysX.

 

[winjer]

I know. My point was a probable concern for future compatibility issues. If future hardware won't support PhysX and if you want your new games to run in future hardware, then you don't want to support PhysX.

It's a Switch game, it will never be ported to other systems.

 

[Edellus]

It's a Switch game, it will never be ported to other systems.

Other systems like future Nintendo consoles?

 

[winjer]

Other systems like future Nintendo consoles?

Do you really think Nintendo, or any company will not use some current hardware feature, because it might not be supported in a next generation?

 

[Edellus]

Do you really think Nintendo, or any company will not use some current hardware feature, because it might not be supported in a next generation?

I think it is possible. Using deprecated and phased out tech for new projects is not particularly considered a good practice in the software industry

 

[winjer]

I think it is possible. Using deprecated and phased out tech for new projects is not particularly considered a good practice in the software industry

No one is going avoid use a feature because some hardware that doesn't exist nyet, might not have a feature.

 

[anyasok]

"looks like a PS2 game" Well that's off to a good start. Nothing says more "I'm open to discussion" than a take like that /s. Clearly epitome of the beginning of a GDC discussion topic.

It's incredible you manage to sum pretty much everything that is wrong with the industry chasing the fucking coat of paints for the past 2 decades while they put physics and AI aside from the early 2000's.

Pretty candies that taste bad

Naughty Dog is indeed being laughed at but not because they chased DK games

Only 1 game has ever had voxel physics without remaining floating bits in the air and actually falling around, one, and its teardown, a game about just destruction and no verticality that has to remain there to get to an objective. Deeprock galactic would just pop out of existence with entire geometry out of existence and confetti particles that will transition from geometry to nothingness for the illusion once it detects no support, not really physics and again, totally different goal of gameplay mechanic in that game than a platformer. How do you design platformer levels when you can make the whole goddamn thing collapse? Make it make sense without breaking the game. You have teardown on PS5 dropping to ~15 FPS during big destruction sequences and you think a dev with an ounce of brain would say this is a good approach for Switch 2?

But here comes like what, the 3rd or 4th game with decent voxel destruction in nearly 25 years, but also one that is actually designed for the first time as a platformer/adventure and let's shit on it, pummel it to the ground and laugh at it, while we lick the balls of the devs continuing to make the 20th layers of paint on the same PS3 baseline game recipes.

Also never seen a ray-marched or dual-contouring or other smoothing techniques of voxels having falling physics, but feel free to find
winjer I doubt you would find that a solution for that in physx either, they're all cubic voxel solutions. You can't have per voxel physics and smoothing, there's 0 cases of it that I can find.

You would have teardown graphic Donkey Kong and you would just shit on it by saying it looks like Amiga pixel art brought to 3D.

Stop shilling dude. Just admit that it looks like ass and N had no bright ideas to make it better. Floating voxels look like shit.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Stop shilling dude. Just admit that it looks like ass and N had no bright ideas to make it better. Floating voxels look like shit.

Lol

Please go ask /r/VoxelGameDev

The technical discussions in this thread are laughable

 

[MidGenRefresh]

Not bad for an 8 year old game:

 

[winjer]

"looks like a PS2 game" Well that's off to a good start. Nothing says more "I'm open to discussion" than a take like that /s. Clearly epitome of the beginning of a GDC discussion topic.

It's incredible you manage to sum pretty much everything that is wrong with the industry chasing the fucking coat of paints for the past 2 decades while they put physics and AI aside from the early 2000's.

Pretty candies that taste bad

Naughty Dog is indeed being laughed at but not because they chased DK games

Only 1 game has ever had voxel physics without remaining floating bits in the air and actually falling around, one, and its teardown, a game about just destruction and no verticality that has to remain there to get to an objective. Deeprock galactic would just pop out of existence with entire geometry out of existence and confetti particles that will transition from geometry to nothingness for the illusion once it detects no support, not really physics and again, totally different goal of gameplay mechanic in that game than a platformer. How do you design platformer levels when you can make the whole goddamn thing collapse? Make it make sense without breaking the game. You have teardown on PS5 dropping to ~15 FPS during big destruction sequences and you think a dev with an ounce of brain would say this is a good approach for Switch 2?

But here comes like what, the 3rd or 4th game with decent voxel destruction in nearly 25 years, but also one that is actually designed for the first time as a platformer/adventure and let's shit on it, pummel it to the ground and laugh at it, while we lick the balls of the devs continuing to make the 20th layers of paint on the same PS3 baseline game recipes.

Also never seen a ray-marched or dual-contouring or other smoothing techniques of voxels having falling physics, but feel free to find
winjer I doubt you would find that a solution for that in physx either, they're all cubic voxel solutions. You can't have per voxel physics and smoothing, there's 0 cases of it that I can find.

You would have teardown graphic Donkey Kong and you would just shit on it by saying it looks like Amiga pixel art brought to 3D.