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Halo |OT15| Beta-tested, GAF approved

Dongs Macabre

aka Daedalos42
In hopes of a discussion that isn't meta as hell, what is everyone's thoughts on Waypoint stat tracking for Halo 4?
I preferred Bungie's stat pages. Waypoint's is more complicated than it needs to be, like Halo 4's UI. It looks cool, but it's not as easy to use.
 

Tawpgun

Member
I don't like the idea of reducing aim assist over range, I never have. Halo CE didn't do it, but because the aim assist and magnetism mechanics weren't stupidly easy, and you had to lead your shots, it still took skill to land shots consistently. The aim assist and magnetism in Halo games post Halo CE (outside of Halo 3, which was just sloppy) needed to be toned down and reworked. It's just too damn easy to aim in Halo 4, the aiming mechanics need to be changed overall, not just at different ranges.

I think it is too jarring for their to be an aim assist drop off at a certain range, or needing to scope in to get back your aim assist. In Halo CE, zooming in with the Pistol was for the most part, unnecessary, and actually worse than just being unzoomed and shooting. You could cross map people consistently because the aim assist didn't change its values at medium to long ranges, only at extremely long ranges, where there was none. But, you still had to lead your shots intelligently and aim properly with CE's smooth and consistent, yet skill based aim assist and magnetism. Shadowrun does the same thing with its aiming mechanics, because it is based off the Halo CE engine, and it works beautifully, just like it does in Halo CE.
Hmm...

Aiming is more consistent and leading shots was a great mechanic in Halo CE, but not in Halo 3 where it was sloppy....

I wonder wh- Oh yeah. You played Halo CE over LAN. And Halo 3 over Xbox live.

A lot of the CE Purists around here need a reality check. A lot of the mechanics in CE would lead to frustration in the online space. Shadowrun had plenty of aim assist, and you could add more with smartlink. And, I think it was all hitscan too.

It's a console shooter, it needs aim assist. And it needs a healthy amount. I'm not talking like Halo 2 levels. But enough. Or else a lot of bad players are gonna end up frustrated. We want a healthy population, not some exclusive mecca for super competetive players. However, the difficult thing to do is how to make sure the bad players are satisfied and the good players are allowed to shine. Things like the faster movement/strafe in Halo 2 along with the button glitches was a great example. Even in Halo 3, the strafe and movement was good enough, and aim assist/the leading which was wonky with the netcode led to a solid game for both casual and competetive players.

I'd need to go back and play the other games, but Halo 4 is decent in this regard I think. Talking about Throwdown settings here. The up in movement speed is great. I feel agile, could use less momentum but its solid for the time being.
 

HTupolev

Member
Aiming is more consistent and leading shots was a great mechanic in Halo CE, but not in Halo 3 where it was sloppy....

I wonder wh- Oh yeah. You played Halo CE over LAN. And Halo 3 over Xbox live.
There's a lot more to it than that. Halo 3 has several big factors affecting aim: both projectile travel time and some weird spread for the latter 2 shots in each burst. And it has very poor visual response on shot impacts. Combine that with the poor networking, and it's often impossible to tell where your shots are going/why they aren't hitting/whatever. It's quite opaque even when playing locally, and would even be a very noticeable issue in campaign if most of the enemies weren't so sluggish.

There's a reason Halo 1 has those gigantic pistol shot impact sprites.
 

Gordon

Member
In hopes of a discussion that isn't meta as hell, what is everyone's thoughts on Waypoint stat tracking for Halo 4?
Meh - same as the rest of waypoint's website. Too much fancy animation and not enough usable content. The whole weapon k/ds being separated by gametype thing bugs me. Sometimes it would be nice to be able to whip out a page that says, "I have 52 Pulse grenade kills". I mean, that's the only real value online stat tracking has - use as proof or evidence during discussions. 343 cut back a lot of the totals and summary numbers. I kinda wish they were running a copy of b.net's stat tracking discreetly in the background so we could use the old interface. I don't have anything against being flashy to attract the new players, but the sacrifices of functionality for the sake of flair is so frustrating and so pervasive in this title.

Idea: instead of outsourcing everything to CA and the other random devs they outsourced to, can Halo 5 just be outsourced to Bungie? I don't even care how dumb it sounds - I just want a coherent game.
 
In hopes of a discussion that isn't meta as hell, what is everyone's thoughts on Waypoint stat tracking for Halo 4?

Layout and navigation is very poor, doesn't provide some basic stats like your weapon kills and deaths across all the War Games. It's a mess.

AntiSLRPtrain
 

HTupolev

Member
In hopes of a discussion that isn't meta as hell, what is everyone's thoughts on Waypoint stat tracking for Halo 4?
The inferiority of Waypoint to bungie.net dwarfs even the inferiority of Halo 4's UI to Reach's UI. It's a gigantic, incoherent pile of stuff with an inexplicably animated background and long load times.
 
Tomb Raider is gorgeous people.

But I can't recommend buying it to be honest, not with Bioshock round the corner.

But it deserves to be played.
 
Tomb Raider is gorgeous people.

But I can't recommend buying it to be honest, not with Bioshock round the corner.

But it deserves to be played.

Yeah anything that is coming out anywhere near this Infinite window is just screaming at me to not get a chance in my Xbox.

SimCity and Tom Raider at some later date. And perhaps Gears Judgment (lol not really, just trolling Domino with this one).
 
There are 67 disc-locked content items in Halo 4 (7 armor sets with 6 pieces each, 9 emblems with 9 complimentary backgrounds, 4 helmets, and 3 weapons) that must be unlocked with a combination of 14 retailer-exclusive marketplace codes, 2 SKU-specific marketplace codes, and the War Games Map Pass.

What the fuck, Microsoft? Was Gears of War 3 this bad?

The sad part is that I have all of them unlocked, but I still think it was a bunch of shit for them to do this to Halo. They had more disc-locked content items in Halo 4 than all of the previous Halo games combined, multiplied by 11 (there were six—the flaming Warthog and Honor Guard Wraith in Halo Wars, Sergeant Johnson in ODST, and the Recon Helmet variant, Elite Officer Armor, and Legendary Armor Effect in Reach).

67?

Woah, I doubt that even counts the pre-order perk bullshit that people in Europe had to deal with?

What was up with the stuff you could only get by playing the 7/11 game too? Im guessing those were just helmets or skins?

Must say that I have not really been invested into the aesthetics of my Spartan at all with Halo 4, the unlock system is so... messy, its hard to keep track of what I want, what unlocks what and when something is actually unlocked... as opposed to available to unlock. Grouping would have gone a long way and so would intergrating the challenge info into the armours page.

None of the armours or skins look that great anyway to be honest. None of them really stand out in combat either.
 

Gordon

Member
I got all those and I don't even use them, is the app offer still going? If so I could definitely get some more codes for GAF.
Naw it shut down a while ago. Otherwise I would have offered already. They indicated they might relaunch with new unlocks down the road though, so you never know.
 
the unlock system is so... messy, its hard to keep track of what I want, what unlocks what and when something is actually unlocked... as opposed to available to unlock.

Yeah what's with not knowing what comes with each specialization besides a pic of the armor? I shouldn't have to go online to know what comes with what. I was also surprised there wasn't a command prompt to choose my specialization when I reached SR 50. If I followed Halo 4 like I do with most titles (just watch trailers and the occasional gameplay), I wouldn't have had a clue on what to do. Specializations as a whole is very anti-user friendly.
 

Booshka

Member
Hmm...

Aiming is more consistent and leading shots was a great mechanic in Halo CE, but not in Halo 3 where it was sloppy....

I wonder wh- Oh yeah. You played Halo CE over LAN. And Halo 3 over Xbox live.

A lot of the CE Purists around here need a reality check. A lot of the mechanics in CE would lead to frustration in the online space. Shadowrun had plenty of aim assist, and you could add more with smartlink. And, I think it was all hitscan too.

It's a console shooter, it needs aim assist. And it needs a healthy amount. I'm not talking like Halo 2 levels. But enough. Or else a lot of bad players are gonna end up frustrated. We want a healthy population, not some exclusive mecca for super competetive players. However, the difficult thing to do is how to make sure the bad players are satisfied and the good players are allowed to shine. Things like the faster movement/strafe in Halo 2 along with the button glitches was a great example. Even in Halo 3, the strafe and movement was good enough, and aim assist/the leading which was wonky with the netcode led to a solid game for both casual and competetive players.

I'd need to go back and play the other games, but Halo 4 is decent in this regard I think. Talking about Throwdown settings here. The up in movement speed is great. I feel agile, could use less momentum but its solid for the time being.

I've spent plenty of time playing Halo CE over XBC, and the aiming is still fine. Halo 3 is sloppy on LAN to me, I hate the way it plays. Shadowrun is not hitscan by the way, you have to lead shots similarly to Halo CE, especially with weapons like the SMG and Pistol, the Rifle needs leading as well. There wasn't much more aim assist in Shadowrun, it is very close to Halo CE, and Smartlink is a non-issue because it is an ability with counters and has to be purchased and mapped. Smartlink also doesn't add a ton of aim assist to long rage battles, it is only really good in close-mid fights.

I don't know what reality check I need. Halo CE is the best playing Halo game, with the best aiming mechanics; subsequent Halo games should try to go back to its style of gameplay. I've always heard that Halo CE would be frustrating over Live, and I laugh because I have more fun playing CE at 100 ping over XBC, than I ever have enjoyed any other Halo on LAN. Shadowrun's netcode handles the Halo CE engine just fine, game runs smooth and aiming is great.
 

HTupolev

Member
The field of view in ODST is wondrous. Why can't we have that in a pvp Halo game?
Halo 1's FoV is normalized pretty much identically to ODST's. Obviously CE's fullscreen is lower than ODST's widescreen, but if CE had a 16:9 mode it would have been just about the same as ODST's widescreen. And split-screen is glorious in both; if you're playing CE with 2 people on each console, each player gets almost 110 degrees of awesomeness.
 
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