Havok Check-In: Dynamic Destruction with Havok Physics Example

CamHostage

CamHostage

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Havok, the OG physics engine provider, posted a new video this week advertising its current Dynamic Destruction system. Their YT page has otherwise been quiet for years aside from a few tradeshow tech talks, so although this video probably won't rock your world (..even though it does have a lot of rocks,) it's interesting to see a renewed push on the Havok front.



I'm not sure what brought Havok back out from underground (technically Havok never went away, but you likely haven't heard the name in a long while, even though it's foundational to this year's GOTY candidates) but I'm encouraged to see them promoting their stuff.

Havok was for a while a "Unity thing" in many minds since Epic had its own Chaos Physics while Unity had partnered to include Havok back in 2019 (around the same time Epic revealed Chaos and begun swapping Chaos for the previous PhysX.) Havok was also acquired by MS in 2015, and that probably changed some things too. However, now Havok can be integrated into UE5 projects (...and given the frustration of Chaos performance over its time, some developers still long for Havok or PhysX over Epic's included system) and as mentioned it still powers aspects of many custom-engine projects like Starfield, CoD, No Man's Sky, Spidey 2, and the aforementioned Zelda TotK and AstroBot.
 
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That fat robotic ass
You Look Good Reaction GIF by Bounce
 
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Meanwhile, Chaos is still improving. It's never been juiced enough to give gamers that "everything everywhere is destructible!!" promise from the original GDC 2019 demo, and compared to lighting and polygons, it's been the least-promoted feature of UE5 in new tech talks outside of its animation/cloth systems and more subtle sims, but Epic hasn't forgotten Chaos. Epic talked a tiny bit about the Chaos and Niagara roadmap at the recent Seattle Unreal Fest. What I'd love to see is a kind of breakthrough of "The Nanite of Physics" like what MegaLights promises to do for increased numbers of light sources... so far, though, it's just tweaks and refreshes and of course some AI promises.



And PhysiX is still around too. Nvidia (who owns it) actually open-sourced PhysX 5 a few years ago, and PhysX is integrated into OmniVerse so that objects built and offered through that service have proper physical properties for "SimReady" objects. They're thinking 'beyond' games (PhysX doesn't even list itself as a game engine feature anymore,) but it's out there.



...Still need some big games to reimagine what's possible with physics (and/or game developers just falling back in love with shit blowing up and crumbling down for mostly no real game purpose,) without that it doesn't matter what tech is out there. But the physical force has been quiet this gen, and maybe we'll get some more power out of new developments going on in this field.
 
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I love anything that doesn't make the game world feel as static as it did in Ghost of Tsushima for example. I don't need the whole world breaking to sell me on the illusion, but give me at least something that makes me feel like I have an effect on the world. That's one thing Batman Arkham Knight did well when you drove around Gotham in the Batmobile.
 
KyoZz said:
HOLD ON HOLD ON

THAT SOUND

Comedy GIF by WE tv




Havok X Half Life 3?

www.neogaf.com

Join me into full Half-Life 3 copium madness

Mainly the community of Half-Life went totally insane with the Mike Shapiro tweet, the voice actor of G-man. This tweet #Valve #Halflife #GMan #2025 The image he's showing is an album cover for his music. WTF? Ok dead end. Done and gone. Now, before we continue, put on your tinfoil hat...
www.neogaf.com www.neogaf.com

TintoConCasera TintoConCasera Buggy Loop Buggy Loop
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I knew I recognized that sound. But now that I hear it clear in that sound clip, I realize it's also the nuke sound from MW2. Stock sound.

What about the other sound in that sequence? I recognize that too.
 
Not enough cool tech demo shit in this thread, probably (I was hoping the trailer would be more exciting when I found it, but it is what it is,) so here's a bonus clip from GDC 2024. It shows what Havok believes is the benefit of integrating Havok into UE5 and getting the best of both Havok and Chaos. Pretty cool ground-collapse at the end of this sequence.

 
Trilobit said:
I love anything that doesn't make the game world feel as static as it did in Ghost of Tsushima for example. I don't need the whole world breaking to sell me on the illusion, but give me at least something that makes me feel like I have an effect on the world. That's one thing Batman Arkham Knight did well when you drove around Gotham in the Batmobile.
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Hey now, the grass blew around in Ghosts….


Give me this over lighting any day.
 
Trilobit said:
I love anything that doesn't make the game world feel as static as it did in Ghost of Tsushima for example. I don't need the whole world breaking to sell me on the illusion, but give me at least something that makes me feel like I have an effect on the world. That's one thing Batman Arkham Knight did well when you drove around Gotham in the Batmobile.
Click to expand...

the destructibility in Arkham Knight was insane for its time... but the game in general was technologically far beyond anything ever done in UE3 before and after it.

bjtcwmocazjjzzgehjes.gif
 
KyoZz said:
HOLD ON HOLD ON

THAT SOUND

Comedy GIF by WE tv




Havok X Half Life 3?

www.neogaf.com

Join me into full Half-Life 3 copium madness

Mainly the community of Half-Life went totally insane with the Mike Shapiro tweet, the voice actor of G-man. This tweet #Valve #Halflife #GMan #2025 The image he's showing is an album cover for his music. WTF? Ok dead end. Done and gone. Now, before we continue, put on your tinfoil hat...
www.neogaf.com www.neogaf.com

TintoConCasera TintoConCasera Buggy Loop Buggy Loop
Click to expand...

Yes man like literally. It's not just the sound. Rumors of half life 3 having new full destruction physics has been going around for awhile and now havok has this? Source 2. Cmon yall. This is it.

Idc about Rubikon, keep the faith.
 
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It looked cool, but I wasn't amazed. Which is good, because it means it's not "bullshot". Would be nice if more modern games had this.
Though I must add, Havok was unbelievable back in the Max Payne 2 and HL2 days.
 
The_Observer said:
Though I must add, Havok was unbelievable back in the Max Payne 2 and HL2 days.
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This cannot be overstated. Man, the part in HL2 where it overcharges the Gravity Gun in the Citadel and you just cause chaos and destruction is one of the coolest in any FPS.
 
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The_Observer said:
It looked cool, but I wasn't amazed. Which is good, because it means it's not "bullshot". Would be nice if more modern games had this.
Though I must add, Havok was unbelievable back in the Max Payne 2 and HL2 days.
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The combo of havok\ragdoll was a revolution, when i first saw hl2 or psi-ops i was mesmerized.
 
Why is ibizapiciolla giving emphaty emoticons?

Did your physics teacher touched you in your special place during college?
 
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Underpowered console cpu's are to blame i guess, but recent games atleast tried to make some progress, one can think about valeguard many things but the physics for long hair and its colition with the body is state of the art at the moment, and will atleast remain there until the hair of GTA6 in the trailers.
 
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KyoZz said:
HOLD ON HOLD ON

THAT SOUND

Comedy GIF by WE tv




Havok X Half Life 3?

www.neogaf.com

Join me into full Half-Life 3 copium madness

Mainly the community of Half-Life went totally insane with the Mike Shapiro tweet, the voice actor of G-man. This tweet #Valve #Halflife #GMan #2025 The image he's showing is an album cover for his music. WTF? Ok dead end. Done and gone. Now, before we continue, put on your tinfoil hat...
www.neogaf.com www.neogaf.com

TintoConCasera TintoConCasera Buggy Loop Buggy Loop
Click to expand...

Valve developed their own physics engine for Alyx. It's better than Havok
 
I only tried Chaos physics (UE5) and Bullet physics (open source), but will have a look at Havok.
From what I can see, Havok and Chaos are CPU only, whereas Bullet supports GPU for collision detection and rigid body dynamics, which is huge.
So I will run benchmarks but my guess is that Bullet is the winner still.
 
This isn't impressive at all ... There no fucking weight it's like I'm playing elden ring and rolling through shit and it gets caught on my leg and I keep walking normally
 
If these shattered pieces had actually some weight, wouldn't looks too bad. Still worst than what physics looked in late 2010, but considering how backwards we are gone in this aspect with modern games, is better than nothing.
 
Ribi said:
There no fucking weight it's like I'm playing elden ring and rolling through shit and it gets caught on my leg and I keep walking normally
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Well, yeah, you keep walking normally... it's a video game.

I mean, would could be cool if a game had physics systems robust enough that objects moved and reacted exactly as we expected, and it certainly looks lame when physics systems hitch up and let objects stick on moving bodies, but game designers want you to play, not to futz with the burdens of reality. They put just enough realism in that scenes are dynamic and do most of the things that are cool to see happen most of the time, but the priority is always the player. If a character gets stuck on physical objects or the gameplay is impeded by physics getting in the way, the player will not have a good time.

Here's an experiment to try at home: out in your garage or by the fence, you probably have a stack of old 2X4s and 1bys and dowels and odds-and-ends of wood teepeed up to the wall, right? So, take that stack and just throw it all haphazardly on the ground. Maybe take a cinderblock or a patio stone and toss it on top.

Now, step back and run through that rubble...

It's a problem, right? Second experiment: stand on that same pile of loose junk, and use a broomstick to pretend you're fighting that tennis ball on a rope hanging from the rafters to keep your wife from driving through the back wall.
Not so graceful, I take it?


1000_F_293558132_QvIgjFvZh3LmjrwGBB6VAgEx8xofvFkB.jpg


Thing is, the reality of physics in a pile of trash (or in game engine parlance, rigid bodies,) isn't as fun as the theatrics or heroics involved in playing a video game. Could a game designer use inverse kinematics and physics models to fully simulate all those objects and the character avatar interacting with each other, really QWOP that shit into reality? I'm not sure yet, but maybe, but my guess would be that even if they could, it'd not be nearly as fun as smiting an ogre or jumping across a chasm or shooting a gun or whatever else you like to do in a game. Designers only simulate what makes a game fun. They also let physics 'sim casual' or run with limited parameters when it's better for the gameplay to deprioitize the accuracy of the simulation for the sake of the play. If for 2 seconds, you think to yourself, "man, that's bullshit, I just stepped through those logs like they were nothing and walked normally", that's a small price to pay compared to whatever you'd spend if your character actually had to step through or over debris wearing 60 pounds of armor and carrying an oversized 24" broadsword.

For sure I would like to see Havok (or whatever physics system) experiments that were better about the actual makeup of objects when calculating weight and inertia and bounce (although a lot of that comes down to how the designer uses it,) but the priority always will be and always has to be the fun of playing it.
 
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Kinds of looks underwhelming even compared to decade old tech its not impressive...says a lot about the state of physics development in the industry. Hell the truth is even this underwhelming level of tech will never be utilized because games will ignore physics.
 
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kevboard said:
the destructibility in Arkham Knight was insane for its time... but the game in general was technologically far beyond anything ever done in UE3 before and after it.

bjtcwmocazjjzzgehjes.gif
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The OG of the series probably left the studio. That was the last great thing from them, and it's been a decade now, and² even thou it's two engines before, it's better looking the a lot of AAA games now
 
It's a bit dissapointing that we did not see allot of games with advance physics especially, enviromental interaction and destructable environments. This generation has focus so much there resources on Raytracing that fewer games allot resources for physics. Its almost like we are back to prerendered environment. That is why Im impress with Astrobot. The physics is fantastic.
 
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