"Health care" bill withdrawn due to lack of votes

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ferr said:
It's a tough blow, but so what? Is it going to lead to an impeachment? It will hurt the GOP in 2018 for sure. But him losing constantly isn't going to get him out of office early. Even if his support went to 0, he'd still have exec power for the remainder of his term. Unless it means an impeachment due to a 2018 congress shift.
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Some people care more about not having their health care taken away then politics as sports. This shit aint about Trump. And I want him gone as bad as anyone.
 
jmdajr said:
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Trump can't even hold that smile before turning away
 
Socivol said:
Most of those are Red States so if ACA explodes it's going to effect those conservative states even more.
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their calculus is simply that if the ACA fails (and it really does need changes) people will blame Obama instead of the party with the power to do something about it

I mean, Trump flat out said this was his thinking a week or two ago -- we even had a thread
 
Steve Youngblood said:
Re: the bolded

That's... kind of the point. I don't even really understand your post. While an impeachment or resignation would certainly be welcome, that's not really necessary at this point. Just seeing him fail is about as much as you can hope for. Taking your point one step further, I could ask you the same question. "OK, they've proven that Donald Trump was colluding with the Russians and he's getting impeached. So what? You're just getting Mike Pence in charge."
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at this point I am not sure which I prefer.

a trump who can't get anything done but could say something stupid and trigger WW3 over twitter.

or a Pence who actually might be able to actually get some stuff done but isn't likely to start the end of times because he can't shut up.

a week ago it would have been pence, but after this trump's support has to drop quite a bit which will make it harder to pass things.
 
sangreal said:
It hasn't happened yet. Trump is betting that when it does, people will blame Obama and not him. History shows otherwise
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If it does collapse it isn't going to happen tomorrow. It will take several years and be slow and painful. Does he really think that just watching it burn and pretending that there's no other option but ashes and cinders is a viable strategy?

Trump's supporters believed that the "repeal and replace" promise was a pledge to introduce something better while Trump is acting like they should be sad that he's not taking away their coverage right now.
 
remember when the worry was that trump was going to throw red meat to his base and moderates by "fulfilling all of his promises" in an empty fashion immediately after he got into office, and then the narrative would be that he did what he promised even if it never materialized
 
ferr said:
It's a tough blow, but so what? Is it going to lead to an impeachment? It will hurt the GOP in 2018 for sure. But him losing constantly isn't going to get him out of office early. Even if his support went to 0, he'd still have exec power for the remainder of his term. Unless it means an impeachment due to a 2018 congress shift.
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So what? For one, people don't have to be scared to lose their health care.

Secondly, the more ineffectual this unqualified turf becomes the better the country will be for it, even it he's not impeached. If his entire term is filled with incompetence and infighting and that prevents him from passing any meaningful legislation that's a win.
 
Saint Gregory said:
If it does collapse it isn't going to happen tomorrow. It will take several years and be slow and painful. Does he really think that just watching it burn and pretending that there's no other option but ashes and cinders is a viable strategy?

Trump's supporters believed that the "repeal and replace" promise was a pledge to introduce something better while Trump is acting like they should be sad that he's not taking away their coverage right now.
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It's almost guaranteed that some insurers will pull out of the marketplace this year (some already have), and rates increase every year (even pre-ACA)

The ACA really does need serious fixes. What Trump doesn't get is that this is his job, and he can't pass the buck anymore
 
On the campaign trail:
- I WILL IMMEDIATELY REPEAL AND REPLACE OBAMACARE

In the white house:
- Uhhh, I think we need to let Obama run a little longer, its going to get worse, and I think we need to let it. Its not like I said I would do it within 64 days anyway.



WINNING.
 
EmCeeGramr said:
remember when the worry was that trump was going to throw red meat to his base and moderates by "fulfilling all of his promises" in an empty fashion immediately after he got into office, and then the narrative would be that he did what he promised even if it never materialized
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I mean, he did try that approach. It just didn't really work
 
Steve Youngblood said:
I'm honestly still amazed that they couldn't get this thing out of the fucking House. This wasn't even the hard part.
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it did indeed make me happy to learn that there are at least a few good people left in the republicans.

I mean if that wasn't the case they would have just made the bill more extreme to get the FC holdouts.

at the very least we have an idea of who these people are.

with any luck trump in a fit of anger over this loss decides that pledging to vote no is the same as voting no and tries his best to make their lives hell (only to have the people rally behind them and for it to not work of course) and make it so that the house majority effectively flips as those people constantly get in trumps way due to his attacks against them.
 
jmdajr said:
Trump could join with Moderate GOPers and DEMs to like, do some nice things.

But you know, Fantasy world.
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I really don't think he can. The people that elected these Freedom Caucus idiots are his base. The people wearing #MAGA hats weren't moderate republicans and democrats.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
So what? For one, people don't have to be scared to lose their health care.

Secondly, the more ineffectual this unqualified turf becomes the better the country will be for it, even it he's not impeached. If his entire term is filled with incompetence and infighting and that prevents him from passing any meaningful legislation that's a win.
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Pretty much this.

A Zero-Sum Trump Presidency is the next best thing to an Impeached Trump Presidency. Could even be preferable. A Pence/Speaker president could have enough political ability to pass something.

Though, the Climate Denial of this administration probably still screws us all.
 
D4Danger said:
what's funny is Trump would probably accept something like a single payer because it's easy to understand.
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Trump will accept anything that makes it look like he accomplished something. He didn't read a page of this bill, and he won't read a page of any other

smokeymicpot said:
White House officials, advisers say Trump is not that upset. He was far angrier about travel ban, Sessions recusal, inauguration crowd size.

https://twitter.com/jdawsey1/status/845386061949915142
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Trump not upset about losing? Nah. It just hasn't hit him yet. He said himself that he thought this bill took a good political argument away from Republicans. He is in for a surprise when he realizes the long term effects of not being able to pass a single piece of major legislation
 
sangreal said:
their calculus is simply that if the ACA fails (and it really does need changes) people will blame Obama instead of the party with the power to do something about it

I mean, Trump flat out said this was his thinking a week or two ago -- we even had a thread
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But those states wouldn't vote Democratic regardless so would it really hurt the Democratic party? I feel like if you see you have reps that are Republican and they have done nothing you would be more likely to vote them out versus blaming a Democrat for the issue. This also takes into account being somewhat intelligent so I'm unsure how that would play out with that subset of the population.
 
sangreal said:
Trump will accept anything that makes it look like he accomplished something. He didn't read a page of this bill, and he won't read a page of any other



Trump not upset about losing? Nah
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Read it again and realize he was more mad about crowd size.
 
sangreal said:
It's almost guaranteed that some insurers will pull out of the marketplace this year (some already have), and rates increase every year (even pre-ACA)

The ACA really does need serious fixes. What Trump doesn't get is that this is his job, and he can't pass the buck anymore
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Congress needs to put the money back into the risk-corridors program that Marco Rubio ripped out of the ACA. Put that money back in there and the insurers will come back.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
So what? For one, people don't have to be scared to lose their health care.

Secondly, the more ineffectual this unqualified turf becomes the better the country will be for it, even it he's not impeached. If his entire term is filled with incompetence and infighting and that prevents him from passing any meaningful legislation that's a win.
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By so what, I meant about the tough blow. Not 'so what' as far as the ACA staying in. My point was, so what if it's a tough blow- what good is a tough blow when it's not going to change anything about him having executive power for at least the next couple of years.
 
Chris Coons on CNN. I actually liked his little slogan for the ACA. "Mend it, not end it." Simple.

They should push that out as a rallying cry to addressing ACA issues.
 
ferr said:
By so what, I meant about the tough blow. Not 'so what' as far as the ACA staying in. My point was, so what if it's a tough blow- what good is a tough blow when it's not going to change anything about him having executive power for at least the next couple of years.
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Well, I mean his executive power includes key executive orders that get blocked by the judiciary and the lack of political capital to rally his own party to pass a bill they all campaigned on. You're really staking out a bizarre position here.
 
ferr said:
By so what, I meant about the tough blow. Not 'so what' as far as the ACA staying in. My point was, so what if it's a tough blow- what good is a tough blow when it's not going to change anything about him having executive power for at least the next couple of years.
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You're making zero sense. Every failure makes Trump a more ineffectual executive, which handicaps his ability to enact the vile shit that's next on his agenda.

If he can't do something the Republicans have run on for the past decade, then how can he even come close to building the wall or cutting taxes for the 1%?

If anything less than impeachment merits a puzzlingly defeatist "so what?" then it's no wonder he got elected in the first place.
 
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