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[PflargBlarg]

Yeah, I think I'd just really like to get rid of it and stick with my indexes. It annoys me to see it sitting there in my portfolio.

All my investments are in tax sheltered accounts so I don't think that tax loss harvesting is relevant here.

I'll likely sell it off and reinvest it back into the index funds the next time I make a contribution.

 

[Randolph Freelander]

Yeah, I think I'd just really like to get rid of it and stick with my indexes. It annoys me to see it sitting there in my portfolio.

All my investments are in tax sheltered accounts so I don't think that tax loss harvesting is relevant here.

I'll likely sell it off and reinvest it back into the index funds the next time I make a contribution.

Bottom line, ignore the loss, focus on the asset. If you're in energy and don't want to be in energy (because you are not confident in it going forward or you just want broader diversification), then get out of energy. The money you've gained or lost is irrelevant, because I agree with tokkun that you could fall into the trap of wanting to make back what you've lost (and maybe never doing it). If you think more diversified funds are where you need to be, then get there.

 

[Randolph Freelander]

The annual reevaluation of 401K and IRA contributions came out a few days ago.

Summary: no changes to contribution limits. 401K individual contributions limited to $18,000 in 2016 (catch-up contribution $6,000 for those above 50). IRA limit $5,500 (plus catch-up of $1,000).

More information can be found here.

 

[anonymous_abc]

I saw this interesting graph today.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I saw this interesting graph today.

Was this part of an article? It's in line with other data I've seen but I'd like to read the source.

My end of month numbers are much happier than last month.

 

[Walter White Walker]

Was this part of an article? It's in line with other data I've seen but I'd like to read the source.

My end of month numbers are much happier than last month.

The day is young and the S&P 500 could still drop 200 points today! Have a little faith!

I wonder if that chart is also including the high fees that active funds charge, or if the loss to fees is additional.

 

[TangoAlphaLima]

I wonder if that chart is also including the high fees that active funds charge, or if the loss to fees is additional.

Fees should always be baked in to the returns. I'd presume that front loads should also be baked into these comparisons as well, and those are pretty much always a bad idea, and may be part of the reason why index funds did so much better in that study. An actively managed fund that takes a 5% front load, for example, would have to perform extremely well over a 5 year period to beat a reasonably well performing index fund.

The same can also probably be said about comparing index and actively managed funds by looking at a small 5 year window in which the economy recovered greatly. When everyone is performing well, it's harder for an actively managed fund to stand out. But when looking long term, there's more of an opportunity to distinguish returns.

There's been a fair amount of anti-actively managed fund talk lately in the news, but there was an article in Kiplinger's a few months ago suggesting that they're possibly undervalued in the current climate. Just watch out for the front loads and high annual fees, and pick historically well actively managed funds and you'll be fine.

 

[anonymous_abc]

Was this part of an article? It's in line with other data I've seen but I'd like to read the source.

My end of month numbers are much happier than last month.

No sorry it was out of context.

 

[Wellington]

Was this part of an article? It's in line with other data I've seen but I'd like to read the source.

My end of month numbers are much happier than last month.

Just did mine, more evidence to just not even look at the gyrations of the market. Glad I kept blindly contributing as much as I normally do.

End of the year is approaching, make sure to max out all tax advantaged accounts.

 

[mercenar1e]

what do you guys recommend for something a bit shorter term (3-4 years) im looking to save up for a down payment on a home and i was wondering what's the best route to take?

 

[GhaleonEB]

The day is young and the S&P 500 could still drop 200 points today! Have a little faith!

I wonder if that chart is also including the high fees that active funds charge, or if the loss to fees is additional.

Well despite my best efforts I didn't torpedo the markets too hard. Still down for the year, but a nice bounce from the lows of the past few months. We'll see how long it lasts.

No sorry it was out of context.

No worries, thanks for passing it on.

Just did mine, more evidence to just not even look at the gyrations of the market. Glad I kept blindly contributing as much as I normally do.

End of the year is approaching, make sure to max out all tax advantaged accounts.

One nice thing about steady regular investing is I bought a decent amount when things were down the past couple months, so the bounce back hit that much more strongly. Market drops just mean we get a discount, and it's nice to see that swing back the other way.

 

[Zips]

Anyone got mutual funds they'd recommend?

I don't like the management fee, but here in Canada there doesn't seem to be much in the way of options. The bank I've used in the past (RBC) has never impressed me with the performance of their funds either. They all seem to be so low. My best performing fund is a conservative one that's up about 10% over what I've put into it over like 5+ years.

I've finished all major expenses except for eventually buying a bigger place, so I'm looking to put more into my investments for retirement. Otherwise just saving for the down payment on a bigger place in maybe 5-ish years.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Anyone got mutual funds they'd recommend?

I don't like the management fee, but here in Canada there doesn't seem to be much in the way of options. The bank I've used in the past (RBC) has never impressed me with the performance of their funds either. They all seem to be so low. My best performing fund is a conservative one that's up about 10% over what I've put into it over like 5+ years.

I've finished all major expenses except for eventually buying a bigger place, so I'm looking to put more into my investments for retirement. Otherwise just saving for the down payment on a bigger place in maybe 5-ish years.

I suggest reading the OP, but the short answer is - index funds, specifically Vanguard or Fidelity for their low fees.

 

[cbf123]

Fantastic topic, guys! I've read from the first page through, and in that time I've setup a Stocks and Shares ISA (UKGAF) which I now put my money into each month, specifically a Vanguard Total Index fund (heavily weighted towards this) and a Vanguard Pacific Ex-Japan fund (I can't seem to find a Total International equiv. with my ISA provider, Hargreaves Lansdown).

I'll be looking through more to see if I can find something with a better balance, but after a lot of reading up, I'm reasonably happy in these early days of my savings to be aiming mostly towards that US market option, and to probably add a separate European option as some point, too.

The actual question that I have is this: as I've been looking into all of this, I've really become very interested in the whole idea of the Markets and different funds, stock types etc. I know that you guys on here are pretty much set with going for passive funds (and I'm with you on this for the most part, too - my highest fee is .23% currently, the US one is only 0.10%), but are there really ANY times when you'd recommend looking to active funds also?

I know this thread is really geared towards retirement, and I plan to use this money as my retirement pot, but say there was a managed fund that had consistently performed well as far as returns went over a 5 year period, but had a +.75% management fee, would it be worthwhile to take something like this on as a short-term 'cash builder' for 5 years or so (with all the potential pitfalls the market can throw up acknowledged) or would you still just keep away and lock into the passives? I know I'm not supposed to check my accounts all the time, but I'm really REALLY fascinated by all this now, and I'm on Morningstar and CNBC and Bloomberg everyday just in awe at how little attention I'd paid to such a major thing.

Sorry for the long ass post, and again, huge thanks for putting this thread together. You've literally helped to change my entire perspective on my money and my future. Not often a GAF thread does that! Well, maybe that one about sandwiches the other week, but...

 

[RumblingRosco]

-

 

[Zips]

I suggest reading the OP, but the short answer is - index funds, specifically Vanguard or Fidelity for their low fees.

I had - I was just confused as it seemed directed at US members. I see Vanguard has a Canadian wing via Google search, so I could use that then.

I'm a bit unsure of how to go about actually investing through Vanguard, and even how to pick which of their index funds to go with. There's still so many to pick from (https://www.vanguardcanada.ca/advisors/etfs/etfs.htm).

To invest, I have to set up an account with them directly? Or do I go through someone/thing else? I haven't found directions on their site yet, if there are any, or in the OP (though there's alot of info there so I may have missed it - I'll keep looking).

The OP seems to advise especially broad indexes, if I understand correctly. Vanguard's S&P 500 Index ETF (CAD-hedged) seems to have done pretty well over time, and seems like a good candidate, but if it's investing into American stocks wouldn't I lose alot from currency conversion right now? I'm not even sure how that works. I was thinking to maybe get a mix of Canadian-focused and american-focused indexes.

When picking, the main things to consider are just what the historical performance has been, and what things the investments are divided into? I feel like that's simplistic and likely a poor way to look at things, but it's all I've had to go off of.

 

[ameratsu]

Zips, check out canadiancouchpotato.com, it helped me a lot when i wanted to get out of a high MER mutual fund.

 

[tokkun]

The OP seems to advise especially broad indexes, if I understand correctly. Vanguard's S&P 500 Index ETF (CAD-hedged) seems to have done pretty well over time, and seems like a good candidate, but if it's investing into American stocks wouldn't I lose alot from currency conversion right now? I'm not even sure how that works. I was thinking to maybe get a mix of Canadian-focused and american-focused indexes.

If you buy a CAD-hedged fund you don't need to worry about the exchange rate. That is the sole purpose of that type of hedging.

 

[Piecake]

I had - I was just confused as it seemed directed at US members. I see Vanguard has a Canadian wing via Google search, so I could use that then.

I'm a bit unsure of how to go about actually investing through Vanguard, and even how to pick which of their index funds to go with. There's still so many to pick from (https://www.vanguardcanada.ca/advisors/etfs/etfs.htm).

To invest, I have to set up an account with them directly? Or do I go through someone/thing else? I haven't found directions on their site yet, if there are any, or in the OP (though there's alot of info there so I may have missed it - I'll keep looking).

The OP seems to advise especially broad indexes, if I understand correctly. Vanguard's S&P 500 Index ETF (CAD-hedged) seems to have done pretty well over time, and seems like a good candidate, but if it's investing into American stocks wouldn't I lose alot from currency conversion right now? I'm not even sure how that works. I was thinking to maybe get a mix of Canadian-focused and american-focused indexes.

When picking, the main things to consider are just what the historical performance has been, and what things the investments are divided into? I feel like that's simplistic and likely a poor way to look at things, but it's all I've had to go off of.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=136790344&postcount=1519

You might find this post informative.

I wouldnt look at historical performance. I would look at the expense ratio and how diversified the index fund is. The expense ratio can be predicted, but the future performance of the fund that you are investing in cannot.

As for investing in a bunch of Canadian funds, home-market bias is a real thing. It doesnt impact Americans too much because the American economy is just so huge and diversified, but an economy like Canada is tilted heavily towards natural resources and finance. You would be over-exposed to those sectors and the Canadian economy if you invested a greater percentage than what the Canadian economy represents on a global scale.

Fantastic topic, guys! I've read from the first page through, and in that time I've setup a Stocks and Shares ISA (UKGAF) which I now put my money into each month, specifically a Vanguard Total Index fund (heavily weighted towards this) and a Vanguard Pacific Ex-Japan fund (I can't seem to find a Total International equiv. with my ISA provider, Hargreaves Lansdown).

I'll be looking through more to see if I can find something with a better balance, but after a lot of reading up, I'm reasonably happy in these early days of my savings to be aiming mostly towards that US market option, and to probably add a separate European option as some point, too.

The actual question that I have is this: as I've been looking into all of this, I've really become very interested in the whole idea of the Markets and different funds, stock types etc. I know that you guys on here are pretty much set with going for passive funds (and I'm with you on this for the most part, too - my highest fee is .23% currently, the US one is only 0.10%), but are there really ANY times when you'd recommend looking to active funds also?

I know this thread is really geared towards retirement, and I plan to use this money as my retirement pot, but say there was a managed fund that had consistently performed well as far as returns went over a 5 year period, but had a +.75% management fee, would it be worthwhile to take something like this on as a short-term 'cash builder' for 5 years or so (with all the potential pitfalls the market can throw up acknowledged) or would you still just keep away and lock into the passives? I know I'm not supposed to check my accounts all the time, but I'm really REALLY fascinated by all this now, and I'm on Morningstar and CNBC and Bloomberg everyday just in awe at how little attention I'd paid to such a major thing.

Sorry for the long ass post, and again, huge thanks for putting this thread together. You've literally helped to change my entire perspective on my money and my future. Not often a GAF thread does that! Well, maybe that one about sandwiches the other week, but...

I personally do not think it is worth it to invest in an actively managed fund. For one, I think the data on mutual funds heavily suggests that a lot of it is luck. And even if it isnt, and a fund manager is particularly talented, once that talent is known to the general investor that fund will already be washed with cash and investments, making it more difficult for the fund to keep getting those returns. I just don't think it is worth it.

 

[SapientWolf]

Personally, I'd just find the highest rate CD, money market account, or MAYBE US government bonds/treasuries I could find. I'd probably just see what I can find in CDs, which will likely not even keep with inflation unfortunately.

Basically, its really difficult to find a short term, safe, inflation-beating investment. Maybe someone else here has an idea, but I can't think of anything.

I've heard that retirement income funds (like VTINX) are good for this, and I haven't lost any money in those, but everything took a big beating this year so that throws the numbers off. The good news is that there isn't much inflation right now.

 

[Mr.Mike]

The actual question that I have is this: as I've been looking into all of this, I've really become very interested in the whole idea of the Markets and different funds, stock types etc. I know that you guys on here are pretty much set with going for passive funds (and I'm with you on this for the most part, too - my highest fee is .23% currently, the US one is only 0.10%), but are there really ANY times when you'd recommend looking to active funds also?

I feel like active management makes sense in markets that aren't efficient. So investing in a actively managed fund that invests in US large caps (super efficient market) is mostly just a waste (tbh, most active funds in this space probably more or less move with the market anyway, but then charge a huge MER). On the contrary a space like developing market small caps would be a lot less efficient, and would present a lot more opportunities to beat "the market". It's also a space where you really want to do your due diligence before investing money into. Due diligence is something you should always do really, but there's probably not many companies in the S&P 500 that are some sort of scam, or don't even actually exist. Not really so with emerging markets small caps. So in such cases I think that paying a high MER might be worth it for the value add of having people do that due diligence and pick out the "good" stocks, rather than just going in and buying a bit of everything (indexing).

Of course these inefficient markets that might actually benefit from active management are also inherently way more risky than large cap equities. But along with the risk there might also be a much higher potential reward.

PS. I am not at all an expert or anything.

 

[cbf123]

Piecake, Mr.Mike - thanks for your input. I had generally thought as much from my past couple of weeks of digging through this thread, but it is good to have firm opinions to back things up.

I'll be keeping an eye on things here for sure. Can't thank you guys enough.

 

[PflargBlarg]

I had - I was just confused as it seemed directed at US members. I see Vanguard has a Canadian wing via Google search, so I could use that then.

I'm a bit unsure of how to go about actually investing through Vanguard, and even how to pick which of their index funds to go with. There's still so many to pick from (https://www.vanguardcanada.ca/advisors/etfs/etfs.htm).

To invest, I have to set up an account with them directly? Or do I go through someone/thing else? I haven't found directions on their site yet, if there are any, or in the OP (though there's alot of info there so I may have missed it - I'll keep looking).

The OP seems to advise especially broad indexes, if I understand correctly. Vanguard's S&P 500 Index ETF (CAD-hedged) seems to have done pretty well over time, and seems like a good candidate, but if it's investing into American stocks wouldn't I lose alot from currency conversion right now? I'm not even sure how that works. I was thinking to maybe get a mix of Canadian-focused and american-focused indexes.

When picking, the main things to consider are just what the historical performance has been, and what things the investments are divided into? I feel like that's simplistic and likely a poor way to look at things, but it's all I've had to go off of.

You've already been directed to my big post for Canadians but I can speak to the things you mention here specifically.

I personally go for the fewest funds possible that are heavily diversified. For Canadians using ETFs that means your options are VXC for global exposure (minus Canada) and VCN for Canadian exposure. Now, you can see on Canadian Couch Potato that he recommends quite a large percentage into VCN which I find odd, but home bias is a thing. I keep myself to 10% in VCN which is still overinvested in Canada relative to their percentage of the global market, but I think it's fairly reasonable.

VXC just recently expanded their holdings into Chinese markets which is great.

I haven't gone looking for it at the moment, but there's a blog post on Canadian Couch Potato that recommends against hedged funds and lays out some good reasons. I think you can probably find it with some googling.

Like has been said, looking at historical performance is exactly useless. You want diversification and low fees, that's the best you can do if you're doing index funds.

 

[mercenar1e]

is anyone on here using Betterment or Wealthfront? would you recommend them?

 

[Makai]

is anyone on here using Betterment or Wealthfront? would you recommend them?

A couple of friends use Betterment. I recommended it to one friend because he couldn't afford the minimum for a Vanguard index fund. It kinda sucks because you must make a certain payment every month or you get hit with a fee. Also, it has an absurdly agressive international/domestic allocation (50/50) and the expense ratio is higher than the Vanguard funds it's buying for you.

 

[mercenar1e]

A couple of friends use Betterment. I recommended it to one friend because he couldn't afford the minimum for a Vanguard index fund. It kinda sucks because you must make a certain payment every month or you get hit with a fee. Also, it has an absurdly agressive international/domestic allocation (50/50) and the expense ratio is higher than the Vanguard funds it's buying for you.

Wealthfront has a smaller minimum compared to Vanguard and the first $10-15,000 is managed for free.. is it the better option of the two?

 

[Makai]

Wealthfront has a smaller minimum compared to Vanguard and the first $10-15,000 is managed for free.. is it the better option of the two?

I am unfamiliar with Wealthfront, but I can use their stats to give you my amateur opinion.

Wealthfront does not charge an advisory fee on the first $10,000 of assets under management. On amounts over $10,000, we charge a monthly advisory fee based on an annual fee rate of 0.25%.

The only other fee you incur is the very low fee embedded in the cost of the ETFs you will own that averages 0.12%.

It's not really free because the expense ratio still applies on accounts under $10k. The expense ratio is actually great, but you're going to get hit with a 0.25% management fee after you reach $10k. Conversely, Vanguard funds get cheaper after $10k - I started with their total stock market index and its expense ratio dropped from 0.17% to 0.05% after $10k. And because this is a passive fund, there are no fees in addition to the expense ratio. You'll be paying Wealthfront to manage your investments, which will reduce your overall return. Managed funds also tend to perform worse than indices, which will further reduce your return. Some funds beat the average, so how did Wealthfront do? I stumbled upon a few of their press releases and a lot of them were critical of Morningstar's rating process because they were basically given a junk rating. I consider that a warning sign. Vanguard's definitely the better pick if you can afford the minimum.

 

[Husker86]

I am unfamiliar with Wealthfront, but I can use their stats to give you my amateur opinion.



It's not really free because the expense ratio still applies on accounts under $10k. The expense ratio is actually great, but you're going to get hit with a 0.25% management fee after you reach $10k. Conversely, Vanguard funds get cheaper after $10k - I started with their total stock market index and its expense ratio dropped from 0.17% to 0.05% after $10k. And because this is a passive fund, there are no fees in addition to the expense ratio. You'll be paying Wealthfront to manage your investments, which will reduce your overall return. Managed funds also tend to perform worse than indices, which will further reduce your return. Some funds beat the average, so how did Wealthfront do? I stumbled upon a few of their press releases and a lot of them were critical of Morningstar's rating process because they were basically given a junk rating. I consider that a warning sign. Vanguard's definitely the better pick if you can afford the minimum.

I assume Wealthfront was like Betterment where their funds that they invest your money in are just Vanguard funds. They just manage the diversification/tax loss harvesting for you.

I keep wanting to try out Betterment (partly, and I'm fully aware this is ridiculous, because their interface/app UI is fantastic), but I always end up not opening an account. The tax loss harvesting seems like a neat feature, and one I definitely wouldn't be able to take the time to manage myself.

 

[Apt101]

I am very disappointed in how my retirement fund has been performing these past two years with Fidelity. Unfortunately it's my only option with my employer. Anyone use Fidelity and can suggest a particular fund or blend of funds?

Back when I had Vanguard my investment funds would earn a good 8-10% a year. With Fidelity it's been like 3%.

 

[Randolph Freelander]

I am very disappointed in how my retirement fund has been performing these past two years with Fidelity. Unfortunately it's my only option with my employer. Anyone use Fidelity and can suggest a particular fund or blend of funds?

Back when I had Vanguard my investment funds would earn a good 8-10% a year. With Fidelity it's been like 3%.

What funds are you in and what funds do you have available? Also keep in mind that the market had tremendous growth from 2012 through 2014, but it is basically flat for 2015.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I am very disappointed in how my retirement fund has been performing these past two years with Fidelity. Unfortunately it's my only option with my employer. Anyone use Fidelity and can suggest a particular fund or blend of funds?

Back when I had Vanguard my investment funds would earn a good 8-10% a year. With Fidelity it's been like 3%.

It totally depends what you are invested in. I recommend their total US market index, and if you don't have access to that, the S&P500 index. The list of their index funds are here, though I'm not sure which are offered by your employer.

My employer offers their S&P 500 fund with a 0.02% expense ratio, but none of their other funds, so all my 401k is there, while I use the Roth to capture the broader market US market and international index.

 

[Apt101]

What funds are you in and what funds do you have available? Also keep in mind that the market had tremendous growth from 2012 through 2014, but it is basically flat for 2015.

I recently moved everything to T. Rowe Price Retirement 2045 Fund. Maybe four months ago. Before that I had it mixed in some international fund focused on energy and a Goldman Sach midcap. All of these have been at Fidelity's suggestions. With Vanguard I could have just thrown a dart at a board and earned at least 6% a year.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I recently moved everything to T. Rowe Price Retirement 2045 Fund. Maybe four months ago. Before that I had it mixed in some international fund focused on energy and a Goldman Sach midcap. All of these have been at Fidelity's suggestions. With Vanguard I could have just thrown a dart at a board and earned at least 6% a year.

The outcomes have very little to do with Fidelity and more to do with the two totally different investment options you listed. I strongly suggest transitioning to index funds. (Those are not Fidelity funds BTW, but funds by other companies that you are buying through Fidelity.)

 

[Apt101]

The outcomes have very little to do with Fidelity and more to do with the two totally different investment options you listed. I strongly suggest transitioning to index funds. (Those are not Fidelity funds BTW, but funds by other companies that you are buying through Fidelity.)

OK, I'll look into them. I have three I can choose from. I'll probably split my money between two of them.

 

[Makai]

I assume Wealthfront was like Betterment where their funds that they invest your money in are just Vanguard funds. They just manage the diversification/tax loss harvesting for you.

I keep wanting to try out Betterment (partly, and I'm fully aware this is ridiculous, because their interface/app UI is fantastic), but I always end up not opening an account. The tax loss harvesting seems like a neat feature, and one I definitely wouldn't be able to take the time to manage myself.

Oh yeah, the UI is nice. But I contribute infrequently, so it's not much of a loss. Vanguard's interface is decent enough to get the current value and I use Personal Capital and OpenFolio for graphs. I'm nowhere near retirement age so I don't think I can take advantage of tax loss harvesting, either.

 

[Husker86]

Oh yeah, the UI is nice. But I contribute infrequently, so it's not much of a loss. Vanguard's interface is decent enough to get the current value and I use Personal Capital and OpenFolio for graphs. I'm nowhere near retirement age so I don't think I can take advantage of tax loss harvesting, either.

Oh right, I know this is the retirement thread but I forgot to mention that if I were to use Betterment it would be with my non-tax advantaged investments.

To the person who originally asked about Betterment/Wealthfront, I would personally avoid them for retirement accounts because the main advantage I see from them is the tax loss harvesting. It's not terribly difficult to rebalance your diversifications once or twice a year on your own.

 

[tokkun]

I recently moved everything to T. Rowe Price Retirement 2045 Fund. Maybe four months ago. Before that I had it mixed in some international fund focused on energy and a Goldman Sach midcap. All of these have been at Fidelity's suggestions. With Vanguard I could have just thrown a dart at a board and earned at least 6% a year.

I like to recommend target funds to people, but the cost of that T. Rowe Price fund is relatively high - 75 bp vs 18 bp for lowest-level version of Vanguard's 2045 target fund. The rule-of-thumb I use is that (all other things being equal) 10 bp is worth roughly 3% in total return over 30 years. So a 57 bp difference can cost you ~15% on the money your are putting in now.

If you are locked into Fidelity, it's worth looking into whether you can build something similar to the target fund that is cheaper.

 

[Walter White Walker]

If you are locked into Fidelity, it's worth looking into whether you can build something similar to the target fund that is cheaper.

That's what I do at Schwab. Their target fund that I would use charges .75%. So, I use 3 ETF's that average out to about .05%. Their target fund isn't going to do anything for me I can't do myself really easily.

 

[Wellington]

is anyone on here using Betterment or Wealthfront? would you recommend them?

I use Betterment as my main taxable account for now.

In general I am ok with it and have reaped enough TLH savings this year to way more than off-set the costs of having the account, so there's that. Obviously it depends on what your feelings on TLH are.

My problem is exactly what Makai mentioned, they are very heavily invested in foreign stocks between emerging and developed markets. I listened to several interviews with Jon Stein, the CEO of Betterment and their belief is that even though those funds are much more volatile than what we would like that in and of itself increases the potential for outsized gains. The 10 year history of VEA and VWO are not very pretty.

MMM has a betterment tracking experiment versus VTI which can be found here.

The Listen Money Matters interview with Jon Stein can be found here

Given the choice, I think just go with either VTSAX or VTI if you don't have the initial funds.

 

[Smiley90]

What a great month October was, I'm up nearly 9% in the last 30 days. Slowly approaching the July peak again before everything hit the shitter in August

 

[RumblingRosco]

-

 

[Earthstrike]

I have a bunch of 1 oz silver US dollars. Anyone have a suggestion for how I can go about selling them? Tired of holding onto them and they were given to me as gifts from my grandparents ages ago... Yeah, this might not be the right thread, but it's either this or Stock-age. Figured "trading silver" is sort of a thing that crazy people do for retirement, so maybe you all would have some idea.

Wait until silver is trading a bit above its previous historical high then sell.

 

[Mr.Mike]

Wait until silver is trading a bit above its previous historical high then sell.

Eh, think of the opportunity cost of holding on to that silver instead of selling it and investing the money.

I don't know how to go about selling silver though.

 

[Makai]

I have a bunch of 1 oz silver US dollars. Anyone have a suggestion for how I can go about selling them? Tired of holding onto them and they were given to me as gifts from my grandparents ages ago... Yeah, this might not be the right thread, but it's either this or Stock-age. Figured "trading silver" is sort of a thing that crazy people do for retirement, so maybe you all would have some idea.

Physical silver?

http://catalog.usmint.gov/bullion-dealer-locator?_ga=1.74213714.1728674329.1421249845

This is an official government website

 

[Veritigo_X]

Hi all,

I'm 26 and starting to think about retirement (better late than never I guess). I've got $15k in savings, a retirement plan with my employer that I've put $8k into, and no student loans or major debt. I guess I'm wondering what is a good place to start for someone in my position?

I feel like I'm on the right track by matching my employer's contributing each month, but I have a lot in savings that I don't really know what to do with.

Thanks for any advice.

 

[Niahak]

Hi all,

I'm 26 and starting to think about retirement (better late than never I guess). I've got $15k in savings, a retirement plan with my employer that I've put $8k into, and no student loans or major debt. I guess I'm wondering what is a good place to start for someone in my position?

I feel like I'm on the right track by matching my employer's contributing each month, but I have a lot in savings that I don't really know what to do with.

Thanks for any advice.

You're on the right track.

I'd suggest looking at the first post in this thread under "Retirement Vehicles". Most people recommend at least three months' (some say six or more) expenses accessible in savings. After that:

So, which one should I choose? Well, the rule of thumb for most is:
- 401k up to the employer match (401ks usually have higher fees and shittier funds)
- Fully fund Roth or traditional IRA (5,500)
- Fully fund 401k (17,500, i think)

I do a Roth IRA with Vanguard, but others here recommend Fidelity or other providers. Most providers you can sign up with online keep things pretty easy. As to what to invest in... it's up to you, but I'd read the first post for that too ("How" section). It makes a compelling argument for index funds.

 

[TMC]

Hi all,

I'm 26 and starting to think about retirement (better late than never I guess). I've got $15k in savings, a retirement plan with my employer that I've put $8k into, and no student loans or major debt. I guess I'm wondering what is a good place to start for someone in my position?

I feel like I'm on the right track by matching my employer's contributing each month, but I have a lot in savings that I don't really know what to do with.

Thanks for any advice.

I was in the same boat with a large amount in savings. I suggest starting out with a Roth IRA or Traditional IRA depending on what is best for your age and income level. Use your excess in savings and maybe invest in the index funds listed in the first post. Like mentioned, I would keep 6-8 months of expenses in your savings account and invest the rest. I did this, but I still had a large amount in savings after maxing out for 2015. It was suggested that I start a taxable account on Vanguard and further invest in the index funds listed.

I couldn't put the excess amount from savings in my Roth IRA because I already have it maxed for the year. I also don't contribute to my company's 401k because they don't match (its for a contracting company on a temp contract) and I will be hired on with the company in Q1 of next year.

 

[Veritigo_X]

Thanks for the advice guys. I'll look into a Roth IRA and investing in index funds. I figure I can safely use $5k of my savings based on my current expenses. I'll need to do some more research but I feel like I have somewhere I can start now.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Thanks for the advice guys. I'll look into a Roth IRA and investing in index funds. I figure I can safely use $5k of my savings based on my current expenses. I'll need to do some more research but I feel like I have somewhere I can start now.

To add, if you are starting from scratch and can meet the minimums (which is sounds like you can), go with Vanguard. Largest selection of index funds and they are about the lowest cost you can get. I'm with Fidelity because my 401k is there, and their index funds are excellent (matching Vanguard's costs) but their selection is more limited.

 

[Sanpunkan]

Like I said, you get a 401k from your employer, and you can set up a IRA at a place like Vanguard or Fidelity. After that, put the funds I mentioned above in them, or at least ones that are close. Below are links to the funds that I talked about.

Vanguard Total Stock Market Index Fund

Vanguard Total International Stock Index Fund

Vanguard Total Bond Market Index Fund

Vanguard Inflation-Protected Securities Fund Investor Shares(look into this fund when you are nearing retirement)

Can someone help me clarify something? The first 3 funds listed each have an opening balance of $3k. So if I wanted to do something like the 60/40 split mentioned in the OP, I would have to pony up $6k to start both of those funds?

Also, when I click on the funds it tells me they are available as an ETF. These do not have an opening balance requirement and seem to have lower expense ratio. Obviously I have no idea what an ETF is (and yes, I know what the acronym stands for but that doesn't really clarify anything) and how it compares to the versions linked in the OP.

Deciding to get serious about investing since my (very small) 401k from my previous employer was moved to a terrible company (Total IRA) that is charging me fees for not meeting their $50k minimum balance.