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"I need a new PC!" 2010 Edition

DeathNote said:
Is videocardbenchmark.net the best place to compare graphic cards and CPUs?

What about motherboards?
For reviews you can look at most of the sites in the OP but I favor:
Anandtech
Tech Report
Guru 3D
professor_t said:
I'll be happy to give that a shot.

Okay, I give up. What the hell is HP's 1.3.1 very high or Mster config?
HP - http://crymod.com/thread.php?threadid=13790
Mster - http://crymod.com/thread.php?threadid=28937
Extreme Particle -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bCEv9_X4epo
If someone could snag that mod for me I'd appreciate it
MisterAnderson said:
Are there any cards 200-300 dollars that are a decent upgrade from an HD 4890 1gb?

Looking to maybe get something 3D ready, but it's not essential. Not essential for me to upgrade either just curious because my bday is coming up and trying to think of something to splurge on myself.
Kinda sorta. GTX 465 should be out soon for ~$275 imo. Should be about on par with a 5850.
 
Hmm. Maybe it would be money better spent on doubling my RAM and maybe getting an SSD instead? For SSD to be worthwhile does my operating system need to be installed on it? Like... would I have to do a total re-do with my computer to take full advantage of SSD?
 
MisterAnderson said:
Hmm. Maybe it would be money better spent on doubling my RAM and maybe getting an SSD instead? For SSD to be worthwhile does my operating system need to be installed on it? Like... would I have to do a total re-do with my computer to take full advantage of SSD?
You could install certain programs to it but for maximum benefit your OS needs to be installed.
 
I'm probably going to buy a new computer within the next month or 2. Do you guys think the 5870 will be good enough to run Mafia 2 at highest settings or should I spend the extra $300 on the 5970?
 
Hazaro said:
You could install certain programs to it but for maximum benefit your OS needs to be installed.

Hmm. I'll consider doing a redo to my computer sometime then. Really curious to see a SSD in action. What's a good bang for the buck SSD? They still sound incredibly pricey for not much space. My computer right now has a standard harddrive that is 1.5 TB and I got it for $114.
 
MisterAnderson said:
Hmm. I'll consider doing a redo to my computer sometime then. Really curious to see a SSD in action. What's a good bang for the buck SSD? They still sound incredibly pricey for not much space. My computer right now has a standard harddrive that is 1.5 TB and I got it for $114.

This is one of the best ones you can buy, was $10 cheaper a few days ago, but it's something you will basically never need to replace, so I don't see it as expensive personally.

You absolutely should do a fresh install of Windows on it, otherwise there's no point. It's not really meant for games, and a lot of games don't go any faster on a SSD due to the way they are accessed.

After Windows and your office/standard apps, you should end up using around 40 of the 80 gigs, leaving you another 20 or so to screw around with, I wouldn't fill it up too far personally, they work best when they can swap around the writes more evenly than if say it only had 1 gig free.
 
I'll look into that. So while it doesn't benefit gaming I'm guessing it makes loading any program/browsers/etc. generally just much faster? Also what is RAID? Is that when you put more than 1 SSD and link them together so that they are both working in unison or something?
 
Ok guys I think I'll need a new case.

Can someone reccomend me a cheapish good case that'll fit a 5970. Under $100 in price (for those of you who are american), around £60 for me. Not really willing to go higher than that considering I also need a new high quality PSU and the 5970 itself.

I've been looking at this one ---> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146064&Tpk=nzxt hades

Any other reccomendations or is that pretty much the best I'll get for that price range?
 
MisterAnderson said:
I'll look into that. So while it doesn't benefit gaming I'm guessing it makes loading any program/browsers/etc. generally just much faster? Also what is RAID? Is that when you put more than 1 SSD and link them together so that they are both working in unison or something?
I've compared load times on an Intel X25 vs. a 1TB Caviar Black. Depends on the specific title, but most games I tested (Bioshock 2, Borderlands, Crysis, DiRT 2, L4D, L4D 2, UT3, and Resident Evil 5) all ran better on the HDD than on the SSD. Textures seem to load better from a SSD, but level load times (which is the bigger factor for me) were tilted more in the HDD's favor.

I didn't analyze this in any sort of scientific way. It's mostly anecdotal, but the differences were noticeable enough to keep in mind. RE5 and DiRT 2 both benefited significantly from being on the HDD. RE5's load times off the SSD were absolutely ridiculous. A little while into the game and I started to think maybe I had a faulty drive or something. They were that bad.

Installing an OS and programs on my SSD made a huge impact on my overall system performance. After POST, Windows boots in like fifteen seconds, tops. I haven't compared it to another desktop, but I've timed it against my laptop (which had W7 on a Seagate 7200.3 at the time). Once I typed my password to log in on my laptop, I still needed to wait between ten to fifteen seconds for Windows and my start programs to load. On my SSD, it's all literally instant. Similar improvements abound throughout all general use.
 
MisterAnderson said:
I'll look into that. So while it doesn't benefit gaming I'm guessing it makes loading any program/browsers/etc. generally just much faster? Also what is RAID? Is that when you put more than 1 SSD and link them together so that they are both working in unison or something?
RAID = writing half of the data to each drive. You almost double your write/read but if 1 drive fails all your data is gone.
Also much much much faster.
GHG said:
Ok guys I think I'll need a new case.

Can someone reccomend me a cheapish good case that'll fit a 5970. Under $100 in price (for those of you who are american), around £60 for me. Not really willing to go higher than that considering I also need a new high quality PSU and the 5970 itself.

I've been looking at this one ---> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146064&Tpk=nzxt hades

Any other reccomendations or is that pretty much the best I'll get for that price range?
I do like the Cooler Master 690 or 690II
 
GHG said:
Hmmm.... Just had a quick look into this and... the 5970 will fit into that case, but only just:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=4142672&postcount=16

Cutting it way too fine IMO. Any other suggestions?
Most cases will be like that. You might be interested in a Lian-Li 73B (or something like that...) Also if you can find a 'RocketFish' case which is a rebranded Lian-Li for BestBuy. It's what I have and is absolutely gigantic.
satori said:
Hey Hazaro, again thanks for the heads up to that site. I just got my new MSI GX640 and I seriously can not be any happier lol. This thing is a beast!!!
Ahh hope you like it. I know two others who have the previous model with the 9800M. Both still running well after a year.
 
Hazaro said:
Most cases will be like that. You might be interested in a Lian-Li 73B (or something like that...) Also if you can find a 'RocketFish' case which is a rebranded Lian-Li for BestBuy. It's what I have and is absolutely gigantic.

Ahh hope you like it. I know two others who have the previous model with the 9800M. Both still running well after a year.

The Lian Li's are too expensive for me and Rocketfish isn't sold here in the UK.

What about the coolermaster HAF 922?
 
GHG said:
The Lian Li's are too expensive for me and Rocketfish isn't sold here in the UK.

What about the coolermaster HAF 922?
That has about an extra inch of clearance right?

Case preference is entirely up to you. HAF 922 is fine.
 
MisterAnderson said:
I'll look into that. So while it doesn't benefit gaming I'm guessing it makes loading any program/browsers/etc. generally just much faster? Also what is RAID? Is that when you put more than 1 SSD and link them together so that they are both working in unison or something?

RAID doesn't work well with SSDs, it's generally used for normal HDDs. I mean it works, but you run in to issues, TRIM is no longer supported, etc. Plus it's sorta pointless, SSDs are already as fast as they really need to be for normal OS apps and windows.

RAID doesn't decrease seek time, just how fast data is read/written is doubled. An SSD's main strength is that it's seek (access) times are like 20x faster than any HDD on the market, even those expensive 15K velociraptors.

Fast Seek time with small files is what apps and windows need to be faster, because they rely on millions of tiny tiny files assorted all over your HDD, and that is what SSDs excel at.

Games will often just pack 100s or 1000s of MBs of data in a couple files. So for games, it's not unusual to just want a drive that reads and writes to single files faster, which is not the strength of an SSD.
 
Minsc said:
This is one of the best ones you can buy, was $10 cheaper a few days ago, but it's something you will basically never need to replace, so I don't see it as expensive personally.

Is the 40 gig 25-V a good alternative? Have a tight budget and only plan on installing windows and a few programs on it, so the space should be enough.
 
Kerrinck said:
Is the 40 gig 25-V a good alternative? Have a tight budget and only plan on installing windows and a few programs on it, so the space should be enough.

Yup, if you're comfortable using around only 30GB of space, I'd leave 5-10GB free if at all possible. They give pretty much the same end result, I'd just be worried you'd regret it down the road if you ran out of space!

Figure Windows 7 uses about 10GBs for a fresh install, + like another 4-8GBs for a pagefile I think, so you'd have around 10-15GBs for apps (leaving the drive some free space). You could use compressed folders to stretch it a tiny further on certain programs, I occasionally see over 50% reduction with it.
 
Guys I need a little help. I was thinking of buying a GTX 470. The problem I have is that it seems the card comes with one One 6-pin PCIe to Molex power adapter, while all the reviews state that it needs two of those. Then why it is coming with only one? I am slightly confused.
Also, other than being enough powerful, does my PSU need anything else to run these cards? Like some different connectors or something?
 
Ok, bought everything I need, tonight I'll be putting it together.

So, I went to nvidia 3d route. Bought a Samsung Syncmaster 22" 3d ready.

This is the core of my new rig:

intel i5 750 quad @ 2.66ghz
4gb apacer ddr3 1600mhz
gigabyte gtx480 1.5gb
win 7 pro
 
kittoo said:
Guys I need a little help. I was thinking of buying a GTX 470. The problem I have is that it seems the card comes with one One 6-pin PCIe to Molex power adapter, while all the reviews state that it needs two of those. Then why it is coming with only one? I am slightly confused.
Also, other than being enough powerful, does my PSU need anything else to run these cards? Like some different connectors or something?

What PSU do you have? Any decent PSU will have at least 2 6 pin PCI-E leads.

metareferential said:
Ok, bought everything I need, tonight I'll be putting it together.

So, I went to nvidia 3d route. Bought a Samsung Syncmaster 22" 3d ready.

This is the core of my new rig:

intel i5 750 quad @ 2.66ghz
4gb apacer ddr3 1600mhz
gigabyte gtx480 1.5gb
win 7 pro

Good man. You'll enjoy it.
 
Seems like SSD would be nice for reliability in case your HDD shits the bed, it wouldn't take your OS down with it if that happens if you have a SSD with it.

I'm very distrustful of HDD reliability, despite the fact i've never had one outright die on me. They just seem like ticking time bombs with all the fragile moving parts.
 
GHG said:
What PSU do you have? Any decent PSU will have at least 2 6 pin PCI-E leads.

It is a 600 Watt one but its 2 years old, though was very expensive. I guess it will do the trick.
 
Is it worthwhile to invest in an aftermarket cooler? I was playing around with PCSX2 this morning and noticed my CPU temps were getting fairly hot (~60C or so). I was looking at this cooler at Newegg and was wondering if it was any good.

Note: I have no plans to overclock for the time being. I might in the future when my i5 starts showing its age.
 
Kerrinck said:
Is the 40 gig 25-V a good alternative? Have a tight budget and only plan on installing windows and a few programs on it, so the space should be enough.
I have this drive, awesome entry level SSD if you don't want to splurge much for an OS drive. I have Win7 64-bit, iTunes, Media Player Classic, Office 2007, Adobe CS3, Firefox, MS Security Essentials, and a bunch of smaller business and administrative apps installed on it and all of them run blazing fast, with about 8-9GB to spare. These apps are usually my biggest resource hogs but it's not much of an issue using the X25-V. I ended up getting a 7.5 on my SSD on the Windows Experience Index after enabling AHCI for the SATA drives on my motherboard. I totally recommend the drive, just as long as you're only using it to install essential OS, business, and admin apps on it.
 
Am I supposed to check the hardware audio box in games? I never do.

I'm not using a dedicated sound card or anything. Just using the audio on my Gigabyte EX58-UD5 motherboard with headphones.

I've tried clicking the box and I don't really notice much of a difference. Basically can someone explain how hardware sound works?
 
iNvidious01 said:
i was thinking of getting a better pc for gaming.

currently play on the ps3, have been on consoles since ps1.

only played a few pc games on a standard dell pc.

i dont know whether to start pc gaming properly.
has anyone else made the move from console to pc, how was it?


best decision i ever made.
 
i have a question my brother wants to upgrade from a 5770 to something better.

so i had 3 options for him, either get a second 5770 so it could match the 5850.

or spend a little more and get a 5870, my question is though how much faster is the 5870 than the 5850.

any benchmarks
 
Omiee said:
i have a question my brother wants to upgrade from a 5770 to something better.

so i had 3 options for him, either get a second 5770 so it could match the 5850.

or spend a little more and get a 5870, my question is though how much faster is the 5870 than the 5850.

any benchmarks

2 5770s are slightly faster than a 5870, and a 5870 is 15-20% faster than a 5850, but you can overclock a 5850 to 5870 speeds pretty easily I'm told.

If you google 5870 review or better yet, GTX 480 review (those cards are newer, and will have more updated drivers), you can find benches. look for tech report, legion hardware, anandtech, legit reviews, pc games hardware, xbit labs, or any other big name review site.
 
Omiee said:
i have a question my brother wants to upgrade from a 5770 to something better.

so i had 3 options for him, either get a second 5770 so it could match the 5850.

or spend a little more and get a 5870, my question is though how much faster is the 5870 than the 5850.

any benchmarks
CF 5770 outperforms a 5870, let alone a 5850. If he has a CF-capable mobo, that is. Here are some comparison benchmarks:

http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/...=on&prod[3650]=on&prod[3649]=on&prod[3653]=on

Second column is CF 5770s and last column is a single.

Other bechmarks are here: http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/
 
esc said:
CF 5770 outperforms a 5870, let alone a 5850. If he has a CF-capable mobo, that is. Here are some comparison benchmarks:

http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/...=on&prod[3650]=on&prod[3649]=on&prod[3653]=on

Second column is CF 5770s and last column is a single.

Other bechmarks are here: http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/


what the hell do two 5770's realy out perform a 5870..?
he does have a mother board that supports it. he has the gigabyte 790xt a-ud4 i think

so the best thing to do is just get a second saphire 5770 1gb
it is cheaper than getting the 5850 which is 250 euro.
 
Omiee said:
what the hell do two 5770's realy out perform a 5870..?
he does have a mother board that supports it. he has the gigabyte 790xt a-ud4 i think

so the best thing to do is just get a second saphire 5770 1gb
it is cheaper than getting the 5850 which is 250 euro.

The downside of XFire/SLI are:

You get micro-stuttering, which can make your framerate appear less smooth than what the numbers say (ie 60fps SLI/XFire may look less smooth than 40fps on a single GPU)

You need profiles for the games to work properly. If there's no working profile, you get single 5770 GPU speeds (so you really need to stay on top of profiles/drivers if you play a lot of games day 1).

And of course, you have a slightly higher chance of encountering weird misc bugs due to less testing on SLI/XFire hardware.
 
Minsc said:
RAID doesn't work well with SSDs, it's generally used for normal HDDs. I mean it works, but you run in to issues, TRIM is no longer supported, etc. Plus it's sorta pointless, SSDs are already as fast as they really need to be for normal OS apps and windows.

RAID doesn't decrease seek time, just how fast data is read/written is doubled. An SSD's main strength is that it's seek (access) times are like 20x faster than any HDD on the market, even those expensive 15K velociraptors.

Fast Seek time with small files is what apps and windows need to be faster, because they rely on millions of tiny tiny files assorted all over your HDD, and that is what SSDs excel at.

Games will often just pack 100s or 1000s of MBs of data in a couple files. So for games, it's not unusual to just want a drive that reads and writes to single files faster, which is not the strength of an SSD.

Sorry for another noob response, but what is TRIM?
 
MisterAnderson said:
Sorry for another noob response, but what is TRIM?

See this. To really simplify it, it prevents performance degradation over time, the intel non-trim drives were a lot less prune to this than other brands, but either way, TRIM all-but eliminates the performance drop SSDs experience over time.
 
Minsc said:
The downside of XFire/SLI are:

You get micro-stuttering, which can make your framerate appear less smooth than what the numbers say (ie 60fps SLI/XFire may look less smooth than 40fps on a single GPU)

You need profiles for the games to work properly. If there's no working profile, you get single 5770 GPU speeds (so you really need to stay on top of profiles/drivers if you play a lot of games day 1).

And of course, you have a slightly higher chance of encountering weird misc bugs due to less testing on SLI/XFire hardware.


oke so for a first time builder etc what are the steps i have to take to get the most out of the card for my brother.

im gonna go for the 5770, they come with this crossfire cable thing so after i put it on the mother board and connect the 2 cars with the cable what is the next steps i have to do..?
 
Omiee said:
oke so for a first time builder etc what are the steps i have to take to get the most out of the card for my brother.

im gonna go for the 5770, they come with this crossfire cable thing so after i put it on the mother board and connect the 2 cars with the cable what is the next steps i have to do..?

I have no idea, I just didn't want you to buy a XFire setup completely unaware that such drawbacks exist, I wouldn't have even brought them up until you said you were buying the 2nd card. The huge, inexpensive performance boost certainly outweighs those minor drawbacks in many cases, but someone else will need to help you with the setup procedures.
 
Omiee said:
oke so for a first time builder etc what are the steps i have to take to get the most out of the card for my brother.

im gonna go for the 5770, they come with this crossfire cable thing so after i put it on the mother board and connect the 2 cars with the cable what is the next steps i have to do..?

Make sure your power supply is capable and do a clean install of the latest drivers after using driversweeper. Apart from that you should be good to go.

CF/SLI issues now are pretty much non-existant. Almost all games that came out in the last 5-6 years support it and older games which don't will not need more power than a single 5770 anyway.

professor_t said:
Very interesting.

I'm using DX11, and it looks like these mods were designed for older versions of DirectX. Do you have any idea if that would pose a problem? Or should it not matter?

Doesn't matter. Direct X is backwards compatible.
 
he has the be quit 480W atx power supply, when we went to the shop we asked if it was enough for crossfire and they said it was.

i mean i was gonna sugest the 5850 to him or spend a little more for the 5870, but from whayt i have seen a CF5770 is a little faster than the 5850 and not to much slower than the 5870.
thats a good buy cuz its only 120 euro wher as the 5850 is 250 euro and the 5870 is 320 euro.

also can u check for me if his board will support it cuz it has 2 video card thing ( sorry for calling them thinghs i dont know the name lol )
but i just wanna be sure before i put in the order now for him.
he has the gigabyte 790xt a-ud4

also could u tell me whats the best one for him from this list

http://tweakers.net/pricewatch/cat/...80T19hn3BDK3-eyxqlY4hFoqaA8acua_xnPWP7o6l1voD

or is it important its the same card.
 
Omiee said:
he has the be quit 480W atx power supply, when we went to the shop we asked if it was enough for crossfire and they said it was.

i mean i was gonna sugest the 5850 to him or spend a little more for the 5870, but from whayt i have seen a CF5770 is a little faster than the 5850 and not to much slower than the 5870.
thats a good buy cuz its only 120 euro wher as the 5850 is 250 euro and the 5870 is 320 euro.

also can u check for me if his board will support it cuz it has 2 video card thing ( sorry for calling them thinghs i dont know the name lol )
but i just wanna be sure before i put in the order now for him.
he has the gigabyte 790xt a-ud4
It supports CF. For installation, you should put the second graphics card into the adjacent PCIe slot and connect the two cards using a crossfire bridge. ATI drivers will auto-detect, you don't need to do anything else. Dunno about the PSU...do you know the exact model?
 
So i probably need to return my 5770; it runs at x1 on multiple motherboards while other cards run at x16 on mine. (I'm going to try messing with the bios, but I don't hold out too much hope for that)

How exactly does RMAing something to Newegg work. Do I really have to pay return shipping on a defective product? That seems pretty unfair.
 
Omiee said:
he has the be quit 480W atx power supply, when we went to the shop we asked if it was enough for crossfire and they said it was.

also could u tell me whats the best one for him from this list

http://tweakers.net/pricewatch/cat/...80T19hn3BDK3-eyxqlY4hFoqaA8acua_xnPWP7o6l1voD
A GOOD 480w is cutting it very close for Crossfire 5770's. I would not run crossfire 5770's due to the massive amount of 12V current you need. Also any PSU under 500w usually isn't that great. What model is yours?
Out of the list I'd probably go with the cheapest Sapphire 5850 if you are looking to upgrade.
Boonoo said:
So i probably need to return my 5770; it runs at x1 on multiple motherboards while other cards run at x16 on mine. (I'm going to try messing with the bios, but I don't hold out too much hope for that)

How exactly does RMAing something to Newegg work. Do I really have to pay return shipping on a defective product? That seems pretty unfair.
That's a bummer, did you try cleaning the contacts with alcohol? I'd also try setting it manually at 100,101,102,103 Mhz but it sounds like a card issue.

Call newegg, get a free UPS label, stick it on a box and wait 5 days for you new card :D
 
Boonoo said:
So i probably need to return my 5770; it runs at x1 on multiple motherboards while other cards run at x16 on mine. (I'm going to try messing with the bios, but I don't hold out too much hope for that)

How exactly does RMAing something to Newegg work. Do I really have to pay return shipping on a defective product? That seems pretty unfair.

That's usually how it works and why I tend to buy super heavy items like Plasma TVs or appliances from places with local stores. Newegg is super friendly. Call them and see if they set you up, if you order a lot of stuff you might not have to pay.

They've shipped me free games before, well, replacement ones. I had a copy of DMC4 that didn't come with the disc, and no questions asked they shipped me another copy for free. Great customer service.
 
Hazaro said:
That's a bummer, did you try cleaning the contacts with alcohol? I'd also try setting it manually at 100,101,102,103 Mhz but it sounds like a card issue.

Call newegg, get a free UPS label, stick it on a box and wait 5 days for you new card :D

Yeah; I tried several different manual settings. That another card worked fine and that this one failed on 2 boards makes me think it's broke.

Calling them up and complaining works? I'll have to do that tomorrow.

That's usually how it works and why I tend to buy super heavy items like Plasma TVs or appliances from places with local stores. Newegg is super friendly. Call them and see if they set you up, if you order a lot of stuff you might not have to pay.

They've shipped me free games before, well, replacement ones. I had a copy of DMC4 that didn't come with the disc, and no questions asked they shipped me another copy for free. Great customer service.

Yeah. I wouldn't have minded too much, but with the shipping at 10 bucks; I'm getting into better card territory. I have been ordering a lot from them recently--I hope they play nice.
 
Ive recently bought the Coolermaster cm690 Pure case and was I really want a window side panel for my case.

Will the windowed side panel for the Coolermaster cm690 ii advanced case fit the pure case?
 
this is the model he has http://tweakers.net/pricewatch/246876/be-quiet!-straight-power-bqt-e7-cm-480w.html

i think he will feel screwed cuz in the store they said it would be enough for crossfire for 2 5770's
 
Omiee said:
this is the model he has http://tweakers.net/pricewatch/246876/be-quiet!-straight-power-bqt-e7-cm-480w.html

i think he will feel screwed cuz in the store they said it would be enough for crossfire for 2 5770's
That is a good PSU but with only 2 PCI-E connectors and 35A on the 12V I'd be wary of using crossfire. A 5850 would be good though.
*Crossfire 5770's could work fine but I'd advise against it.
 
Hazaro said:
That is a good PSU but with only 2 PCI-E connectors and 35A on the 12V I'd be wary of using crossfire. A 5850 would be good though.
*Crossfire 5770's could work fine but I'd advise against it.
It's actually 48A, which is plenty.

Edit: Nvm, was looking at the 450W version. You're right. 35A is cutting way too close.
 
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