Support NeoGAF

[Flying_Phoenix]

You're using the "wrong" benchmark. Use AS SSD (or ATTO) to get the advertised numbers.

They use the benchmark that gives them the fastest numbers, obviously. I forget which one (ATTO or AS SSD) is currently the "standard".

I did. Same thing.

 

[Coldsnap]

For side vents on cases do you have the fan blowing air into the case onto your GPU or sucking air out? Thanks

 

[mkenyon]

For side vents on cases do you have the fan blowing air into the case onto your GPU or sucking air out? Thanks

First one, you want positive pressure in a case (more fans in than out).

 

[RS4-]

Thanks! That's one tiny piece of tech. Nice.

If you've got a webcam you can use that too

 

[knitoe]

I did. Same thing.

Manufacturers use ATTO Benchmarks. Run it and show us the screenshot.

 

[Tallshortman]

I've heard the same thing happens to the Cyborg RAT mice. No surprise since they're affiliated with Razer

RAT mice aren't associated with Razer... they're made by Mad Catz. Why would Razer help a direct competitor?

 

[Coldsnap]

First one, you want positive pressure in a case (more fans in than out).

ok gotcha, 500rpm scythe running at full speed would be enough air moving to cool down a gpu a bit?

 

[Guerrillas in the Mist]

A friend of mine is running 8 PNY video cards in his "computer lab". No problems from what I've heard. I've got one coming in the mail as well.

Awesome, took the plunge and ordered the parts, my stomach is gonna drop once I see my bank statement after they ship.

CPU: Intel Core i5-2500K
Mobo: Asus P8P67
GPU: PNY GeForce GTX 560 Ti 850MHz 1GB PCI-Express HDMI OC1 Edition
HDD: Samsung 1TB Spinpoint F3 7200rpm SATA 3Gb/s 32MB
Case: Antec 300
RAM: Corsair Memory 4GB (2 x 2GB) Vengeance DDR3 1600MHz
PSU: OCZ Technology PSU, ModXStream Pro, 700W
Drive: A cheap Sony DVDRW drive.

Arriving on Friday according to Dabs, hopefully I'll get it around the same time as the copy of Windows 7 I ordered from Amazon.

Hopefully, I'll be joining the Master Race by this weekend or early next week (well, I'll no longer be doing my PC gaming on a dying laptop). Cheers for the advice, PC-GAF.

 

[RS4-]

RAT mice aren't associated with Razer... they're made by Mad Catz. Why would Razer help a direct competitor?

Oh fuck, sorry, thought they were all under the same company.

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

Manufacturers use ATTO Benchmarks. Run it and show us the screenshot.

How's this?

How does this compare to other Sata 6 SSD?

And if good then why should I believe this benchmark more than others?

 

[tiff]

The connections to the actual devices seem fine from here (make sure they don't wiggle at all). I can't see the connections to the motherboard in that shot though.

http://i.imgur.com/lJ0Ch.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/WwMjf.jpg
These are the best shots I can get of the SATA ports. They're right behind the video card which makes them really tough to get to. The connections are just below the two white ports near the middle of that first picture.

http://i.imgur.com/lVi7j.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/mRCVY.jpg
These are some wider shots of the interior if it helps any.

 

[knitoe]

How's this?



How does this compare to other Sata 6 SSD?

And if good then why should I believe this benchmark more than others?

You got the stated manufacturer speeds, ~500MB/s. It's not a realistic benchmarks since it only applies to a certain condition, but that's what they use to inflate and PR their scores. The other benchmarks you used are more accurate for daily use.

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

You got the stated manufacturer speeds, ~500MB/s. It's not a realistic benchmarks, but that's what they use to inflate and PR their scores. The other benchmarks you used are more accurate for daily use.

So the previous two tests were correct and I got ripped of with this SSD?

Or are none of them that accurate and as long as its fast thats all that matters?

 

[mkenyon]

So the previous two tests were correct and I got ripped of with this SSD?

Or are none of them that accurate and as long as its fast thats all that matters?

Read reviews from websites like anandtech, HardOCP, Toms and the like. You didn't get ripped off, but it's not doing the numbers you thought it would do.

Question though, have you noticed sluggishness? Or are you just mad the benchmark you ran didn't match up with a manufacturer's posted speeds with a particular benchmark?

 

[knitoe]

So the previous two tests were correct and I got ripped of with this SSD?

Or are none of them that accurate and as long as its fast thats all that matters?

The other test are more accurate for daily use. The ATTO test shows the best performance, but is unrealistic. You didn't get rip off since everyone uses that test to state their "Upto X speeds".

When buying a SSD, you should check legit site reviews for the realistic speeds.

 

[LordCanti]

http://i.imgur.com/lJ0Ch.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/WwMjf.jpg
These are the best shots I can get of the SATA ports. They're right behind the video card which makes them really tough to get to. The connections are just below the two white ports near the middle of that first picture.

http://i.imgur.com/lVi7j.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/mRCVY.jpg
These are some wider shots of the interior if it helps any.

Those look to be properly plugged in as well. Just so I'm clear, you can get to the bios, but neither HDD shows up? Do they show up in POST (the screen that comes up before BIOS)?

It's unlikely that both the HDD and the DVD drive are just individually dead. It's more likely that the SATA ports on the motherboard are. If you can, test the DVD drive (or the HDD) in another computer. If you can't, try switching the SATA cables to other motherboard ports.

If nothing else works, you may have to RMA the mobo.

Take a picture of the boot select screen in the BIOS, so that we can make sure the HDD's really aren't being seen.

 

[RS4-]

tiff, can you take pictures of your bios settings? Maybe, for whatever reason, the SATA controllers are off?

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

Question though, have you noticed sluggishness? Or are you just mad the benchmark you ran didn't match up with a manufacturer's posted speeds with a particular benchmark?

Its not sluggish at all. I'm just angry that it isn't posting the speeds at the benchmark while others are getting much faster speeds.

EDIT - Its actually on par with the anandtech benchmarks, maybe a bit faster. I'm just wondering how these people are getting these high scores on the same bench.

 

[mkenyon]

Its not sluggish at all. I'm just angry that it isn't posting the speeds at the benchmark while others are getting much faster speeds.

FWIW, Crucial Drives do really well on the Crystal Mark Benchmarks, but about the same as similar drives on ATTO. You're comparing apples to oranges.

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

FWIW, Crucial Drives do really well on the Crystal Mark Benchmarks, but about the same as similar drives on ATTO. You're comparing apples to oranges.

Please explain this in a bit more detail. How am I comparing apples to oranges?

 

[drakesfortune]

So I'm down to these two monitors :

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824236059&Tpk=asus vh236

vs

http://www.buy.com/prod/asus-ve248h...x-1080-speakers-hdmi/q/loc/101/217317196.html

pretty much lcd vs led. I'm leaning towards the LCD because it's a bit cheaper, is the monitor of choice for mlg so it's tried and tested.

I can't say anything about the LED monitor, but I'm running two of those exact ASUS monitors, and have been now for almost 2 years I think, and they are superb. Great IQ, nice a bright, good image contrast etc... They are great for the money. I'm about to build a new rig and take these monitors and my old computer to be my new office computer, and I'll probably be picking up the LED monitors you linked to above, but if you're tight on cash, you won't be upset with the ASUS LCD. The only thing I don't like about them is the orange power button (seems out of place), but I don't even notice that anymore.

 

[mkenyon]

Please explain this in a bit more detail. How am I comparing apples to oranges?

You want your Agility 3 to have the same benchmarks on Crystal as a Crucial M4, which is a different drive with different firmware and a different controller. You were led to this hope because you saw benchmarks on Newegg that are posted from the manufacturer using completely different software.

I mean, yeah, it's confusing and that sucks, but when the facts are on the table it sounds kind of silly.

Lesson of the story: OCZ is not a trustworthy company, and most drive manufacturers are going to twist specs to appear better than they are. Be sure to read real reviews before buying, as the SSD world is highly complicated and confusing.

 

[LaneDS]

Case (Corsair 600T!) and remaining parts arrived today. Time to attempt the build. I'll try to take a few pictures, because pictures are fun, right?

Pretty excited. Core 2 Duo, you have served me well for half a decade, but it's time to go.

 

[mkenyon]

Case (Corsair 600T!) and remaining parts arrived today. Time to attempt the build. I'll try to take a few pictures, because pictures are fun, right?

Pretty excited. Core 2 Duo, you have served me well for half a decade, but it's time to go.

Use those holes and backpanel like crazy, you can hide just about everything with that case, it's awesome.

Core 2 Duo can always become a totally sweet fileserver!

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

I've decided to just get a HDD to complement my SSD. Which would be the best to get for under $100?

Or should I just get a good deal for one around $50?

I'm targeting at least a TB here.

You want your Agility 3 to have the same benchmarks on Crystal as a Crucial M4, which is a different drive with different firmware and a different controller. You were led to this hope because you saw benchmarks on Newegg that are posted from the manufacturer using completely different software.

I mean, yeah, it's confusing and that sucks, but when the facts are on the table it sounds kind of silly.

Lesson of the story: OCZ is not a trustworthy company, and most drive manufacturers are going to twist specs to appear better than they are. Be sure to read real reviews before buying, as the SSD world is highly complicated and confusing.

I'm never buying another OCZ product ever again.

They're crossed off my list.

 

[mkenyon]

I've decided to just get a HDD to complement my SSD. Which would be the best to get for under $100?

Or should I just get a good deal for one around $50?

I'm targeting at least a TB here.



I'm never buying another OCZ product ever again.

They're crossed off my list.

Fair enough!

<3 my samsung spinpoint F3's. If you want it for games, may I suggest two for RAID0. If you don't use it for storage, they're plenty reliable enough.

 

[tiff]

Those look to be properly plugged in as well. Just so I'm clear, you can get to the bios, but neither HDD shows up? Do they show up in POST (the screen that comes up before BIOS)?

This? It's the only thing that shows up before BIOs, and it goes by so fast I don't know if I got it all.

It's unlikely that both the HDD and the DVD drive are just individually dead. It's more likely that the SATA ports on the motherboard are. If you can, test the DVD drive (or the HDD) in another computer. If you can't, try switching the SATA cables to other motherboard ports

I had them in two other SATA ports before and I had the same problem. Should I just keep looking for a pair that works?

Take a picture of the boot select screen in the BIOS, so that we can make sure the HDD's really aren't being seen.

Here's the storage configuration and boot select screens. There's some options on there that I don't have a clue on so I might guess one of those might be the problem, but then again I tried reverting to defaults and that didn't work either...

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

Fair enough!

Sending SSD with a 1 in 4 failure rate and completely false advertising? To be fair the Agility supposedly has some of the highest lite speeds (booting up Firefox) of all SSD, but sucks at sequential.

<3 my samsung spinpoint F3's. If you want it for games, may I suggest two for RAID0. If you don't use it for storage, they're plenty reliable enough.

Is RAID:

#1 Hard to do?

#2 Make the drives significantly more unreliable?

#3 Make the drives go significantly faster?

# 4 Affect the space of the drives?

 

[mkenyon]

Sending SSD with a 1 in 4 failure rate and completely false advertising? To be fair the Agility supposedly has some of the highest lite speeds (booting up Firefox) of all SSD, but sucks at sequential.



Is RAID:

#1 Hard to do?

#2 Make the drives significantly more unreliable?

#3 Make the drives go significantly faster?

# 4 Affect the space of the drives?

1. No, you can even do it through windows. You just select both drives in the manager and click "create striped partition".*

2. No, it just means that if one drive fails, you lose data from both.*

3. Doubles the speed.*

4. No, you'd get the full 2TB with 2 1TB drives.*

*this is all about RAID0, not any other RAID formats.

 

[LordCanti]

This? It's the only thing that shows up before BIOs, and it goes by so fast I don't know if I got it all.


I had them in two other SATA ports before and I had the same problem. Should I just keep looking for a pair that works?


Here's the storage configuration and boot select screens. There's some options on there that I don't have a clue on so I might guess one of those might be the problem, but then again I tried reverting to defaults and that didn't work either...

Change "Marvell SATA3 bootable" to Yes, and see if that does anything. Also, change "Hard Disk S.M.A.R.T to Enabled, if it will let you.

Try a SATA port that is a different color (should be a different controller).

Sure enough, it doesn't seem to be detecting any drives. May just be a bad SATA controller.
Click "H/W monitor" in the BIOS, and see if anything shows up in there.

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

So this is the HDD I should get?

EDIT - Are RAIDs as fast or faster than SSD for sequential speeds? Like compressing video, game loading, and animation frame loading?

 

[LordCanti]

So this is the HDD I should get?

Yes.

 

[LaneDS]

Use those holes and backpanel like crazy, you can hide just about everything with that case, it's awesome.

Core 2 Duo can always become a totally sweet fileserver!

Definitely plan to! My current wiring solution in my C2D setup is an embarrassment, I plan to make up for that. Currently in the process of attaching the Cooler Master Hyper 212+ without hopefully effing anything up.

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

Is Hitachi reliable?

This drive is $55 with a promo code.

 

[mkenyon]

So this is the HDD I should get?

EDIT - Are RAIDs as fast or faster than SSD for sequential speeds? Like compressing video, game loading, and animation frame loading?

Depends on the mechanical drive and SSD you're comparing. But, mechanical drives shine in sequential/sustained read/write. A two drive RAID0 setup will bring you close to Vertex 2 performance, without really a noticeable difference in performance.

Is Hitachi reliable?

This drive is $55 with a promo code.

Read some reviews if you can find any. I'd really suggest those spinpoints. I have 7, none of which have failed yet in about 2 years.

 

[tiff]

Change "Marvell SATA3 bootable" to Yes, and see if that does anything. Also, change "Hard Disk S.M.A.R.T to Enabled, if it will let you.

Changing one of these got me something new on start-up, which doesn't tell me anything I didn't already know.

Try a SATA port that is a different color (should be a different controller).

Tried this too, but I got the same result.

Sure enough, it doesn't seem to be detecting any drives. May just be a bad SATA controller.
Click "H/W monitor" in the BIOS, and see if anything shows up in there.

This is the H/W monitor screen.

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

I really REALLY liked the idea of having 3 TBs but nothing can rival reliability. Spinpoints ordered.

 

[LordCanti]

Changing one of these got me something new on start-up, which doesn't tell me anything I didn't already know.


Tried this too, but I got the same result.


This is the H/W monitor screen.

Do you have any other HDD's you can test? Any other DVD drives? The DVD drive should get power, so pushing the button should open it. If it doesn't, it may be a power issue (assuming you really do have it plugged in properly of course, which I believe you do). That POST screen shows us that no HDD's are detected. You could try another SATA power cable (actual cable, coming out of the PSU, not just another plug on the cable with multiple plugs...if that makes any sense) just to make sure that the one you've used isn't bad.

Unless anyone else has any ideas, it's looking like your mobo just has dead SATA ports for some reason. Or the HDD could be dead in the water. You can test this by trying the HDD in another computer, or by trying to boot the Windows install disc (or a linux live CD) off of the DVD drive. If it boots, it means the DVD drive is working, and the HDD is a lemon.

 

[Tashi]

You may remember me asking about which PC parts to get about a month ago. You may not. It doesn't matter. What does matter is that I was banned for a month and during that month I received all of my PC parts and was finally able to build. Here's the deal.

WD 1 TB 7200RPM HDD
ASRock P67 Extreme 4 Motherboard
G Skill 4gb DDR3 RAM
ASUS 24x CD/DVD Burner
Intel i5-2500k Sandy Bridge
Corsair Enthusiast 750w
Cooler Master CM690 II case
MSI Twin Frozr II GTX560 ti
Cooler master hyper 212 plus

And here it is all built!

It took me 4 hours total. It went really smooth for my first PC build ever. The only problem I had was I plugged in the CD/DVD Burner and the HDD into the SATA3 slots instead of SATA2. Other than that, it went great.

I really want to thank everyone who gave me advice in this thread before I was banned (lol). I want to thank the OP for being so awesome. I wish I could build more and more PCs. It runs great BTW, definitely the best PC I've ever used. I've recently installed a Black Magic Intensity Pro capture card and that runs great as well. This PC destroys everything I throw at it (not a big PC gamer at all)

It was a whole lot of fun building it. I would say the biggest issue I had was installing the after market CPU fan. It was bitch getting the backplate put into place as well as screwing the bracket in that locks the heatsink into place. Everything else went pretty damn smooth.

Thanks again, you guys are the shit!

 

[LaneDS]

Aligning the CM Hyper 212+, I want the fan the comes with the heatsink to be parallel to the front intake fan (and closer to the front than the back), right? Just trying to envision the best airflow solution, and it makes sense that the case draws in air, passes it to this fan, which cools the heatsink, and then any extra heat is sucked out the back.

Is that right?

Edit: Or, looking at both the picture posted above and then the gigantic fan on the top of my case... should I have the CPU's heatsink fan towards the bottom? I'm not sure if the fan on the top of the Corsair 600T is an intake or an exhaust.

Second edit: Looks like the front and top fans are intakes.

 

[LordCanti]

Aligning the CM Hyper 212+, I want the fan the comes with the heatsink to be parallel to the front intake fan (and closer to the front than the back), right? Just trying to envision the best airflow solution, and it makes sense that the case draws in air, passes it to this fan, which cools the heatsink, and then any extra heat is sucked out the back.

Is that right?

Yep, you've got it. You want the 212+ fan pushing air through the heatsink, and out the back.

 

[LaneDS]

Yep, you've got it. You want the 212+ fan pushing air through the heatsink, and out the back.

Right on, thanks much.

 

[tiff]

Do you have any other HDD's you can test? Any other DVD drives? The DVD drive should get power, so pushing the button should open it. If it doesn't, it may be a power issue (assuming you really do have it plugged in properly of course, which I believe you do). That POST screen shows us that no HDD's are detected. You could try another SATA power cable (actual cable, coming out of the PSU, not just another plug on the cable with multiple plugs...if that makes any sense) just to make sure that the one you've used isn't bad.

Unless anyone else has any ideas, it's looking like your mobo just has dead SATA ports for some reason. Or the HDD could be dead in the water. You can test this by trying the HDD in another computer, or by trying to boot the Windows install disc (or a linux live CD) off of the DVD drive. If it boots, it means the DVD drive is working, and the HDD is a lemon.

Actually, a friend suggested I try another connector and the drives are showing up now. I assume this is how the boot menu's supposed to look? (here's the storage config menu)

 

[LordCanti]

Actually, a friend suggested I try another connector and the drives are showing up now. I assume this is how the boot menu's supposed to look? (here's the storage config menu)

Yep, that is looking correct. What did you do exactly? I thought we had already tried different connectors, lol.

 

[Laurentius]

[snip]

That's a pretty slick looking case. How do you like it? I like the design better than the HAF's, and it's actually in stock, unlike the Lian Li Lancool I was looking at. How's the airflow? Would you recommend installing another fan or two in that case (possibly a side fan)?

Nice looking build, by the way.

 

[Herpes Reasons]

i dont know if this is the right place to ask, but i just bought 3 wd tv live plus to stream my videos and hd tv shows. what's the fastest nas out there under $200?
also, would this be a viable alternative?
NETGEAR N750 450 Mbps Wireless Dual Band Gigabit Router

 

[The Bookerman]

I got the impression that my pc is having issues with either my CPU or Mobo;
it's kinda slower to start up. used to be a bit faster to load up.
Any tools out there I should pick up?

CPU Core i5 2500k
Mobo asus p8p67.

This pc is 3 months old, it should still be blazing fast.
I don't get why it's getting slower to load up.

 

[tiff]

Yep, that is looking correct. What did you do exactly?

I just went to the next plug down on each SATA power cable. The plugs were a little different than the end ones: shorter and seemed to plug in more securely.

I thought we had already tried different connectors, lol.

We did? Sorry, I must have misread you at some point then. I'm pretty clueless about all this

Thanks for all your help though

 

[Coldsnap]

I can't say anything about the LED monitor, but I'm running two of those exact ASUS monitors, and have been now for almost 2 years I think, and they are superb. Great IQ, nice a bright, good image contrast etc... They are great for the money. I'm about to build a new rig and take these monitors and my old computer to be my new office computer, and I'll probably be picking up the LED monitors you linked to above, but if you're tight on cash, you won't be upset with the ASUS LCD. The only thing I don't like about them is the orange power button (seems out of place), but I don't even notice that anymore.

Cool. I'm gonna get that LED monitor I linked. I'll let you know how much I hate it

 

[LordCanti]

I got the impression that my pc is having issues with either my CPU or Mobo;
it's kinda slower to start up. used to be a bit faster to load up.
Any tools out there I should pick up?

CPU Core i5 2500k
Mobo asus p8p67.

This pc is 3 months old, it should still be blazing fast.
I don't get why it's getting slower to load up.

Have you installed a bunch of junk that loads during startup? Type MSconfig into the start menu search bar. Go to "Start up". If there is anything there that you don't need to start with windows, disable it.

You may considering using sleep mode instead of turning the computer off as well. That would save a lot of time.

I just went to the next plug down on each SATA power cable. The plugs were a little different than the end ones: shorter and seemed to plug in more securely.


We did? Sorry, I must have misread you at some point then. I'm pretty clueless about all this

Thanks for all your help though

I'm......I'm just....

I knew the issue was that you hadn't plugged the damn thing in lol. I knew it, deep down inside.