whatsinaname
Member
Does anyone have any idea about how much I could recoup by selling off my old E8400 + Gigabyte EP45-UD3P combo? Basically trying to figure out how much it would cost me to upgrade to an i2500k setup. The upgrade bug has hit.
"I need a New PC!" 2011 Thread of reading the OP. Seriously. [Part 2]
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This is not uncommon and you should enter your RAM setting manually anyway. 1600 sticks are still OC'd 1333 sticks so it is not a big deal.lordy88 said:
$100-$140. If you got a good OC out of it higher on that scale.whatsinaname said:
vaelic said:
Spreading it manually causes air pockets. You want the small ball of paste to spread evenly under applied pressure.Teetris said:
Depending on your size of tube even the smallest is at least 8 applications.
hey mkenyon, does your Fractal also has these inward pointing folded strips of metal in the 5.25" bay? They seem designed to hold DVD-drives... did you have to remove them for that XSPC pump/res combo?
I just bought a Fractal XL to move my system in somewhere in the next month or so (more noise isolation and my Stacker is pretty bent lol), but I was inspecting it and now I kind of doubt it'll fit my EK spin bay reservoir (or any other dual/triple bay stuff) without bending or cutting those metal edges. But the paint is nice and I don't want to ruin it
I just bought a Fractal XL to move my system in somewhere in the next month or so (more noise isolation and my Stacker is pretty bent lol), but I was inspecting it and now I kind of doubt it'll fit my EK spin bay reservoir (or any other dual/triple bay stuff) without bending or cutting those metal edges. But the paint is nice and I don't want to ruin it
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Adding a good 120mm fan would increase airflow a lot more than just turning up the fan speeds. Either way the Antec 300 is going to limit you unless you do some modding, it's simply an inadequate case for modern systems. Doubly so if you want silence.Thrakier said:That's the problem, I can't do that...I went to a shop and paid them so that they installed the heatsink...And they will claim that my temperatures are normal and that it isn't their fault.
If I put all coolers to max the temperature barely goes down, so I don#t think that another 120mm would make a big difference...
If it had four 5.25 bays, I'd recommend putting a 120mm fan in there, but since it has three you'll have to sacrifice the optical drive for that. Would do wonders for airflow to your CPU, but you'd need some sort of mesh to let air in, and something to filter the air (I hear pantyhose work well for this).
And like mkenyon said, open case temps don't really mean much - aside from the fact that lower temps without side panels means your airflow is poor. With proper airflow the sides of the case will help direct airflow and create pressure where you want it.
You should be able to reseat the heatsink yourself, but honestly I think you would probably end up about the same or worse. The temps with the case open aren't bad at all for 4.2GHz, it looks like it's all in your airflow.
BrassMonkey1010
Member
My friend wants a decent gaming rig for $700ish.
Still recommended to get the dual core i3's over any of the amd quads? I just have a hard time believing a dual core will be better down the road, but I haven't been keeping up with the pc world in a while.
Still recommended to get the dual core i3's over any of the amd quads? I just have a hard time believing a dual core will be better down the road, but I haven't been keeping up with the pc world in a while.
I'm trying to remember as I did quite a bit of modding on the case. The only thing I had to remove was a pre-installed 3.5" adapter in the bottom of the two 5.25" bays. Though this is of course on the Arc, not Define. If it wasn't an adapter, it was certainly something.
I know that between the two bays there is some sort of metal support actually built in the cage, but my XSPC dual bay res was seemingly designed for it, which tells me it is something standard in 5.25" bays. Funny how I never really noticed something like that before I needed to.
*further edit*
Looking at the EK res, it has the same slots on the sides down the middle as my XSPC. Should be good to go.
I know that between the two bays there is some sort of metal support actually built in the cage, but my XSPC dual bay res was seemingly designed for it, which tells me it is something standard in 5.25" bays. Funny how I never really noticed something like that before I needed to.
*further edit*
Looking at the EK res, it has the same slots on the sides down the middle as my XSPC. Should be good to go.
As a guy who still has two AMD PII X4 systems floating around, I would even recommend the i3's over them. The i3's iirc are hyperthreaded, so they essentially have 4 virtual cores. If you're looking "down the road", it's still a better option because you can throw in a 2500K or 2600K (or whatever else may come) once the i3 is starting to bottleneck too much since it's the same mobo. The AMD quads (if we're talking Phenom II's) are on a dead chipset, and the FX processors are a joke.BrassMonkey1010 said:
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Dual core i3 has a great upgrade path through Ivy Bridge so you can add a very nice quad later if/when it limits you. AMD quads don't have a performance advantage right now, and have no upgrade path so you'll need a whole new motherboard and CPU later.BrassMonkey1010 said:
Edit: Well, you could get an AM3+ board, but upgrading to Bulldozer is not as worthwhile as upgrading to Ivy Bridge.
chaosblade said:
Hm, weird. I thought a lot about which case I want to buy and read tons of reviews and the antec always had great reviews. Should I try to open up the slots under PCIE so more fresh air comes in or the hot air beneath the GFX can go out?
Whatever. I bought another 140mm for the top of the case to suck out the air a bit more. It's always about sucking more air out than bringing in I guess, so maybe that should help.
Here are my settings at the moment:
http://i.imgur.com/2CECU.png
Case fans at low, Macho fan at max. The temps go up though sometimes, the hottest core is 65 and the others are around 60. But they go back to the temps from the picture after some time. Testing it with Prime95 maximum heat.
I also bought a silentmaxx HDD silent drive + cooler. I hope my PC is really silent after that because t the moment the HDD is the loudest...
I've heard a lot of conflicting reports about airflow, but my personal best results have always come from positive pressure (more air in than out). I'm thinking there's basically 0 fresh air that is getting to your heatsink. Is the intake obstructed by anything you could remove? Could you add a fan to the side panel?
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Unfortunately with the PC component market, you have a problem with some people sticking to the status quo and continue to buy/recommend old and outdated hardware even when you can get something better for the same price or less. One thing I really love about the GAF PC community here is that people are usually on top of things and avoid such recommendations.
And there will always be some variance in temps while you test, max temps is what you'll want to go by. Those temps are fine as far as running 24/7 goes, you just want to be under 70C.
Of course it's better than nothing. If he wants silence I'd recommend a fan controller and a couple more 120mm fans and use the 140mm for exhaust.
And there will always be some variance in temps while you test, max temps is what you'll want to go by. Those temps are fine as far as running 24/7 goes, you just want to be under 70C.
I'm a firm believer in positive pressure as well, but I'm not sure a side fan will help. The side fan on the 300 is low, the GPU will probably obstruct the majority of the air.mkenyon said:
Of course it's better than nothing. If he wants silence I'd recommend a fan controller and a couple more 120mm fans and use the 140mm for exhaust.
I actually like the case, it's solid build for that money and looks great. ;D The airflow thing wasn't mentioned in any of those reviews. I had a Ximatek case before, I don't know...it's recomended everywhere but it felt very cheap and I don't know how the airflow is supposed to be better in that case.
I could add another 120mm to the front if I need to. But like I said, that will also make the sys louder...
I could add another 120mm to the front if I need to. But like I said, that will also make the sys louder...
So I'm having a bit of a problem with my GTX460. I recently decided to hook my computer up to my TV on a permanent basis so I ordered an HDMI switcher and a couple of extra cables. When I hooked it up to my TV though nothing was being displayed and I found that the connection to my video card (an HDMI cable with the HDMI->mini HDMI adapter provided by NVidia) was extremely loose. It would come out with even the slightest tug on the cord.
I double checked the switch and the cables with other devices and they all work fine, I also bypassed the switch straight to the TV and the same result occurred. I remounted the video card into the motherboard as well just on the off chance that would fix it, it didn't.
Has anyone else ever had a similar problem? Is there anything I can do too specifically fix the mini HDMI port on my card? That appears to be the issue, as everything else on the card functions fine. I actually had the PC hooked up to my TV a week or two ago just for a football game and everything worked fine then, it seems odd to me that the port would get loose in such a short period of time.
I double checked the switch and the cables with other devices and they all work fine, I also bypassed the switch straight to the TV and the same result occurred. I remounted the video card into the motherboard as well just on the off chance that would fix it, it didn't.
Has anyone else ever had a similar problem? Is there anything I can do too specifically fix the mini HDMI port on my card? That appears to be the issue, as everything else on the card functions fine. I actually had the PC hooked up to my TV a week or two ago just for a football game and everything worked fine then, it seems odd to me that the port would get loose in such a short period of time.
So, I'm thinking of getting an HTPC (well, high end music server) set up for my father. He's going to be connecting it to a $5000 DAC, so I won't be skimping too much. One thing is essential however: it has to be quiet.
I realize I could go the Atom route with passive cooling, but I'd want to go with something a little more powerful and maintainable. Is it possible/viable to passively cool any of the current desktop CPUs? I mean, I could try to get a low profile Noctua 140mm cooler that "should" fit into an HTPC case, but I'm not sure if I'd consider that quiet enough for an audiophile setup.
I realize I could go the Atom route with passive cooling, but I'd want to go with something a little more powerful and maintainable. Is it possible/viable to passively cool any of the current desktop CPUs? I mean, I could try to get a low profile Noctua 140mm cooler that "should" fit into an HTPC case, but I'm not sure if I'd consider that quiet enough for an audiophile setup.
As long as you have some awesome case fans that are ultra quiet, you could always simply put a nice cooler on there and have it simply passively cooled by the case airflow. Totally acceptable route, especially since this will not be an OC'd system.TheExodu5 said:
An A8 system might be just what you're looking for.
mkenyon said:
The A8 CPU is 100W though, isn't it? I'd feel more comfortable with a 65W i3 2300.
Also, any suggestions on really nice looking aluminum (at least the front panel) HTPC cases?
If I were going the micro-ATX route, this one looks amazing:
But, at $350, god damn it's expensive.
Yeah, but then you'll need a GPU on top of that. The A8 is both, so you won't need a fan to cool any sort of GPU.TheExodu5 said:
Possible idea - mATX A8 system, put it in a Silverstone FT-03, put some Scythe Gentle Typhoons. Throw a giant heatsink on the CPU with 0 fans on it.
BoobPhysics101
Banned
TheExodu5 said:The A8 CPU is 100W though, isn't it? I'd feel more comfortable with a 65W i3 2300.
Also, any suggestions on really nice looking aluminum (at least the front panel) HTPC cases?
If I were going the micro-ATX route, this one looks amazing:
But, at $350, god damn it's expensive.
A8 has a TDP of 100w, does not mean that's what it runs at. In fact, if I remember correctly, that thing idles at like 8w power usage!
And the AMD GPU > Intel for any HTPC. Plus those A8's need like NO cooling whatsoever to keep themselves cool. Even on stock HSF with the fan set to low, they idle at like 20c.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
If you don't have a CD, it should have come with a backup/restore partition on the HDD. Should be able to boot to it, or maybe try to open it and it should run something.Tashi0106 said:
If you don't have that you'll probably need to contact the whoever made it, because you should have some option to restore it to factory defaults, be it through discs or a restore partition.
Really? That's pretty ballsy of Microsoft. Not sure if he would have a key, I know my old HP PC didn't have an XP key and they wouldn't give me one. Had to use their restore utility which put all their bloatware back on my PC.mkenyon said:
I like my HTPC's somewhat larger, but the Silverstone LC17 works wonders. With a quiet PSU and a large, but quiet Scythe, it works wonders. Room for 3 to 4 case fans, which means that you can either go for onboard gpu, or buy a small passively cooled one (GT210 is what I have).
BoobPhysics101
Banned
TheExodu5 said:
You won't be disappointed. I've had two Llano setups: An A4-3400m in an Asus K53Ta: quad-core that OC'd from 1.4 Ghz to 2.8 Ghz - in a laptop! And also an A6-3650m, which is the same thing as an A8 but clocked a bit lower and with a slightly worse iGPU. That thing used like no power and ran extremely cool. Llano is awesome.
BoobPhysics101
Banned
mkenyon said:
He doesn't even need the key.
http://forum.notebookreview.com/windows-os-software/428068-legal-windows-7-download-links-just-like-vista-before.html said:
I probably know the answer to this question, but is there any reason I shouldn't get the cheaper memory of these two?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231417
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231424
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231417
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231424
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Nope, won't make any difference. Good deal on that RAM for $30.Hylian7 said:
And this is it GAF, it's almost time.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Forum upgrade, 15 (or more) hours downtime.mkenyon said:
aaaand we're back
yeah the latest (rev3) have got those, I don't think my rev2 has them though :/ let me crawl under the desk to see so I can use the new post edit feature
can't see it, but googling around seem like mine doesn't have the slots so I'm gonna have to bend or cut those rails ... luckily the res is pretty short so only the front four are in the way
yeah the latest (rev3) have got those, I don't think my rev2 has them though :/ let me crawl under the desk to see so I can use the new post edit feature
can't see it, but googling around seem like mine doesn't have the slots so I'm gonna have to bend or cut those rails ... luckily the res is pretty short so only the front four are in the way
PC suddenly switched itself off. Would then run for two minutes, switching off again once Windows booted. Each subsequent switch-on reduced the amount of active time, by the end not even getting to the OS boot phase and switching off at the bios boot.
Leaving it for two hours then switching it on again allows Windows to be booted and it is currently running fine. Awaiting it's next switch-off.
This leads me to guess a component (probably my CPU, right?) is overheating and my motherboard is doing the job it is supposed to and is killing the power to prevent component damage.
I have zero experience of hardware troubleshooting though so I don't have a clue. If GAF could advise what I need to do to:
1 - confirm the problem is a component overheat
2 - identify the problem if that isn't the case
3 - fix the problem
I have done nothing to this PC in the last few weeks that could cause a change. Once the problem began, I opened the case and gave it a good cleanout with a can of compressed air, but airflow was already pretty good anyway so that wasn't it.
Leaving it for two hours then switching it on again allows Windows to be booted and it is currently running fine. Awaiting it's next switch-off.
This leads me to guess a component (probably my CPU, right?) is overheating and my motherboard is doing the job it is supposed to and is killing the power to prevent component damage.
I have zero experience of hardware troubleshooting though so I don't have a clue. If GAF could advise what I need to do to:
1 - confirm the problem is a component overheat
2 - identify the problem if that isn't the case
3 - fix the problem
I have done nothing to this PC in the last few weeks that could cause a change. Once the problem began, I opened the case and gave it a good cleanout with a can of compressed air, but airflow was already pretty good anyway so that wasn't it.
TouchMyBox
Member
The A8 CPU is 100W though, isn't it? I'd feel more comfortable with a 65W i3 2300.
Also, any suggestions on really nice looking aluminum (at least the front panel) HTPC cases?
If I were going the micro-ATX route, this one looks amazing:
But, at $350, god damn it's expensive.
Do any stores in Canada carry this? Shopbot returns nothing.
edit:
Look like this the best place place to go? http://www.shop.perfecthometheater.com/Case-HTPC-M10-VFD310-right-button-Black-HTPC-M10-VFD310-rb-B.htm
first:
are all the fans running?
what do temperatures look like in bios? (system health tab or something similar)
what do temperatures look like in Windows using a program like HWmonitor ?
once you have confirmation the temperatures look normal you can stress test specific components using programs like Prime95, memtest86+ and so on
Machine died again not long after making previous post. Gave it a few then checked the following:
System overall had about 18 degrees C last I checked before the switch off.
This is with the side of the case removed and the french doors open onto a cold and windy afternoon.
Didn't get into windows to run HWmonitor for obvious reasons.
... it's the CPU, isn't it?
Yes. Front and rear of case, CPU heatsink/fan, GPU and PSU all going good.
CPU started at 80 degrees C and over three minutes rose to 120 before switching off.
System overall had about 18 degrees C last I checked before the switch off.
This is with the side of the case removed and the french doors open onto a cold and windy afternoon.
Didn't get into windows to run HWmonitor for obvious reasons.
... it's the CPU, isn't it?
Core2Duo E8400, running with the stock heatsink/fan. Had it and ran the machine daily for long stretches of time for about three and a half years now.
Never checked temperatures before, but also never once had a problem with system instability.
I got to go now but,
if it really ran without issues before, and you haven't moved the pc/it hasn't fallen over or anything (and the stock heatsinks on those are pretty tight AFAIK) AND you are certain the fan still runs (at a decent amount of RPM ofcourse) it's probably not a mechanical issue.
So then it is either the stock paste degrading over time, which I don't really buy, or the heatsink being clogged with a ton of dust ? any dust visible? I always clean out my air heatsinks with a vacuum cleaner + inserted straw, just be careful about static electricity near the PCB so touch only the heatsink and nothing else
it's probably best anyway to just take it off, clean it, and replace the thermal paste with some fresh higher quality stuff (assuming you have something available quickly)
only other thing I can imagine was it just never being installed correctly in the first place but I don't see why temps haven't been an issue up till now
Alright, ordered my dad's music server components:
I opted for an AMD E-350 system in the end. He was pretty adamant about having it as silent as possible, so I'm hoping it can run entirely fanless. The motherboard is micro ATX as opposed to ATX because he wanted to be able to have a dedicated USB and firewire card if needed. He didn't care about having a small system like a mini ITX system. This works out in the end, because at least the system can later be upgraded to a full speed desktop system if he wants to, and big, low speed fans can be used to cool the system if needed as well.
The power supply is fanless and seemed to be a great choice for an HTPC system. Total overkill for a 50 watt system, but it's the only high quality fanless and modular PSU I could find.
Here's the case:
Silverstone Lascala LC-13
Nothing special, but it was relatively cheap, and should fit anything needed. It will allow for quiet cooling if needed as well.
I opted for an AMD E-350 system in the end. He was pretty adamant about having it as silent as possible, so I'm hoping it can run entirely fanless. The motherboard is micro ATX as opposed to ATX because he wanted to be able to have a dedicated USB and firewire card if needed. He didn't care about having a small system like a mini ITX system. This works out in the end, because at least the system can later be upgraded to a full speed desktop system if he wants to, and big, low speed fans can be used to cool the system if needed as well.
The power supply is fanless and seemed to be a great choice for an HTPC system. Total overkill for a 50 watt system, but it's the only high quality fanless and modular PSU I could find.
Here's the case:
Silverstone Lascala LC-13
Nothing special, but it was relatively cheap, and should fit anything needed. It will allow for quiet cooling if needed as well.
Alright, I removed the fan and cleaned it (not a lot to clean - I've been fairly regular about vacuuming+air blasting the inside of the case since I got it anyway) but I do notice some dried, crumbly residue on the CPU and fan, which I guess means the stock paste is dry?
Thank you for all your help, anyway. This is scary new territory for me.
Dear all, when it comes to thermal paste, does near enough anything with 'thermal paste' written on the tube work well or are their particular brands/sorts to go for? What's the difference between paste and grease?
Also, is Qtip+diluted rubbing alcohol the best method for removing old paste? Or is the alcohol even not needed and just a slightly damp Qtip do the job anyway?
I would simply just say "fuck it" and buy a new mobo and an i5 (the moment I tried to play GTAIV I regretted getting only a dual core...), but with all the rumours flying around about the next XBOX having a 6-core CPU I thought it more wise to wait for affordable consumer 6-core PC CPUs so I won't have a headache of trying to run next-gen console ports.
edit - on the upside, thermal paste seams to be bloody cheap. Anything from £0.5 to £4 average. That's good news.
edit 2 - the worst part is that I'd just started a new, modded playthrough of Morrowind. I WANT BACK IN
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Look for MX-4 thermal paste, if you can't find that there are plenty of good ones out there. Noctua NT-H1, Chillfactor 3, IC Diamond, among others. Stores (at least around here) don't usually care any good stuff, just "cheaper" lower end stuff but they charge a lot more for it than online stores.
And Qtip+alcohol is fine, not sure if it's supposed to be diluted or not. I had some compound remover that I've used, but most people just use alcohol I think.
Also wouldn't worry about 6 core CPUs anytime soon, until recently dual cores were fine for almost any game despite the 360 having 3 cores. Whether or not it's a console port and what the console internals are doesn't really matter, it's pretty hit or miss and depends entirely on the quality of the port.
I'd agree, except it's getting rarer and rarer to find a decently optimised port. Tri-core being the 'hidden' system requirement is becoming more and more common. That and I just really wanted to play GTAIV on my PC. GTA is worth 10 other games at least!
I get that, but that was also the argument used to convince me an E8400 ("hardly any games support more than two cores! When they do, it won't be a problem") was the better choice than whatever Quad core intel CPU was the hot shit at the time. Within a year I was wishing I had gone with a Quad.
All irrelevant right now as I'm ordering some paste and praying that fixes the problem.
It was the Q6600. And don't worry. Even overclocked to 3.4Ghz it still runs Civ5 like shit later in this game.
Even still though, a quad would do you well right now but the C2Q architecture is really showing it's age now. Even if you went with the quad you'd still be looking to upgrade now. I'd be upgrading now if the GPU die shrink had happened yet. As it stand I'm fine with waiting for spring for a Ivy Bridge build with the new GPUs and cheap, fast SSDs. I've already noticed some SSDs going on sale near the 1$/GB mark as the Christmas sales ramp up (With MIR of course :S).- Status