I rewatched the Star Wars prequels for the first time in years ..

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There's not much to talk about when you spot a turd on the ground and point to it and call it a turd.
Somewhere, JJ Abrams is now playing at making the turd seem like this important thing, or perhaps it's not a turd at all. Maybe it's vomit instead. At least that's what it looked like in the trailers.

No, wait. It was a turd afterall. ABRAAAAAAMS!

What the hell did I just type?

But still, despite how I'm certain people are championing him as "NOT BEEING LOOKAAAS!", Abrams just is not the right man to take over Star Wars.
 
I don't understand the backlash against Abrams.

When the 2009 Star Trek film came out, a lot of people bashed Abrams for turning an intellectual series into a simplified summer action blockbuster. In essence, he turned Star Trek into Star Wars. While most of this criticism was plagiarized from RedLetterMedia (much like most of the criticisms against the prequels in this thread), the general opinion was that Abrams would be better off directing Star Wars. Now he's the director of the new Star Wars movies and there's still backlash because...why? If it's established that Star Wars is basically a sci-fi adventure series that's not particularly sophisticated, why couldn't Abrams create a modern version of the series? It doesn't have to be perfect either, just good.

Reminds me of the random hate against Joss Whedon when he was set to direct Avengers.
 
I don't understand the backlash against Abrams.

When the 2009 Star Trek film came out, a lot of people bashed Abrams for turning an intellectual series into a simplified summer action blockbuster. In essence, he turned Star Trek into Star Wars. While most of this criticism was plagiarized from RedLetterMedia (much like most of the criticisms against the prequels in this thread), the general opinion was that Abrams would be better off directing Star Wars. Now he's the director of the new Star Wars movies and there's still backlash because...why? If it's established that Star Wars is basically a sci-fi adventure series that's not particularly sophisticated, why couldn't Abrams create a modern version of the series? It doesn't have to be perfect either, just good.

Reminds me of the random hate against Joss Whedon when he was set to direct Avengers.

I haven't heard much Abrams negativity. Anything is better than Lucas. Abrams does solid work.
 
I don't understand the backlash against Abrams.

When the 2009 Star Trek film came out, a lot of people bashed Abrams for turning an intellectual series into a simplified summer action blockbuster. In essence, he turned Star Trek into Star Wars. While most of this criticism was plagiarized from RedLetterMedia (much like most of the criticisms against the prequels in this thread), the general opinion was that Abrams would be better off directing Star Wars. Now he's the director of the new Star Wars movies and there's still backlash because...why? If it's established that Star Wars is basically a sci-fi adventure series that's not particularly sophisticated, why couldn't Abrams create a modern version of the series? It doesn't have to be perfect either, just good.

Reminds me of the random hate against Joss Whedon when he was set to direct Avengers.
Because I feel that they could do better than Abrams. Because of stuff like say " we're going to recapture the spirit of the Original Trilogy" when in all honesty, we should be moving away from that. They should do something that in itself captures the essence of what makes Star Wars, Star Wars , instead of one particular version of Star Wars. That's one of the reasons why I feel that Episode VII might end up being the first Star Wars movie that'll feel somewhat empty after all is said and done. In fact, here's a video made about a year back that basically sums up what I have to say better than I probably could (for the record, when he did see Star Trek Into Darkness, he did not like that flick at all).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAg68T1N_9A

I haven't heard much Abrams negativity. Anything is better than Lucas. Abrams does solid work.
Your post is basically what was picked upon in the video just now. Do we really want something like Abrams, because it seems like he'll do a decent job and nothing more? That's not what we should be striving for.
 
Because I feel that they could do better than Abrams. Because of stuff like say " we're going to recapture the spirit of the Original Trilogy" when in all honesty, we should be moving away from that. They should do something that in itself captures the essence of what makes Star Wars, Star Wars , instead of one particular version of Star Wars. That's one of the reasons why I feel that Episode VII might end up being the first Star Wars movie that'll feel somewhat empty after all is said and done. In fact, here's a video made about a year back that basically sums up what I have to say better than I probably could (for the record, when he did see Star Trek Into Darkness, he did not like that flick at all).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAg68T1N_9A

I'd love for Quentin Tarantino to do Aliens vs Predator. But he would turn it down if they offered him. The director has to accept. Do we know they didn't try Steven Spielberg?
 
Because I feel that they could do better than Abrams. Because of stuff like say " we're going to recapture the spirit of the Original Trilogy" when in all honesty, we should be moving away from that. They should do something that in itself captures the essence of what makes Star Wars, Star Wars , instead of one particular version of Star Wars. That's one of the reasons why I feel that Episode VII might end up being the first Star Wars movie that'll feel somewhat empty after all is said and done. In fact, here's a video made about a year back that basically sums up what I have to say better than I probably could (for the record, when he did see Star Trek Into Darkness, he did not like that flick at all).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAg68T1N_9A

Your post is basically what was picked upon in the video just now. Do we really want something like Abrams, because it seems like he'll do a decent job and nothing more? That's not what we should be striving for.

So is your concern that Abrams will create a solid, but not particularly spectacular series of films that are somewhat derivative of the OT? From where I see it, Star Wars (outside of Episode V) has never been a top-quality series. Certainly a good one, but even A New Hope wasn't exactly a cinematic masterpiece. Empire seems like an anomaly in its own series for that reason. If Abrams can capture the feel of the universe while still delivering a solid sci-fi blockbuster, that will be good enough for me. Although I can certainly understand your point in wanting for more.
 
I found them to be harmless films. I don't find them to be paragon of awesomenss, but they are watchable. Also the hate for Jake Lloyd is fucking stupid. He was a little kid! of course his acting skill would not be so fucking good. That the script he got was not so good was also a problem. People ruined his life over a fucking film he did when he was a kid.
 
Meh. I would take them anyyday, over, say...Green Lantern or Pearl Harbour.

Now why can't people ever talk about actual craptacular movies like the two I mentioned?

Disappointed SW fanboys hyperbolize how bad the prequels are and nitpick every single flaw as proof that they are the worst films ever.

Yes, the prequels are not as good as the OT, but there are films that are far worse than them.
 
Saw a few people hating on RotJ, can someone walk me through what's so terrible about it.

My view
APM- jar jar kills it, like seriously how did they let that abomination happen? Maul makes it bearable, I think it could have been better if he was in clones. 5/10
AotC- Anakins just annoying. I didn't really like the movie as a whole. 4/10
RotS- Anakins still annoying, but this is probably the strongest of the prequels. Last half is worth watching. Would have been better if darth had more screen time. First half: 5/10 last half: 8/10
 
So is your concern that Abrams will create a solid, but not particularly spectacular series of films that are somewhat derivative of the OT? From where I see it, Star Wars (outside of Episode V) has never been a top-quality series. Certainly a good one, but even A New Hope wasn't exactly a cinematic masterpiece. Empire seems like an anomaly in its own series for that reason. If Abrams can capture the feel of the universe while still delivering a solid sci-fi blockbuster, that will be good enough for me. Although I can certainly understand your point in wanting for more.
You are correct in my "wanting to do more with the franchise, other than hang off the coattails of the Originals". I mean, I'm certain that the franchise has had good, if not great stories in other media (Knights of the Old Republic one of the prime examples), so why shouldn't the medium that started it all give it a go? Because fans will bitch and moan about it (or some other example, that one was the first that came to me)? I say "screw the fans, for all I care". Say what you will about Iron Man 3. That twist was spectacular. Who cared if it upset a vocal minority of fans, it sure as hell was something interesting. Why should we have to listen to a fanbase that cling onto a franchise that has about only 2 great movies under its belt (sorry folks, Jedi was a poor ending to what it set up before it)? Because it might deviate from what they want? Going back to what I said about Iron Man 3, if new Star Wars has those kind of risk taking moments, then sign me up.

I'd love for Quentin Tarantino to do Aliens vs Predator. But he would turn it down if they offered him. The director has to accept. Do we know they didn't try Steven Spielberg?
Like the video said, there is a ton of visionary talent that would kill to gave a go at their own Star Wars movie. Not necessary the established directors like Spielberg, although that would still be an interesting choice. It's merely looking at what fresh, bold visionaries can bring to Star Wars, rather than someone as adequate as Abrams is.
 
Honestly, the original movies aren't that good either. You were just younger when you got to know them.

I agree. Of the original Trilogy only Empire is good. Of the Prequels only Revenge of the Sith was good.( though not as good as Empire ) I really never liked "A new Hope" at all. Not even as a kid.
 
I missed seeing revenge of the Sith in the cinema so bought it on DVD many many years ago I only ever watched it once while blind drunk and can't remember half of it so I've put it on now and the one thing I can't help but vomit at is some of the cgi work is so so horrible, yeah 1 and 2 are likely worse but 3 is not exactly that old a movie it shouldn't look this horrible surely, I've seen better in ps2 cut scenes
 
Probably not a popular opinion but I'd take Revenge of the Sith over Return of the Jedi any day. Menace and Clone were both terrible though.
 
My ranking 5>4>6>>3>>>>>2>1.

tumblr_m8iall9Z0s1qhi1hz.jpg
 
I missed seeing revenge of the Sith in the cinema so bought it on DVD many many years ago I only ever watched it once while blind drunk and can't remember half of it so I've put it on now and the one thing I can't help but vomit at is some of the cgi work is so so horrible, yeah 1 and 2 are likely worse but 3 is not exactly that old a movie it shouldn't look this horrible surely, I've seen better in ps2 cut scenes
Hyperbole to the extreme.

There's actually a ton of practical effects work in the Prequels that you probably never noticed.

http://boards.theforce.net/threads/practical-effects-in-the-prequels-sets-pictures-models-etc.50017310/
 
People who actually think RotJ is on par with ANH or ESB are going off nostalgia. It doesn't hold up.

The Luke/Vader encounter in RotJ can only make up so much for the rest of the movie. It's the best thing about it. I have not seen Revenge since 2005, but I only remember the final battle (and all for the wrong reasons).
 
I never said there wasn't practical effects in the movie, I never even said some of the cgi wasn't beautiful, just that some of it is eye gratingly bad

Well, for the time those prequels were released is when CGI was still being developed. I mean look at the CGI in the lord of the rings trilogy. I was rewatching that trilogy and alot of CGI in my opinion looked horrible.. Nowadays, CGI is getting better and better. There's still some bad CGI in some movies. Personally, I like both practical effects, and CGI. The best effects are when practical and CGI are combined together..
 
Well, for the time those prequels were released is when CGI was still being developed. I mean look at the CGI in the lord of the rings trilogy. I was rewatching that trilogy and alot of CGI in my opinion looked horrible.. Nowadays, CGI is getting better and better. There's still some bad CGI in some movies. Personally, I like both practical effects, and CGI. The best effects are when practical and CGI are combined together..

Rots offends me as it came in 2005 a time when cgi was fairly mature and some of it does look great but other bits look atrocious (greavous's cloak for one example)
 
Well, for the time those prequels were released is when CGI was still being developed. I mean look at the CGI in the lord of the rings trilogy. I was rewatching that trilogy and alot of CGI in my opinion looked horrible.. Nowadays, CGI is getting better and better. There's still some bad CGI in some movies. Personally, I like both practical effects, and CGI. The best effects are when practical and CGI are combined together..
Exactly. Those claiming that the CG in the Prequels was bad...come on. The CG in those movies is 10 to 15 years old. Of course its gonna look bad in comparison with newer movies. It's called progress.
 
Rots offends me as it came in 2005 a time when cgi was fairly mature and some of it does look great but other bits look atrocious (greavous's cloak for one example)

That's the thing though 2005 was when Revenge of the Sith came out. There was still some problems with CGI. That year is when it started to improve alot though.. Like take for example The Hobbit trilogy. The movies have very great special effects,
but there's a part in the last scene with Smaug concerning molten gold, where it looked very very fake, and videogamey.

Also, I agree with you on Grevious clothe, one of the few CGI elements I did not like in the movie.
 
Exactly. Those claiming that the CG in the Prequels was bad...come on. The CG in those movies is 10 to 15 years old. Of course its gonna look bad in comparison with newer movies. It's called progress.

I agree with you there. There's a few bad CGI moments in movies still, and one that comes to mind recently is The Hobbit Desolation of Smaug..
 
RotS has some great CGI, it's AotC that has the really wonky stuff for the most part. What's really bizarre though is that there is one shot of Yoda that is 100% photorealistic in AotC (it's a shot when he's on the clone gunship) but everywhere else in the movie he looks bad.
 
RotS has some great CGI, it's AotC that has the really wonky stuff for the most part. What's really bizarre though is that there is one shot of Yoda that is 100% photorealistic in AotC (it's a shot when he's on the clone gunship) but everywhere else in the movie he looks bad.

Well about Attack of the Clones, at that time, the CGI was still progressing. I mean Spiderman came out around that time, and to me it shows it's age too. I agree that AOTC had alot of problems CGI, but there were alot of great uses of CGI in that movie too. I really liked the chase scene in the beginning of the movie, the fight with Jango Fett at Kamino. I agree that Yoda didn't look that good. But I loved that fight between Count Dooku and Yoda. Also, Revenge of the Sith they really improved his CGI model in that movie. I thought that the war on Geonosis looked outdated. The clones themselves looked very CGI. I feel that in Revenge of the Sith, the clones looked much better. Also, what improved in that movie CGI wise, is the worlds. They all look stunning to me, with my favorite being Kashyyyk and Felucia.

One thing that has me excited about Episode VII and the other new Star Wars movies, is how they are going to look, since special effects has advanced so much, that alot of stuff look great nowadays. Like Davy Jones is one of the best CGI characters I ever seen, and I first thought it was a guy in a mask, and costume. I just want to see some new worlds, and I want the new trilogy to be it's own thing.
 
For me personally it goes 4=5>6>>>3>>>>>>>>>>1>2.

Three did the best it could to redeem the prequels but it is really hard to go up with the holiest of film theologies.
 
Exactly. Those claiming that the CG in the Prequels was bad...come on. The CG in those movies is 10 to 15 years old. Of course its gonna look bad in comparison with newer movies. It's called progress.

...Except it looks worse than Jurassic Park and Terminator 2, two movies that are older.
 
...Except it looks worse than Jurassic Park and Terminator 2, two movies that are older.

No it doesn't if anything I think that the T1000 looks really bad nowadays. I mean it hasn't aged well at all. As for Jurassic Park, there are certain scenes with the CGI dinosaurs where they look very CGI. I'm talking about where they take a jeep and enter the fenced area. I find that Jurassic Park does a great job with CGI for it's time. Overall, that movie was amazing visually due to how long ago it was.
 
...Except it looks worse than Jurassic Park and Terminator 2, two movies that are older.

I think it's important to keep in mind the sheer density of special effects in the films you're comparing them to. Jurassic Park had CG but it also had a lot of animatronics and models and such. So did the prequels, but those clearly had vastly more effects shots and details going on. They're a whole different ballgame. Achieving what ILM did with the prequels is admirable considering the amount of CG they had, and for the most part they look fine.
 
...Except it looks worse than Jurassic Park and Terminator 2, two movies that are older.

Terminator 2's CG doesn't really "hold up."

It shouldn't HAVE TO, viewers should be able to keep in mind when the movie was made and roll with it. But to say any of the Prequels SFX looks worse than the morphing effects in T2 is pretty hyperbolic.
 
Terminator 2's CG doesn't really "hold up."

It shouldn't HAVE TO, viewers should be able to keep in mind when the movie was made and roll with it. But to say any of the Prequels SFX looks worse than the morphing effects in T2 is pretty hyperbolic.

I'm sorry, but I find Terminator 2's liquid metal man much more convincing than this:

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or this

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I'm sorry, but I find Terminator 2's liquid metal man much more convincing than this:

I think that opinion is ridiculous on the face of it and can't even start to see how I could meet you halfway on it. Dunno what to tell you, man.

I mean, to be clear, T2 is a better movie than Attack of the Clones in damn near every way, but Cameron likely would have murdered someone for the chance to pull off anything like Dexter Jettster back in 1991.

I think the space-ticks are dumb as fuck, and the scene they're in is maybe one of the 3 worst scenes in all of Star Wars - but c'mon.
 
I actually think those two scenes look fine, for a movie that came out in 2002. That liquid metal man in Terminator 2 looked fake at times nowadays. Great movie overall, but the special effects has aged quite a bit.
 
ROTS has "seams" in the CGI, but I still find it so much better graphically than AOTC. Each year of the early 2000s brought leaps and bounds in cinematic technique.

In 2002 there was a LOT of jank (Spiderman, Clones, Blade 2 kung fu scene).. by about 2006 we were getting to a pretty good place.
 
I felt bad when the guy that voiced Jar Jar Binks did an AMA on Reddit. I knew how that was going down right away.

Honestly, he probably did the best job acting out of them all though. The dialog was horrible in the prequels, but that didn't excuse a lot of the horrible acting too.

Revenge of the Sith turned out decent in the last half but that's for obvious reasons where there was little dialog and a lot of fighting. I think Ewan did a decent job conveying emotions in the fight though.

It's hard because I don't think the prequels would have ever been able to live up to the hype considering where the bar was set for some people, but there were so many problems with the movies that guaranteed it would be a huge letdown for the fans. A lot of kids enjoyed it though which makes sense since they seemed catered to them, but now those kids go back and watch it and say, "What the hell?"
 
I felt bad when the guy that voiced Jar Jar Binks did an AMA on Reddit. I knew how that was going down right away.

Honestly, he probably did the best job acting out of them all though. The dialog was horrible in the prequels, but that didn't excuse a lot of the horrible acting too.

Revenge of the Sith turned out decent in the last half but that's for obvious reasons where there was little dialog and a lot of fighting. I think Ewan did a decent job conveying emotions in the fight though.

It's hard because I don't think the prequels would have ever been able to live up to the hype considering where the bar was set for some people, but there were so many problems with the movies that guaranteed it would be a huge letdown for the fans. A lot of kids enjoyed it though which makes sense since they seemed catered to them, but now those kids go back and watch it and say, "What the hell?"

I find that The Clone Wars tv show is the best thing that modern Star Wars has to offer and is better than all the Prequel movies combined. Also, about that hype thing I agree. I think that George Lucas is good at coming up with ideas. I mean great ideas, but he should let other people write the script and direct. I think that's why The Clone Wars ended up being so great.
 
I find that The Clone Wars tv show is the best thing that modern Star Wars has to offer and is better than all the Prequel movies combined. Also, about that hype thing I agree. I think that George Lucas is good at coming up with ideas. I mean great ideas, but he should let other people write the script and direct. I think that's why The Clone Wars ended up being so great.

Yea, it's like how a lot of inventors can come up with the ideas, but they don't stand a chance when it comes to creating a viable product or business without people that run that side of things.

George Lucas is an inventor with a great imagination, but he needed to let other people handle the business itself. In a way, I guess that's the case now for better or worse? lol

Oh, and I just started watching the TV show out of boredom one day not too long ago. It's actually quite surprising despite my reservations in the beginning.
 
There's a difference between something being technically more impressive and something being more aesthetically appealing.

The T1000's liquid form is so convincing because you can buy into the material being smooth and somewhat amorphous. The lack of detail isn't a setback.

In the SW prequels there's some damn impressive CGI. I think what people are criticizing there is the over reliance on the CGI, being present in practically every shot of AOTC and ROTS (I think it is actually every ROTS shot), rather than the quality of the CGI itself.

Both sides are right. :)
 
Yea, it's like how a lot of inventors can come up with the ideas, but they don't stand a chance when it comes to creating a viable product or business without people that run that side of things.

George Lucas is an inventor with a great imagination, but he needed to let other people handle the business itself. In a way, I guess that's the case now for better or worse? lol

Oh, and I just started watching the TV show out of boredom one day not too long ago. It's actually quite surprising despite my reservations in the beginning.

Personally, I liked the prequels, but the show is much much better than the prequels. I mean wait till you get into the other seasons. Also concerning J J directing Episode VII. I just hope he takes some risks on Episode VII and not over do with the references to the old trilogy. I mean this movie is suppose to take place 30 years after. Another thing I really hope that there's no len's flare.. I'm cautiously optimistic about Episode VII..
 
There's a difference between something being technically more impressive and something being more aesthetically appealing.

The T1000's liquid form is so convincing because you can buy into the material being smooth and somewhat amorphous. The lack of detail isn't a setback.

In the SW prequels there's some damn impressive CGI. I think what people are criticizing there is the over reliance on the CGI, being present in practically every shot of AOTC and ROTS (I think it is actually every ROTS shot), rather than the quality of the CGI itself.

Both sides are right. :)

Diplomatic skills befitting a Jedi. Well-played. :)
 
I keep thinking one day I'm going to sit down and watch the prequels. I've actually never seen them, just clips when episode 1 was coming out and it was everywhere like MTV or whatever.

Stay strong, my friend. I envy you.
 
You are correct in my "wanting to do more with the franchise, other than hang off the coattails of the Originals". I mean, I'm certain that the franchise has had good, if not great stories in other media (Knights of the Old Republic one of the prime examples), so why shouldn't the medium that started it all give it a go? Because fans will bitch and moan about it (or some other example, that one was the first that came to me)? I say "screw the fans, for all I care". Say what you will about Iron Man 3. That twist was spectacular. Who cared if it upset a vocal minority of fans, it sure as hell was something interesting. Why should we have to listen to a fanbase that cling onto a franchise that has about only 2 great movies under its belt (sorry folks, Jedi was a poor ending to what it set up before it)? Because it might deviate from what they want? Going back to what I said about Iron Man 3, if new Star Wars has those kind of risk taking moments, then sign me up.

Like the video said, there is a ton of visionary talent that would kill to gave a go at their own Star Wars movie. Not necessary the established directors like Spielberg, although that would still be an interesting choice. It's merely looking at what fresh, bold visionaries can bring to Star Wars, rather than someone as adequate as Abrams is.

I don't know how you can watch Mission Impossible 3 or Star Trek and think "Abrams is just an adequate director who won't bring anything new".

Since he started directing he's done nothing but restore dead franchises to their former glory. There was seriously no better choice for this.

I'm sure Disney will make plenty of Star Wars movies where your bold visionaries can show what they can do, especially after Abrams brings back the franchise's credibility.
 
Since he started directing he's done nothing but restore dead franchises to their former glory. There was seriously no better choice for this.

Real talk. Mission Impossible 3 was fucking awesome and by far the best one for me. Star Trek finally made me give a fuck about Star Trek, or I guess at least this one.
 
Real talk. Mission Impossible 3 was fucking awesome and by far the best one for me. Star Trek finally made me give a fuck about Star Trek, or I guess at least this one.

Either way man, I'm just looking forward to watching this movie, since it's been a long time since I had my Star Wars movie fix. I hope Disney realizes that they can do alot with the Star Wars license and make movies in different timelines, and also with different characters.
 
Either way man, I'm just looking forward to watching this movie, since it's been a long time since I had my Star Wars movie fix. I hope Disney realizes that they can do alot with the Star Wars license and make movies in different timelines, and also with different characters.

Oh I'm sure they realize... I mean the $$$ will make them realize. There's a reason why they've floated ideas about Yoda and Boba Fett spinoffs before the first numbered sequel has even released.
 
Oh I'm sure they realize... I mean the $$$ will make them realize. There's a reason why they've floated ideas about Yoda and Boba Fett spinoffs before the first numbered sequel has even released.

What I really really want is a Obi Wan Kenobi Movie set during The Clone Wars, and with Ewan Mcgregor playing him on a mission. Since Obi Wan is my favorite Star Wars character.
 
What I really really want is a Obi Wan Kenobi Movie set during The Clone Wars, and with Ewan Mcgregor playing him on a mission. Since Obi Wan is my favorite Star Wars character.

I hope for your sake you get your wish.. but for me personally, the Clone Wars are literally the only place I do not want to see again for a good long while. Between the latter two prequels and 2 different cartoon series, that's where we've spent the last 12 years of Star Wars... it's such an incredibly small part of the universe too.
 
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