Tradethenews.com but its a subscription service. Mainly if I'm looking for something to trade I have my own filters to find these things and alert me (ie something trades at a huge volume, my software will tell me). Outside of that, if you look to day trade just look at cnbc.com and marketwatch and find their active stock articles. This is basically how I find my first trades of the day.
I'm going to take $1,405.35 and turn it into $100,000 using stock options.
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It's not that hard guys.
You pay more for more certain outcomes, you pay less for less certain outcomes.
As the deadline approaches - and the stock isn't going in the right direction, the options become devalued.
If the stock fails to exceed the strike price ($770) + cost of options ($.90), you lose - there's no point in paying a guaranteed $770 a share when the stocks are only worth $769 or less.
With a few hours left, and the outcome increasingly unlikely, you sell them to whatever gambler that wants to take the risk to reduce your burden.
Of course the initial bet in this case was kinda fool hardy. An intuition bet that didn't pay out. But at least MVP knows when to call intuition into question and reassess.
You pay more for more certain outcomes, you pay less for less certain outcomes.
As the deadline approaches - and the stock isn't going in the right direction, the options become devalued.
If the stock fails to exceed the strike price ($770) + cost of options ($.90), you lose - there's no point in paying a guaranteed $770 a share when the stocks are only worth $769 or less.
With a few hours left, and the outcome increasingly unlikely, you sell them to whatever gambler that wants to take the risk to reduce your burden.
Of course the initial bet in this case was kinda fool hardy. An intuition bet that didn't pay out. But at least MVP knows when to call intuition into question and reassess.
AppleSmack
Banned
Good luck. You will definitely need it.
Castor Krieg
Banned
No, it is not random. It all comes down to your knowledge about the industry and some accounting benchmarks e.g. P/E ratio. As mentioned, Forbes gives a really good reasoning for their stock pics.
Although I have no doubt most market players have no idea what they are doing.
How does that make sense for a put?
He buys the put option at 100. Market price goes to 95, and then he has to buy the exercise price, losing 5 dollars compared to market price? How would a put option make money this way?
The Elite
BOSS
I'm no expert, but if the stock had never been that high before and the fact that it jumped up seemed strange, I would have sold at that amount since I would assume it couldn't last. Then you have a lot more money to work with.
Put option means he can buy it at market price (i.e. 95) and then sell it for 100
If the market prices got to 105, he'll make money.
Indeed, if the market price goes to 101, he'll still want to exercise it - he'll recoup some of his losses, but not all of it.
Dreamgazer
Member
In a put option, the buyer of the put has the right to SELL the stock.
So when the market price goes to 95, the put buyer gets to sell it at 100.
Castor Krieg
Banned
What rjc571 said, a Put option gives you a right to sell at a strike price. He will buy on the market for 95, exercise his option and sell for 100, getting $5 in profit.
You mistook it for a call option.
Dreamgazer
Member
Of course, all this discussion is not accounting for the breakeven price (market price + premium) and also whether it's better to hold or exercise the option.
That's what I was saying/asking. I was also wondering who he would sell it to, and whether or not shares actually had to be bought in the case of a put. I don't think people that responded followed the full quoted conversation though, or maybe I phrased something weird.
Also, where do these options originate from? Fatcats that have a fuckload of shares? The companies themselves who issue the stock?
Option writers and market makers
FlashFlooder
Member
But then , as you previously pointed out, you hate yourself when it runs another, say, 400% in the days following your selling. When you're sitting on a stock like this, you're sitting there trying to figure out why it popped and what's to stop it from continuing it's run. It's almost harder (for me) than deciding when to dump a stinker and take my losses.
greed can be a real bitch, and often causes people to never realize profits as in the case provided. There's a saying for this: "pigs get slaughtered"
I have a question: Do you ever feel like what you're doing is ultimately a waste?
What I mean is...
Well, I'm a software engineer. The systems I work on will be operational 24/7 for decades to come . Code gets rewritten, written over, taken out, but ultimately, I am contributing something towards society, however small it may be. And yes, eventually, the system will probably be decomissioned, with some of the code recycled or used as a reference for building the successor. I'm making a difference, though, and that gives my life and my work meaning above just a paycheck.
A theater performer provides entertainment to people.
College professors and teachers train future professionals and stimulate individuals' interests and career paths.
If you're just buying stocks and selling them seconds later, you're not really investing or providing resources to companies you want or expect to see grow (or that should grow), you're just, well, playing with money. Have you ever wanted to do something more?
I'm just curious. Because I delve into investing on my own time. And I contribute 18% of my salary to my 401k (the more you get in earlier, the better). I understand the value of long term equity. But I have always felt that day trading is ultimately gaming the system without contributing to it in any meaningful way. It feels dirty to me. Though I've done quite well in stock market games, I just don't feel like i t's something worth pursuing in real life.
That's basically what everyone told them just about every day.
Most of all because they had bought it much earlier (sometime during that "stagnant" part) and really could have used the money to invest in something else.
But I just remembered that at the time one of the two sold it he still made a small plus (of about 500$).
IF I were smart enough to get into something like this, I think I'd take a safety model. Pick a minimum investment amount, say $2000 for sake of argument. Then I'd pick a goal, say $50,000. Once (and if) that $50,000 goal was reached, I'd cash out, set that money aside and start with a new $2000. How viable is a conservative plan like that if you can get lucky and manage your options well enough?
And of course, I know nothing is a guarantee and you're betting against unknowns, but it would seem the risk mitigation would be lower if you didn't keep all your eggs in one basket. I know that the potential for turnaround is greater when you have more money to play with, but there might also be something to be said about the tortoise vs the hare approach.
And of course, I know nothing is a guarantee and you're betting against unknowns, but it would seem the risk mitigation would be lower if you didn't keep all your eggs in one basket. I know that the potential for turnaround is greater when you have more money to play with, but there might also be something to be said about the tortoise vs the hare approach.
LOL
so you basically going to play opex day hero trade?
I guess it's a good way to make money with the volatility now (not as good as it was a year ago though)
I used to do some thing like this. However you can easily have awesome weeks, and just as easily, shit weeks. There's no fundamental behind this. It's a feeling game, and you know how feeling goes.
At one point my monthly commission was about 3000$. I stopped doing this now though, maybe when I settle down (getting married soon) and have some extra money left over, I'll start again.
so you basically going to play opex day hero trade?
I guess it's a good way to make money with the volatility now (not as good as it was a year ago though)
I used to do some thing like this. However you can easily have awesome weeks, and just as easily, shit weeks. There's no fundamental behind this. It's a feeling game, and you know how feeling goes.
At one point my monthly commission was about 3000$. I stopped doing this now though, maybe when I settle down (getting married soon) and have some extra money left over, I'll start again.
When you're bathing yourself in a $50,000 claw foot tub, it doesn't feel as dirty. Obviously it's just as easy to lose your tub and the house it sits in though.
I don't have the balls for day trading/forex trading/options trading.
Dreamgazer
Member
Let's not get into Options Margin at this point.
However, please feel free to look it up on your own -_-
By any chance was it LEXG? Most incredible run I've seen...40 cents to $10 in a couple months or so, then dumped HARD.
About put options, if you hold onto a successful put option until the exercise date do you have to have enough money to buy all of the shares in order to exercise it, even though you'd be immediately selling them for profit? Or would you have to sell it before the exercise date if you can't afford the shares, like with a call option? Sorry if this is a dumb question.
Yeah that's why I told people in PM to NOT follow my trades...they would be mostly gambles in the beginning because $1,400 is not a comfortable amount to play with, so I would try to create some breathing room quickly. Maybe I'll make another thread in the future starting with $10k and that might be more of an educational one, only put 5% in each trade, blah blah...
The Elite
BOSS
That's the basic model I'd consider. Takes greed out of the equation. Making that first $50,000 is the real trick though. How many times will you have to risk a $2000 investment to reach your goal. You gotta have the cash to jump in.
Heh. True.
For some people, I guess the pursuit of material wealth is all they need, or the thrill of the risk is appealing. Me, I've always felt like I need more than that, but I've always been an intellectual of sorts (in before custom title quote)
FlashFlooder
Member
It doesn't take greed out of the equation. Greed comes into play every single time you go to sell a winning commodity. Which you will be doing a LOT of on your way up to that $50k.
What if you never reach $50,000? What if you only get to $32,759 before losing a ton and now you have $6,000 left thinking about how you once had $32,759, and now you're emotionally broken and taking bigger gambles to get back to $32k, and you end up losing it all, to then hear the people who have never traded in their life tell you "Dude, I would've cashed out at $30,000"
Yep. Quite literally the first thing I was ever told of day trading is that if you're looking to feel great about yourself, its the wrong profession to do so and that you need to find other activities while trading to provide a service(ie volunteer at a charity, etc). I'm in it to make money. I don't lie about that.
Granted, I do provide the market with liquidity along with other day traders. This is indeed important, something that you can actually get paid extra for just by doing so.
The Elite
BOSS
That's true.
I've always been the type that when I can sit comfortably in my big house and drive my nice car, I'll make time for my intellectual thoughts. Until then, I'm looking to make my family a lot more comfortable.
Truth be told, this shit scares me and I wouldn't try this.
GoldenEye 007
Member
I bought like $80 in AMD shares a few days ago. Just wanted to play around since I've never really messed with the market.
I figured that with the WiiU getting close to launching and the fact AMD is dirt cheap, they'd have a chance of going up a bit over the next few months.
I am waaaay far from getting involved with option trading, though. Godspeed for the people with the balls (and money) to do that.
I figured that with the WiiU getting close to launching and the fact AMD is dirt cheap, they'd have a chance of going up a bit over the next few months.
I am waaaay far from getting involved with option trading, though. Godspeed for the people with the balls (and money) to do that.
FlashFlooder
Member
I prefer biotechs over options whenever I'm in a gambling mood.
Zaraki_Kenpachi
Member
Usually comes from big brokerage firms in the marketplace, has nothing to do with who issued the stock originally.
Edit: And you usually don't own anything. You're trading on the margins not the actual stock. You can buy put options without ever owning the stock.
Unfortunately I can't remember anymore, but as you mentioned with LEXG the climb was steady over a longer period.
That was one point I discussed with them too - me and some other guy suggested this but both of them had similar reasons against it - at the time I didn't understand, but it makes sense - it's also why they rarely talk about their profits or the lack of it...it's not something that can easily be discussed with people who never traded and who think about money in a different way I guess. One of their explanations was that for them it's not about the day-to-day basis of reaching a wanted amount, selling, starting out new with little and saving the rest for living.
I just transferred $1,400 into a dormant Fidelity account and I will run an experiment I've run before, which had mixed results, and try to turn a little into a lot. I will be gamb...ahem, I will be investing in mostly weekly and front month options. If you don't know what this is, Google it. If you do, you can follow my progress. Whenever I make a trade, I will update with the profit/loss amount, what symbol and option I bought, and why I did it.
I may have future withdrawals or deposits to manage risk, and I'll update the balance accordingly, along with screenshots to keep track of the progress. I will be trading just naked calls and puts, nothing fancy. This thread may also be short-lived because I'm starting with such a low amount I kind of have to take higher risks in the beginning to get some breathing room.
If you have any questions about options, I'd be happy to answer them, but just keep in mind I am not a financial advisor, and you will lose all of your money following my advice. My posts are for entertainment purposes ONLY.
I ran this experiment before with a partner keeping track, but I started with much higher, about $7k, in a couple of months I had $59.5k, before losing $30k in a single day on a stupid NFLX option that expired that same day, because I didn't think that POS could sink any lower. Oh, it could and it did and I got my face ripped off for being a stupid aggressive over-confident jackass.
After that, I sulked and withdrew my $22k-ish profits and bought the Lexus I have now. Here I will try it again and let you guys follow along.
Balance:
9/27/2012: $1,405.35 > $667.61
Trades:
9/27/12:
Bought 15 GOOG calls, expire tomorrow, $775 strike....bought them at .90, sold @ .40 for $700 loss
Bought 7 TPX puts, Oct 20 expiration, $29 strike...bought for .85
OP, I hope you paid your estimated taxes to the IRS when you booked your $22k profits earlier this year. Otherwise, you will be hit with a penalty next April.
Speaking of which, sorry to go a tiny bit OT, but can I ask you guys a question in here?
What is the thought of buying stock in Nintendo right now before the wii U? I have a feeling that even if it doesn't perform like the wii 1, it should do decent enough to keep Nintendo afloat.
(Sorry for the dumb question, I have absolutely no knowledge of stocks and such)
I have no clue what is going on in this thread other than stock trading/investing?
My high-school Economics class did a stock-simulator/game thing for a week or a month and all I know is that I lost money going into stock on tech and science more than anything.
Only if lightning strikes twice and the hardware gets a BIG (and I mean BIG) boom like the original Wii. You might want to sell after that initial wave if the typical Nintendo apathy/no third-parties on board starts to settle in.
My high-school Economics class did a stock-simulator/game thing for a week or a month and all I know is that I lost money going into stock on tech and science more than anything.
GoldenEye 007 said:
Only if lightning strikes twice and the hardware gets a BIG (and I mean BIG) boom like the original Wii. You might want to sell after that initial wave if the typical Nintendo apathy/no third-parties on board starts to settle in.
Zaraki_Kenpachi
Member
It's a gamble like anything else and depending on when you feel like selling it, no matter how the stock performs you could gain/lose money.
Can I get into your game? What's the link?
Warrior_Keoni
Member
Most interesting off-topic thread for today.
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Mysterious Stranger
Member
I want a lexus!!
Zaraki_Kenpachi
Member
Haha, to the point where you could lose every penny you invested and it not impact you. Anyone who says otherwise is wrong. It's the same thing with any other betting.
Eh, not exactly like people always hit it big at casinos and it's not comparable. This is higher risk with higher rewards than a casino, there at different spots along the continuum.
DietRob
i've been begging for over 5 years.
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