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[Garani]

He also showed a game he worked on doing the exact same thing in the video, in fact better as both instances of the world/locations were running in real-time.

So, he is pissed because people are not givng him attention. Right.

Has he worked on a game on the PS5? Has he done better then R&C on the PS5? The answer, at the moment, is no. So he is just sore at this point, and going for the clickbating.

I'm listening to the guy who made the video, he seemed highly knowledgeable and intelligent. 30 years experience, I say his history speaks for itself.

Who? The guy with 30 years experience who is sore because he did it like 25 years ago and now others are doing it again on a faster storage with high quality asset? Be serious.

I agree on the asset quality.

Ratchet isn't Pixar quality though. It's closer than anything has come though. It takes hours to render a single frame of a Pixar movie.

Technology moves forward. Pixar will always be further ahead than any console. On the other hand a pixar movie, once rendered, will remain static.

 

[assurdum]

I'm listening to the guy who made the video, he seemed highly knowledgeable and intelligent. 30 years experience, I say his history speaks for itself.

It's not the years of experience of him which convinced you and "casually" the other Xbox fanboy in this thread though.

 

[Werewolfgrandma]

You literally have 8 seconds to load 6 seconds of on rails gameplay. How does anyone think this isn't possible on other things? Just don't get the blind following here.

 

[winjer]

Yeah since why would Insomniac even talk about Xbox in their marketing? Would Xbox talk about their competitor if they market something or what?

Insomniac has always said it wasn't possible on previous hardware. Did they said it was not possible on PC or Xbox? Why bring the Xbox into it in the first place with a game developed exclusively for the PS5?

Why does this all sounds like the xbox fans are desperately trying to shit on this lol. Also Insomniac has never claimed Rift Apart would use all the SSD I/O power and that there was no room, since they said there was still enough of room left. So we already knew that and no other game atm is using the full potential, but that doesn't mean you just need to put in a lower spec SSD, because that makes no sense.

I only see this as a new "sEe, tHe xSx sSd iS oN pAr" kinda nonsense...

It's on that trailer, published by Insomniac, saying clearly, that it's only possible on the PS5's SSD.
Thus, not possible on any other platform. It couldn't be any clearer.

 

[cireza]

Unless his "lego ps3" game was loading the second gameplay from the HDD (was probably already in ram/vram wasting space that could have been used by the active gameplay view) when pressing change viewport he did not disprove much.

You can stream content from discs or cartridges. We did not have to wait for SSDs to do this.

 

[Negotiator101]

It's not the years of experience which convinced you and the other Xbox fanboy though.

Pal you're the biggest fanboy who has ever been or ever will be. Once again we have narrow minded individuals on this site who even faced with an industry veteran telling them an SSD is not needed, they still bury their heads in the sand I can't quite believe the ignorance on display.

 

[Snake29]

It's on that trailer, published by Insomniac, saying clearly, that it's only possible on the PS5's SSD.
Thus, not possible on any other platform. It couldn't be any clearer.

Are you fucking dumb or what? Why would they talk about other platforms? Does MS talk about Horizon 5 open world bla bla "only possible on XSX, XSS, PC and PS5"...

No they don't, it doesn't matter.

 

[nush]

Has he done better then R&C on the PS5?

On a console that "Can't do 3D or transparencies"

 

[assurdum]

Pal you're the biggest fanboy who has ever been or ever will be. Once again we have narrow minded individuals on this site who even faced with an industry veteran telling them an SSD is not needed, they still bury their heads in the sand I can't quite believe the ignorance on display.

Pal I could be the biggest fanboy of whatever but differently to you I'm not passing as the other of your comrades, most of my time in every thread relative to the hardware counterparts to downplay his hardware capability. Don't try to pass your attitude as a genuine criticism, because it's pathetic. It doesn't exist an unique and indisputable opinion about this matter, every time some people try to sell their opinion as an universal truth because they are expert, show just arrogance.

 

[Garani]

On a console that "Can't do 3D or transparencies"

Which is not on a PS5, so the point is mutt. He did what he did with the tecnology available to him.

But has he done something better that R&C on the PS5? Once he does we can discuss about it. Until then, he is just sore.

 

[Chukhopops]

Just want to point out that coding secrets (the channel) is really good and super interesting to watch generally speaking. I don't have an opinion on the Ratchet thing but the guy is legit talented.

 

[winjer]

Are you fucking dumb or what? Why would they talk about other platforms? Does MS talk about Horizon 5 open world bla bla "only possible on XSX, XSS, PC and PS5"...

No they don't, it doesn't matter.

All you have to do is watch that trailer and see that Insomniac did just exactly that.
Not directly, but by stating it's not possible any where else.
And refrain from insulting people, just because you disagree with them.

 

[Mithos]

You can stream content from discs or cartridges. We did not have to wait for SSDs to do this.

I doubt he did though, both viewports was more then likely already loaded in ram, which is breaking the "rules" laid down by how R&C is supposed to work.
Load stuff in just as it's needed not 30 seconds or minutes in advanced (unless there is proof that Insomniac indeed load stuff in 30second or a minute in advance?).

When people say this is not possible on previous hardware they mean the hole package, graphical quality, load-times, and when, where and how they are allowed to load things into ram.

OR
tldr; "not possible as is."


Every time you have 2 different gameplay views loaded into ram/vram you compromise the one that you are actively playing, because you need to store the second in ram/vram, memory that you could use for your currently active gameview.

 

[Darius87]

how is possible to load in ~14GB into ram while assets from previous level still have to be in RAM? that would exceed 16 GB what PS5 have.
i bet he can't explain that.

 

[Snake29]

All you have to do is watch that trailer and see that Insomniac did just exactly that.
Not directly, but by stating it's not possible any where else.
And refrain from insulting people, just because you disagree with them.

I don't give a flying fuck. It's a game build for the PS5 so they don't even have to talk about other platforms. So are you going to post videos from MS telling us it's only possible on XSX?

 

[Negotiator101]

Are you fucking dumb or what? Why would they talk about other platforms? Does MS talk about Horizon 5 open world bla bla "only possible on XSX, XSS, PC and PS5"...

No they don't, it doesn't matter.

Calm down dear.

 

[nush]

Which is not on a PS5, so the point is mutt.

MOOT you ignoramus.

 

[Guilty_AI]

so much denial, i like it

 

[Werewolfgrandma]

Pal I could be the biggest fanboy of whatever but differently to you I'm not passing as the other of your comrades, most of my time in every thread relative to the hardware counterparts to downplay his hardware capability. Don't try to pass your attitude as a genuine criticism, because it's pathetic. It doesn't exist an unique and indisputable opinion about this matter, every time some people try to sell their opinion as an universal truth because they are expert, show just arrogance.

You are not close to the biggest fanboy here. Not top 10 either.

 

[waquzy]

 

[Thirty7ven]

It's funny how some people cling to the words of people if it confirms their bias. Let's start off with the fact that John Burton has spent more time writing and directing kids shit than actually programming, and really wanted to be Hollywood except he picked a trash project for that. Point being his fame doesn't come from his programming accomplishments, far from it.

But let's talk about it.

From the get go, we know portals are possible on older gen because we are not dumb idiots, Valve has even released a game called Portal. It got a sequel. We also know streaming is a thing because we have been playing open world games without loadings.

So now that we know we aren't idiots, and we know John spent most of his career not actually programming but writing and directing for kids and trying to become an Hollywood producer/writer/director, it begs the question. Why so bitter? Did Sony lie about the SSD?

The whole point is high quality asset streaming. Fidelity. Not just end result but ease of development. If you make a video talking shit only to show that if a game looked like trash, you could do anything, then you're an idiot for making the video.

 

[Garani]

MUTE you ignoramus.

Oh, loosing the argument and going for the spelling mistake. Great strategy!

I wanted to write moot, happy now?

 

[assurdum]

how is possible to load in ~14GB into ram while assets from previous level still have to be in RAM? that would exceed 16 GB what PS5 have.
i bet he can't explain that.

Jesus how much hate when such expert point the finger. How the hell he know how insomniac coding the game and what works his behind it? So basically they are a bunch of liars.

 

[Werewolfgrandma]

I doubt he did though, both viewports was more then likely already loaded in ram, which is breaking the "rules" laid down by how R&C is supposed to work.
Load stuff in just as it's needed not 30 seconds or minutes in advanced (unless there is proof that Insomniac indeed load stuff in 30second or a minute in advance?).

When people say this is not possible on previous hardware they mean the hole package, graphical quality, load-times, and when, where and how they are allowed to load things into ram.

OR
tldr; "not possible as is."


Every time you have 2 different gameplay views loaded into ram/vram you compromise the one that you are actively playing, because you need to store the second in ram/vram, memory that you could use for your currently active gameview.

They said they load the map in sections.

how is possible to load in ~14GB into ram while assets from previous level still have to be in RAM? that would exceed 16 GB what PS5 have.
i bet he can't explain that.

If that 6 seconds needs 14gb then the game install size is 5000gb

 

[Negotiator101]

Pal I could be the biggest fanboy of whatever but differently to you I'm not passing as the other of your comrades, most of my time in every thread relative to the hardware counterparts to downplay his hardware capability. Don't try to pass your attitude as a genuine criticism, because it's pathetic. It doesn't exist an unique and indisputable opinion about this matter, every time some people try to sell their opinion as an universal truth because they are expert, show just arrogance.

It's not my opinion though is it? The industry veteran made the video, he has no reason to make stuff up. You've been banned previously for being unreasonable and arrogant, ignorant to the facts, as you are being right now. This guy knows more than you or I on this matter, please take the time to listen to the video and look at this person's credentials.

 

[nush]

I wanted to write moot, happy now?

No you didn't. Also I answered your question and you...

 

[assurdum]

It's not my opinion though is it? The industry veteran made the video, he has no reason to make stuff up. You've been banned previously for being unreasonable and arrogant, ignorant to the facts, as you are being right now. This guy knows more than you or I on this matter, please take the time to listen to the video and look at this person's credentials.

I'm not banned for that reason but nice try. And I'm not blame him but your hypocrisy. The fact he is an expert doesn't means nsomniac has lied, it's just his opinable opinion, he isn't the voice of the universal truth. Though casually most of the Xbox fanboy believe more to him than anything said in favour the SSD by other developers until now.. coincidence?

 

[Guilty_AI]

Its ok guys, i heard its possible to breath without a ps5's ssd. A tech specialist said it so it must be true.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Shots fired. I wonder if anyone can debunk this.

 

[Low Moral Fibre]

This comment is what I agree with most. Why have all that tech to instantly load worlds from scratch only to essentially limit it to on-rails sections or cutscenes (I guess the mine level is not on-rails entirely but it is super linear so again would work on an older machine) - so much potential and basically you end up with a nice looking PS3 game.

The rifts look impressive but impact on gameplay is basically zero. You could do the same game minus the rifts and the gameplay wouldn't be any different. Again I pictured being able to use the rifts dynamically in gameplay, like summoning rifts at any point in time to dynamically move between worlds, but nothing even remotely like that ever happens.

I know this is an early gen game but there was tons of chest beating from Sony and Insomniac and all I could think after completing the game was that the rifts were a total damp squib that added nothing to the game.

 

[assurdum]

Shots fired. I wonder if anyone can debunk this.

Ask to Nsomniac.

 

[Darius87]

They said they load the map in sections.

If that 6 seconds needs 14gb then the game install size is 5000gb

POV in rift apart takes all RAM that's what insomniac stated.

 

[Garani]

It's funny how some people cling to the words of people if it confirms their bias. Let's start off with the fact with the John Burton has spent more time writing and directing kids shit, and really wanted to be Hollywood except he picked a trash project for that.

But let's talk about it.

From the get go, we know portals are possible on older gen because we are not dumb idiots, Valve has even released a game called Portal. It got a sequel. We also know streaming is a thing because we have been playing open world games without loadings.

So now that we know we aren't idiots, and we know John spent most of his career not actually programming but writing and directing for kids and trying to become an Hollywood producer/writer/director, it begs the question. Why so bitter? Did Sony lie about the SSD?

The whole point is high quality asset streaming. Fidelity. Not just end result but ease of development. If you make a video talking shit only to show that if a game looked like trash, you could anything, then you're an idiot for making the video.

Right my point.

No you didn't. Also I answered your question and you...

He did not write any game for PS5, this is the reason why the point of comparing different systems is moot, and I stated this in my very first post.

He is acting like a sore looser for no apparent reason. Instead he could decide to write a wonderful game for the PS5 and out do R&C.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

This comment is what I agree with most. Why have all that tech to instantly load worlds from scratch only to essentially limit it to on-rails sections or cutscenes (I guess the mine level is not on-rails entirely but it is super linear so again would work on an older machine) - so much potential and basically you end up with a nice looking PS3 game.

The rifts look impressive but impact on gameplay is basically zero. You could do the same game minus the rifts and the gameplay wouldn't be any different. Again I pictured being able to use the rifts dynamically in gameplay, like summoning rifts at any point in time to dynamically move between worlds, but nothing even remotely like that ever happens.

I know this is an early gen game but there was tons of chest beating from Sony and Insomniac and all I could think after completing the game was that the rifts were a total damp squib that added nothing to the game.

Yeah, it's basically a gimmick to show off the SSD. Nothing wrong with that tho.

 

[assurdum]

You are not close to the biggest fanboy here. Not top 10 either.

.. thanks. I guess.

 

[Md Ray]

The more you post the more I think you just get your rocks off from trolling.

Jokes aside. Someone needs to bring this vid to Insomniac's attention and let them debunk the uploader's theory themselves, they probably won't go deeper than what they've already said in the interviews w/ DF and other outlets due to NDA stuff. So I'll take IG's word for it, I don't think Rift Apart's instant level switching would be possible with HDD on something like PS4.

 

[assurdum]

Jokes aside. Someone needs to bring this vid to Insomniac's attention and let them debunk the uploader's theory themselves, they probably won't go deeper than what they've already said in the interviews w/ DF and other outlets due to NDA stuff. So I'll take IG's word for it, I don't think Rift Apart's instant level switching would be possible with HDD on something like PS4.

The industry veteran has talked. No way Nsomniac can counterpoint him. Joke aside I really don't understand what exactly he tried to demonstrate. A stupid example: bump and normal mapping were possible on PS2 too via software. It means Xbox hardware support about it was pointless?

 

[Schmick]

Disclaimer.... i havent played this game and really want to but if i have this right.... the portal bits is basically a level on rails? No freedom for the player to create portals and jump between levels?

 

[assurdum]

Disclaimer.... i havent played this game and really want to but if i have this right.... the portal bits is basically a level on rails? No freedom for the player to create portals and jump between levels?

I haven't the game but there aren't different portals in some levels where you can shift Ratchet in different spots of the area during the combat to avoid the enemies fires? I remember to have seen something like this in some videos

 

[Whitecrow]

That guy is as smart as one that believes that 'son of a bitch' is an insult to the mother.

I'm honestly embarrased of how many of you are totally missing the point just as he did to make the video.

Good luck in your life, you will need it.

 

[assurdum]

That guy is as smart as one that believes that 'son of a bitch' is an insult to the mother.

I'm honestly embarrased of how many of you are totally missing the point just as he did to make the video.

Good luck in your life, you will need it.

Which was such point? Because personally seems pointless to me.

 

[Certinty]

Disclaimer.... i havent played this game and really want to but if i have this right.... the portal bits is basically a level on rails? No freedom for the player to create portals and jump between levels?

Pretty much. It's predetermined destinations where you can't really do much besides move a little up, down, left and right and they barely last more than ten seconds each.

 

[Esppiral]

how is possible to load in ~14GB into ram while assets from previous level still have to be in RAM? that would exceed 16 GB what PS5 have.
i bet he can't explain that.

The moment I saw this thread emerge from oblivion I knew someone was posting this video.

People should what it entirely, he is a genius coder he just explains how it could be done without SSD on previous gen consoles.

 

[Garani]

Disclaimer.... i havent played this game and really want to but if i have this right.... the portal bits is basically a level on rails? No freedom for the player to create portals and jump between levels?

There are 2 portals: local and global.

Local portals are yellow in color and you use them as you see fit by moving in other sections of the same area/level.

Global portals are purple and you don't "interact" with them: you are a passive passenger and they have whole level loading behind.

The magic is not in the portals, but in the fact that since you can stream high quality assets in real time, you can keep the geometry and graphic quality very high all the time.

 

[Whitecrow]

There are 2 portals: local and global.

Local portals are yellow in color and you use them as you see fit by moving in other sections of the same area/level.

Global portals are purple and you don't "interact" with them: you are a passive passenger and they have whole level loading behind.

The magic is not in the portals, but in the fact that since you can stream high quality assets in real time, you can keep the geometry and graphic quality very high all the time.

But the guy with 30 years of experience didnt say anything about asset and graphic quality, so it doesnt matter.
Loading a 5 GB level sure it's the same as loading 10MB, so a PS2 can do the same as the PS5 obviously.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

But the guy with 30 years of experience didnt say anything about asset and graphic quality, so it doesnt matter.
Loading a 5 GB level sure it's the same as loading 10MB, so a PS2 can do the same as the PS5 obviously.

He indirectly mentioned it by saying that the dimension rift experience is on rails so you can save a ton of ressources by knowing exactly what to load.

 

[Whitecrow]

He indirectly mentioned it by saying that the dimension rift experience is on rails so you can save a ton of ressources by knowing exactly what to load.

Look for the Digital Foundry video instead of this cherry pick.

When not on rails, two dimensions can be loaded at the same time and the transition between them is as smooth as nothing seen before.

 

[cireza]

unless there is proof that Insomniac indeed load stuff in 30second or a minute in advance

He explains how things are loaded in the video.

 

[GuinGuin]

The same people arguing that new technology doesn't enable new gameplay are the same people saying cross gen games are being held back by old hardware. You can't have it both ways.

 

[Werewolfgrandma]

Jokes aside. Someone needs to bring this vid to Insomniac's attention and let them debunk the uploader's theory themselves, they probably won't go deeper than what they've already said in the interviews w/ DF and other outlets due to NDA stuff. So I'll take IG's word for it, I don't think Rift Apart's instant level switching would be possible with HDD on something like PS4.

You can't debunk what he said. I think you need to watch again and not with thinking there is some malicious intent.

But the guy with 30 years of experience didnt say anything about asset and graphic quality, so it doesnt matter.
Loading a 5 GB level sure it's the same as loading 10MB, so a PS2 can do the same as the PS5 obviously.

The main point in the video is the experience. Ratchet has been marketed as a ps5 only experience. It's not. It's been done and been possible for years. Let's say each Rift in those transitions is 5gb, that's believable. That gives you 8 seconds to load 5gb. That's very reasonable for most any SSD. With smart but time consuming optimization those 6 seconds scenes could have way less memory requirement because you don't need high res for things you actually can't in want way see the detail while playing even if you pause and look around.