SteveWinwood
Member
Was it just that they stopped supporting MNC and tried to shift them over to this new thing?
I only played like an hour of MNC and like 4 hours of Super.
I only played like an hour of MNC and like 4 hours of Super.
Introduction to MOBAs
- Thread starter SteveWinwood
- Start date
They said they wanted to grow MNC on 360 and even went through the trouble of becoming a Summer of XBLA featured dev. Then they ran headlong into the patching regulations Microsoft has for all of their Xbox 360 titles, so they expedited a PC port which got a lot faster balance and content patches. But after the second content patch (note, each content patch was pretty much just one new map in a game that started with four) finally hit 360 late they went dark and eventually put out a trailer for Super Monday Night Combat, and all MNC saw after that was maybe one more balance patch. They then went on to say that Super Monday Night Combat is really the game they wanted to make but needed to develop the original Monday Night Combat first in order to get enough money to live off of.
I could be horribly wrong, as some of it is second hand information and all of it is from memory.
What's been going on with Orcs Must Die? Did they announce another new game (or sequel) recently?
You know what I suddenly just remembered? Dungeon Defenders.
I could be horribly wrong, as some of it is second hand information and all of it is from memory.
What's been going on with Orcs Must Die? Did they announce another new game (or sequel) recently?
You know what I suddenly just remembered? Dungeon Defenders.
SteveWinwood
Member
Orcs Must Die Unleashed.
5V5, large cast of hero characters, Free to play, pay 150 bucks for instant alpha access.
Can't say I expect much which is awful considering I have well over 200+ hours in those games.
yiss
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
<----- Best Waifu. Won't nag you with all her shit.
SteveWinwood
Member
dota had one forever ago i read once on the deep recesses of the internet
gambler? i wanna say
Dawngate has a skill tree like thing for what are essentially passive abilities.
U gotta go more HAM
SteveWinwood
Member
im sure he tried but the towers stopped him
SteveWinwood
Member
Is MOBA a Genre? The Design of Dawngate PAX East 2014
This is actually kind of interesting as they talk about all the maps they tried with 2 lanes and one lane and no lanes and zig zags and all sorts of stuff, and why lanes even exist. Oh and why your shapers actually need to look different because it didn't matter if they played completely differently people would still immediately think they were rip offs. So put effort into your animations and stuff companies!
PAX East 2014 - The Art of Relaunching Champions
I didn't watch it but someone out there might find this interesting.
Then there are these three panels that I can't even find
League of Legends YouTuber Panel: How League Becomes Your Entertainment
Heroes of the Storm - The Ultimate Blizzard Mashup
Live On Three: The Last 5 years in eSports and Competitive Gaming
I have no clue if they're informative or entertaining, but they exist! And they relate to MOBAs so here they are.
This is actually kind of interesting as they talk about all the maps they tried with 2 lanes and one lane and no lanes and zig zags and all sorts of stuff, and why lanes even exist. Oh and why your shapers actually need to look different because it didn't matter if they played completely differently people would still immediately think they were rip offs. So put effort into your animations and stuff companies!
PAX East 2014 - The Art of Relaunching Champions
I didn't watch it but someone out there might find this interesting.
Then there are these three panels that I can't even find
League of Legends YouTuber Panel: How League Becomes Your Entertainment
Heroes of the Storm - The Ultimate Blizzard Mashup
Live On Three: The Last 5 years in eSports and Competitive Gaming
I have no clue if they're informative or entertaining, but they exist! And they relate to MOBAs so here they are.
I've never played Dawngate, but this is super fascinating and makes me want to play the game. Someone should send this video to Dustin Browder.
What conclusions did they come to after testing out the different map layouts and what realizations did they make about the concept of "lanes"?
I swear, one of the most consistent complaints about MOBAs from non-MOBA people is: "why is there is only one map?"
I swear, one of the most consistent complaints about MOBAs from non-MOBA people is: "why is there is only one map?"
You need to see how the enemy is becoming more powerful. If resources aren't ordered properly you can just have like four people popping out of the jungle super-powered and it doesn't feel like you could stop it.
Laning is an elegant solution for players to have a back and forth. If there are no lanes both characters will very quickly just unload (welcome to every fight in Heroes of the Storm) and the fight is over after one exchange. In this enviornment there's no repercussion to using your abilities.
And towers turn out to be really important for the team that's behind as a place for players that are behind to accrue experience and gold.
SteveWinwood
Member
I'd definitely recommend watching the video starting at around 17 minutes.
Basically they were testing just about every variable they could and found that if you only had one or two lanes, but with large jungles, the players wouldn't be able to see the power accruement and it was frustrating for them to come out of nowhere and be much higher than you as you had no tabs on them.
Also if there were no creeps in lanes then it was just a shitty fighting game where you'd unload everything, run away, and then do it again with no point.
Thirdly, and this point didn't really make much sense to me in the way he presented it, but I'm pretty sure he was saying it was essentially a comeback mechanic where if they're super far ahead they can force you out of the jungle through map control, but to capture actual objectives they have to essentially force xp and gold (the creeps) into you with their push giving you a way to farm up again.
He talked about it in a different context, but I'll put it here as well where whenever you put a player in a pve it will always end up the same, so you can technically maximize your jungle or whatever because it's just dumb ai that can be manipulated, but pvp was always going to be different because it's a person, so with lanes you can essentially force players into a pvp environment making it more fun for them.
He also talked about how they tried 10 v 10, 6 v 6 and 4 v 4 but 5 v 5 was the best balance where you could feel you could still carry your team if needed.
Then he talks about the rigid meta in LoL because of maximizing gold efficiency on the map because of the way the different roles scale and how in dota it wasn't that way because not all heroes need gold to scale, and how they're trying to fix that with some role system thing.
Yeah I feel bad for making fun of it, because they're clearly intelligent articulate people who really care and are trying different things, but then I play it... and it's not very fun to me...
I find myself hopelessly addicted to League. I started playing this past summer, played all summer, then dropped it once the fall semester started only to pick it up again during my spring semester. My weekends have become consumed with LoL. Any time that i'm not playing the game i'm watching streams of it (trick2g mostly). Its a minor miracle that i'm going to have passing grades this semester. To anyone on the fence about jumping in, I highly recommend it. Most rewarding experience in gaming i've ever had, it's a genre that just keeps on giving. Also I haven't really had many friends play with me and I've still been able to get a lot out of the game.
Yeah, just looking at the character kits made me lose all interest. At least some of the abilities have synergy with one another, so they're one step ahead of Blizzard.
AzureSkies
Member
That one dude from HotS you posted about in the League thread looked awesome. There's 70 more heroes like that right?
SteveWinwood
Member
Abathur is honestly the only good thing I've seen out of HotS. Something that you can only do when your team as a whole shares xp and gold so he can sit at base and do stupid global stuff.
I think he sounds pretty unique and could be fun.
All the other heroes tho...
The role system is interesting but it's either pointless, or impactful enough that it lends to incredible snowball because they're all multiplier effects - if you're ahead, you'll generate more gold and experience than normal.
One of the roles idr what it's called but it essentially it gives you bonus gold and experience when you kill somebody.
Think about that.
Another one gives you stacking gold if you have the opportunity to farm (alchemist passive)
Zoned out of lane? Well too bad, your opponent is farming up increasing gold.
Waiting for HoN 3.0
Dota players clearly feed too much
SteveWinwood
Member
boken hon 3.0 came out over a year ago
all they did was make it uglier
Tyran_lord
Member
Yeah i have to agree that the role system is sometimes really pointless. Most of the time there will be a gladiator and tactician in lane. Gladiator gets double the vim for a last hit and tactician gets extra vim for nearby dieing lane minions and harassing enemy shapers.
The role you are talking about is Predator and is one of the weaker ones atm actually, because you will get either really behind or you snowball really hard if you get a lead. The devs added another part to the predator role so if you kill spirit well workers you get double the vim and exp than other roles.
If you are jungling you definitely want the hunter role, because that is extra vim for jungle creeps.
Abathur looks awesome and he's kind of fun, but for all the assistance offered he really hamstrings his own team in certain ways. Without being a physical presence on the map in a game about taking objectives it's kind of easy for teams to blame their Abathur when they lose. He's frustrating for the team he's with and the team he's against, and the novelty wears off kind of fast when what the moment to moment is just button spam. His presence is almost imperceptible to allies and enemies. And again, Abathur is the kind of guy who has a mish-mashy sort of kit that doesn't really blend together outside of offering global pressure.
They keep announcing really weird heroes. Like one that is just going to suicide over and over. On one hand HotS has the most basic MOBA characters to ever exist and on the other they have these super oddball ones that just seem like they'll be frustrating to play with or against.
"My life was nearly ruined by cocaine. Highly recommended."
Pureauthor
Member
I might try Dawngate when it comes out.
Can't decide how I feel about HotS. I don't think it'll be that good, but maybe Blizzard can surprise me.
Can't decide how I feel about HotS. I don't think it'll be that good, but maybe Blizzard can surprise me.
Hots version of lols junglers
Except even worse
Junglers who provide no objective control and have no presence or CC to gank.
Tyran_lord
Member
Dawngate opened up to community beta, which is just open beta lol, last tuesday.
I really need to play some dota2 soon. I played one game of it and it didn't really leave a good impression. Mostly because i still sucked really hard at League then.
Sounds like Legion Commander.