Support NeoGAF

[Buggy Loop]

So, you just confirmed everything that I said, including the fact that the devs have vastly altered the scope of the game instead of fulfilling the original promises made during the Kickstarter.

I was in dozens of kickstarters, the whole point is having new funding levels.

You don't go from a goal of what was it originally... 1M$ ? To the most successful funding campaign and have anywhere near the same game as the original pitch.

What CIG did was essentially a bait-and-switch con. They promised something, took money for it, and then delivered something else—although in this case, they haven't delivered at all.

The community endorsed those changes and features as they backed those funding goals.

What they did should be illegal and if any of us tried it with tangible, physical goods, it would be illegal, but because we're talking about non-tangible goods and a Kickstarter they are able to flaunt the law via loopholes.

Again, endorsed and funded by the community. There's a tangible game right now that anyone can go and download today and try for free.

Honestly, I'm surprised some motivated state attorney general or federal prosecutor hasn't tried to bring a case against them for fraud, because that's exactly what this is at this point. Hell, they should probably investigate Kickstarter too for helping to facilitate the fraud.

Oh don't worry, probably a lot of peoples have been trying to build a case against CIG since the decade including the claims of yachts and other nonsense things that were circulating around clickbait 2015 journalism era and any lawyers worth a damn found it was a no go.

I have a lot more complaints about kickstarters like a cRPG like Torment Tides of Numenera that while the game shipped, it had culled a shitload of the goals. But its "out".

In the end, the initial funding has been completely squished into nothingness compared to the funding since the MMO exists. Like 1 record year like last year is bigger than years of intial funding. If peoples were not happy with the scope change in 2014, they would have dropped a long time ago. If anything the change in scope has made it explode with support.

1 year of funding now is like 4.5 years of the intial campaign. Goes from year 2012 to 2016 ish.

 

[tr1p1ex]

I'm surprised a game that continually has needed to raise new funds over 11 years needs more money.

 

[Poppinfresh]

I was in dozens of kickstarters, the whole point is having new funding levels.

No, the point is to lay out a plan for a project, get funding for it, and then deliver the project and whatever other items were promised during the Kickstarter campaign.

That is what the majority of successful, non-scam kickstarters do.

You don't go from a goal of what was it originally... 1M$ ? To the most successful funding campaign and have anywhere near the same game as the original pitch.

No, you do that on the backs of whales by selling them ships that don't exist.

The community endorsed those changes and features as they backed those funding goals.

If by "community" you mean those whales I just referenced, you are probably right, but the average Kickstarter investor had no say in the direction of the project.

If CIG were trying to be an honest, above-board company, they would have delivered on their original Kickstarter promises using the original Kickstarter revenue and then (and ONLY then) started to add additional features.

There's a tangible game right now that anyone can go and download today and try for free.

It's an alpha-phase tech demo at best.

Those of us who invested our money for SQ42 have jack sh*t to show for it almost a decade later.

At the end day I'm out $60, which isn't that big of a deal, but there are people who have been scammed for tens of thousands, if not more by CIG. What they are doing is criminal, and you should be ashamed of yourself for continuing to make excuses for them.

 

[zeroluck]

It's smart to profit from the rich who'll gladly spend thousands on your games, rather than foolishly trying to squeeze pennies from the struggling masses.

 

[Hudo]

They should hire Jade Raymond.

 

[MiguelItUp]

It's just a money hole and it has been. I just don't understand the amount of money being put into this. Every time I see it in action, even after "updates", I just don't see the amount of work actually pulls its weight, lol. It always looks like its lacking and like it should look better than it does. I remember Lirik checking out some parts of it the past year or so after one of their "big updates", and it looked SO buggy and hardly playable at times.

 

[Mobilemofo]

I'm startled by the number 800 million. Jesus Christ. That's mentally large for a game.

 

[Redneckerz]

I just want Squadron 42 released next year. That's the only bit on CIG that actually looks shippable, has all the tech of Star Citizen but in a more condensed scale, and probably would be okay to run on current-gen consoles.

 

[rkofan87]

fans of star c are like vtuber fans deep pocket chads but unlike vtuber chads star c chads get nothing in return lol.

 

[iHaunter]

At what point is this game investigated for money laundering?

All of their records are public because they are in the UK. It's not money laundering - misuse of money.

 

[Gen.Grievous]

Haven't followed it in a while but I'm pretty sure they rake in more cash every year.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Haven't followed it in a while but I'm pretty sure they rake in more cash every year.

They keep having >$100M in recent years and 2025 is looking to break the record

So the title is completely wrong

The whole backlash is that the fans were pissed that they had to wait until JUNE to buy the AI blades in-game. As if they couldn't contain themselves to wait, they felt pressure to go and buy it on a store.

I mean I guess if you spend >$10K on any game and you can't wait a couple of weeks you literally have compulsion issues and its a mental health problem, if it was not SC it would be something else. Most peoples would not even have heard of these blades AI if it had been released at the same time in the in-game store.

 

[Spyxos]

What about operating cost?

 

[Outlier]

Maybe they should just go ahead and actually release a game.

They have no legit reason to NOT have released small titles (over the years) that would ultimately lead to the great Star Citizen.

Perhaps Chris Roberts well documented character flaw that prevents him from fulfilling obligations needs to be definitively addressed.

 

[Hideous Snake]

Release the game then you fucking scammers. Instead of making releasing ships that costs a kidney

I don't feel sorry for anyone that backed or paid anything for this game. Same clowns that cries over early access games, are the ones paying mad money in this. Get fucked

 

[nemiroff]

They keep having >$100M in recent years and 2025 is looking to break the record

So the title is completely wrong

The whole backlash is that the fans were pissed that they had to wait until JUNE to buy the AI blades in-game. As if they couldn't contain themselves to wait, they felt pressure to go and buy it on a store.

I mean I guess if you spend >$10K on any game and you can't wait a couple of weeks you literally have compulsion issues and its a mental health problem, if it was not SC it would be something else. Most peoples would not even have heard of these blades AI if it had been released at the same time in the in-game store.

Yeah, the "running out of money" thing was just Luke's flawed hypothetical of a funding/development scenario which doesn't necessarily have anything to do with SC. I'm a subscriber, but he clearly pulled that one out of his ass. 2025 will as you mention beat yet another record for SC funding.

And also yes; The "blades" thing wasn't what it appeared. The community reaction was understandable at first, even tho it resolved into an overreaction. But of course, we always have conspiracy theories to fall back on if needed.

Maybe they should just go ahead and actually release a game.

If you had followed this game, you'd know that a lot of things have changed internally at CIG. The focus is now on releasing stable versions, instead of only implementing new features.

I played Star Citizen for about 20+ hours the last week since 4.1.1. It's so stable now that I didn't have a single crash, but one server crash which lasted between 60-90 seconds before another server resumed exactly from where the game left me.

I did 6-8 successive different full missions and trips during one session last night without a single hiccup. Dogfighting, traversing systems, visiting the convention, cargo missions, on-foot mercenary missions, and more.

Lots of things can of course be improved, and obviously will be. But it's not like the game doesn't exist

I don't feel sorry for anyone that backed or paid anything for this game.

Why would you feel sorry for us, we're just having fun

 

[Buggy Loop]

What about operating cost?

They spend iirc almost all of it for roughly the amount of the previous year. Costs a fortune to have ~1000 employees, not in cheap labour countries.

 

[Hideous Snake]

Why would you feel sorry for us, we're just having fun

Are you?

 

[nemiroff]

Are you?

I promise you I am. What you see from the vocal people isn't always representative of what's going on. There are so many lies and myths going on from this game, it's exhausting. I didn't have fun in SC until last year, so yes: SC has had a lot of problems, and spending an hour enganged in a mission for then to just explode and die from nothing is not fun. And to be honest the game is a fucking bitch to get into, it's overwhelming.

But the 4.1.1 version (it started to form around 3.23 for me), yes, it is true fun to me, it's a sandbox game with a lot of freedom and atmosphere. The technology in this is amazing (server meshing didn't fully make until this year....), and it makes for new types of gameplay you can't get in other games.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Are you?

You think tens of thousands of peoples log daily for no fun?

This is old by today's game build, but I see peoples having fun.

I had more fun in SC than my 2 years in Elite dangerous. Or my 6 attemps at having fun in No Man sky...



Stealing peoples' cargo by pirating


They have events. Jumptown, overdrive, xenothreats, etc etc.

 

[Danjin44]

Are you?

Like it or no it's their own money they can burn it that money however they want.

 

[Hideous Snake]

I promise you I am. What you see from the vocal people isn't always representative of what's going on. There are so many lies and myths going on from this game, it's exhausting. I didn't have fun in SC until last year, so yes: SC has had a lot of problems, and spending an hour enganged in a mission for then to just explode and die from nothing is not fun. And to be honest the game is a fucking bitch to get into, it's overwhelming.

But the 4.1.1 version, yes it is true fun to me, it's a sandbox game with a lot of freedom and atmosphere. The technology in this is amazing, and it makes for new types of gameplay you can't get in other games.

You think tens of thousands of peoples log daily for no fun?

This is old by today's game build, but I see peoples having fun.

I had more fun in SC than my 2 years in Elite dangerous. Or my 6 attemps at having fun in No Man sky...



Stealing peoples' cargo by pirating


They have events. Jumptown, overdrive, xenothreats, etc etc.

More power to you boys. As long as you're actually enjoying and not in some loop hole because you invested money in it, then I'm happy for you. The narrative behind this game is so loud people started to get the idea that its a scam

Its always good to hear from the people that are actually playing to understand whats actually happening

Like it or no it's their own money they can burn it that money however they want.

 

[Poppinfresh]

They have events. Jumptown, overdrive, xenothreats, etc etc.

LOL

This video is great, because at the end the content creator talks about the fact that the event had a reward that was only useful for a ship that you had to spend money on.

So you play the event, and as a reward, you get something that is useless unless you spend money to buy the ship that was released in conjunction with the event.

Fu*king scammers.

EDIT: Oh yeah... the other reward that the video talks about is some armor set, which I guess isn't bound to your account so when the server is reset you lose it forever, because the game is still in alpha and servers get reset all the time.

 

[AJUMP23]

Just get SQ42 out the door.

 

[laynelane]

They've raised so much money and monetized a game that's never been finished or had a retail release. And there's still those that support the dream they're selling. This is one for the history books, imo, and it may very well be studied one day as how to implement a long-running scam.

 

[Buggy Loop]

LOL

This video is great, because at the end the content creator talks about the fact that the event had a reward that was only useful for a ship that you had to spend money on.

So you play the event, and as a reward, you get something that is useless unless you spend money to buy the ship that was released in conjunction with the event.

Fu*king scammers.

Same vibe dude.

I'm glad you're there to warn me that trying SC could lead me to sell my house and be homeless.

The event of the video :

•A complimentary upgrade from the Hornet F7C to the military-exclusive F7A. So those who HAD the F7C got an upgrade to a specific version of the ship
•Seven-day free rental of the Hornet F7A
•A set of XenoThreat Medium Armor

Nobody is forcing anyone to use their credit card. There's a ton of events that don't lead to a ticket for buying a ship. If you get the item and you're not interested you can sell it off in-game to someone else. There's tons of constant warfare zones right now in Pyro with rewards that are not like that specific event

In fact some of the Pyro contested zone rewards are

• Anvil F7A Hornet Mk II Executive
• Anvil F8C Lightning Executive
• Drake Corsair Executive
• Drake Cutlass Black Executive
• Gatac Syulen Executive

How dare they give ships away for an event? They have to go to the store!

 

[Poppinfresh]

Nobody is forcing anyone to use their credit card.

How much money have you spent on Star Citizen?


Be honest

 

[YeulEmeralda]

And what they showed of squadron 42 looked like shit. It was pretty much a 30 minute long turret shooter with terrible cutscenes.

Its pretty clear to me that most of the backers who are left don't care about a single player space fighter game.

 

[RaidenJTr7]

"The Money is flowing like this "

 

[Oberstein]

 

[StueyDuck]

Well many people struggle with what a scam is, what nickel and diming means, are incapable of adjusting their opinion based on new information and have an appallingly poor grasp on economics
I personally find it amusing when people whine about publishers making demands on devs then go on the scam citizen band wagon or whine about how a Kickstarter failed to deliver
It's possible for something to be horribly mismanaged but not be a scam

Absolutely correct.

it's also because most of the people just parrot things from idiot influencers who don't even play the game or have genuine knowledge of the situation, like old dummy angry joe.

The guy always makes a vid on anything that's negative Star Citizen, yet I've never seen that fat chop actually touch the game.

It's 1000% mismanaged, though and Chris roberts was absolutely taking people for a ride initially, but all things considered in recent years, they've managed to sort out their production cycles (albeit 10 years too late). Patches now don't completely reinstall the game and completely wipe everything like they use to.

And we wont' even get into the feature creep aspect either, like there's no way housing and base building is gonna be ready in a year or so.

 

[Buggy Loop]

How much money have you spent on Star Citizen?


Be honest

I can't recall the CCU chains to get to what my hangar is now but I had the starter from 2013 which I can't even remember what it was but eventually switched to 300i, which I upgraded through a bunch of intermediate ships to Ares ion for a long time → Guardian QI recently (upgrade of $10 for that one i recall), then the starter Syulen, then the corsair. That's pretty much it. 3 ships with lower costs than store with CCU chains when there's deals. Probably ~$400.

Basically starter ship + a more robust ship for coop with friends I work with + 2nd solo ship for more specific tasks in what I find fun than the starter ship (bounty hunting).

Backed in 2012 but sat on 300i until 2023.

I've spent $300 backing Elite dangerous for less return as they crapped out big time on DLCs.

And I didn't need to spend fuck all except for starter pack. But I also don't need to buy $1500 headphones or $1500 amp/dac or $3000 guitar amp or $2000 Gibson guitar, etc. Glad you're worried about me hon

EDIT: Oh yeah... the other reward that the video talks about is some armor set, which I guess isn't bound to your account so when the server is reset you lose it forever, because the game is still in alpha and servers get reset all the time.

Permanently attached to your account and safe from wipes.

 

[Avid Reading Horse]

Here's what not running out of money looks like, I don't know let's call this gentleman... I don't know... The Skipper:

Or perhaps The Millionaire... and His Wife:

But actually running out of money in the low paying World of Academia, we have The Professor

 

[SILKYSMOOTH30FPS]

I doubt Chinese gacha game studios dare to pull of a Star Citizen because the Chinese players backlash would be huge.

Gacha players can be manipulated as easily as those still believing that Scam Citizen is the best game that has ever began production. Just gave em a bunch of half naked waifus, and job's done.

 

[Neilg]

At what point is this game investigated for money laundering?

If it is spent on staff and office space to chase the ever moving goalposts of a coke addict on an ego trip, it's technically not being laundered.

 

[Von Hugh]

I hope Chris gets some jailtime

 

[nemiroff]

More power to you boys. As long as you're actually enjoying and not in some loop hole because you invested money in it, then I'm happy for you. The narrative behind this game is so loud people started to get the idea that its a scam

Its always good to hear from the people that are actually playing to understand whats actually happening

There's plenty of legit criticism. It's just rare to see on message forums like this because it's such a turbulent, iconic, long-term and successful project. In other words, it's an easy target. People see these "rich" PC people who spent thousands of dollars on a rig, and thousands of dollars on ships and think this is some ultra-high-brow stuff. But what these people don't understand is, you can play this game for about 45 dollars... that's all the "investment" you need to happily play the game... and most importantly: YOU CAN BUY (or rent) EXPENSIVE SHIPS WITH IN-GAME EARNED MONEY BY DOING MISSIONS, no need to pay real-life dollars for them.

 

[StueyDuck]

How much money have you spent on Star Citizen?


Be honest

$45, bought the starter kit with SQ42 and haven't looked back.

You know that there's a rental and purchasing option for all items, with in-game currency earned through quests, and it does not require you to spend a dollar more?

The majority of people I know have at worst upgraded to a slightly better ship using real-world money, I think the most i know that someone spent was about $120 worth, now ask me about what people I know have spent on FIFA UT and Fortnite/CoD skins, or even better, what people have spent on GTA shark cards.

Most people are just grinding quests and jobs to get new parts or weapons.

Plus, with salvaging and trading being more of a thing now, some things you don't even have to buy, you can just scrap it from the NPCs and their ships or others.

 

[DeepEnigma]

You know that there's a rental and purchasing option for all items,in-game

 

[StueyDuck]

as in with in game currency.

 

[DeepEnigma]

as in with in game currency.

 

[Burger]

I hope one day in the distant future everyone who gave these guys money get everything they deserve.

 

[StueyDuck]

yeah some of the ships are a big grind obviously to purchase, but say you need like a miner for a quest or you just feel like mining in general you can rent one for a short period of time.

It's a good way to onboard new players i find, rent the big multicrew ship, let your bambi join and hop in to experience the big leagues then they get their dinky little starter like the aurora and the grind lust kicks in.

 

[nemiroff]

Oh yeah... the other reward that the video talks about is some armor set, which I guess isn't bound to your account so when the server is reset you lose it forever, because the game is still in alpha and servers get reset all the time.

If you buy an armor set, it's permanently tied to your account, you'll never lose it for real. There was an issue in SC where there was a temporary bug where you couldnt regain access to wear the armor in-game. I guess that's where someone made some shit up. But when they fixed that issue, everyone got their stuff back to use in the game.

Edit: Wait, "reward"...? I guess we're talking about two different things, but it could be from the same origin, idk.

I hope one day in the distant future everyone who gave these guys money get everything they deserve.

Thanks, but I have already gotten my huge decade old 35 dollars investment's worth of fun out of the game. It nice of you to be concerned on my behalf though. Appreciate you

 

[mitch1971]

he's literally explaining how he's squeezing and finagling money out of PC suckers

He's showing you how to navigate the intestines of the players once you get through their arsehole.

 

[Super Lemon Drop]

The video I watched reported that one of these initiatives was also limited time only, so people could buy an item to give them an advantage and once the selling period ends, anyone who didn't buy that stuff is at a disadvantage.

 

[bitbydeath]

I dont think star citizen is that different. Star citizen could be seen as a sim game. But no they don't really have goals and objectives. They can but they dont have too, and they're not win conditions. Like in crusader kings, there are really no goals, or rather there are 1000 potential goals you could choose to pursue in any playthrough, but the game doesn't tell you to do anything. Wanna conquer half of europe and northern africa and restore the roman empire? Do that. Just want to rule over a small county and make it prosperous while defending yourself from greater powers? Do that. Wanna Just fuck around and make a bunch of children and conquer land to give them the titles to have as many titles in your bloodline as possible? Do that.

Haven't heard of Crusader Kings, but I gather this "do whatever you want" gameplay type is an acquired taste, so each to their own.

 

[Halo is Back]

I would like to take this opportunity to remind everyone that you can log in and play this "scam" for free, right now, and see what it's got to offer for yourself. Bear in mind the game is still in alpha, with many things unfinished, but it's quite playable now with a very active player base.

 

[Ozriel]

When this was Kickstarted I was flying a Sandy Bridge + Gtx 560.

Nvidia and Intel were still consistently delivering on the hardware front.

EA was still beginning to deliver a fairly good sequence of Battlefield games (3-4-1)

We still had hope that Diablo 3 (in beta testing) would be a great game like D2.

BioWare was still a household name in WRPG and CDPR was an "indie" company...

And my beloved Manchester United was still a top football club

 

[Ozriel]

GRR Martin will have "Winds of Winter" out before Star Citizen is released.