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J. Michael Straczynski's comments on Star Trek

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ShadowRed

Banned
Interesting read.





Quote:I'm trying this via google to see if I can access the groups, since
I've been offline since AOL stopped carrying newsgroups.

I don't normally do this...in fact, I don't think I've ever done this in any group before, because I've always kind of waited to make sure it was worth doing, and that it would make a difference.

I'm sending this to both the B5 folks reading this and any Trek fans looking on.

Bryce Zabel (recently the head of the Television Academy and
creator/executive producer of Dark Skies) and I share one thing in common. We are both long-time Trek fans, from the earliest days, who felt that the later iterations were not up to the standards set by the original series. (I'm exempting TNG because that one worked nicely, and was in many ways the truest to the original series because Gene was still around to shepherd its creation and execution.)

Over time, Trek was treated like a porsche that's kept in the garage all the time, for fear of scratching the finish. The stories were, for the most part, safe, more about technology than what William Faulkner described as "the human heart in conflict with itself." Yes, there were always exceptions, but in general that trend became more and more apparent with the passage of years. Which was why so often I came down
on the later stories, which I did openly, because I didn't feel they lined up with what Trek was created to be. I don't apologize for it, because that was what I felt as a fan of Trek. That's why I had Majel appear on B5, to send a message: that I believe in what Gene created.

Because left to its own devices, allowed to go as far as it could, telling the same kind of challenging stories Trek was always known for, it could blow the doors off science fiction television. Think of it for a moment, a series with a forty year solid name, guaranteed markets...can you think of a better time when you take chances and can tell daring, imaginative, challenging stories? Why play it safe?

When Enterprise went down, those involved shrugged and wrote it off to "franchise fatigue," their phrase, not mine.

I don't believe that for a second. Neither does Bryce. There's a tremendous hunger for Trek out there. It just has to be Trek done *right*.

Last year, Bryce and I sat down and, on our own, out of a sheer love of Trek as it was and should be, wrote a series bible/treatment for a return to the roots of Trek. To re-boot the Trek universe. Understand: writer/producers in TV just don't do that sort of thing on their own, everybody always insists on doing it for vast sums of money.

We did it entirely on our own, setting aside other, paying deadlines out of our passion for the series. We set out a full five-year arc.

But when it came time to bring it to Paramount, despite my track record and Bryce's enormous and skillful record as a writer/producer, the effort stalled out because of "political considerations," which was explained to us as not wishing to offend the powers that be.

So on behalf of myself and Bryce, I'm taking the unusual step of going right to the source...right to you guys, fueled in part by a number of recent articles and polls, including one at www.scifi.com/scifiwire in which nearly 18,000 fans voted their preference for a new Trek series, and 48% of that figure called for a jms take on Trek. (The other choices polled at about 18% or thereabouts.)

See, if somebody doesn't like a story, doesn't want to buy it, that's all well and good, that's terrific, that's the way it's supposed to be. But when "political considerations" are the basis...that just doesn't parse.

So here's the deal, folks. If you want to see a new Trek series that's true to Gene's original creation, helmed by myself and Bryce, with challenging stories, contemporary themes, solid extrapolation, and the infusion of some of our best and brightest SF prose writers, then you need to let the folks at Paramount know that. If the 48% of the 18,000
folks who voted at scifi.com sent those sentiments to
Paramount...there'd be a new series in the works tomorrow.

I don't need the work, I have plenty of stuff on my plate through 2007 in TV, film and comics, so that's not an issue. But I'd set it all aside for one shot at doing Trek right, and I know Bryce feels the same.

If you want this to happen...it's up to the Trek and B5 fans to make it so.

The rest I leave to the quiet turning of your considered conscience.

J. Michael Straczynski



From: www.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu/pipermail/b5jms/2005-February/005495.html
 

SteveMeister

Hang out with Steve.
If Gene Roddenberry were to somehow be resurrected and read this, his reaction would likely be something along the lines of "I'm out of it for a little while and suddenly everyone has delusions of grandeur."

Sorry JMS, Babylon 5 was GOOD, but it wasn't GREAT, and I think it committed many of the sins you seem to feel the later Star Trek series committed, particularly that 5th season -- and I know that you rushed the story because you thought it was going to be cancelled after season 4, but that's not really an excuse now, is it?
 

themadcowtipper

Smells faintly of rancid stilton.
I really loved what he did with the first season of Jeremiah, not so crazy about the second, I think thats when he left.
 

Mr Mike

1 million Canadian dollars
He certainly has a high opinion of himself. I think I could write better dialogue/stories for the SW prequels, but you don't see me asking people to go to Fox and demand I get put in charge. JMS' BIGGEST FAN TURNS OUT TO BE JMS SHOCKER, etc.
 

Vlad

Member
FYI, that post from JMS is from the middle of February, and the whole idea ended up falling through about a day after he posted that... The relevant comments can be found here
 

duckroll

Member
I used to respect JMS quite a bit in the past. Lately he's been coming off as more of an arrogant jerk who's a has-been than anything else. Anyone following his comics works will tell you that his work on Rising Stars turned fucking lame after the first arc and shockingly the final arc and finale were even WORSE than the crappy 2nd arc. His work on Spider-man and Supreme Power isn't particularly impressive either. For a guy that seems to have such a high opinion of himself it's sad that he couldn't even get the timeline for his own Rising Stars right. The guy needs to reflect on his own original work before thinking of tackling an established series like Star Trek imo.
 

DarienA

The black man everyone at Activision can agree on
I'd love a new Trek series... but I don't want a Trek reboot... hell no.
 

SteveMeister

Hang out with Steve.
Boogie said:
BLASPHEMY!

Not really. I watched the show religiously when it was on. Liked the characters, despite the wooden acting and bad dialogue. The Shadow War storyline was good. But that 5th season sucked.
 

Sukahii16

Member
Can we expect an episode of Star Trek in which Kirk finds that two assailants he believe to be his children in fact belong to....


"KHHAAAAAANNNN!"
 
SteveMeister said:
Sorry JMS, Babylon 5 was GOOD, but it wasn't GREAT
Until I find a way to perform Scar's head explode attack from FMA on you this is all I can do. *Hates SteveMeister with the fury of 1,000 suns*
 

DarthWoo

I'm glad Grandpa porked a Chinese Muslim
The only reason Season 5 turned out the way it did was because of network bullying. Had JMS had the support he wanted, Season 4 would have been the first half of Season 4, and Season 5 the second half, if you know what I mean. They had even shot Sleeping in Light (the series finale) at the end of Season 4, just in case. I think that after all the fighting with the networks and having to compress what he wanted to do in two seasons into one, he just didn't have as much motivation to work to his potential in the last season.
 

duckroll

Member
DarthWoo said:
The only reason Season 5 turned out the way it did was because of network bullying.

Right just keep telling yourself that. That's always JMS's excuse time after time. I bought it at first but now, no longer. I'm sorry but he's the ONLY creator in just about everytime I've seen who is so fucking vocal about how the flaws in his works are always someone else's fault and when something doesn't work out everyone is to blame EXCEPT himself. The sad fact of the matter is that I've come to learn that much of the problems in many of his works just boil down to two things: 1) he's not as excellent a writer as he might think so himself, 2) he's an ass to work with and has an ego the size of the moon.
 

DarthWoo

I'm glad Grandpa porked a Chinese Muslim
Well, considering that he wrote the two best seasons of B5 in their entirety by himself, he did pretty damn well.
 
Ash Housewares said:
*votes against giving the Bablyon 5 guy the chance to fuck over Star Trek even worse*

Worse? How can it get any worse? I think Voyager and Nemesis proved definitively that we've hit the bottom of the tank in that regard.

I'm not a universal fan of JMS' works (and trusting Majel at all seems crazy) but sci-fi obviously seems to be his strong suit, so what the hell, why not? Trek clearly needs to take some almost Battlestar Galactica level chances rather than merely adding mood lighting and time travel plots.
 

Anthropic

Member
For the people who think the fifth season sucked...

Have you recently gone back and watched Season 5 in order, in quick succession lately? I remember being dissapointed with the pacing in the first half of the season when it originally aired, but when I watched it again, it wasn't nearly as bad as I remembered.

Also, while the first half of Season 5 certainly had it's flaws, the second half was great. Finally watching Londo's fall was great. And then there was Sleeping in Light, which was probably the most awesome last episode of anything, ever.
 

maharg

idspispopd
This is really
really
really
old.

And he basically recanted the whole thing almost before that post made it through the moderation of the newsgroup. He basically found out there was no hope of them doing another series for a very very long time.

And haters be damned, JMS rocks. The man wrote 90 of 110 episodes of B5 and the thing held up amazingly well. I'm pretty sure no one has ever taken such a heavy hand in the creative side of a show (especially one with an arc), let alone done it and made it WORK. He also kept the whole thing under budget.

Mind you, Manny Coto has already proven himself. If anyone should have been given a chance to run a new Trek show, it's him.
 

Oxymoron

Member
duckroll said:
Right just keep telling yourself that. That's always JMS's excuse time after time. I bought it at first but now, no longer. I'm sorry but he's the ONLY creator in just about everytime I've seen who is so fucking vocal about how the flaws in his works are always someone else's fault and when something doesn't work out everyone is to blame EXCEPT himself. The sad fact of the matter is that I've come to learn that much of the problems in many of his works just boil down to two things: 1) he's not as excellent a writer as he might think so himself, 2) he's an ass to work with and has an ego the size of the moon.

Joss Whedon.
 

Vlad

Member
maharg said:
This is really
really
really
old.

And he basically recanted the whole thing almost before that post made it through the moderation of the newsgroup. He basically found out there was no hope of them doing another series for a very very long time.

Don't bother, I said the same thing back in post #6, and it appears that nobody was paying attention.
 

DarthWoo

I'm glad Grandpa porked a Chinese Muslim
Vlad said:
Don't bother, I said the same thing back in post #6, and it appears that nobody was paying attention.

The thing is, the thread went off on another topic (JMS's works in general), so the original post doesn't really matter any more.
 

Xenon

Member
Just imagine if Kevin Sorbo somehow got a hold of Star Trek. [shudders]


I know it’s a moot point, but hell, I'd love to see a JMS Trek series. The show has been in creative bankruptcy since the end of DS9. Sure this season of Enterprise has been entertaining, but it’s only because they have been raiding the storylines of the past series and tapping into trek nostalgia.
 

ShadowRed

Banned
Xenon said:
Just imagine if Kevin Sorbo somehow got a hold of Star Trek. [shudders]


I know it’s a moot point, but hell, I'd love to see a JMS Trek series. The show has been in creative bankruptcy since the end of DS9. Sure this season of Enterprise has been entertaining, but it’s only because they have been raiding the storylines of the past series and tapping into trek nostalgia.




Why imagine when you can watch Andromeda?
 
DS9 is my favourite Trek. Next is Enterprise. I just love Enterprise, especially this Season. Sucks it has to end so soon. :(
 

Anthropic

Member
Though, as poor as Infection was, it did serve the purpose of introducing us to IPX and their involvement in alien weapons technology.
 
Xenon said:
No, actually I can't. Believe me I've tried. That show is now completely unwatchable.

I think what he meant was that Andromeda was originally a Star Trek set in a post-Federation universe.
 

maharg

idspispopd
ManDudeChild said:
I think what he meant was that Andromeda was originally a Star Trek set in a post-Federation universe.

Er, no it wasn't. The plot came from a bunch of places, but the stuff about being frozen through the fall of civilization actually comes from a Roddenberry western TV show that wasn't picked up for production after its pilot. See here:
If certain elements and ideas in Andromeda appear familiar, that’s because there are echoes from Roddenberry’s unsold 1973 TV movie Genesis II, which starred Alex Cord and Mariette Hartley. In that film, NASA scientist Dylan Hunt was accidentally frozen in an underground chamber and revived in a post-apocalyptic future world where civilization had crumbled and a group of scientists were determined to rebuild it.

It apparently sucked.

I don't think Roddenberry would have ever done a 'post-federation' story. The federation was his baby, he'd never kill it.
 

quest

Not Banned from OT
I think it would rock if JMS and the guy writing this years Enterprise teamed up we could finally get a great Star Trek. Let JMS write the overall story arc and let the current Enterprise guy take it from there.

The first 4 years of B5 were easilymy favorite seasons of any SciFi show ever. Great story told with great continuity. The acting I thought was great and I loved how much the characters changed from the begining of the show to the end. The transformations of londo and G'Kar were nothing short of mindblowing. I loved how almost every character had to pay a price for what they did. The last episode sleeping in light might of been the best final episode of a show ever.

Until Sorbo went insane and fired the creative team I thought that Andomedia was a damn good show. It was a really really dark show with good characters except hunt. It is a shame what Sorbo did to that show. It just pains me to watch what happened to a once great show. This year of Andromeda is easily the worst season of any TV show ever. To bad the scifi picked the show up for another year when that money could of went towards more episodes of BSG and SG:A.
 
Jeffahn said:
I think they should let the guy who did McGuyver do Star Trek.


Henry Winkler's Star Trek?

I can just see it now.

Stardate 1956, These are the voyages of the U.S.S. Fonzarelli.

Captain: "Ensign Cha-chi, engines full ahead warp factor AYYYYYY!!!!!"
 

duckroll

Member
Cyan said:
Well, that was his excuse for several things in B5, because it was true. He's not totally averse to blaming himself though--see his comments on how he screwed up a large segment of Rising Stars.

Which "large segment" was this? I would actually like to see what he actually said because if this segment he referred to was the 2nd arc, then it's laughable because the final arc is even WORSE. Not to mention he ends up forgetting what year the story is in and messing up all continuity before blowing the entire series off with a crapass ending. >_<
 

Phoenix

Member
ManDudeChild said:
I think what he meant was that Andromeda was originally a Star Trek type show set in a post-Federation-ish universe.

(fixed)

And back then I used to watch it. It was an interesting universe initially, but then somewhere along the way it just imploded upon itself and not it IS truly unwatchable.
 
So I finally got around to finishing Rising Stars and I haven't laughed that hard in years, literally, it is so bad on every level that it is a work of pure comedic genius. Hahahhahahahahahaa oh my god the hurting, the belly laughing. JMS is a worthless hack and anyone who still respects him clearly hasn't seen what he's been up to lately, hahahahahahahahahaa!
 
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