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[A Link to the Past]

Think can be Bliz strict with stuff, but I can also see why. Letting something like this go through can open a can of worms. What's to stop someone from announcing an "KKK," "Anti Jew," and etc. guild.

It's not a guild where only gay people join, it's a guild where gay friendly people join. It's not for the sake of furthering any agenda, it's just to form a guild where they can find others that are GLBT-friendly.

 

[myzhi]

It's not a guild where only gay people join, it's a guild where gay friendly people join. It's not for the sake of furthering any agenda, it's just to form a guild where they can find others that are GLBT-friendly.

"It's not a guild where only KKK people join, it's a guild where KKK friendly people join. It's not for the sake of furthering any agenda, it's just to form a guild where they can find others that are KKK-friendly"


See what I mean? Not hard to change / say few things to try to make it politically correct and acceptable. Like I said, opens cans of worms.

 

[A Link to the Past]

"It's not a guild where only KKK people join, it's a guild where KKK friendly people join. It's not for the sake of furthering any agenda, it's just to form a guild where they can find others that are KKK-friendly"


See what I mean? Not hard to change / say few things to try to make it politically correct and acceptable. Like I said, opens cans of worms.

Yeah. Let's compare homosexuality to a group devoted to the hatred of Jews and minorities.

Seriously, you people are reaching. Are you listening to yourselves? Let me revise your arguments to better compare them to other arguments on a related subject.

"If gay marriages are legalized, what will stop people from demanding that they be allowed to marry their pets or children?"

 

[Snow]

"It's not a guild where only KKK people join, it's a guild where KKK friendly people join. It's not for the sake of furthering any agenda, it's just to form a guild where they can find others that are KKK-friendly"


See what I mean? Not hard to change / say few things to try to make it politically correct and acceptable. Like I said, opens cans of worms.

Wow. That's one of the more stupid post I've seen in this thread. And this thread is pretty stupid.

Anyway, I played WoW for a couple of months. Had a pretty good guild, spend quite a lot of time chatting with them during the game. We actually played on a RP server, but still, when you spend that much time with people, RL stuff comes up every once in a while. "Oh, the wife wants me to stop playing. " "Yeah, went out with my girl." etc. Now, in your random WoW guild, when you just happen to 'let slip' that you're straight, what's going to happen is... absolutely nothing.

Now, same scenario. Someone joins a random guild. And happens to mention that he's a guy and has a boyfriend. There is a decent chance that what is going to happen is... he is going to get a whole lot of shit about it. How hard is that to understand? To understand some desire to insulate yourself from that by joining a guild that doesn't state "we're gay", but states "we're not going to give you shit over it".

And the difference between that and the KKK (or homophobes, or any of the other strange counter examples given in this thread), is that KKK members deserve all the hate they get.

 

[mrklaw]

surely there should be no need to advertise as gay-friendly? If the WoW ToS have harassment as a bannable offense, then all players should be friendly to all other players.

 

[EviLore]

"It's not a guild where only KKK people join, it's a guild where KKK friendly people join. It's not for the sake of furthering any agenda, it's just to form a guild where they can find others that are KKK-friendly"


See what I mean? Not hard to change / say few things to try to make it politically correct and acceptable. Like I said, opens cans of worms.

FYI you don't get to compare homosexuals to Klan members on GAF, even if it's for the sake of your slippery slope argument.

 

[Waku]

FYI you don't get to compare homosexuals to Klan members on GAF, even if it's for the sake of your slippery slope argument.

He's not comparing the Groups of People or their Idiology's. He's just showing with what reasoning other, not so harmless Groups could use this situation and reasoning to justify their Clan Policies.

Can of Worms indeed.

 

[Snow]

surely there should be no need to advertise as gay-friendly? If the WoW ToS have harassment as a bannable offense, then all players should be friendly to all other players.

And despite that, a part of WoW's population still seems to have "give people shit over stupid things" as their mode of operation. I can understand the desire to just avoid them, at least as far as guild mates are concerned.

edit:

He's not comparing the Groups of People or their Idiology's. He's just showing with what reasoning other, not so harmless Groups could use this situation and reasoning to justify their Clan Policies.

Can of Worms indeed.

Except that it's a really bad example. You're not allowed to harrass people for their sexuality according to the ToS. So here we have a guild that says they're not going to harrass you over your sexuality.

You're not allowed to harrass people over their skin colour or race. So here we have a guild dedicated to a group of people that harrass folks over their skin colour and race. See where the parallel breaks up?

 

[No.1]

And despite that, a part of WoW's population still seems to have "give people shit over stupid things" as their mode of operation. I can understand the desire to just avoid them, at least as far as guild mates are concerned.

It is part of life. You can't control what people will say and do, and how they will react to certain situations. But Blizzard can restrict it, which is what they were trying to do with the 'no advertising for strictly gay guilds'. That's what I don't see so offensive about Blizzard asking for it to be removed from the guild's recruitment policy.

I can't it's stupid that this has been blown up so much. This group is after a better TOS from Blizzard, a closer watch of how gays are treated? It's a joke. This is something that shouldn't even be an issue in video-games.

Should be something the guild masters focus on and not Blizzard. I can't express myself enough at just how funny this is, though. Asking for a better justification on the game's TOS and treatment to 'certain' people? God, it's a video game. If these people can't manage the mistreatment of the word gay, then it is unlikely they've been hit hard by the real world and their views and opinions on gays. It comes with such a game though. Like I said, Blizzard can't control what is done, but they can offer restrictions - but with silly things such as this coming up, it is a step backwards.

 

[EviLore]

He's not comparing the Groups of People or their Idiology's. He's just showing with what reasoning other, not so harmless Groups could use this situation and reasoning to justify their Clan Policies.

Can of Worms indeed.

Since this is a tricky subject, and maybe an unpopular decision, I'll paste my just-written thoughts from the mod forum:

---
Yeah, I understand how the argument works, but it still strikes me as intolerant. In the context of the discussion, there are plenty of WoW guilds that are "asian friendly" or "australian friendly" etc., and I'm doubting that he would ascribe the same terms when dealing with that sort of group, as it *is* a far cry to go from having a guild full of people from those versus a guild of people sympathetic to a hate group. Now, whether we believe in the genetic argument or what the bible says or whatever, I'm inclined to treat homosexuals with the ethically fairer of those with regards to moderation policy.

So yeah, you could say it's just a bad argument, or a rather extreme endpoint to his slippery slope, and really that's accurate, but I think it's stepping a little to close to the edge of indiscretion. *shrug*
---

I'm not a fan of slippery slope arguments, since they're often logical fallacies and regularly used in the context of homosexuality to offensive effect.

For any further discussion of the ban, use staff@ga-forum.com

 

[Teknopathetic]

I don't really see the point of a "gay-friendly" guild. You should just advertise a guild that doesn't accept dickheads. That should weed out the "hur hur what a [insert any slur here]" set. Just advertise yourself as a guild that accepts players so long as they respect each other.

 

[arhra]

What? ITS A GAME. I don't care if they have green skin, worship hedgehogs, or are A-SEXUAL.

ITS A GAME. I DONT NEED TO KNOW ANY OF THAT.

How often do you stop mid-battle, and ask, "hey, you gay?" "Hey, you black?" "Hey you muslim?"

WHO THE FUCK CARES. PLAY THE GAME AND STFU.

This is NOT about Homosexuality, it's about who the hell cares if you are anything, it's a damn game. LEAVE THE REAL WORLD OUT OF IT.

Fucking asshats trying to make EVERYTHING a political fucking movement.

You realise that during the social interactions that make up most of the game, you might occasionally have cause to mention your real life, right? Like saying you can't make it to a guild meeting because you have something planned with your boyfriend, or whatever? Sure, you could tiptoe around it, but it's that kind of bullshit these guilds are trying to avoid, people shouldn't be constantly watching what they say just in case they let something slip and expose themselves to the average WoW-player's views on homosexuality (which are, in general, far from tolerant). If the no-harrassment policies in the ToS were enforced perfectly, and it never happened, it would be less of an issue (although there are still a lot of ways people can make your life difficult in teh game without it being open harrassment), but since they're not, and never will be (unless blizzard come up with some kind of AI system rivalling Skynet to monitor people's behaviour and auto-ban anyone who says anything remotely intolerant at any time), people will naturally try to find other people with similar viewpoints that they can socialise with.

 

[kevm3]

Actually, I think having 'gay only guilds' will make the situation WORSE because it will only further distinguish gays and they will be a bigger, more visible target. And if there are 'gay guilds' you already know people are going to beg for straight guilds, and I can see them conducting war against each other.

But seriously, this is a GAME and its purpose is to escape from reality. Why is the issue of sexual preference being brought up in a game? Is it that difficult to ignore those ignorant assholes who use derogatory remarks or even to report them?

 

[Nikashi]

I don't really see the point of a "gay-friendly" guild. You should just advertise a guild that doesn't accept dickheads. That should weed out the "hur hur what a [insert any slur here]" set. Just advertise yourself as a guild that accepts players so long as they respect each other.

+1

 

[Flynn]

I don't think anyone needs any empathy. The world has far too fucking much of that.

Are we living in the same world?

 

[A Link to the Past]

He's not comparing the Groups of People or their Idiology's. He's just showing with what reasoning other, not so harmless Groups could use this situation and reasoning to justify their Clan Policies.

Can of Worms indeed.

You're comparing the support of a group whose existence is based off of the hatred of entire races and religions to a sexuality. Advertising yourself as being gay friendly should not be equated to advertising yourself as being KKK friendly.

 

[Dr_Cogent]

The fact that the net kids also made it mean "stupid" is beside the point.

I just wanted to say that this existed WAY before the existence of the Internet.

Carry on.

 

[Zaptruder]

He's not comparing the Groups of People or their Idiology's. He's just showing with what reasoning other, not so harmless Groups could use this situation and reasoning to justify their Clan Policies.

Can of Worms indeed.

The fallacy of the argument is likening an attitude of tolerance to one of intolerance, but disguising the latter with semantics.

You're not been accepting of *hate based minority group* when you recruit specifically for those group types, you're been unaccepting of the target group of hate.

I don't really see the point of a "gay-friendly" guild. You should just advertise a guild that doesn't accept dickheads. That should weed out the "hur hur what a [insert any slur here]" set. Just advertise yourself as a guild that accepts players so long as they respect each other.

Ideally, you'd be able to do that... but what flawed person sees themselves as flawed? A person can be in general pretty nice, but they can at the same time hold some pretty appallingly close minded views (thanks religion).
I think in that situation, it's a service to potentially bigotted applicants as it is for members that need that kind of social protection.

 

[borghe]

one thing that this idiotic organization has missed is, there is no freedom to do ANYTHING inside the game. Blizzard owns everything from the servers right down to the characters and guilds that the players are using. If someone made a spider-man comic where Peter Parker was gay, they would have no right to do so, not because of free speech but because marvel owns the character.

the absolutely worst part about this is blizzard will cave to avoid the further bad press.

mind you that I have no problem with GBLTs. my problem comes strictly from the protection of IP rights. sexual preference, religion, political affiliation, ethnicity, etc have NO PLACE IN ONLINE GAMES, especially games where you sign an EULA that strictly forbids bringing that stuff into the game.

the one place where you can remain truly anonymous and we can wipe away all of the prejudice and hate and people STILL want to bring it in... fucking idiots.

 

[A Link to the Past]

one thing that this idiotic organization has missed is, there is no freedom to do ANYTHING inside the game. Blizzard owns everything from the servers right down to the characters and guilds that the players are using. If someone made a spider-man comic where Peter Parker was gay, they would have no right to do so, not because of free speech but because marvel owns the character.

the absolutely worst part about this is blizzard will cave to avoid the further bad press.

mind you that I have no problem with GBLTs. my problem comes strictly from the protection of IP rights. sexual preference, religion, political affiliation, ethnicity, etc have NO PLACE IN ONLINE GAMES, especially games where you sign an EULA that strictly forbids bringing that stuff into the game.

the one place where you can remain truly anonymous and we can wipe away all of the prejudice and hate and people STILL want to bring it in... fucking idiots.

The main issue isn't that they shouldn't be allowed to do it, it's that they shouldn't do it - it's backwards. Plus, warning someone for "opening that worms can", or something, is just dumb.

Also, WoW is a bit different from traditional games - MMORPGs seem to have a lot more of a community style going for them.

 

[BobTheFork]

There was an issue a few months ago where someone in blizzard decided to move an entire guild to our server (eldre thalas) because they were an openly gay guild and they were getting harassed on their own server. Apparently the blizzard employee didn't have the clearance to do this. They moved the whole guild back to their own server and dropped a 2 page explanation on us. It was mostly about how moving the guild was the wrong responce and they were banning the harassers instead. Most of the server freaked out because they thought it was a farming guild, and all OUR GOLD WOULD GO OVERSEAS lol.
I didnt know blizzard had a policy against guilds like that, seems like i've already seen many of them.

 

[borghe]

The main issue isn't that they shouldn't be allowed to do it, it's that they shouldn't do it - it's backwards. Plus, warning someone for "opening that worms can", or something, is just dumb.

you are absolutely correct that people shouldn't be doing this type of thing. but in lieu of people using common sense and refraining from "preaching" (i.e. spouting off ideas that have no place in this context) there SHOULD be rules set by blizzard against it. I do agree that warning someone over this behaviour is stupid. Just go to them and say they can't openly advertise a GBLT guild the same way someone can't advertise an all caucasion guild or an all republican guild.

Also, WoW is a bit different from traditional games - MMORPGs seem to have a lot more of a community style going for them.

I don't fucking care about this point in the slightest. I play wow to occassionally escape from all the stupid bullshit in real life. I don't need all that same stupid bullshit dragged back in the game because some group is trying to make a statement. and let's not gloss over the fact that that's exactly what this was. as others have said, you could make a guild advertising "no intolerant dickheads" and reached the same goal. Instead they specifically made mention of GBLT to pull their bullshit into the game and say "WE'RE [insert social category]!! LOOK AT US!!"

 

[madara]

Dang, I cant imagine them having much success with the Wow "community". I shocked they would even bother really, its such an anti social, ADHD fest anyhow. So that does tend to tell me this could be for selfish reasons. I surely wish them the best but if its an honest effort I save it for mmorpg that will actually have a community and foundation of some maturity at very least.

 

[Tritroid]

I can really see both angles regarding this.

For one, the excuse that homosexuals 'need' to express their sexual orientation in guild descriptions so that they can avoid being in a guild where words like 'fag' are tossed around is untrue. There are countless mature guilds out there, that consist of ages 20-40ish, that has members who would consider the usage of words like that bad conduct, and they don't have to label themselves as a specific orientation for that to be the norm. My guild, for example, does not use words like that because for one it's inappropriate in a game setting, and two because we have a few gay couples actually in the guild mingled amongst straight couples. But the point is we don't have to label ourselves as a 'gay friendly' guild because the mindset in the guild is maturity and respect towards all members, regardless of personal real life orientations, and I'm sure there are many many other guilds out there across the WoW servers who have the same type of atmosphere.

As far as guilds being allowed to express their orientation openly however, I think they definitely should be. People can start a guild based on virtually any theme they want, and sexual preference shouldn't be excluded. The people who think that sexuality shouldn't enter an online gaming atmosphere at all are correct, but unfortunately that can never be prevented no matter how strict the ToS guidelines are.

 

[Xdrive05]

You're comparing the support of a group whose existence is based off of the hatred of entire races and religions to a sexuality. Advertising yourself as being gay friendly should not be equated to advertising yourself as being KKK friendly.

Okay, okay... I have to step in here for a sec.

Those two things ARE equated because they potentially produce the same effect, which Blizzard is trying to avoid. That being - drawing negative attention from others in the server community. It has greater potential for conflict than otherwise.

If your guild is <KKK friendly dragons fo da whin> or <LGBT friendly whatevers>, it doesn't matter. Both will attract negative attention from other players and create conflict. They're NOT saying each group is morally equivalent to the other.

It just seems that this point glided right over a lot of people's heads. "But we're not the same as the KKK! They're evil and we're peaceful..." Yes, that may be true but that does not address the real issue at hand.

 

[borghe]

at it's core, if a GBLT guild should be allowed to be advertised, then an anti-GBLT guild should be allowed to be advertised. and that right there is why this shit should be left out of online gaming. we deal with enough of this type of thing in real life. do we need it to carry over to our virtual entertainment now?

edit - excellent point xdrive. exactly. there is no reason for them to differentiate themselves in a real world way from inside the game. and by doing so they are going to bring real world issues into the game.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Okay, okay... I have to step in here for a sec.

Those two things ARE equated because they potentially produce the same effect, which Blizzard is trying to avoid. That being - drawing negative attention from others in the server community. It has greater potential for conflict than otherwise.

If your guild is <KKK friendly dragons fo da whin> or <LGBT friendly whatevers>, it doesn't matter. Both will attract negative attention from other players and create conflict. They're NOT saying each group is morally equivalent to the other.

It just seems that this point glided right over a lot of people's heads. "But we're not the same as the KKK! They're evil and we're peaceful..." Yes, that may be true but that does not address the real issue at hand.

Again, as I already stated before, that argument was used with gay marriage, claiming that gay marriage will lead to "other perverted marriages".

 

[Zaptruder]

you are absolutely correct that people shouldn't be doing this type of thing. but in lieu of people using common sense and refraining from "preaching" (i.e. spouting off ideas that have no place in this context) there SHOULD be rules set by blizzard against it. I do agree that warning someone over this behaviour is stupid. Just go to them and say they can't openly advertise a GBLT guild the same way someone can't advertise an all caucasion guild or an all republican guild.


I don't fucking care about this point in the slightest. I play wow to occassionally escape from all the stupid bullshit in real life. I don't need all that same stupid bullshit dragged back in the game because some group is trying to make a statement. and let's not gloss over the fact that that's exactly what this was. as others have said, you could make a guild advertising "no intolerant dickheads" and reached the same goal. Instead they specifically made mention of GBLT to pull their bullshit into the game and say "WE'RE [insert social category]!! LOOK AT US!!"

I really don't understand why you feel the need to be vitriolic on this issue.

Been practical about it, MMORPGs are social constructs... you can wax lyrical about how it should be this or that, while ignoring what it really is... but the reality of the matter is, people are going to be talking about themselves, their lives. It's just natural.

Besides, more than anything else, the explicit formation of GBLT friendly social groups is just to get away from the concerns of real life; where you can gather in a comfortable social environment, rather than having to deal with people offending you by using fag or other similarly hateful words as an epithet.

that does not address the real issue at hand.

When the real issue at hand is the ongoing and unjust prejudice that is not only ingrained, but still been reinforced within our culture... then, neither does the simple policy of pretending it doesn't exist really address that issue.

In the meantime, even if it isn't their job to go out of the way to solve social problems, they can be at least accomodating and understanding of the circumstances and needs of their customers.
Ultimately, it is upto the customers to vote with their dollars by leaving, but given the time and emotional investment players typically have, it's not a preferred solution... I don't think it's a preferred solution for Blizzard either.

 

[vitaflo]

I don't really see the point of a "gay-friendly" guild. You should just advertise a guild that doesn't accept dickheads. That should weed out the "hur hur what a [insert any slur here]" set. Just advertise yourself as a guild that accepts players so long as they respect each other.

I've been in those guilds. "Don't be a dick" guids, are not neccesarily "gay-friendly", simply because some people don't think being a biggot is the same as being a dick.

My guild only has two rules, friends of real life friends only (which gives people a vested interest in the guild and means most of our players are over age 30) and no biggots. If any of my guildies started dropping "fag" or "gay" bombs, they'd be booted from the guild. Given the first rule we haven't even had to deal with any issues with the second one.

However, we're not large, and since we're not recruiting people we've met in-game, we'll never do large instances. Lets say we wanted to however. If you have certain rules for a guild, you want to recruite like minded people to cause the least amount of problems. If a person is gay, how are they supposed to know your guild is gay friendly unless you tell them? Most guilds aren't gay friendly. The only way to actually recruit in a guild like this is to say you're gay friendly, and you that you won't be treated like shit. It says nothing about the makup of your guild (technically we're gay friendly but do not have a single gay player), it just lets people who may want to join your guild know what they're getting into before they join, so they can join a guild they feel most comfortable in.

 

[Matlock]

I don't really see the point of a "gay-friendly" guild. You should just advertise a guild that doesn't accept dickheads. That should weed out the "hur hur what a [insert any slur here]" set. Just advertise yourself as a guild that accepts players so long as they respect each other.

But that would require common sense, Tre`.

 

[Xdrive05]

Again, as I already stated before, that argument was used with gay marriage, claiming that gay marriage will lead to "other perverted marriages".

No, I think you need to read my post again. What I said and what you are saying there is in no way logically equivalent to each other. Saying that allowing outspoken *social group friendly* guilds creates negativity and conflict from the server community is not in any way comparible to the *gay marriage leads to other perverted marriages* argument.

The fundamental difference being that gay marriage implying a rise of other non-traditional marriage is dealt with in the realm of implication involving consent - which has NOTHING to do with social group guild profiling in WoW leading to conflict on servers. No consent to non-tradition there - just opening the doors to greater conflict than before.

If you were going to argue your point that I quoted above, you would have to say that my argument would be more like saying "gay marriage shouldn't be allowed because others will come against it and cause trouble." Which I would have to say is, yet again, not sufficient to your cause. Why? Because a right to consenting marriage is fundamental in a society which provided cuts and breaks for the marrital status. Ergo withholding those rights on some traditional or religious grounds is both unfair and morally unjust.

WoW does not give special breaks to heterosexual players. Straight guild members don't get a 20% monthly fee deduction for being straight and in a guild.

At the end of it all you have social group advertising of guilds within servers, which has greater potential for creating a lot more conflict than otherwise. That's just how it is.

 

[UltraMarioMan]

Blizzard is right here.

 

[Zaptruder]

At the end of it all you have social group advertising of guilds within servers, which has greater potential for creating a lot more conflict than otherwise. That's just how it is.

More conflict than has already been created by trying to ban these types of groups from forming? More conflict then people using fag, dyke, etc, casually as epithets?

 

[Xdrive05]

More conflict than has already been created by trying to ban these types of groups from forming? More conflict then people using fag, dyke, etc, casually as epithets?

Yes, more conflict than that. When people start advertising their *we prefer xyz social group* *we tolerate xyz social group* *we are xyz social group friendly* - to whatever degree they take it - it will draw more attention from the haters. You're going to see a lot more fag, dyke, etc.'s when you put social groups in your guild names.

It's not about freedom to be gay or to be a KKK member. It's about Blizzard trying to keep these servers from going to the shitter because of expanded social group profiling with guilds. It would only breed more contempt within the online community when you start flaunting your social group. They don't want that in there and, quite frankly, I can understand why given how immature the majority of gaming community is.

 

[Littleberu]

I sure don't talk about my girlfriends/personnal live over the internet during a game. What the fuck is wrong with you?

 

[Acosta]

Online environments are public accommodations, subject to regulation as such

No.

All WoW is propierty of Blizzard, including your character, your objects, the world and all that is on it.

I have no will to discuss the issue, but just wanted to note that sentence is not true and is specificed in the agreement you must be agree to get into WoW.

 

[Shouta]

+2346234234 points for Tre` for making a post that destroys everyone else's in the thread.

You don't need to advertise that you're "GLBT" if you want members that aren't asshats, you advertise for applicants that aren't asshats (of course, you do it more formally). There's no need to bring up sexual orientation or anything else of the sort if you're looking for members that are respectful, you can just easily screen applicants.

 

[krypt0nian]

+2346234234 points for Tre` for making a post that destroys everyone else's in the thread.

You don't need to advertise that you're "GLBT" if you want members that aren't asshats, you advertise for applicants that aren't asshats (of course, you do it more formally). There's no need to bring up sexual orientation or anything else of the sort if you're looking for members that are respectful, you can just easily screen applicants.

The solit pre-screens them just fine thank you. Worked great before Bliz acted out and works great now that they've rightfully changed their mind.

And once again, no one was advertising that they were gay.

 

[StorablePrawn]

It is completely ridiculous that people are saying sexual orientation shouldn't be involved in a game. People get married through these games, and have for years, you idiiots. It's a form of communication. You think millions of people pay monthly just to play a mindless level grind? These are fantasy chat rooms more than anything.

 

[StorablePrawn]

O WAIT IF THEY LET GAYS MEET UP THEN BEASTIALITY AND CHILD ABUSE IS NEXT FUKKKKKKKK

 

[Shouta]

The solit pre-screens them just fine thank you. Worked great before Bliz acted out and works great now that they've rightfully changed their mind.

And once again, no one was advertising that they were gay.

So why can't you screen them in /tell rather than bring it up in public?

Oh and once again, it's about sexual orientation and respectful members. If you want respectful members, you needn't bring up sexual orientation as a part of it. A respectful member will automatically honor sexual orientation.

 

[Xdrive05]

O WAIT IF THEY LET GAYS MEET UP THEN BEASTIALITY AND CHILD ABUSE IS NEXT FUKKKKKKKK

Way to not read the thread nor understand what the issue is here.

 

[Matlock]

So why can't you screen them in /tell rather than bring it up in public?

Oh and once again, it's about sexual orientation and respectful members. If you want respectful members, you needn't bring up sexual orientation as a part of it. A respectful member will automatically honor sexual orientation.

Yep.

Dunno why people want to throw up neon targets over their heads, but hey, it's their perogative.

 

[A Link to the Past]

No, I think you need to read my post again. What I said and what you are saying there is in no way logically equivalent to each other. Saying that allowing outspoken *social group friendly* guilds creates negativity and conflict from the server community is not in any way comparible to the *gay marriage leads to other perverted marriages* argument.

The fundamental difference being that gay marriage implying a rise of other non-traditional marriage is dealt with in the realm of implication involving consent - which has NOTHING to do with social group guild profiling in WoW leading to conflict on servers. No consent to non-tradition there - just opening the doors to greater conflict than before.

If you were going to argue your point that I quoted above, you would have to say that my argument would be more like saying "gay marriage shouldn't be allowed because others will come against it and cause trouble." Which I would have to say is, yet again, not sufficient to your cause. Why? Because a right to consenting marriage is fundamental in a society which provided cuts and breaks for the marrital status. Ergo withholding those rights on some traditional or religious grounds is both unfair and morally unjust.

WoW does not give special breaks to heterosexual players. Straight guild members don't get a 20% monthly fee deduction for being straight and in a guild.

At the end of it all you have social group advertising of guilds within servers, which has greater potential for creating a lot more conflict than otherwise. That's just how it is.

How in the world are they any different? Just because they are different extremes does not mean that they're different arguments.

 

[krypt0nian]

So why can't you screen them in /tell rather than bring it up in public?

Because its a guild solit over the general channel? Are you supposed to /tell everyone in Ironforge? :lol No worries, Blizzard realized they were wrong. Nothing to worry about anymore.

Here's the typical post on the WOW boards about this: "Gay people are lower forms of humanity though. Kind of like Emo's and Gothics"

Oh and btw BBC is now carrying the story ---

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4700754.stm

 

[Ranger X]

It's fucking game. It's virtual, it's a neutral and free envirronement where there is no sex, religion or any potential association matters that could lead to "real discrimination" and yet some god damned organisation bothers with that shit. Jeez, do they want a free world to be integrated in or they want a status/clan and then actually reinforce discrimination?
No fucking clan or organisation is understanding the irony of discrimination: by forming groups/organisations/clans/religions causes the ones involved to have a status = to have one more chance to be discriminated somehow.
Stop making fucking clans and leave the virtual "free" worlds alone!! I'm totally behind Blizzard in this case i guess.

 

[krypt0nian]

It's fucking game. It's virtual, it's a neutral and free envirronement where there is no sex, religion or any potential association matters that could lead to "real discrimination" and yet some god damned organisation bothers with that shit. Jeez, do they want a free world to be integrated in or they want a status/clan and then actually reinforce discrimination?
No fucking clan or organisation is understanding the irony of discrimination: by forming groups/organisations/clans/religions causes the ones involve to have a status = to have one more chance to be discriminated somehow.
Stop making fucking clans and leave the virtual "free" worlds alone!! I'm totally behind Blizzard in this case i guess.

Bliz already recinded the ban on it. Thanks for your support. It was and is about having a freehaven from the moronic discrimination and abuse you suffer in an online community. And it works just fine.

 

[Shouta]

Because its a guild solit over the general channel? Are you supposed to /tell everyone in Ironforge? :lol No worries, Blizzard realized they were wrong. Nothing to worry about anymore.

You keep the solicitation general and screen interested applicants or are you incapable of actually thinking about doing something without causing an uproar?

I highly doubt they realized they were wrong, it's more likely they reversed the ban because of the bad press they'd get for sticking the ban because the rule would be misconstrued.

 

[krypt0nian]

You keep the solicitation general and screen interested applicants or are you incapable of actually thinking about doing something without causing an uproar?

I highly doubt they didn't realize they were wrong, it's more likely they reversed the ban because of the bad press they'd get for sticking it.

Working as intended.
Those who are making the uproar are not the kinds of people I worry at night about.

 

[Flynn]

It's fucking game. It's virtual, it's a neutral and free envirronement where there is no sex

You're more right than you think.
For some people it is a fucking game.