ElectricBlanketFire
Member
I hate the Wii U as a system but it has some of my all time favorite games on it including the greatest 2D platformer of all time in Donkey Kong Country Returns.
The dirty secret is that NSMBU is the best 2D Mario game
The dirty secret is that NSMBU is the best 2D Mario game
I'm still surprised that they never tried to 'rescue' Wii U in some way, like they did with the 3DS. Nintendo just left it to die.
I still think that if they'd dropped the Gamepad and renamed the console 'Wii 2', then released a Wii 2 SKU with a Wii remote and a Pro controller instead of a gamepad (and patched the system not to require the gamepad) it would have at least recovered a little bit, with a big marketing push. If you remove the Gamepad and push the system focus towards Pro controller & Wii Remote, it was essentially a more powerful Wii.
If they'd done that as Mario 3D World was dropping, who knows. It worked for Sony when they rebranded Playstation 3 as PS3 halfway through the gen alongside the Slim PS3 launch and completely changed its marketing message.
But TBH, if these growing pains led us to where we are with the Switch, then they obviously learned a lot from those pains and I'm actually strangely glad they went through it. The Switch is everything the Wii U wasn't; quick, snappy, easy to understand with clear messaging and PR, a great library thus far (including a clear monumental 'Killer App' in BOTW) and an extremely exciting future and... oh yeah complete versatility in portability and convenience.
I think Nintendo knew internally shortly before launch that the system was in trouble. By early 2013, they likely knew it was in deep trouble and by the end of 2013, knew it was a failure that could not be salvaged. Price drops and new hardware configurations wouldn't have meaningfully grown the install base or produced enough additional revenue to make such endeavors worthwhile. And once third parties completely abandoned ship after less than six months, there was no way to get them back. PS3 had major issues early on, but never on the same level as Wii U. PS3's major hurdle was price. Wii U's hurdle was one that could not really be fixed: it was a completely unappealing product.
I see where you're coming from but I find it hard to accept that making a 'Wii 2' would be a completely unappealing product, when its predecessor sold 100 million. That's like saying a 'Playstation 2' would be completely unappealing just because it has the same controller with a bit more power.
If it had been pushed with a Wii Remote focus alongside HD graphics, as an HD Wii, the gamepad would have long been forgotten but I think the sales could have improved a little. All they'd really need to do was take the gamepad out, put a Wii Remote in and give it a new name on the box, and it would have at least sold better - even though it would have never ever got near Wii numbers with such a samey follow up.
Would it have sold better? Maybe.
Would it have been worth the effort? Doubtful. A defacto relaunch like this wouldn't have been ready to go until around late 2014 and would have been an incredibly expensive risk. Nintendo would essentially have to deprogram everyone's understanding of Wii U via clever marketing and then try to sell them the same system again under a different name.
I think Nintendo was smart to cut their losses, offer decent support for the core Wii U userbase, and focus the majority of their future efforts on mobile + NX after it was clear Wii U was a failure.
I'm still surprised that they never tried to 'rescue' Wii U in some way, like they did with the 3DS. Nintendo just left it to die.
I still think that if they'd dropped the Gamepad and renamed the console 'Wii 2', then released a Wii 2 SKU with the console + a Wii remote and a Pro controller instead of a gamepad (and patched the system not to require the gamepad) it would have at least recovered a little bit, with a big marketing push. If you remove the Gamepad and push the system focus towards Pro controller & Wii Remote, it was essentially a more powerful Wii.
If they'd done that as Mario 3D World was dropping, who knows. It worked for Sony when they rebranded Playstation 3 as PS3 halfway through the gen alongside the Slim PS3 launch and completely changed its marketing message.
That's it though. I don't think most people had any understanding of what Wii U was. That's reflected in all the anecdotes about 'tablet for Wii' confusion and, frankly, the sales figures. They should have just pushed Wii 2 like it was a new console and quietly buried the gamepad forever more. Only geek types like us would have even known any different.
My main memory of the launch is:
I think it's the best side-scrolling Mario game since the SMB3/SMW days. I know a lot of folks will say I mistyped YI, but eh.Also NSMB U is a fantastic game. It gets some flack for being same-y, but it's really well made.
It started with the most boring one and that almost killed the series from the get-go for me. If you can look past the safe and bland aesthetic and music (definitely downsides in every game) you'll find some of the best level-design in 2D platformers. I'm baffled how people prefer Rayman Origins and Legends over NSMB, they're like amateur-hour in my eyes compared to the master-class of game-design of (most of the) NSMB games.I dont ever want to see another NSMB again. They are so boring now.
I see where you're coming from but I find it hard to accept that making a 'Wii 2' would be a completely unappealing product, when its predecessor sold 100 million. That's like saying a 'Playstation 2' would be completely unappealing just because it has the same controller with a bit more power.
If it had been pushed with a Wii Remote focus alongside HD graphics, as an HD Wii, the gamepad would have (rightly) long been forgotten and I think the sales could have improved a little. All they'd really need to do was take the gamepad out, put a Wii Remote in and give it a new name on the box, and it would have at least sold better - even though it would have never ever got near Wii numbers with such a samey follow up.
It wasn't just the console decisions that were weird with Wii U, it was games too. Nintendo abandoned Wii Sports, making that weird-ass downloadable remaster of the original instead of a new game at retail. Nintendo murdered Wii Fit, making that stupid Wii Fit U with a bizarre add-on, instead of just making Wii Fiit 3. There was no Wii Play 2, either. They took all the games that made the Wii so popular and completely abandoned them all, except for Mario Kart (which turned out to be the system's best-selling game - what does that tell you?).
It started with the most boring one and that almost killed the series from the get-go for me. If you can look past the safe and bland aesthetic and music (definitely downsides in every game) you'll find some of the best level-design in 2D platformers. I'm baffled how people prefer Rayman Origins and Legends over NSMB, they're like amateur-hour in my eyes compared to the master-class of game-design of (most of the) NSMB games.
I wouldn't go that far, but I think of the Origins and Legends games as having more in common with the DKCR/TF games due to level length and some of the isolated temple/chase levels having a rather high degree of difficulty in order to run them without dying. But even then, still very different games.It started with the most boring one and that almost killed the series from the get-go for me. If you can look past the safe and bland aesthetic and music (definitely downsides in every game) you'll find some of the best level-design in 2D platformers. I'm baffled how people prefer Rayman Origins and Legends over NSMB, they're like amateur-hour in my eyes compared to the master-class of game-design of (most of the) NSMB games.
I think 'Wii 2' would have been easier to identify than Wii U. I knew what the Wii U was, but it almost sounds like an extension of the Wii, rather than a successor.
Yeah, I think people overestimate how many consumers even knew about the Wii U.
Of course Wii 2 is easier to identify than Wii U and that's what Nintendo probably should have gone with from the start.
But rebranding Wii U as "Wii 2" two years after it launched would not have been a good idea. Nintendo was incredibly smart to cut their losses after 2013 and start fresh with NX/Switch. There's no point in continuing to put resources into a project you know has failed. Wii U was a nothing like PS3, which was an appealing product held back by a high price tag and a somewhat lacking lineup early on. I think what some are failing to realize here is that by 2012, the Wii branding was already starting to become toxic and by 2014, it was a completely dead brand.
I definitely don't overestimate it. I worked retail at the time of Wii U's launch and it was almost impossible to sell consumers on the system, because the entire concept was either too confusing or they simply didn't care. Very few people knew about Wii U for two reasons:
1. Nintendo marketed the console horribly. Which is honestly kind of understandable, because it can be very hard to market an unappealing product.
2. People lost interest in the Wii brand.
I think point #2 is especially important and why Nintendo was smart to move on.
I should have known it was going to be a rough launch when I did the lineup st Target and there were 7 people and there were only around 4 deluxe sets.
One of my favorite memories was collecting $5 back with the DDP program. Shame they got rid of it.
I think a slightly more accurate way to put it would be to say that the Wii brand was toxic for the people that actually knew what a Wii U was. I remember during launch several gaming outlets doing launch coverage, showing themselves playing Nintendoland and answering user questions. The amount of misinformation they were spreading was astounding. I watched a video of two guys getting the resolution the system could handle wrong, whether it had backwards compatibility, frankly some real basic shit about the system. People like to brush it off as Nintendo doing a bad job at explaining the system, but that's horseshit. By the time the system launched, anybody claiming to be a "games journalist" or hosting a fucking video meant to inform consumers about a product should be educated on the matter, or should be professional enough to admit when they didn't know something rather than to straight up misinform their viewers. It really turned me off from a lot of games media.
Of course Wii 2 is easier to identify than Wii U and that's what Nintendo probably should have gone with from the start.
But rebranding Wii U as "Wii 2" two years after it launched would not have been a good idea. Nintendo was incredibly smart to cut their losses after 2013 and start fresh with NX/Switch. There's no point in continuing to put resources into a project you know has failed. Wii U was a nothing like PS3, which was an appealing product held back by a high price tag and a somewhat lacking lineup early on. I think what some are failing to realize here is that by 2012, the Wii branding was already starting to become toxic and by 2014, it was a completely dead brand.
It's really not though. This is the worst system introduction in Nintendo's history, easily. Regardless of any misinformation the media may have spread, Nintendo did an absolutely horrible job introducing and marketing the machine.
It's certainly the best 2D Mario since World.The dirty secret is that NSMBU is the best 2D Mario game