Making more Vita copies will significantly lower the amount available for the PS4 game that is release
Seeing people checkout after you and getting it is the disheartening part.Here's an interesting stat
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1600 people tried to buy a $120 bundle at the same time. Doesn't seem impossible that that many or more were trying for Söldner.
So, at the other end of the spectrum - Breach & Clear Deadline is still in stock, showing as yellow on the website which is > 25% I think.
Mad that we've seen such different ends of the spectrum within one day. Vita game sold out within 3 minutes (or less!); PS4 game still in stock after 13 hours.
Although I know it's the more expensive production, it definitely seems LRG should think about upping their Vita quantities.
Anyway, metroidvania in August. I hope it's not Knytt (also, wouldn't that be from Ripstone, who I'm pretty sure have done their own retail publishing before - Stick it to the Man on PS4).
Guacamelee I would be SO down for. That may also fit with the "PS4 2x Vita" thing I seem to remember from a while ago, because the PS4 version is complete while Vita version is missing stuff.
Axiom Verge would also be all sorts of awesome.
the PS4 releases have taken longer to sell out apart from Saturday Morning RPG (I wonder why that game sold out faster on the PS4?)
So, at the other end of the spectrum - Breach & Clear Deadline is still in stock, showing as yellow on the website which is > 25% I think.
Mad that we've seen such different ends of the spectrum within one day. Vita game sold out within 3 minutes (or less!); PS4 game still in stock after 13 hours.
Although I know it's the more expensive production, it definitely seems LRG should think about upping their Vita quantities.
Anyway, metroidvania in August. I hope it's not Knytt (also, wouldn't that be from Ripstone, who I'm pretty sure have done their own retail publishing before - Stick it to the Man on PS4).
Guacamelee I would be SO down for. That may also fit with the "PS4 2x Vita" thing I seem to remember from a while ago, because the PS4 version is complete while Vita version is missing stuff.
Axiom Verge would also be all sorts of awesome.
Bluntly, after last night's debarcles, I think Limited Run is being irresponsible by not having preorders.
I encountered a store problem last night. Plain and simple.You're more than welcome to start your own company and put up your own capital. You can take all the financial risk of ordering a fixed amount of copies which may never sell, or you can open up pre-orders and watch your sales tank. Which would you prefer?
EDIT: Do people consider the store itself to be the problem, or is it just frustration of getting beat to the punch? I am curious what the flaws are considered to be. I would not consider demand one such flaw.
I encountered a store problem last night. Plain and simple.
Game was added to the cart within seconds of going live and I immediately went to check out. It was listed as "out of stock" that's literally just seconds into the game being on sale. It happened three times.
Then, while browsing forums and twitter, it was clear that there were people who came to the sale AFTER me and we able to make a purchase.
THAT'S the issue which concerns me about the future.
The timing of posts on twitter and forums is a bit misleading, though. I myself usually post about my successful purchases a fair bit after making my purchase. This is not necessarily an indicator of the time of purchase.
You're more than welcome to start your own company and put up your own capital. You can take all the financial risk of ordering a fixed amount of copies which may never sell, or you can open up pre-orders and watch your sales tank. Which would you prefer?
EDIT: Do people consider the store itself to be the problem, or is it just frustration of getting beat to the punch? I am curious what the flaws are considered to be. I would not consider demand one such flaw.
Same here. Also which product did you purchase? I think there was an issue with the bundle, however the vanilla version was on sale for a couple of minutes.
I would imagine for most, it's a mix of a bad storefront and having demand well above supply. If you run into a single issue during checkout, you can basically kiss your chance of getting a copy of the more in-demand games goodbye.
Like it or not, scalpers, low prints and high aftermarket values drives demand enormously. Having pre-orders would make the sales crash, guaranteed. Of course there is a problem if the items sells out in seconds but it is still a one-time event. Let's hope it can be avoided in the future but it's not easy to guess demand in advance. A lower print run than Soldner, Breach & Clear PS4, has still not sold out.
Apparently the first JP game is an RPG in September so probably not La Mulana in August.
But I'd LOVE to have La Mulana EX
I understand LRG wants to sell its games quickly, but B&C PS4 was released barely 24 hours ago. Actually, from a customer point of view : it is the ideal scenario. If I wanted to buy it right now, I wouldn't need to make a splitsecond decision lest it be sold out.
I hope they'll scale their production up in the future so this situation becomes the norm.
I understand LRG wants to sell its games quickly, but B&C PS4 was released barely 24 hours ago. Actually, from a customer point of view : it is the ideal scenario. If I wanted to buy it right now, I wouldn't need to make a splitsecond decision lest it be sold out.
I hope they'll scale their production up in the future so this situation becomes the norm.
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This sounds like the right idea and should alleviate some of the issues people were having with Soldner
Yep that's an ideal amount. But just scaling up prodcution isn't the answer, as 1000 more copies of Deadline would have been a disaster. It's difficult to hit the sweet spot.
This sounds like the right idea and should alleviate some of the issues people were having with Soldner
I've read your arguments against the preorder/subscription model, and they make total sense from a business point of view (at least in the short term) but I'm still convinced it's the worst choice for the customer in the end.
There haven't been disappointed customers with the last few releases IIRC, Söldner was just a mistake. That will happen, but less and less as time goes on. I think for the last releases (Octodad, Futuridium, Xeodrifter, Lost Sea, Deadline) practically everyone who wanted a copy was able to get one without too much trouble.Yes and no. If the quantity of games remain the same, then there will be as many disappointed customers as before, although it won't necessarily be the same people.
BUT it's still a good idea since at least everybody will be on an equal footing when F5 time comes.
This is terrible. I'd rather lose out because I was too slow than participate in a lottery. Good luck selling this idea to people that are aiming for a full collection.If a preorder system isnt ever an option, then there is one other way this could be solved in a fair way.
The lottery way - everyone who wants a copy (limited to 1) can place an order within 1 hour. If the number of orders within that timeframe exceeds the number of printed copies, they just run a script after the cutoff period that randomly picks which people will get it.
This would remove the unfairness of buyscripts, technical issues and scalpers as everyone has the same chance. You cant be angry at an algorithm for not picking you![]()
Once in a while there will be games where demand is higher than supply, I think it's very hard to avoid when you only sell limited editions. Gotta remind myself to be ready whenever the first batch goes online in the future. :-D
which also doesn't happen if the print run is big enough. Even if it happens you have enough time to try again later, clear cookies, use a different device or something. Literally all the problems are fixed if enough copies are there to last 15+ minutes at least.I don't mind the supply being lower than the demand but what's unacceptable is when the technology bugs out and prevents a fan like any of us in here from buying the game.
which also doesn't happen if the print run is big enough. Even if it happens you have enough time to try again later, clear cookies, use a different device or something. Literally all the problems are fixed if enough copies are there to last 15+ minutes at least.
Not that technical diffculties can be excused that way, but unless someone can verify what it is or how it happens (and I haven't seen reports of this bug with shopify outside LRG), it's the next best thing.
What about a pre-order or made-to-demand system with limited "purchase" windows, like two fifteen-minute batches several months in advance? They would enforce small quantities in their own right and offers data that could be used in communicating with the developers over the actual amount that could be pressed. If the developer ultimately demands a smaller run that falls underneath the demand, all initial orders could be fulfilled in a "first come, first serve" basis with everything else being cancelled with an e-mail informing the customer of their purchase falling outside of the batch limitation set by request of the actual game designers. On the other side of the spectrum, LRG and the respective developer agree to match the amount of orders with discretion over adding a few extra copies for contingency (damaged returns, giveaways, etc.). I know most of these suggestions are feeble efforts to get our toes inside the closing floodgates, but I do wish there was less tension when making these purchases. I doubt we'll ever completely remove scalpers from the situation yet, as someone who has thankfully been successful on all order attempts thus far, I do dread the thought of having to turn toward the second-hand market when I'd prefer to support LRG directly as a publisher. Although we aren't quite at this tipping point right now, but I do have worries over small runs being unable to balance out with an increasing user base over an extended period in the future. I believe scripts cutting into stock before an item goes live and other ordering snafus will continue to be an issue as long as the current course is maintained.Imagine a pre-order period (from opening orders until the product ships) takes two months, 3-4 releases per month. That would mean >20000 open orders for months at the same time and that's not even factoring in delays which always happen. And if you worked in retail, you know customers are the worst people in the world. Imagine the customer service nightmare that would be and how much time and money would have to be sacrificed that could instead be spent on new projects and other cool stuff.
I'm repeating myself, but as soon as there is enough data to anticipate demand (we're already there for the most part, Sölder was an exception) and make print runs big enough, most of the growing pains will be gone. A game being available for a few hours on avarage isn't a race, everyone will get what they want. That games sell out in seconds isn't an ideal scenario for anyone, neither for us, the devs or for LRG. So it's guaranteed that they will adjust.
In very rare cases people will miss out because of a wrong prediction of demand, but even then, missing out on a game and spending a few $ more on the aftermarket is not the end of the world. There is no need to have pre-orders open for a longer time and accept all the drawbacks that come with them for us and LRG just because of that.
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I think people are too quick to demand big changes just because one thing went wrong. The last few months before Söldner were fine. We've already seen IMMENSE improvements in every area. Give it more time.
You're more than welcome to start your own company and put up your own capital.
Its high time this shit gets stopped. This is not a fanpage for circlejerking. It's a discussion about a peculiar online shop and a business model that for Soldner collapsed into a raffle. People have legitimate and polite complaints, and noone has the need for your permission or that of Any other to raise them. If it was so, one could stop Any discussion on Any game just by "if you dont like it them code your own".
IT: I was there both times the very second stuff went online, didn't even manage to get to the check-out. Great job guys.
In my opinion the most convenient solution for the customer isn't the best here. I still see this project as something that we, the fans, are in with LRG together, so we have to compromise and find solutions that work for everyone.
I think people are too quick to demand big changes just because one thing went wrong. The last few months before Söldner were fine. We've already seen IMMENSE improvements in every area. Give it more time.
There haven't been disappointed customers with the last few releases IIRC, Söldner was just a mistake. That will happen, but less and less as time goes on. I think for the last releases (Octodad, Futuridium, Xeodrifter, Lost Sea, Deadline) practically everyone who wanted a copy was able to get one without too much trouble.
Imagine a pre-order period (from opening orders until the product ships) takes two months, 3-4 releases per month. That would mean >20000 open orders for months at the same time and that's not even factoring in delays which always happen. And if you worked in retail, you know customers are the worst people in the world. Imagine the customer service nightmare that would be and how much time and money would have to be sacrificed that could instead be spent on new projects and other cool stuff.
What about a pre-order or made-to-demand system with limited "purchase" windows, like two fifteen-minute batches several months in advance? They would enforce small quantities in their own right and offers data that could be used in communicating with the developers over the actual amount that could be pressed.
Were there 3200 copies of both the Soldner soundtrack bundle and the standalone game, so 6400 total, or 3200 between the two?
Well, this particular (or is peculiar?) online shop is based on a business model that allows them to sell the most copies because they negotiate up-front deals to release these games. This is a huge financial risk in that one serious miscalculation can break the bank.
I am tired of pricks like you and others in this thread being so dismissive of the challenges that LRG must face trying to run this company, taking care of all the crazy shipping customs snafus, negotiating deals, the finances, etc. These guys provide a great and unique service, so I think we should give these guys the benefit of the doubt instead of having what you call "polite" discussion calling LRG irresponsible or throwing tantrums like a 4-year-old. You bring nothing new or interesting to the conversation.
Like I said before, if the store is a problem, then it can, in theory, be fixed since this is just technology. I have never experienced any problems, and I doubt most people have had any issues either. If the demand is high, you might miss out.
Well, this particular (or is peculiar?) online shop is based on a business model that allows them to sell the most copies because they negotiate up-front deals to release these games. This is a huge financial risk in that one serious miscalculation can break the bank.
I am tired of pricks like you and others in this thread being so dismissive of the challenges that LRG must face trying to run this company, taking care of all the crazy shipping customs snafus, negotiating deals, the finances, etc. These guys provide a great and unique service, so I think we should give these guys the benefit of the doubt instead of having what you call "polite" discussion calling LRG irresponsible or throwing tantrums like a 4-year-old. You bring nothing new or interesting to the conversation.
Like I said before, if the store is a problem, then it can, in theory, be fixed since this is just technology. I have never experienced any problems, and I doubt most people have had any issues either. If the demand is high, you might miss out.
I wanted a bundle, and now I'll have an incomplete collection forever because the bundle was NOT up simultaneously and that cost me a split second to get a solo version. Been posting here since day one, too. Right there on the very first page.
If you guys really see zero issues with this, I don't even want to be part of this thread's community anymore.
Zero empathy, Jesus christ.