I recall failing on the N64 because I kept slamming into rings trying to reorient myself.
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Majora's Mask 3D |OT| Remakes are a Nice Thing to Have Heh, heh
- Thread starter Kriken
- Start date
TheMoon
Member
Yup that sounds familiar.
Immediately after I made that post I'd sussed it haha. I think I just wasn't thinking straight, forgot it was even there. Stumbled upon it by accident and it all came flooding back...
I completely 100% the game just now, beat the final boss and got all heart pieces and masks. God, what an awesome game. I'm super glad I got to finally play through this game and not only do that but get everything, which is a rarity for me in most games. I felt really motivated to do it for this game, though, because... of the characters. I wanted to see the scenes and, of course, get the mask(s).
Final boss is too easy with FD Mask but there's no reason not to use it if you 100% -- it's your reward for doing it after all lol.
Not sure if I'll have the desire to replay it again for awhile. 100% generally means I won't probably play it again for quite some time. But awesome game regardless, took me a whole month to do this (there were breaks in between obviously).
I really hope someday we get another game like this one, or even another Zelda that at least features Majora again. Such a great villain, there's so much mystery behind it and it's awesome because of that.
Final boss is too easy with FD Mask but there's no reason not to use it if you 100% -- it's your reward for doing it after all lol.
Not sure if I'll have the desire to replay it again for awhile. 100% generally means I won't probably play it again for quite some time. But awesome game regardless, took me a whole month to do this (there were breaks in between obviously).
I really hope someday we get another game like this one, or even another Zelda that at least features Majora again. Such a great villain, there's so much mystery behind it and it's awesome because of that.
Zora: just follow the fish....and hope you're good at jumping out of the water.(My God it's time consuming with those switches)
Goron: land on one of those eyes and you're always stand staright on the path after screwing up. After bouncing off the first set of chests, it's on auto pilot for a bit before you have to steer yourself.
Goron: land on one of those eyes and you're always stand staright on the path after screwing up. After bouncing off the first set of chests, it's on auto pilot for a bit before you have to steer yourself.
Silent_Ocarina
Member
I did those last night. I thought they were quite frustrating. I finished the game, though. The only thing I have left to do is get all the fish. I haven't really fished at all. I have to admit, I was pretty sad when the Bombers stopped running to me.
The Zora speed when holding R is the same as before, so the beaver race isn't really different aside from having to swerve to hit the pots now.
It'd be interesting to time how long it takes to swim across the bay using both speeds to see the difference, but the problem with the new swimming isn't the speed alone. Even if the speed was identical, the slow swim is way less graceful and fun to control; swimming in the original was almost like piloting an arwing.
The new swimming is just typically boring and clumsy video game swimming. You can't make those tight spiraling turns nor can you dive out like a dolphin. All the little flourishes that made the Zora swim a great mechanic are neutered.
John Kowalski
Banned
Yikes, took me two whole days to understand the Zora dungeon >_> i just tried to find all the fairies and now i'm gonna reset time and do it all again. My brain just borked with all the water stuff. And even though i now know what to do i still don't really understand what is actually happening.
Lol i feel you friend.
Lol i feel you friend.
That dungeon's pretty confusing with all the pipes and shit, and the boss is pretty hard. IN the first room, search underwater.
an advice: If you feel you don't advance in the temple, just save at the beginning room. try things out till you find the way (or whatever). Restart the game and load your file.
I did this a couple of times when I was in the middle of a temple or when I searched for the fairys at the same time ^^
Before that, actually. As soon as you hit top speed, you can let go of the stick.
ShadowOwl
Member
I have to admit, I didn't enjoy the water temple at all. The constant backtracking there felt incredible annoying as you could lose orientation very quickly. The OoT water temple was such a joy compared to that.
Oh, and the
was one of the worst quests I ever had to do in any Zelda game.
Oh, and the
beaver race(s)
Shuggananas
Banned
Übermatik;156041782 said:
uh.. it's not that hard or long I feel like
graveyard > captain's hat
song of storms
gibdo mask
do the fucking pit (longest and most boring part), get mirror shield
do ikana castle
climb stone tower
song of storms
gibdo mask
do the fucking pit (longest and most boring part), get mirror shield
do ikana castle
climb stone tower
So yeah it's a bit longer than the swamp and mountain but as long and less tedious than the great bay section imo. fuck the swimming section before pinnacle rock
Another 15 tries with the
Walking away again before I throw my 3DS against the wall. Seriously soured right now.
Zora final dungeon. Still can't make the last jump, always flub it up because it's shorter than the rest and the rhythm is different. I got the heart, no problem.
Walking away again before I throw my 3DS against the wall. Seriously soured right now.
Did you get Chateau Romani so you don't have to worry about magic? That might make it slightly less annoying.
Green Mamba
Member
I appreciate a lot of the changes in this version but there are a lot of changes that just make me shake my head. I think the game would have been better served following OOT3D's example of not fixing what wasn't broken. There's a lot I like, but too much I don't like that prevents it from being the definitive version it should be.
The swimming is absolutely borked, good lord.
The swimming is absolutely borked, good lord.
Chuckie
Member
That took me a long time too.
Professor Beef
Banned
Just got done 100%'ing it after putting it off for a while now. Skull Kid, you lovable scamp.
Barrow Roll
Member
This is such hyperbolic nonsense, at least you acknowledge you're having a hissy fit. Two changes you don't like undermine everything? Come on.
I'll take the 3DS version for the better framerate alone, dips with 3D on notwithstanding.
Heavy's Sandvich
Member
Does finding the frogs for the thingy reset?
Inferno313
Banned
Finished this last night, with the fierce diety mask. I wouldn't say it's beaten out Wind Waker as my favorite 3D Zelda, but it's right up there with Ocarina for second place.
I'm a huge Zelda fan and this was one of the few titles that I've played but never beaten, so finally getting around to it now was a great experience. I'm kind of glad it took me so long though, I think the darker themes and permeating feeling of sadness affected me much more as an adult than they would've as a 9 year old.
Between this and the fact that I finally picked up Hyrule Warriors this week, my Zelda fandom is at a high. I've played a significant amount of every game, but I've yet to beat 4 of them. Zelda 1, 2, Link's Awakening, and Oracle of Seasons. I think I'm going to try to beat those four before Zelda U comes out.
I have mixed feelings on beating the game with the fierce diety for the first time. I honestly have no idea what any of Majora's attacks were, as I killed all three forms practically instantly.
I guess the challenges given by the creepy mask kids to get the mask were the trade-off, those were more frustrating than any Zelda boss I've fought.
I'm a huge Zelda fan and this was one of the few titles that I've played but never beaten, so finally getting around to it now was a great experience. I'm kind of glad it took me so long though, I think the darker themes and permeating feeling of sadness affected me much more as an adult than they would've as a 9 year old.
Between this and the fact that I finally picked up Hyrule Warriors this week, my Zelda fandom is at a high. I've played a significant amount of every game, but I've yet to beat 4 of them. Zelda 1, 2, Link's Awakening, and Oracle of Seasons. I think I'm going to try to beat those four before Zelda U comes out.
I have mixed feelings on beating the game with the fierce diety for the first time. I honestly have no idea what any of Majora's attacks were, as I killed all three forms practically instantly.
I guess the challenges given by the creepy mask kids to get the mask were the trade-off, those were more frustrating than any Zelda boss I've fought.
Shuggananas
Banned
Yeah but it's pretty quick to do, like 15 minutes
get the one in clock town (1 minute)
get the one in swamp (1 minute)
beat mini boss in woodfall (5 minutes)
beat mini boss in great bay temple (5 minutes)
beat goht (5 minutes)
get the one in swamp (1 minute)
beat mini boss in woodfall (5 minutes)
beat mini boss in great bay temple (5 minutes)
beat goht (5 minutes)
I found the Zora swimming to be bearable but only just. I know I've asked before but can someone remind me what was changed besides Magic use for fast swim?
From the comments it seems like it's a complete overhaul....
Anyway finished the game. It's good. It's laid out really well and I appreciate the design. I like having to explore and learn. Reaching a pre dungeon area with ABCD to do and having to explore all before figuring C is what you're supposed to do first which unlocks B then AD fall into place beats just "do A, now do B, now do C and D." And EF as side quests thrown in are just great ways to keep you involved and figuring stuff out.
The game is long though, it was like 40 hours for me and I didn't get everything, far from it. Maybe I'll go back and find everything. Need a break though because it did feel slightly chore-y by the end.
Picked up Shantae on special and while that looks good, the gameplay and level layout feels so pedestrian by comparison. There's no character to the levels and encounters.
From the comments it seems like it's a complete overhaul....
Anyway finished the game. It's good. It's laid out really well and I appreciate the design. I like having to explore and learn. Reaching a pre dungeon area with ABCD to do and having to explore all before figuring C is what you're supposed to do first which unlocks B then AD fall into place beats just "do A, now do B, now do C and D." And EF as side quests thrown in are just great ways to keep you involved and figuring stuff out.
The game is long though, it was like 40 hours for me and I didn't get everything, far from it. Maybe I'll go back and find everything. Need a break though because it did feel slightly chore-y by the end.
Picked up Shantae on special and while that looks good, the gameplay and level layout feels so pedestrian by comparison. There's no character to the levels and encounters.
The swimming used to be like the magic version. The slower normal swim didn't exist at all.
Really? Hmm.
And what about goron link? That seems the same to me. I guess it makes sense to have the fast swimming as an "extra". For the most part it didn't bother me so long as magic is plentiful. No pots in pirate bay is kind of weird though.
Overall I'm not sure I remember enough of how the original is to care about the changes, all I know is that the Zora controls and camera are kind of infuriating.
Like in the race, hitting a wall will stop you dead AND flip you 180, thus you can't just head off again.
I wonder if c-stick controls change that feeling though.
Professor Beef
Banned
Goron Link is mostly the same. They sped up his BBB attack combo, and you don't have to hold A anymore to stay rolled up.
In the original, you had to hold A to roll.I preferred it that way.
Wait, it's not like this now? Lol I'm not really paying attention... I think I'm holding A now. Maybe I'm not. Lol.
You press A once to roll and stay in the rolled position. I preferred having to hold A, gave you greater control and it's what I was used to. Seeing it changed in the 3DS version gave me a bit of a headache as a result.
It's reasonable to say a few bad changes can undermine an experience. Look at the Star Wars films. The special editions have hundreds of improvements like matte painting replacements and effects touch ups that do make them better, but it doesn't count for anything when one CGI dance sequence derails the whole film.
MM3D is a good game and I'm glad so many people are playing it, but it's not the definitive remake that OoT3D was. OoT3D was respectfully remade as if the original game was a masterpeice that had to be faithfully recreated, but Majora's Mask 3D plays as if it were made by people who didn't like a lot about the original game.
The interviews make it clear that Aonuma himself was embarrassed by the original, and some of the staff members never even completed it. Instead of preserving the way the original game played, they actively went out of their way to change it, and the results were often for the worse.
Your experience may have been better but I kept running into frustrating moments due to the changes that made me wish I were playing the original instead. Most of the improvements in MM3D are very small little convenience tweaks that I can easily live without. The visuals are the only improvement I'd have a hard time giving up, but the original hasn't aged nearly as badly as OoT did.
I never finished MM on the N64 and coming in "fresh" and I do not have any problems with the swimming mechanic.
I think that since you can effectively negate the magic consumption issue by consuming a bottle of Chateau Romani the complaint is even more diminished.
I even understand the rationale for making saving easier since your battery running out while your system is closed is a horrible fate indeed.
If I were able to offer the team a suggestion it would be to allow you to assign masks to the d-pad.
I think that since you can effectively negate the magic consumption issue by consuming a bottle of Chateau Romani the complaint is even more diminished.
I even understand the rationale for making saving easier since your battery running out while your system is closed is a horrible fate indeed.
If I were able to offer the team a suggestion it would be to allow you to assign masks to the d-pad.
TheMoon
Member
the new saving was validated instantly as I played it on the train the day it came out and had to close the game in order to check in with the nintendo zone I was at. all the complaints from the save whiners instantly go to my mental trash bin.
I don't see why you'd complain about the optional new save system. If you want to relive 'the thrill' of the original, then only save right after you return to dawn of the first day. I mean, I know these people will always exists.. like people who complained about the option to play Casual mode in Fire Emblem Awakening.. even though it's just about making the game more accessible. But I'll never understand complaining about it.
This is well said and I agree with pretty much all of it.
However, I'd say that some of the graphical updates also rubbed me the wrong way. I really dislike it when remastered/remade games change colors around, and MM3D is guilty of this at parts. A lot of devs don't seem to realize that color plays a huge role with how something you experienced made you feel, so as a result, some of the minor color/design changes end up changing the "feel" of the game.
The original swimming mechanics had this massive kick-off motion to start the swim that routinely meant banging into walls. It was basically an underwater roll.
You can see it in the original GameXplain video that kicked off the swimming change panic: https://youtu.be/vmous633Sx0?t=23s
Caved in and bought it this weekend even though I was planning to wait (replayed the original not that long ago). There's just nothing with quite the same feel. Played three temples so far.
I don't approve of some of the boss changes though. Hitting-the-weak-spot-while-the-boss-is-incapacitated is one of my least favourite aspects of modern Zeldas, it's basically the gameplay version of kicking someone when they're down, and it's not very interesting from a gameplay mechanic perspective and doesn't feel very good thematically. GOHT was probably my favourite 3D zelda boss of all time; and the giant eyeball thingy just made it feel cheaper.
I don't approve of some of the boss changes though. Hitting-the-weak-spot-while-the-boss-is-incapacitated is one of my least favourite aspects of modern Zeldas, it's basically the gameplay version of kicking someone when they're down, and it's not very interesting from a gameplay mechanic perspective and doesn't feel very good thematically. GOHT was probably my favourite 3D zelda boss of all time; and the giant eyeball thingy just made it feel cheaper.
You could have done this just as easily in the original game, using an owl statue in the exact same way. Although in the original you would have the added benefit of being able to save anywhere, anytime using the song of time without having to even warp to a statue. The new system has no benefit the original didn't other than adding extra statues.
I like the new saving ability, but I would like to end the sessions with the song of time. Saving at a statue right afterward isn't the same thing. It was the action of playing the song and seeing the cycle restart, knowing that your progress was being saved, that made it satisfying. I tried saving at the start of each new cycle and it just didn't have the same impact. You can condescend and say that I'm nitpicking if you want, but that's how I enjoyed the game.
I wouldn't expect you to have a problem if you didn't know what you were missing. You'll probably feel like you're superpowered if you play Great Bay in the original.
Part of the problem is that Great Bay is a boring space when slow swimming. It was fun and memorable because of the action that took place there- the swimming- not the environment itself. It was designed as a wide expanse to serve as a sort of playground for the fast swimming mechanic. That space is a lot more tedious to get across without the mechanic it was designed around.
Chateau Romani unbalances the difficulty by giving you unlimited magic everywhere, which I don't want when I'm not underwater. It also doesn't change the fact that the electric shield gets really annoying when swimming long distances.
It also requires you to have romani's mask, to wait until a substantial portion of the 3 day cycle is over, and spend 200 rupees every single time you start a new cycle in Great Bay. The amount of time you'd spend doing all this outweighs the amount of time you'd save by fast swimming, and it'd put a dent in your savings for the banker heart piece.
I understand that some people want to defend this remake no matter what, but this was a stupid change. There was a need to make the swimming more flexible indoors, but it didn't require wrecking what seem to be the only good swimming controls in the history of gaming.
They just had to toggle the speeds. That's it. There would be no problem with the new swimming at all if they had done this.
Come, now. No need for that.
TheGreatLugia
Banned
I just finished the game earlier today. Majora's Mask was the only 3D Zelda game I never played since I figured it would eventually get a remake. I'm glad I waited since I really enjoyed it. I wasn't sure how much I would like it going in, but I had a lot more fun with it than I expected to.
It should be uncontroversial to say that the game would be better with the option to save with the song of time so that everyone can play how they like, yet any time it's mentioned there's a string of "anyone who wants the old saving is an idiot" type posts, as if it would be detrimental to anyone's experience if the choice were available.
It should also be uncontroversial to say that the zora swimming was poorly implemented considering that the majority of fans have been disappointed by the change. Swimming was obviously a fun part of the game to a lot of people, otherwise it wouldn't be such an issue. Even if you like the change, you should appreciate that it wasn't the right way to alter a mechanic that people really liked. A remake should enhance the things people liked about a game, not remove them.
Yet here we are... arguing about it. Why not just admit that maybe these changes weren't handled well, even if you personally aren't bothered by them?
You can't if you intend to lock in your progress even once in the entire playthrough. My problem isn't that the save statues are there, it's that the song of time save isn't. It was a much cleaner and more satisfying way to wrap up a play session than the statues.
I think I agree fully, playing the song of time is a nice break and offering save then wouldn't really break any flow. Though I stand by that adding more options with a handheld system is a good thing.
It seems you agree that the old mechanic didn't work well in the dungeon and the Gameexplain video posted highlights why it worked really poorly there. That kind of control failure rarely happens in a Nintendo game and yet, there it was with the original swimming mechanic.
So it seems the loss is really only during the bay and Pirates Fortress portions. Still, the original mechanic is available, and while I would agree that it eats magic, you can negate that with an in game mechanic. If MM was a throwback to Nintendo Hard, does this change really represent a big diminishment?
All that said, I think I would increase the base swimming speed by maybe 1.25 to 1.5 times as it is a little slow, but controls well enough.
If you aren't bothered, it is rather hard for many to see the issue. I really don't see it as an issue as I just finished that section with no problems using the magic boost to clear long distances, the beaver race, ect and the slower swimming when more control was needed.
If Nintendo ever gets around to releasing N64 VC on the Wii U I may have to give it a go.
I just needed a few magic jars added around the ocean floor and would have been fine. I didnt like that there was no way to recharge magic without going back and buying potions.
I also don't understand why it doesnt just save when you play the song of time. I needed the extra save points because the 3ds makes you close the app to check your streetpasses and stuff but it should have auto saved when you play the song. That would be true to the orignal and be more intuitive and accessable having an autosave.
Meanwhile I love the remake and I have to finish off the last temple and the game before im distracted by too many other games.
I also don't understand why it doesnt just save when you play the song of time. I needed the extra save points because the 3ds makes you close the app to check your streetpasses and stuff but it should have auto saved when you play the song. That would be true to the orignal and be more intuitive and accessable having an autosave.
Meanwhile I love the remake and I have to finish off the last temple and the game before im distracted by too many other games.
Heavy's Sandvich
Member
Appreciate it, just got the mask and was trying to be as keen as possible.
Hadn't even seen the others, not even got to the second temple.
Green Mamba
Member
The new Gyorg fight, specifically the second phase, is straight up terrible. In a game where you're on a time table, what the hell possessed them to make the fight nearly twice as long and janky as hell?