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Man sentenced for stabbing date 119 times after learning she was trans
- Thread starter badboy78660
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wait, what? It's a completely different scenario. Disclose that I am cisgender to whom, a trans person? If I was homosexual and went out on a date with someone that's transgender, and didn't disclose until after having sex that I am gay while my date was under the impression that I am a straight male, she would have every right to be just as offended. I think that's the scenario you're trying to paint, right?
While I consider a trans woman a woman and not a man that's trying to pass off as a woman, not everyone sees it that way. It sucks, but it's how it is. Legally, it could fall under rape by deception. Just as the scenario that I described earlier would, too, I think.
hodayathink
Member
If the person you're having sex with is specifically only attracted to transgendered people, then possibly? I mean, we don't even know if this does count as rape by deception, but if one does count, then I don't see why, legally, the other doesn't as well.
Matrix XII
Member
What a tragedy. What a psychotic person.
Masculine fragility is unbounded. Sickening and toxic.
Rip to the victim
Masculine fragility is unbounded. Sickening and toxic.
Rip to the victim
Alexander DeLarge
Member
When you turn someone's face into something that resembles ground meat rather than a person, I think you're beyond rehabilitation. Think about what 119 stab wounds looks like.
I would think that someone who was only attracted to transgendered people would need to establish that upfront, right? They wouldn't assume a person is transgendered. So that would probably not be categorized as deception, but rather flat-out lying.
Care strongly enough to brutally and fatally stab them 119 times right? Digest on what you just typed out and think a bit deeper because there is a muuch bigger underlying issue at play here.
You're really going to bring up this bullshit?
It certainly isn't the world we live in now. But it should be. My point is that queers have to censor and change themselves just to tread water. That's fucked up, and every time I see someone say "they should have known" I want to die because all I hear is "they should be someone else."
No one can be someone else.
There are a lot of factors potential partners can care about. For example, I don't wanna fuck with a Tea Party supporter. If I find out someone is, I am fairly certain I won't stab them a hundred times.
Casual bigots are writing this shit off like "Oh, this is more serious than just a straight person lying."
Dark Cloud
Member
I don't think I've ever heard of someone being stabbed 119 times and I watch a lot of Forensic Files. That number is was gets me. The amount of anger to stab someone 119 times...I can't even...
Hey... She should have been honest tho.
A Link to the Past
Banned
As far as justifying that trans people need to be more careful, I mean, this is certainly true. But at the exact same time, imagine going into a thread about a black victim of a police shooting. It would be rightfully upsetting to see a user discuss why that black person should have been more mindful of their actions or behaviors.
To clarify, you're referring to a particular banned user? Or are you making things up because it's easier than being intellectually honest?
Who cares? On one hand, he may get out before he dies. On the other hand, people are venting about a horrible person doing a horrible thing.
To clarify, you're referring to a particular banned user? Or are you making things up because it's easier than being intellectually honest?
Who cares? On one hand, he may get out before he dies. On the other hand, people are venting about a horrible person doing a horrible thing.
tearsintherain
Member
Its pretty interesting that he was charged with a capital murder, aka first degree. That is usually considered in the case of premeditation, but it can also be applied if the prosecutor feels the defendant acted with malice. I'd say stabbing someone 119 times definitely counts as malice.
The guy only got 40 years (20 with parole if good behavior, not sure the second charge of robbery though) because he plead guilty and took a deal, if it went to trial he would have faced the death penalty on first degree murder. This is probably not a case to put towards a jury for the prosecutor, since he is being charged with first degree murder the defense would take the tack that what he is really guilty of is second degree murder ("he snapped and went insane") and if even one jury member felt thats a reasonable defense he would walk free. Its a tough call for a prosecutor to bring up both first and second charges or just present first and force the jury to pick guilty or innocent.
Story is pretty bizarre, how could they talk for months online and it never come up. No sexting, camming, etc?
The guy only got 40 years (20 with parole if good behavior, not sure the second charge of robbery though) because he plead guilty and took a deal, if it went to trial he would have faced the death penalty on first degree murder. This is probably not a case to put towards a jury for the prosecutor, since he is being charged with first degree murder the defense would take the tack that what he is really guilty of is second degree murder ("he snapped and went insane") and if even one jury member felt thats a reasonable defense he would walk free. Its a tough call for a prosecutor to bring up both first and second charges or just present first and force the jury to pick guilty or innocent.
Story is pretty bizarre, how could they talk for months online and it never come up. No sexting, camming, etc?
That poster never attacked you. Way to respond to someone that can't respond back.
That post was possibly badly worded. It was a losing battle in a forum like this one.
Doing a bit of searching, I was able to find a Cornell Law Professor's ethics blog on the topic of disclosure and coercion in sex. There really isn't a conclusion, the blog just more eloquently presents arguments for each side.
https://verdict.justia.com/2015/06/18/is-there-a-moral-duty-to-disclose-that-youre-transgender-to-a-potential-partner
Granted, I don't know anything about this professor beyond this specific link.
https://verdict.justia.com/2015/06/18/is-there-a-moral-duty-to-disclose-that-youre-transgender-to-a-potential-partner
Granted, I don't know anything about this professor beyond this specific link.
Royce McCutcheon
Junior Member
What in the hell is a casual bigot.
If you stabbed someone for being a tea party member, you'd go to jail too.
If you stabbed someone for being a tea party member, you'd go to jail too.
What a horrific story!
I don't know if I want to have someone capable of stabbing a person they liked enough to sleep with over a 100 times in the street.
I don't know if prison is the solution, I do know I don't want that guy in normal society.
The victim could have stolen the guy's life work for all I care.
40 years is really cheap considering people can get put for life in jail for the pettiest things in the US.
Barely a year for 3 stabs, it's insane.
I don't know if I want to have someone capable of stabbing a person they liked enough to sleep with over a 100 times in the street.
I don't know if prison is the solution, I do know I don't want that guy in normal society.
The victim could have stolen the guy's life work for all I care.
40 years is really cheap considering people can get put for life in jail for the pettiest things in the US.
Barely a year for 3 stabs, it's insane.
Hey thanks for providing the link nonetheless. Reading now.
Otakumegane
Member
In regards to disclosure that could affect one or more of the partners in a physical way in the vases of an STIs or fertility I absolutely agree that the law calls that rape by deception and is a punishable offence. Same in issues related to consent.
In the cases of religion and gender related issues, nothing is actually being transmitted here that could potentially become a physical issue. At worst you offend on a personal view of morals and ethics. Now I don't believe that this is worthy of being called a crime in a court of law, but in such cases as is every case related to potentially infringing on another's views, you need to treat cases with as much transparency as one can offer, and display a willingness to disclose any and all issues.
That's as far as I can go on with this discussion related to disclosure. I'll take my leave and let the more on topic posts have more room to discuss the thread. I'll be reading that link in my spare time.
In the cases of religion and gender related issues, nothing is actually being transmitted here that could potentially become a physical issue. At worst you offend on a personal view of morals and ethics. Now I don't believe that this is worthy of being called a crime in a court of law, but in such cases as is every case related to potentially infringing on another's views, you need to treat cases with as much transparency as one can offer, and display a willingness to disclose any and all issues.
That's as far as I can go on with this discussion related to disclosure. I'll take my leave and let the more on topic posts have more room to discuss the thread. I'll be reading that link in my spare time.
A Link to the Past
Banned
Think Diet Racism. People who like to make (for instance) hot takes on racial topics.
Baki
Member
I was simply responding and commenting to the emerging sub-topic in this thread about disclosure.
I already posted my thoughts on the main topic (the horrific crime) in previous posts.
I did not, at any point, say the disclosure issue was in any way related to the crime. Please don't put words into my mouth.
The crime was horrific, and justice has been served.
I was responding and commenting on a separate sun topic.
Perhaps this is not the best thread to discuss.
Demoskinos
Member
Exactly. This is why so many trans people are goddamn terrified of letting anyone know. And I can't blame them.
This psycho needs to be locked away for life.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Jesus, what a terrible story.
Someone who half-excuses this shit with claims that "trans people are liars if they don't disclose this and they're the true criminals!" *when trans people can be potentially murdered if they disclose they're trans to someone, and their murderer used to easily get away with it*
Casual bigotry where trans people are criticized for this instead of the problem at hand.
The Supreme Court has ruled that in capitol cases the court must instruct the jury that they may find the defendant guilty on a lesser included offense. 2nd degree murder is a lesser included offense.
The prosecutor was probably worried that the jury might let him go on a temporary insanity defense or something.
Fair enough. Sorry if I was presumptuous in my comments. I am pretty fired up about this right now. Open to future discussions outside this thread.
A fantastic read. Thank you.
Prototype Viktor
Member
how did he not get 119 years instead of 40 and get out when he's in his 60's
LinkAndEpona
Banned
He deserves life for what he did, wow.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
Horrific story. Absolutely NO ONE should ever have to be stabbed 119 times and die a horrible death after having sex. This has got me thinking about relationship dynamics between cis-genders vs. transgendered people. When a man and a woman get together, there's no requirement to disclose genders because both parties assume that when it comes time to be intimate, that the other will have the opposite genitalia. I'm not transgendered, but I wonder if that's what trans people are aiming for too, that it shouldn't be necessary to disclose because if you identify as a certain gender that the person that likes you is attracted to, and that person likes you, then what does it matter what's between their legs? (If I'm misunderstanding, feel free to pick apart my points) It's just difficult because sexuality being what it is and people having different tastes means there will always be clashes (some very traditional either because of sexual attraction to the opposite genitalia, religion, and/or feeling less masculine if you have sex with same gender people).
Y'know, that would've been a most appropriate sentence. A year per stab.
Tinfoilhatsron
Banned
You probably won't have people in that thread going 'But you should've let the killer know you're a Tea Party member in the first place.'
Seriously what a psycho though, holy shit.
Royce McCutcheon
Junior Member
Wether or not we wanna believe It, there are levels to this. The world is not fair.
Salty Rice
Member
What a psycho. Its nice to see he doesnt get away with this horrible act.
His life is over.
His life is over.
excelsiorlef
Member
And I guess trans folk just get to carry all of the unfair weight eh?
A Link to the Past
Banned
Why not try and reinforce the idea that all cis people should indicate whether they are okay with sexual relations with a trans person?
guys can have a really tough go of things when they find out they got their dick sucked by a vulnerable innocent person who happens to have a Y chromosome
boys will be boys
you have to communicate
she was basically asking to get stabbed over a hundred times
Huh? Not trying to reason the amount just asking if it is literally 119 separate wounds since that is far beyond "moment of rage" levels.
Laughing Banana
Weeping Pickle
Is the whole "transgender folks should properly explain their situation to their potential partner" talk really the right thing to do in here? 'Cos really it feels like "Well she should have been more clear about her being a transgender so that the man would not stab her" 
Icyflamez96
Member
My god. I don't even know how one could keep that up for that long.
EASTC0AST_GH05T
Member
Totally missed the point of my post lol wow and I am not going to explain it since its off topic anyways.
Why should trans people confirm to an unfair situation? Maybe the onus is on everyone to foster an environment that doesn't have them fearing for their lives every time they go on a date.
i didn't mean to disparage your question, your comment of ”seems sociopathic" just triggered my frustration that there are probably an uncomfortable number of straight/cis men who would respond to this scenario with violence who wouldn't normally be labelled sociopaths
i believe that yes, they were able to deduce the actual number of times the victim was stabbed
A Link to the Past
Banned
Is the whole "transgender folks should properly explain their situation to their potential partner" talk really the right thing to do in here? 'Cos really it feels like "Well she should have been more clear about her being a transgender so that the man would not stab her"
That's my take, yeah. It's one thing to talk about how unfair it is that trans people have to be mindful of this. It's a whole 'nother thing when you're actively encouraging it by criticizing a victim. Like I said, we do not see this kind of victim blaming - at least not permissibly - for other protected classes. A woman is raped, anyone who blames her for her outfit or for being in a bad part of town gets a grey name. A black person is unjustly killed by police while running, the only people who criticize the person for running has a grey name. All I want to see is some consistency, you know? Not to say that mods are turning a blind eye, but I'm seeing some posts where, if certain details were flipped, I don't think would be as permissible as they are.
tl;dr Finger waving at a victim of a horrible hate crime is pretty darn victim blamey.
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