eot
Banned
lol, the article doesn't corroborate the tweet at all
Stop with this nonsense or do like the Chinese and self-quarantine yourselves (in a separate thread)
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Mask Efficacy |OT| Wuhan!! Got You All In Check
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lol, the article doesn't corroborate the tweet at all
Stop with this nonsense or do like the Chinese and self-quarantine yourselves (in a separate thread)
Slings and Arrows
Banned
Weapons testing. All these OTT drills are just that; to see the response times of what would happen during the busiest time of the year, if a major outbreak of an uncontrollable contaminant.
We (the UK) saw the a similar thing with the Heathrow/Gatwick drone over Xmas. People said it wasn't a weapons test/drill because "Why would they do it at the busiest time of the year when it would affect the most people?". That's precisely why.
It's also the reason not to panic, because this is a drill.
If this really was something to worry about, the % of fatalities would be much higher and the Chinese government wouldn't be spouting off on social/traditional media.
Alebrije
Gold Member
Ma-Yuan
Member
I don't think this is it. Why damage ur economy most likely to a point where it doesn't grow for a drill? A drill that affects a population bigger then most European countries... Also damaging the reputation of the cpc and government in a way that's dangerous for their own good. Nope really can't see that.
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infinitys_7th
Member
So Canadian officials will not talk about why a Chinese agent, with a speciality in a similar coronavirus and developing vaccines, was removed from her position in an infectious disease research facility because of privacy reasons, but also because China has Canada by the Canuts.
Just look away, nothing to see here. I'm sure none of those students who
Slings and Arrows
Banned
To sell a vaccine to norovirus'. Imagine China having a cure for 90% of all influenza, a cure that would cost other economies 100's of billions of dollars (think of all the crap on the market from Lemsip to paracetamol to God knows what other crap people buy when they're feeling bad). China could sell this cure to high bidders for Trillions or be paid to keep it under wraps.
That's just one scenario.
Another is; drills cost money, but real attacks/outbreaks cost substantially more.
As crazy as my idea/theory sounds, this of this; If bats spread the coronavirus and it's so deadly that China has to be locked down during the busiest period of the year, why haven't we seen this response from Africa, South America or the many other places that eat bat, all over the world?
Added bonus that could be something of nothing; Auto-correct already auto-corrects a misspelling of the coronavirus.
eot
Banned
I read the article, do you have something concrete to say, rather than simply insinuating that it's 'suspicious'?
Let me guess, China plants a researcher in a Canadian laboratory so she can smuggle out hitherto undiscovered viruses back to the homeland, where they'll test them on the masses, because China is communist and they're cartoonishly evil. Is that about right?
Or how about this, China, in an attempt to catch up technologically and scientifically, conducts industrial and scientific espionage wherever they can. China didn't have a BSL-4 lab until a handful of years ago, so it's especially interesting to them. Since they are a potential national security risk, the people working in those labs (foreigners from countries with antagonistic regimes in particular) are going to be monitored, hence they'd be more likely to get caught doing suspected espionage. Furthermore, the vast majority of her research is about Ebola, despite what the news-piece said I didn't find any papers about SARS.
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Ownage
Member
Is this a resident evil image? Lolleaked image....
infinitys_7th
Member
It's just strange that the first case happened miles from a Chinese infectious disease research facility, and then you had little covered-up incidents like that regarding Chinese espionage.
I mean, it is self-evident that China is cartoonishly evil from their treatment of the Uyghurs (forcing their women to marry Party loyalists), harvesting organs from political prisoners and dissenters to give to Party loyalists, social credit system, etc.
I think developing a virus to selectively cull "unproductive" eldery Chinese is right up their alley. At least until a bat they were testing it on escapes and ends up in someone's soup.
The Chinese have been hilariously incapable of invention since their culture was ruined by Communism; their tech is always backwards unless they steal it, and even when they steal it their leadership lacks the ingenuity to utilize it. That's why their military is like 70s-80s level.
So they just developed a lab they can barely run and have no experience in managing it. Sounds like a great way for an infected bat to escape by flying through a crack in the wall of the glorious Communist construction. Maybe one of Qui's "students" was working on it?
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llien
Member
Situation looks pretty bad.
It's the strongest virus of that kind that we have faced so far.
Actually most of them are deadly: people, mostly older ones, who are already ill, routinely die from them.
However, this one is particularly strong and who knows if it can mutate into something that is worse.
This map looks quite grave, they haven't managed to contain it:, it is entire China:
It's the strongest virus of that kind that we have faced so far.
Actually most of them are deadly: people, mostly older ones, who are already ill, routinely die from them.
However, this one is particularly strong and who knows if it can mutate into something that is worse.
This map looks quite grave, they haven't managed to contain it:, it is entire China:
It is way to weak to be used as biological weapon, in my humble opinion.
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infinitys_7th
Member
Unless that is the point - make a virus that is very selectively lethal towards the elderly and that you have an effective vaccine for to give to the elderly Party officials and other comrades, and then release it around in different areas as needed to cull the elderly.
It is a very archetypal Communist solution to China's looming problem of having a generation of hundreds of millions of elderly people without adequate youth (thanks to the one child policy) to support them. China will just make epidemics that kill large swathes of those they deem "inefficient" and "unproductive".
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eot
Banned
That lab was built with support from other countries. Be honest with yourself, you have no concrete knowledge about the lab. Why are you jumping to these ridiculous conclusions?
Also, FWIW I work in a lab (not microbiology) and I've visited a lot of Chinese labs in my field, I've read many peer reviewed papers from those labs, and it's preposterous to suggest that they don't have capable people over there, many of them educated at top universities in the west.
infinitys_7th
Member
I'm sure they have people who understand it, and did not say otherwise. However, their culture has broadly stunted invention, and "official" projects like that facility are going to be controlled by Party officials. I do not believe that the Party officials are capable of making good decisions or planning or even understanding risks.
So when I hear that this disease started popping up miles from a research facility, it makes sense that there would be an accident. I expect there to be shoddy construction, containment systems, etc.
I don't trust the Chinese, as country, in the slightest, and I don't see any reason to start now.
"I'm just throwing it out there!"
But yeah, that is just a theory I developed. No evidence, of course, just putting bits of the story together along with China's typical behavior.
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llien
Member
We get those viruses annually for free, no research needed.
infinitys_7th
Member
Obviously, but having one ready and modified for improved selectivity, improved vaccine effectiveness (perhaps by artificially adding more antigens into the viral structure), longer asymptomatic period to promote spreading, etc. would be more useful to the Chinese government than relying on nature.
cryptoadam
Banned
except for babies of course
2008 Chinese milk scandal - Wikipedia
The 2008 Chinese milk scandal was a widespread food safety incident in China. The scandal involved milk and infant formula along with other food materials and components being adulterated with melamine. Of an estimated 300,000 victims in China,[1] six babies died from kidney stones and other kidney damage and an estimated 54,000 babies were hospitalized.[2][3] The chemical gives the appearance of higher protein content when added to milk, leading to protein deficiency in the formula. In a separate incident four years prior, diluted milk had resulted in 12 infant deaths from malnutrition.[4] The scandal broke on 16 July 2008, after sixteen babies in Gansu Province were diagnosed with kidney stones.[cm 1] The babies were fed infant formula produced by Shijiazhuang-based Sanlu Group. After the initial focus on Sanlu—market leader in the budget segment—government inspections revealed the problem existed to a lesser degree in products from 21 other companies, including an Arla Foods–Mengniu joint venture company known as Arla Mengniu, Yili, and Yashili.[5]
The issue raised concerns about food safety and political corruption in China, and damaged the reputation of China's food exports. At least 11 countries stopped all imports of Chinese dairy products. A number of criminal prosecutions were conducted by the Chinese government. Two people were executed, one given a suspended death penalty, three people receiving life imprisonment, two receiving 15-year jail terms,[6] and seven local government officials, as well as the Director of the Administration of Quality Supervision, Inspection and Quarantine (AQSIQ), were fired or forced to resign.[7]
Hopefully shits improved since 2008. But there is a reason why mainlanders smuggle Baby formula out of Hong Kong and there was even quota's placed on it.
Mainland Chinese, desperate for untainted baby formula, are wiping out supplies in Hong Kong
In China, infant formula is something you just don’t scrimp on. That’s partially because of a widespread reluctance to breastfeed. It’s also due to China’s remarkably toxic track record with infant formula production, most notorious of which is the 2008 melamine contamination scandal that killed...
qz.com
And that’s been terrible for Hong Kong parents. The milk formula shortage in Hong Kong first developed in December 2010. Since then, rising prices and scarcity—the latter caused by pharmacists reserving stock for mainlanders, whom they can charge more—have left them struggling to keep their infants fed.
The Hong Kong government has finally stepped into the fray. Just before Chinese New Year in early February—the most popular time for giving gifts—setting a two-can limit for mainlanders returning to China via Shenzhen, the border checkpoint. Today, that rule became permanent. It also set up a hotline for Hong Kongers to order formula from overseas manufacturers.
infinitys_7th
Member
You realize they eat whole bats in soup, right? I'd call soup with a bat in it "exotic".
And I'm sure those restaurants never pay bribes to inspectors to overlook actual hygiene issues along with the regular bribes they pay to not get shut down over trivial or invented issues. It's all on the up and up in China.
Karma Jawa
Member
Must be a nightmare for those living in Wuhan.
eot
Banned
Maybe the outbreak is related to the lab, maybe it isn't, it's obvious enough that I'm sure it'll come up. However, as of now there's nothing concrete pointing towards it. For example, it's not a new outbreak of a known virus, and there are afaik no reports of employees of the lab (or related personnel) being infected, which are the most likely people in the event of a containment failure.
In any case, how is this now concretely related to the Canada story?
The claim on twitter was that she exported pathogens to China (not supported by the story), and that her husband is a coronavirus expert (he has a single publication related to SARS). It's a load of bull. Then the implication here is that she's involved in a conspiracy to ... kill off Chinese elderly?
This is C-tier conspiracy nut "none sense". The problem conspiracy theorists have is that they think they're applying critical thinking and rational arguments, when they're actually not. What you're doing is handwaving to support a conclusion you probably believed in advance.
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infinitys_7th
Member
An escaped animal would not necessarily infect personnel in its escape.
I see that story as more of an indication of the Chinese strategy - put their agents in places where they can gather technology. I did not mention any connection to my theory that China may be making a virus designed to kill off the elderly. I started forming my theory because the very long asymptomatic/incubation period stands out as something that would be beneficial for an engineered pathogen. While their research could indirectly further that, any research on an engineered pathogen would be compartmentalized away from the "gathers" like Qui and her husband or the students they work with. All their status as spies demonstrates is that China has a specifically furtive interest in a wide range of virology and immunology topics including coronaviruses.
I did not even realize that their research that as nascent as you described; that bolsters the idea that this was an accidental release.
Why shouldn't people theorize, as long as they acknowledge that their theories are just theories? Examining possibilities and rearranging data in unconventional ways is crucial to critical thought.
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Furlong
Banned
Interesting discussion from two Westerners with close ties to China. It's book-ended with talk about the current Coronavirus situation, but the middle section is about the cultural differences in China towards basic hygiene, why every city has wet markets, traditional Chinese medicine, etc that cause these viruses to spring up there in the first place.
Taxexemption
Member
This is why you lift weights, do cardio, eat plenty of meat and vegetables, and drink alcohol gentlemen. I won't be part of the 3% or the 50% even if 100% of the planet gets this.
F
Foamy
Unconfirmed Member
China needs to forward their thinking a century in regards to hygiene and eating or they're going to be the demise of us all.
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China's president Xi Jinping warns of 'grave situation' as killer coronavirus accelerates, doctor dies and US evacuates its citizens from hotspot Wuhan after death toll jumps to 42 with 1,372 cases and 56 million on lockdown
www.dailymail.co.uk
Wuhan doctor dies nine days after contracting deadly coronavirus
Chinese President Xi Jinping spoke following an emergency government meeting to warn that the spread of the killer virus is worsening. It comes after a doctor, Liang Wudong, 62, died this morning.
Karma Jawa
Member
Looks like I picked the right week to quit bat soup.
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infinitys_7th
Member
South Korea values hygiene too, but Japan has germaphobia imbedded in its culture.
NorwayBot
Banned
SirKicksalot
Member
This but with China instead of the Soviets
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As always we have panic spreaders trying to paint this as some apocalyptic level event just like bird flu, Ebola etc. when in reality seasonal flu claims way more lives each year. Conspiracy theorists talking about purposefully released virus and population control plans. People never change. Feels like some people can't wait for world to burn and events like this is their holiday. 
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Liberty4all
Banned
It's in Toronto now https://globalnews.ca/news/6462626/coronavirus-toronto-hospital/
My spouse is a front line RN. Thankfully not at her hospital
My spouse is a front line RN. Thankfully not at her hospital
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Captain Zyrain
Member
As always we have panic spreaders trying to paint this as some apocalyptic level event just like bird flu, Ebola etc. when in reality normal flu claims more lives each year. Conspiracy theorists talking about purposefully released virus and population control plans. People never change. Feels like some people can't wait for world to burn and events like this is their holiday.
Shock sells.. And gets likes and favorites and retweets.. So it persists.
Will be curious to see how it plays out over the next week.
There is also a certain segment that seems into 'disaster porn' who can never get enough out of bad things happening in the world, for various reasons.
indigo-cyclops
Member
Slings and Arrows
Banned
How are the Hong Kong protests going?
SaturnSaturn
Member
Since the incubation period is two weeks and you have no noticable symptoms during it and thousands upon thousands of people went on vacation from Wuhan to Europe, Asia and the States there is no escaping infection in the west. Flights are still going from Wuhan, the lack of urgency from the west is startling.
Also lol at people beliving the ccp numbers, if people knew anything about the chinese you would know they are trying to save face. you can take the official number and multiply it by 10-15, at least.
Also considering that they are sending people in droves home and not testing them, baracading roads so people dont escape, banning use of cars speaks volumes, but hey at least the official "infected" statistics dont go up that much and the party saves face. Also 19 major cities with a combined population of 55 milion is on lockdown
Also lol at people beliving the ccp numbers, if people knew anything about the chinese you would know they are trying to save face. you can take the official number and multiply it by 10-15, at least.
Also considering that they are sending people in droves home and not testing them, baracading roads so people dont escape, banning use of cars speaks volumes, but hey at least the official "infected" statistics dont go up that much and the party saves face. Also 19 major cities with a combined population of 55 milion is on lockdown
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infinitys_7th
Member
A purported Wuhan nurse says that 90,000 people have been infected.
lyan
Member
This is why the number of recovered and released cases is also needed to better see the full picture, everything starts with a 0 mortality rate.
infinitys_7th
Member
Is anyone else feeling some anxiety now? Theories aside (because they are practically meaningless) we have a disease that is asymptomatic but contagious for up to two weeks popping up immediately after the biggest Chinese holiday with lots of international travel. I'm sure a few people from Wuhan went to, oh, Chinatowns in NYC and SF and LA. If you know anything about how Chinese travel in the US, a lot of ethnic Chinese take Greyhounds regularly to the different Chinatowns. So what happens if the Chinatowns become infection centers? Potentially contagious people have been in confined spaces going cross country stopping at who knows where.
I have a meeting next week with some Europeans and I am kind of freaking out. Did they go through France on the way here? Will they stop in New York and brush up on some CNY traveler who is contagious?
I have a meeting next week with some Europeans and I am kind of freaking out. Did they go through France on the way here? Will they stop in New York and brush up on some CNY traveler who is contagious?
nush
Member
Faked.
infinitys_7th
Member
How can you tell? Not questioning, just want to tell how. I'm seeing videos of doctors saying the government is hiding the real stats and of nurses breaking down and hospital corridors filled with body bags. If you can translate or tell dialect/language or something it's helpful in separating signal from noise.
nush
Member
As I said yesterday, that's store brought gear meant to look like a hazmat suit. But the big giveaway is the ceiling is too low commercial and public buldings always have higher ceilings.
Wait until you find out how many get infected by seasonal flu and how many die from it. You will probably jump into a giant condom and never leave your home.
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nush
Member
Kadayi
Banned
Do you think every hospital has enough hazmat suits on hand for a national pandemic? It could well be fake, but may well be the case they are working with what they have.
Chairman Tickles
Banned
To give an idea of the intense misinformation currently being propagated as news;
There was a video circulating with an alleged Wuhan medical worker on Weibo behind full hazard suit claiming the government was lying and that 100,000 people have been infected and dying on the streets. She tried to fake her Wuhan accent but was ousted as fraud.
She was wearing a bathing cap as part of her biohazard uniform.
Edit: Ah yes there it is, made it to this thread. Trending on Twitter of course.
There was a video circulating with an alleged Wuhan medical worker on Weibo behind full hazard suit claiming the government was lying and that 100,000 people have been infected and dying on the streets. She tried to fake her Wuhan accent but was ousted as fraud.
She was wearing a bathing cap as part of her biohazard uniform.
Edit: Ah yes there it is, made it to this thread. Trending on Twitter of course.
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infinitys_7th
Member
The flu doesn't have roughly equal amounts of dead/recovered three weeks after infection starts. The death rate is much lower.
I also get a flu shot every year and keep disinfectant around when I am out and about, and stay away from people who are noticeably sick. Can't do that with this.
nush
Member
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