Media Create Sales 12/26-01/01 It's Real Bitches
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MrAngryFace
Banned
Yes, cry for me N-fans. Aside from that, shitting yourselves and learning to print your names I dunno how you find time to play your abortion of a handheld.
Where was brand loyalty when Sony was in the lead, and then when Nintendo and Sony were neck and neck? No, the majority of brand loyalty purchases all burned out when the DS launched. This sudden and ridiculous boost in hardware sales isnt from every person in Japan suddenly turning around and saying "My GBA was great, I love Nintendo, time to get the DS." all at once for some sudden and unknown reason. It was due to a burst of varied and quality software which could not be ignored.
Thats my take anyway.
I do think the, "WHOO GO JAPAN HELL YEAH BEAT THE PSP WHOOOOO," type stuff is a bit ridiculous. Even going by the sales numbers, the PSP is doing wonderful numbers, and, if anything, it's only the weirdos saying, "FUH, HANDHELDS ARE FOR SUCKERS I'LL ENJOY EVERYTHING ON MY HDTV THANKS," that should be chastised here.
I think instead of championing the DS' marvelous numbers, people should instead be terrified by what they actually mean. While it's certainly REALLY AWESOME AND STUFF that Nintendo's doing well, they aren't doing well for actual gamers. While I like the DS and enjoy the kind of innovation the DS brings, with games like Kirby, Jump Superstars, Ouendan, Trauma Center and such, and how games like Gyakuten Saiban and Castlevania benefit from the addition of an extra screen, the DS absolutely sucks and is setting an awful trend for games as a whole.
Real-Type games are doing VERY poorly. Kirby was once heralded as a savior to DS! and rising the charts! But, since the explosion of the DS, it hasn't been seen anywhere near the rise of sales of DS games. Same with Ouendan. Slime Morimori 2 and Jump Superstars, despite the enormous sales expected, haven't made any sort of mark at all on the charts. Slime 2 is at, what, maybe 250k, when the first sold about 700k? JSS sold maybe 500k so far? These should be killer-apps, and they aren't selling nearly what they should be.
What I think is funny, is that the same people bombing on all the "URBAN THUG SIMZ" games, because they're "killing the industry" are campaining for these "non-games." They're both doing the same thing; moving the market towards demographics that don't include you, be it african-american 18-29 years of age, or homemaker women 32-45 years of age. Real games are getting shafted, terribly.
Instead of hootin' and hollerin' because Brain Training 2 sold 420k its first week, shouldn't you be lamenting the fact that actual good games have bombed completely? Stuff like Irregular Hunter X, Exit, Me & My Katamari, Ouendan, Castlevania, Pheonix Wright, Trauma Center, Ouendan and Slime 2 were completely thrashed in the sales charts. But it's a GOOD sign when Brain Training, Brain Training 2, Animal Crossing and Gentle Brain Training are dominating the sales charts? Do you people like games, or blind company alliance? Because these sales numbers are absolutely disasterous for actual gamers.
I think instead of championing the DS' marvelous numbers, people should instead be terrified by what they actually mean. While it's certainly REALLY AWESOME AND STUFF that Nintendo's doing well, they aren't doing well for actual gamers. While I like the DS and enjoy the kind of innovation the DS brings, with games like Kirby, Jump Superstars, Ouendan, Trauma Center and such, and how games like Gyakuten Saiban and Castlevania benefit from the addition of an extra screen, the DS absolutely sucks and is setting an awful trend for games as a whole.
Real-Type games are doing VERY poorly. Kirby was once heralded as a savior to DS! and rising the charts! But, since the explosion of the DS, it hasn't been seen anywhere near the rise of sales of DS games. Same with Ouendan. Slime Morimori 2 and Jump Superstars, despite the enormous sales expected, haven't made any sort of mark at all on the charts. Slime 2 is at, what, maybe 250k, when the first sold about 700k? JSS sold maybe 500k so far? These should be killer-apps, and they aren't selling nearly what they should be.
What I think is funny, is that the same people bombing on all the "URBAN THUG SIMZ" games, because they're "killing the industry" are campaining for these "non-games." They're both doing the same thing; moving the market towards demographics that don't include you, be it african-american 18-29 years of age, or homemaker women 32-45 years of age. Real games are getting shafted, terribly.
Instead of hootin' and hollerin' because Brain Training 2 sold 420k its first week, shouldn't you be lamenting the fact that actual good games have bombed completely? Stuff like Irregular Hunter X, Exit, Me & My Katamari, Ouendan, Castlevania, Pheonix Wright, Trauma Center, Ouendan and Slime 2 were completely thrashed in the sales charts. But it's a GOOD sign when Brain Training, Brain Training 2, Animal Crossing and Gentle Brain Training are dominating the sales charts? Do you people like games, or blind company alliance? Because these sales numbers are absolutely disasterous for actual gamers.
The Abominable Snowman
Member
Great PSP numbers! Hell, it even beat the PS2
The DS is just the 'it' machine in Japan, and it's cheap.
The DS is just the 'it' machine in Japan, and it's cheap.
MrAngryFace
Banned
Japan doesnt like gaming, it likes tasks.
Shhhhhhhh! MAF doesn't want to hear it, he has his angry face on right this moment.Dalamar86 said:
See this? MAF doesn't like the success of the DS for whatever reason since he's so convinced PSP is superior and decided to start trolling against the DS becuase of that. It's funny how he's complaining about fanboys yet he's becoming one him-self.
amodf said:
The funny thing is that these "non-games" are so few and far between that I don't know why people are actually thinking the market is being saturated with them in the same way that the urban thugz games have done so on the console front. Admittedly, I don't care for Brain Training or Nintendogs (I do like AC however), but I would take those (well, Brain Training) over most GTA-esque clones any day. But that's mainly cause I despise those types of games. But whatever.
MrAngryFace
Banned
Im a fan of quality gaming, and yes, I do believe in it enough to be called a Fanboy of Quality Gaming.
DS is not a part of that quality.
DS is not a part of that quality.
ThunderEmperor
Banned
MrAngryFace said:
so sound just like your avatar. Big o'l LOSER. I guess the 4 million in te us who own ds's don't know quality or the 550,000 who play mario kart onlie don't knwo quality. Sigh :lol :lol
MrAngryFace
Banned
You dont, and you never will. Its like you all exist in your own sucky little universe
BudokaiMR2
Member
Yeah I really don't see any harm with games like Brain Training and AC doing well. They might be outselling games like M&L, Castlevania. But those games still didn't bomb, see the fact that a new CS has already been announced. Plus is just means more revenue for Nintendo, so more funds for new DS games.
Also the term Non-Game makes me sad. If someone can give me a definition of game and then show me how these don't fit into that definition then they get a cookie.
Stupid trolls.
Also the term Non-Game makes me sad. If someone can give me a definition of game and then show me how these don't fit into that definition then they get a cookie.
Stupid trolls.
MrAngryFace
Banned
Yes, posting pictures of peoples faces sums up your argument quite nicely.
Ill try and make things simple for you guys. This is how I see you all:
Uwe Boll makes a movie. A few in fact. None of them good.
Uwe Boll is interviewed, asked about his movies. He rants and raves about his latest work and how perfect it is.
And for a good five minutes I stare at screens of his movies, hell, maybe even spend more time watching them, and I mentally grapple at his idea of such slop being perfection.
If only there was some way to make him see the light, but that may never be so.
This is called the Uwe Boll effect. Its in your 5th grade science workbooks. Look it up.
Ill try and make things simple for you guys. This is how I see you all:
Uwe Boll makes a movie. A few in fact. None of them good.
Uwe Boll is interviewed, asked about his movies. He rants and raves about his latest work and how perfect it is.
And for a good five minutes I stare at screens of his movies, hell, maybe even spend more time watching them, and I mentally grapple at his idea of such slop being perfection.
If only there was some way to make him see the light, but that may never be so.
This is called the Uwe Boll effect. Its in your 5th grade science workbooks. Look it up.
Oblivion said:
They're few and far between, but they're dominating the sales charts. And I really doubt they're being played by gamers deciding, "Well, it's selling well, so it must be good!"
And, also, why hating on GTA-esque clones? Do you hate on Dora the Explorer GBA games also? How about Maya the Bee, were you pissed when that came out, also? Golly, I can't believe games would target a market that doesn't include you, in fact, I'm taken aback.
Another thing is, those games, like 187 Ride or Die and even the "INCREDIBLY ANTICIPATED" 50 Cent: Bulletproof have faltered at retail. The only game of its ilk that's done well at all was True Crime: Streets of L.A., but only because it was the first; the rest of the GTA clones have faltered at retail, and rightly so. If you don't like the GTA games because of some sort of deep-seeded prejudice, fine, whatever. But, they're good games. Their clones are also bad, so it works out.
But the DS "non-games" are also the ones constantly succeeding at retail against their competition; that being, actual games. This isn't the DS succeeding and Ouedan selling even 100k, this isn't the DS succeeding while Kirby's about to break a million. It's not even the DS succeeding and a game based off a gaggle of popular franchises like JSS succeeding. This is a bunch of games like Brain Training decimating actual game sales, while quality stuff like Kingdom Hearts 2 and Ryu ga Gotoku are struggling in the market. It's also the reason game sales are going down the toilet, and I really don't think housewives are going to break open the market.
The Brain Training phenomenon in Japan is equally comparable to the way The Sims is performing in the US. These aren't good numbers for gamers. They're good numbers for marketing departments.
BudokaiMR2
Member
amodf said:
Umm...actually Japan's market has grown this year, mostly based on those games. And as I said before, Nintendo makes revenue from these Brain Training games and they are going to continue to make your "real games".
If this is good news, then forget it all.
Because this extra amount of income will totally come to fruition in the name of all that is good and holy. And make for real games, because this is just some side project, but they're not in it for the money, but, instead, in the business for making games.
Sometimes, this forum is great, but, now, I wish I could come up with stuff as brilliant as Drinky does. There's really no hope, here.
Because this extra amount of income will totally come to fruition in the name of all that is good and holy. And make for real games, because this is just some side project, but they're not in it for the money, but, instead, in the business for making games.
Sometimes, this forum is great, but, now, I wish I could come up with stuff as brilliant as Drinky does. There's really no hope, here.
amodf said:
Well, I don't really know what to say. There's a lot of other stuff that I don't like either, but nothing grinds my gears more than them GTA-esque type games. Just to clarify, I like the gameplay, I just detest the atmosphere. Everyone's got an opinion, and I'm just sharing mine.
Here's all the successful non-games we've seen in Japan so far:
Nintendogs
Brain Training
Brain Training 2
Tomagachi
I'm not gonna count AC because it's the same as The Sims. If you look at the DS's library, there's a SHITLOAD of regular games, and hardly any non-games that I can remember off the top of my head. The urban thugz games didn't stop great RPGs or platformers from coming to consoles, so I don't think you need to worry about these non-games driving away traditional ones on handhelds.
Edit: Also, you should be mad at Sony for allowing something like Sega's Brain Training for being on the PSP and selling pretty damn well.
You people are fucking crazy. Who gives a shit what people are buying in Japan :lol
I don't even care what people are buying in the US... what happened to playing games for fun?
Too bad it's all brand wars with most people who call themselves "Gamers."
In other news, does anyone have a good idea of when PS3 and Rev will come out? I've been wondering and too lazy to search.
I don't even care what people are buying in the US... what happened to playing games for fun?
Too bad it's all brand wars with most people who call themselves "Gamers."
In other news, does anyone have a good idea of when PS3 and Rev will come out? I've been wondering and too lazy to search.
amodf, are you serious? The Brain Training games are only 2800 yen and they are mostly selling to people who don't play games. I doubt their sales have anything at all to do with the poor performance of PS2 titles, and if anything, their existence improves the sale of other DS titles, thanks to the growth in the market.
Yes the market was up because these new people bought 2 or 3 games this year but will they be buying games in the future in significant numbers? That's the point in people not liking how well these games have done, it's not trickling down (at least not noticeably) to other games.BudokaiMR2 said:
MrAngryFace
Banned
spencerr is my new favorite poster
MrAngryFace
Banned
blood in the water
BudokaiMR2
Member
MAF, I love how you are pretty much the embodiment of all DS hate but can turn around and agree with what Spenceer said(which I agree with wholly, I love my DS and PSP).
Brand wars? You come into any DS thread I have seen and cause a war.
Brand wars? You come into any DS thread I have seen and cause a war.
MrAngryFace
Banned
Spencerr and I have an agreement, he doesnt respond to me and I dont troll him.
GBA SP > DS btw
GBA SP > DS btw
BudokaiMR2 said:
Yeah, all that revenue is going to support all those side projects they do. Instead of making more Brain Training games, in the interest of, FUH, "profit." Like that would ever happen.
Nintendo's a business, just like all other companies. They don't make games just because their fanbase demands them. Where are all those Punch-Out!!, Kid Icarus and F-Zero sequels? Or Pikmin? Or the oft-rumored Mario 128? Surely, it's because they're biding their time, until the market is ripe for another medieval-themed side-scroller, not because they performed poorly, and instead have optioned towards more games marketed towards the type of people that are buying Brain Training and its ilk. Because they aren't in it for the money! They're pure-hearted and sound of mind! Brilliant logic.
amodf said:
...You do realize that this argument that you're making could be said about any company with a platinum selling title.
Zelda: OoT sold 7.6 million, does that mean Nintendo only wanted to make yearly Zeldas from then on? Yeah, I think you're a tad overreacting.
norinrad21
Banned
amodf Nintendo's a business said:
BudokaiMR2
Member
Okay...so your logic is that they are going to stop making "real games" completely and focus on these "non games"?
If you had some reading comprehension you would notice that I did not say the profits would transfer. I stated that they are making profits. Then I also stated they will continue to make "real games".
If you had some reading comprehension you would notice that I did not say the profits would transfer. I stated that they are making profits. Then I also stated they will continue to make "real games".
Jonnyram said:
I do agree with the growth of market, and anything else I said was more in outburst towards blind company loyalty. It's both good and bad, in that sense.
Again, it's just like The Sims. It's a growth of market, but not towards positive actual market-growth, if that makes sense. People that are buying Brain Training aren't very likely to buy the next Generation of Chaos. They're sticking with what they've bought.
The poor performance of PS2 titles should be more closely examined, if anything, and also the poor performance of PSP titles, especially. Aside from Monster Hunter, nothing's really made any sort of dent on the charts for the PSP, and, coming from a season of constant quality releases, that news is absolutely terrible. If anything, charts have only proven the Japanese GAMERS are moving away from console games completely, and instead a new market is taking its place. And, as gamers ourselves, we should be worried because of that.
norinrad21
Banned
amodf said:
God damn Nintendo for trying different things to get Japan out of depression, damn them
BudokaiMR2
Member
There have been PS2 games selling well, namely KH2 and Rouge Galaxy.
But you also have to remember that the PS2 is at the end of it's life cycle. If you look at any generation, game sales always start dropping off at the end of a life cycle. They start off slow, climb, hit a peak, and then drop off from that.
But you also have to remember that the PS2 is at the end of it's life cycle. If you look at any generation, game sales always start dropping off at the end of a life cycle. They start off slow, climb, hit a peak, and then drop off from that.
JoshuaJSlone
Member
If Jump Superstars was a PSP game, it would be the #2 selling game on the system. Even halving its sales to get a similar ratio of game sales per hardware, it would be the #4 selling game on the system. Why is that so poor? Most Japanese PSP games have not passed 50,000, and you're saying DS is exceptionally poor for normal games?amodf said:
If we remove all sales of Brain Training and Nintendogs for argument's sake, the DS tie ratio would still be higher than PSP's.
JoshuaJSlone said:
It's not that it's doing poorly... but it's not nearly doing the millions of sales it should be. And, it also just about dropped off the map on the charts, and about the time of the DS explosion. It's just like Kirby and Wario Ware Touched! before it, it did well for a while because people were buying it with their new systems, but, of late, they've stopped. At least, in a significant amount, anyway. The fact remains: the people buying the DS aren't gamers. They're a whole new audience, and their changing the landscape of how games should be marketed.
In a positive light, it'd mean games treated in a mature manner, and given scenarios fitting a mature manner, instead of the normal shonen dreck found in every RPG since Dragon Quest. But, also, it could mean games move further away from interesting game mechanics that can be broken down and exploited towards riches and fame, and instead towards more Brain Training games for every consle. It's an extreme, but it's only based on how Japanese game sales are going. I like the DS, I really do, but... these aren't bad omens? They're expanding the market, for sure, but such a thing only alienates the rest of the crowd while encouraging development towards profitability. I'd hoot and hollar for a DS million seller... but, Brain Training 1 & 2, Simple Brain Training and Mario 64 DS? You HAVE to see something wrong with that, especially as a gamer, considering the DS's library.
BudokaiMR2
Member
amodf said:
There is one small point that you are missing. Installed User base. When Kirby came out, the user base was a lot smaller than it is now. What about Wario ware? Jump Superstars sold well and sold a lot of DS's. And about the new consumers not buying games. I don't see a solid point there. No way of backing this up. Are they more likely to buy "real games" now that they own a DS? I say yes, maybe not all of them. Let's wait and see how next years games do, in the light of this increased user base.