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[Kuwitzzer]

Metroid is a series that has been on a run for more than 3 decades. Most of the main entry games range from great to excellent, which is a legacy that many Metroid fans are proud of because not every often that a franchise can maintain such high quality consistently. Long series like these often require constant innovation and differentiation to refresh. If we look at Metroid's siblings like Mario and Zelda, we can see this "reinvention mindset" just by comparing different "main entry" Mario games or Zelda games. Mind you, reinvention does not mean total revolution or creation of new ideas that have never been tried before. Taking an idea from 30-40 years ago and adding modern touches to it is great enough.

I see that many people complain about Metroid Prime 4's pointless additions of Bike, Empty desert, and companions and just want the original MP1 experience. But for me, I want something entirely new, something more original and refreshing. That is not to say I love any of the mentioned changes but it is absolutely necessary that decades-old franchise like Metroid needs reinvention. They could have expanded on the original Metroid's non-linearity, created creative and challenging platforming sections (Tropical Freeze was peak), borrowing systematic gameplay elements from BOTW, changing the perspective to allow for more actions, or just borrow Dark Souls 1 ideas. They had done none of these things. Instead, they opted for linear and railroaded design philosophy, a bloated desert that serves to waste time only, companions that are annoying and cringey, underwhelming psychic powers (what is the point of these powers again), areas that are thematically identical to Prime 1 (basically just corridors from the look of it). The fact that Retro Studios has not made a single game since Tropical Freeze should also be a huge redflag. Spending so many years to just make a 12ish hours game is laughable.

 

[Buggy Loop]

 

[Arsic]

 

[K' Dash]

 

[Dacvak]

I'm honestly the opposite. I want Metroid Prime 1 again, but in a new environment, with new enemies, new mechanics, and new music. I think the formula in Metroid Prime 1 and 2 is essentially perfect, and I just want more of that. I don't want them to reinvent it, I don't want them to create wildly game-changing gimmicks. I just want more Metroid in its best form.

That series, in particular, does not have any competition or games that fully scratch that itch, and that's because they're not easy to make. But that doesn't mean the formula is stale.

 

[Danny Dudekisser]

Ironically, a new Metroid Prime that doesn't deviate from the formula would actually be novel these days, because nobody seems willing to make a game like Metroid Prime 1 and 2 anymore, with that level of focus and that level of trust in the player's intelligence.

I don't think changing the formula is a bad thing, but people have to understand that change, in and of itself, isn't necessarily good. There are good ways to expand upon the established design that elevate the things that make Metroid fun and unique. There are also bad ways to do it.

 

[RoboFu]

of course mp4 is no dread but it's still get glowing reviews is you read the actual review.

So dramatic you guys are and it must be a sad gaming life to down games that are actually a lot of fun like ninja gaiden 4 just because of metacritic scores that aren't even given by reputable people anymore.

 

[Katajx]

I'm actually interested in it almost solely because I have a Switch 2 and never played any of the Prime series before.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

Ironically, a new Metroid Prime that doesn't deviate from the formula would actually be novel these days, because nobody seems willing to make a game like Metroid Prime 1 and 2 anymore, with that level of focus and that level of trust in the player's intelligence.

I don't think changing the formula is a bad thing, but people have to understand that change, in and of itself, isn't necessarily good. There are good ways to expand upon the established design that elevate the things that make Metroid fun and unique. There are also bad ways to do it.

True that, which is why I did mention that they could have had gone the original Metroid way by extensively palying around with non-linearity. Instead of creating the bloated empty desert, they could focus resources on creating undergound areas, sky areas, and increasing the size of existing ares. Then, connecting these areas in various ways: elevators, a large forest, a desert that is more contained and packed, a driveway that utilizes the bike, an underwater tunnel. These ideas require efforts though.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

of course mp4 is no dread but it's still get glowing reviews is you read the actual review.

So dramatic you guys are and it must be a sad gaming life to down games that are actually a lot of fun like ninja gaiden 4 just because of metacritic scores that army even given by reputable people anymore.

I read some reviews, the game is okay enough but nothing outstanding. Some fans need to understand that the "nothing outstanding" has implication to the franchise's survival itself. This franchise is a already a neglected one, one more subpar-sales game will only move it closer to the dead franchise list. Hate Metacritic scores all you want but they can largely influence normies' purchase decisions.

 

[adamsapple]

The GAF reaction cycle in progress.

 

[Zephyranthes]

Or you could, I dunno, actually play the game when it comes out and form your own opinion?

 

[Neff]

New ideas without impacting the formula and experience of MP1 was what MP2 and MP3 were. I'm not sold on the new stuff from MP4, and I think low effort irreverent cringe quippy dialogue is something which really has no business being in Metroid, but I'll wait and see how it all comes together.

 

[semiconscious]

Or you could, I dunno, actually play the game when it comes out and form your own opinion?

as david byrne'd say, stop making sense...

 

[Kuwitzzer]

Or you could, I dunno, actually play the game when it comes out and form your own opinion?

Most of 75s-low 80s games are what they are, just average, and nothing more. It is not mere coincidence that most of the games that are considered the greatest are critically acclaimed or at least high 80s. Some cult classics were not fairly judged, but that is why: they are cult classics to begin with, and they are also rare.

 

[Generic]

Most of 75s-low 80s games are what they are, just average, and nothing more. It is not mere coincidence that most of the games that are considered the greatest are critically acclaimed or at least high 80s. Some cult classics were not fairly judged, but that is why: they are cult classics to begin with, and they are also rare.

"It is not mere coincidence that most of the games that are considered the greatest are critically acclaimed or at least high 80s"

And half of them suck.

 

[Kacho]

I read some reviews, the game is okay enough but nothing outstanding. Some fans need to understand that the "nothing outstanding" has implication to the franchise's survival itself. This franchise is a already a neglected one, one more subpar-sales game will only move it closer to the dead franchise list. Hate Metacritic scores all you want but they can largely influence normies' purchase decisions.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

"It is not mere coincidence that most of the games that are considered the greatest are critically acclaimed or at least high 80s"

And half of them suck.

So?

 

[RoboFu]

"It is not mere coincidence that most of the games that are considered the greatest are critically acclaimed or at least high 80s"

And half of them suck.

Yeah but a lot of those high scoring great games were in a different time where reviews were done by a select few and those gaming mags and sites were way more influential and serious than where the reviews come from today.

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

Here's an idea: play it for yourself and then judge it instead of letting others do it for you.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

I see that many people complain about Metroid Prime 4's pointless additions of Bike, Empty desert, and companions and just want the original MP1 experience. But for me, I want something entirely new, something more original and refreshing. That is not to say I love any of the mentioned changes but it is absolutely necessary that decades-old franchise like Metroid needs reinvention. They could have expanded on the original Metroid's non-linearity, created creative and challenging platforming sections (Tropical Freeze was peak), borrowing systematic gameplay elements from BOTW, changing the perspective to allow for more actions, or just borrow Dark Souls 1 ideas. They had done none of these things. Instead, they opted for linear and railroaded design philosophy, a bloated desert that serves to waste time only, companions that are annoying and cringey, underwhelming psychic powers (what is the point of these powers again), areas that are thematically identical to Prime 1 (basically just corridors from the look of it). The fact that Retro Studios has not made a single game since Tropical Freeze should also be a huge redflag. Spending so many years to just make a 12ish hours game is laughable.

Agree to this.

Prime formula with 3 games has run its course. All these years later, I would prefer something more than a retread.

 

[Crayon]

I'm scared to spend $70 on it. Nintendo is big hit and miss for me, these days. Can't even wait for sale. I've had switch since day one and bought so few games it's wild.

 

[Sebastian1295]

Nintendo games need better writing and better stories. It's hard to care about samus aran as a character when the writing team sure dosen't.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

Agree to this.

Prime formula with 3 games has run its course. All these years later, I would prefer something more than a retread.

They have not even done a good job of retreading based on the reviews that I read, especially the "extremely linear areas" part of the game.

 

[Dice]

I bought a Switch 1 for the game. Now I have a Switch 2. Things I'm seeing and reading are very disappointing and I'm basically bracing for a Halo game with item scanning at this point. I don't trust game reviewers as they are so often astonishingly wrong. I hope I am pleasantly surprised.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

Most of 75s-low 80s games are what they are, just average, and nothing more. It is not mere coincidence that most of the games that are considered the greatest are critically acclaimed or at least high 80s. Some cult classics were not fairly judged, but that is why: they are cult classics to begin with, and they are also rare.

It can go both ways.

Game can turn out to be incredible upon playing it. I have far too many GOTY contenders in 70s to care about this.

That said, I don't care too much about npcs if done well. Would like to see more favourable improvements to core gameplay. Thats where it counts IMO.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

Nintendo games need better writing and better stories. It's hard to care about samus aran as a character when the writing team sure dosen't.

This is actually something that most fans would look with disdain but I think it can be a good idea. But with all ideas, execution matters as we know half-baked solutions result in things that nobody wants and is interested in.

 

[Sebastian1295]

This is actually something that most fans would look with disdain but I think it can be a good idea. But with all ideas, execution matters as we know half-baked solutions result in things that nobody wants and is interested in.

If they wanna innovate and take a risk then rip the bandaid off and make metroid an M rated series instead of following the T rating and formula. Make metroid a dark, mature, horror atmosphere game and ramp up the storytelling by taking samus aran to a storytelling philosophy that no one would've expected out of nintendo. Explore samus aran the woman behind the suit and her life before putting it on, give her depth as a character etc and make us good a shit about her as a woman/character. But we all know that nintendo would never dare to do something like that and wanna keep the half assed philosophy of 'kid friendly' so they'll stick with the T rating and teen focused writing philosophy ala cheesy companions etc.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

If they wanna innovate and take a risk then rip the bandaid off and make metroid an M rated series instead of following the T rating and formula. Make metroid a dark, horror atmosphere game and ramp up the storytelling by taking samus aran to a storytelling philosophy that no one would've expected out of nintendo. Explore samus aran the woman behind the suit and her life before putting it on, give her depth as a character etc. But we all know that nintendo would never dare to do something like that and wanna keep the half assed philosophy of 'kid friendly' so they'll stick with the T rating and teen focused writing philosophy ala cheesy companions etc.

There is light story in Metroid games. Similar to Returnal etc.

Making it into space drama, not sure if it will fly. Will up the budget quite a bit.

 

[Mozza]

This is actually something that most fans would look with disdain but I think it can be a good idea. But with all ideas, execution matters as we know half-baked solutions result in things that nobody wants and is interested in.

The fans again.... I only wish these fans would actually come out and buy these games in greater numbers lol.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

If they wanna innovate and take a risk then rip the bandaid off and make metroid an M rated series instead of following the T rating and formula. Make metroid a dark, horror atmosphere game and ramp up the storytelling by taking samus aran to a storytelling philosophy that no one would've expected out of nintendo. Explore samus aran the woman behind the suit and her life before putting it on, give her depth as a character etc and make us good a shit about her as a woman/character. But we all know that nintendo would never dare to do something like that and wanna keep the half assed philosophy of 'kid friendly' so they'll stick with the T rating and teen focused writing philosophy ala cheesy companions etc.

Metroid can work so well as a game with more of survival identity. Dread and Fusion briefly explore this aspect. Ramping up the "Dread" aspect while still keeping the intricate level design can be such a breath of fresh air. Especially in a 1st person perspective like Prime where action is so limited. After all, Metroids always start with Samus losing most of here abilities so she is in such a weak state that anything can kill her. Tension is important to keep players engaged but Nintendo seems to completely forget about it.

 

[I collect VHS tapes]

ZA got worse scores and it's one of my favorite games in a while

I actually tend to really enjoy games in the high 70s low 80s

 

[Sebastian1295]

There is light story in Metroid games. Similar to Returnal etc.

Making it into space drama, not sure if it will fly. Will up the budget quite a bit.

To me metroid is one of the only series nintendo has that should be for adult audiences and should have adult themes behind it. They keep playing it safe by giving us light story elements but it's few and far between and at the end of the day samus aran feels more like a robot and cyborg than a woman who's in a suit. Develop the woman as a character so that when she gets into the suit we give a crap about keeping her alive and we have background information/good storytelling driving us on the adventure. The series flatout has stagnated cause they're not willing to take any risks with it. That's just my opinion cause i'm an adult and I need good stories in my games nowadays cause it gives me a motivation to keep playing said game.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

The fans again.... I only wish these fans would actually come out and buy these games in greater numbers lol.

The fans do buy the game I think, it's just that Metroid never has that many fans anyway so it does not matter. You need to attract normies to sell well, not just fans.

 

[kiphalfton]

I mean what do you expect. The best one was the first prime game, but the 2nd and 3rd game didn't seem to receive anywhere close to the critical acclaim.

The 4th game will review well, largely in part to people being hard up for a new game. Not saying it won't be good, just that people will probably judge it based solely on the on the good (and ingore the bad).

 

[Nvzman]

Most of 75s-low 80s games are what they are, just average, and nothing more. It is not mere coincidence that most of the games that are considered the greatest are critically acclaimed or at least high 80s. Some cult classics were not fairly judged, but that is why: they are cult classics to begin with, and they are also rare.

This is an incredibly dumb take, because there are plenty of genuinely fun games that you may absolutely personally love that not everyone else does, so who gives a fucking shit if its critically acclaimed or not?
The Last of Us Part 2 is critically acclaimed and has one of the dumbest, most contrived stories in gaming that is only "good" if you completely ignore everything that made the writing good about Part 1. Its a critic fart huffing game that has an overly bleak and contrived tone. Great gameplay and technically impressive, fucking abysmal story.

Similarly, Super Mario Odyssey is critically acclaimed despite it being probably the blandest 3D Mario title besides 3D World. The worlds feel incredibly sterile (they're all just dioramas suspended over bottomless pits), the platforming is not particularly difficult, and the moons make the rewards of doing all of the objectives underwhelming. Its absolutely a huge downgrade over Galaxy 1 and 2, and yet its critically rated the same as them because critics (who are typically dogshit at video games and enjoy extremely accessible polished products) eat it up.

Death Stranding has an 82 metacritic and it ended up being one of my favorite PS4 exclusives of that era simply because of how unique and interesting the story, the mechanics, and the execution of the whole game.

Similarly, Sonic Unleashed is one of my favorite games, and I'll happily admit it has flaws, but its an incredibly fun and engaging game from start to finish with amazing music and visuals for its time. It has a 60 metacritic

I'd rather have games that are unique, fun, and not meant for everyone, than the slop that usually gets critically acclaimed nowadays. The fun games are the ones I'm actually going to want to go back to, you should never let something as subjective and stupid as a fucking metacritic score define what you play, go watch gameplay and figure out if it looks good to you. Critics and video game journalists are largely absolutely shit at their job to begin with.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

This is an incredibly dumb take, because there are plenty of genuinely fun games that you may absolutely personally love that not everyone else does, so who gives a fucking shit if its critically acclaimed or not?
The Last of Us Part 2 is critically acclaimed and has one of the dumbest, most contrived stories in gaming that is only "good" if you completely ignore everything that made the writing good about Part 1. Its a critic fart huffing game that has an overly bleak and contrived tone. Great gameplay and technically impressive, fucking abysmal story.

Similarly, Super Mario Odyssey is critically acclaimed despite it being probably the blandest 3D Mario title besides 3D World. The worlds feel incredibly sterile (they're all just dioramas suspended over bottomless pits), the platforming is not particularly difficult, and the moons make the rewards of doing all of the objectives underwhelming. Its absolutely a huge downgrade over Galaxy 1 and 2, and yet its critically rated the same as them because critics (who are typically dogshit at video games and enjoy extremely accessible polished products) eat it up.

Death Stranding has an 82 metacritic and it ended up being one of my favorite PS4 exclusives of that era simply because of how unique and interesting the story, the mechanics, and the execution of the whole game.

Similarly, Sonic Unleashed is one of my favorite games, and I'll happily admit it has flaws, but its an incredibly fun and engaging game from start to finish with amazing music and visuals for its time. It has a 60 metacritic

I'd rather have games that are unique, fun, and not meant for everyone, than the slop that usually gets critically acclaimed nowadays. The fun games are the ones I'm actually going to want to go back to, you should never let something as subjective and stupid as a fucking metacritic score define what you play, go watch gameplay and figure out if it looks good to you. Critics and video game journalists are largely absolutely shit at their job to begin with.

That is like your opinion man, it is irrelevant to the consensus. Yes, TLOU2 was controversial, but also yes, most of the critically acclaimed games have favourable user review scores. I played TLOU2, I hate its direction, but love the gameplay, the intensity of the story; how depressing and sorrow it is. Mario Odyssey, easy game, but also pure fun, great movement and good attempt at rediscovering 64 freedom and sandbox design philosophy. 3D World is also incredible for its tightness and challenging levels that are more like the original 2D games. I have quite different taste than you, and so do thousands who rate Odyssey 10 on Metacritic. If we judge by this, your opinion is nothing compared to ours. But that is clearly not my point, I do not follow the mass, what I like, I like, what I don't, I don't

I brought up Prime 4's metacritic as a reference, but I also stated that I already sensed something wrong right from the start. Something that only scores 70s-low 80s is usually shit. Popular games with heavy marketing that can only score low 80s are usually shit. Exceptions do not make the rule. If even the casual do not like a casual game, how can the hardcores do? MP4 is literally a casual game so don't tell me it isn't. The game looks ez-pz, plays straightforward with info-dump from companions, linear structure (no chance of getting lost), empty desert to grind materials Jesus,…

 

[Fess]

Nintendo games need better writing and better stories. It's hard to care about samus aran as a character when the writing team sure dosen't.

Writing? A Metroid game just need to throw Samus down on an interesting alien planet full of strange creatures and gear-based puzzles, explored alone without hand-holding.
Whatever story there is could be told through environmental storytelling.
This thing of trying to flesh out Samus as a character with more story and add side characters are only making it feel less like a Metroid game.

 

[FoxMcChief]

Is it Friday already? I thought the dumb threads were usually created on Friday afternoons.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

Is it Friday already? I thought the dumb threads were usually created on Friday afternoons

I don't know that only -180 IQ can enjoy MP4. Sorry, I am not that smart.

 

[Sticks]

Zelda and Mario have weak entries too.

 

[vodka-bull]

Zelda and Mario have weak entries too.

But Zelda had a few releases since Gamecube.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

Game does not seem like a weak entry from what I have seen.

Their direction is not ideal for Metroid.

But I need to play to see if I like it.

Nintendo prices are a huge problem though, wish they were better with discounts.

 

[Sticks]

But Zelda had a few releases since Gamecube.

Thats because Metroid isn't one of their biggest sellers.

 

[Seomel]

Ok schizo

 

[Paasei]

I read some reviews, the game is okay enough but nothing outstanding. Some fans need to understand that the "nothing outstanding" has implication to the franchise's survival itself. This franchise is a already a neglected one, one more subpar-sales game will only move it closer to the dead franchise list. Hate Metacritic scores all you want but they can largely influence normies' purchase decisions.

Yep, and I think that's a problem. Being influenced big time by a number without any nuance to it. How many of those people actually read/watch reviews I wonder? This is meant generally speaking and not just for Metroid.

In some way I can understand why people only want 90+ games given how the prices have gone up and the quality hasn't necessarily gone up. but still, 80 seems good. I find user scores to be a little more reliable in combination with a videoreview so I can see gameplay footage myself.

 

[vodka-bull]

Thats because Metroid isn't one of their biggest sellers.

That's because they didn't release a game in the past 20 years.

 

[Sticks]

That's because they didn't release a game in the past 20 years.

Samus Returns, Dread?

 

[L*][*N*K]

Metroid Prime suffers from the same issue Diablo and Borderlands suffer from, go read the reviews they all just compare it to Prime 1 at this point i don't even know what MP4 is like and I read like 4 of those reviews all they talk about is that the game is not like Prime 1, so it is pointless to look up reviews anymore

 

[Robb]

Eh.. Personally all I really wanted from this installment was more classic and safe Metroid Prime. It's not like these are games that are flooding the market, there's almost nothing else like Metroid Prime even today, despite how old it is now.

Metroid Prime suffers from the same issue Diablo and Borderlands suffer from, go read the reviews they all just compare it to Prime 1 at this point i don't even know what MP4 is like and I read like 4 of those reviews all they talk about is that the game is not like Prime 1, so it is pointless to look up reviews anymore

I personally think that's fair from what I've read so far (and it also kind of makes sense to compare it to Prime 1 since the remaster is the most recent release).

I need to play it, but from what I've read it seems Prime 4 has distinct regions that you puzzle through, unlock an ability, kill the boss with it, move on to the next region.. Nothing seems to be interconnected like in the original game. Makes me question if this is Metroid or just Zelda in a Metroid skin. Doesn't sound like a 3D Metroidvania anymore if that's the case.