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[Bishman]

http://boards.ign.com/Metal_Gear_Solid/b5200/71598322/?83

This was started by Gotjapanka.

Go the the PS2 mailbag

You can copy and paste this, or you can come up with your own words.

"Dear PS2.IGN editors
It has come to my attention that Halo2 will finally be released this Tuesday, and other video game companies can finally get an equal chance at having their games covered equally.

The release of Halo2 has over-shadowed many other great games. We are asking you, now that Metal Gear Solid 3 release is a week away, to start a countdown to the release of the game. You still have not mentioned the cure system which has been talked about for a while now, you still did not explain the use of the PS2 internal clock in advantage of the game, and many other things that you really ignored so far.

10 more days to go, video game retailers have a low number of MGS3 reservations. In a way, this was your fault. For over hyping MGS2 back in 2001, then -your Gamespy affiliates- calling it "the most overrated game of all time” This really hurt the series. We read many reviews of the game, and they stated that it is the best out of the series, the longest, and it has boss battles that will go down in video gaming history books.

Why are you ignoring it? It seems Gamespot.com is the only website who realized that over hyping Halo2 is hurting other video games, and thus are giving equal coverage of all games a like.

We are asking for a countdown feature, where you take that 10 page preview, that no-one wants to read because of how bulky and poorly written it was. Research the new information that makes people want to get the game, and make a countdown feature. You had 5 Halo2 articles in less than 3 days, this is the least you can do for Metal Gear Solid 3, which you have been treating as an independent title that should go under the radar. At least have a "final built first hands-on impressions-"

Do not say "you can take the horse to the spring, but you can't make him drink" you guys have dried the spring, and killed the horse.

I remember a time in IGN's life 2 years ago, where each newly released game will get the attention it deserves, now people know about the games and when they will come out just when they are reviewd.

Thank you. "

 

[jett]

Hype campaign? IGN's fault? Puh-leeze. MGS3 is my most anticipated game, and if it doesn't sell well it'll be nobody's but Konami's fault.

 

[Sinatar]

Why would the staff at IGN PS2 be affected in any way by the IGN Xbox staff hyping Halo 2?

*Boggle*

 

[Cathcart]

Why would the staff at IGN PS2 be affected in any way by the IGN Xbox staff hyping Halo 2?

*Boggle*

There was that time when the front page of PS2 had as the main article a big picture of Master Chief and then the name of the article was "Halo 2: No, we're not kidding" and then you clicked on it they were like "PSYCHE!! No Halos for you, but this game sounds awesome!" and then if you clicked on the screenshots link it was a bunch of pictures of the IGN staff fallating Bungie employees. It was totally gross.

 

[lexi]

There was that time when the front page of PS2 had as the main article a big picture of Master Chief and then the name of the article was "Halo 2: No, we're not kidding" and then you clicked on it they were like "PSYCHE!! No Halos for you, but this game sounds awesome!" and then if you clicked on the screenshots link it was a bunch of pictures of the IGN staff fallating Bungie employees. It was totally gross.

Thanks, now there's Dr. Pepper all over my monitor.

 

[Do The Mario]

Why all the MGS2 hate?

I mean I just got the game a few days ago on the Xbox and it’s Awesome best game I have played this gen!

I can’t stop jizzing over it !!!!!!!!!

I am mega sad the MGS3 3 release date is the 30th of March 2005 for Australia. This means if it gets ported to the Xbox we will not see the game for ages!

I am almost tempted to buy a US PS2 just to play this game!

 

[Docpan]

Who cares?

People have too much time on their hands.

 

[Lord Error]

Hmmm, I think current IGN editors are simply not much of an MGS fans. Two of them have already expressed that sentiment in some of the mailbags editions, and one of those two is actually reviewing the game.

I am almost tempted to buy a US PS2 just to play this game!

Why don't you just buy an australian PS2 and get the game in march, if that's more convenient? That way you'd be able to play the better version of MGS2 as well.

Who cares?

People who'd like to see the game sell well enough to see more of the series. I question how much IGN can do or not do about it, though. The matter is in Konami's hands, and I must say they have not been doing the best of jobs to keep MGS3 in the spotlight so far.

 

[Riskbreaker]

Hype campaign? IGN's fault? Puh-leeze. MGS3 is my most anticipated game, and if it doesn't sell well it'll be nobody's but Konami's fault.

Two of my students are purchasing MGS3 after I lent them my demo....+2 sales of MGS3

 

[Do The Mario]

Hmmm, I think current IGN editors are simply not much of an MGS fans. Two of them have already expressed that sentiment in some of the mailbags editions, and one of those two is actually reviewing the game.


Why don't you just buy an australian PS2 and get the game in march, if that's more convenient? That way you'd be able to play the better version of MGS2 as well.


People who'd like to see the game sell well enough to see more of the series. I question how much IGN can do or not do about it, though. The matter is in Konami's hands, and I must say they have not been doing the best of jobs to keep MGS3 in the spotlight so far.

Well I had a PS2 but when it broke down and I sent it of to Sony of Australia and they sent it back to me broken twice! After three months of fcking around they replaced it with a refurbished unit.

Not happy sony, still I am almost tempted to buy a PS2 again just for this game.

 

[Kuroyume]

What really hurt the series was Splinter Cell being much better.

 

[Dead]

What really hurt the series was Splinter Cell being much better.

Splinter Cell is awful....and is almost a completely different type of game than Metal Gear Solid.

 

[Lord Error]

What really hurt the series was Splinter Cell being much better.

Without going into pointless discussion about this, consider that
a) MGS is pretty much a Playstation brand game, and
b) Splinter Cell was not any kind of mega-hit on PS2,

I doubt Splinter Cell had much of an impact on it's popularity either way.

And if you really want to go there, the hype for SC3 is probably ten times less than it ever was for MGS3.

 

[Miburou]

Splinter Cell, at least the single player mode, sucks ass.

 

[Kanbee-san]

Splinter cell was actually a game. Thats why it was better.

You know, you could play it....... not watch some b grade cutscene that goes on and on and on and on.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Splinter cell was actually a game. Thats why it was better.

You know, you could play it....... not watch some b grade cutscene that goes on and on and on and on.

Wow this card has never been played before!

 

[Miburou]

At least with MGS you don't have to watch the same unskippable, poorly directed cut-scene over and over because of some shitty trial and error design. ZING!

 

[Wario64]

Uh oh, Splinter Cell mentioned in a MGS thread? Bail out

 

[Mr_Furious]

You have to give Splinter Cell more credit for 'emphasizing' the stealth element better than the Metal Gear series. Everything from the gadgets to the moves to the level layouts offered so much more options to encompass stealth gameplay. I still love the MGS franchise for different reasons though and both offer a great experience unique to themselves.

 

[Grizzlyjin]

Splinter cell was actually a game. Thats why it was better.

You know, you could play it....... not watch some b grade cutscene that goes on and on and on and on.

Metal Gear Solid cutscenes.... "B grade." I'm calling bullshit on that statement right there. I don't care if you like Splinter Cell more, thats your preference. But I don't know any other game that does cutscenes better than Metal Gear Solid.

Metal Gear Solid 3 is going to rock my monkey loving socks off, so I don't give a crap what anyone else likes. As long as I get to play it.

 

[Sinatar]

Wow this card has never been played before!

Played or not, its very very true.

 

[SolidSnakex]

At least with MGS you don't have to watch the same unskippable, poorly directed cut-scene over and over because of some shitty trial and error design. ZING!

Heh Atleast when I go for a headshot in MGS it actually hits an enemies head. +1 for polish.

Seriously MGS2's plot hurt MGS. Reviewers never mention MGS2's gameplay as its problem. It's one of the very few console stealth game that doesn't rely on trial and error tactics to show off its stealth gameplay.

 

[Miburou]

Played or not, its very very true.

What is true? That because a game has a lot of cut-scenes the gameplay suddenly disappears into thin air? You could skip every cut-scene and code conversation in MGS2 and it still would be a 10 hour game.

 

[duckroll]

I think people who say Splinter Cell has "actual gameplay" and MGS doesn't is completely delusional. While it's completely true that Splinter Cell probably has MORE gameplay and is much HARDER and more REALISTIC than MGS, I believe the reason it does not sell as well is simply because it isn't as fun.

MGS games are not meant to be 15 hours of pure gameplay experience focusing on mission based realistic stealth missions. They're meant to be arcade style experiences which simply gives you as large an illusion of stealth and being a super agent as possible. When you get detected, the game will not end (unless you set it such but let's not get into the entire "you can make the game as realistic as you want it" discussion) and when you get killed, you can pretty much continue from the last room you entered. The game is much faster, enemies are "dumber" and bosses are outragous. The entire point is that while Splinter Cell is an actual stealth simulator (like GT is a racing simulator), MGS is just an arcadey action game with illusions of stealth to make the experience more fun (like how GTA is an action game with the illusion of racing around the city in a car).

MGS is also meant to be very replayable, which is why the game isn't usually very long. The cutscenes are placed there to make the entire experience more fun and cinematic. As an entertainment product, it simply wants to entertain. Sure the cutscenes are really long, but that's what makes playing any MGS the first time so awesome. The game is longer, there's so much to see, and subsequently once you've seen the cinemas once, replaying the game doesn't require you to see them again, so that's a null point.

It's completely pointless comparing MGS and SC because they cater to completely different audiences and play completely differently. Sure they both look similar if you look at the back of each box, but seriously, this is like comparing Deus Ex with Time Crisis because they both feature a first person view, and you shoot stuff.

 

[SolidSnakex]

"The game is much faster, enemies are "dumber" and bosses are outragous."

They're pretty smart on Extreme minus the radar. Once you're doing that you no longer have the radar advantage over them. That's what made the series so easy for some. Once you level the playing field it becomes much more stealth oriented since you can no longer run through a level real fast because you no longer know exactly where each guard is. You also can't be running fast because their hearing goes up quite a bit. MGS3 is going to be really hard for those people who've never experienced one of the MGS games on a harder level without the radar. It turns into a completely different game.

"MGS is also meant to be very replayable, which is why the game isn't usually very long. "

This I agree with. Since the game isn't trial and error based, you're given much options to get through a level. So you're allowed to be alot more experimental in levels than in other stealth games.

 

[duckroll]

They're pretty smart on Extreme minus the radar. Once you're doing that you no longer have the radar advantage over them. That's what made the series so easy for some. Once you level the playing field it becomes much more stealth oriented since you can no longer run through a level real fast because you no longer know exactly where each guard is. You also can't be running fast because their hearing goes up quite a bit. MGS3 is going to be really hard for those people who've never experienced one of the MGS games on a harder level without the radar. It turns into a completely different game.

Man, your tag is really spot on. I was trying to tackle the issue of SC vs MGS without sounding like an apologist. The entire "they're pretty smart on Extreme" and "if you turn the difficulty up and select Game Over If Discovered the game is almost like Splinter Cell" shit isn't worth crap. I'm a huge MGS fan, but to try and apologist for faults the game does NOT have isn't helping the fanbase one bit. I'm not remotely ashamed that MGS games are easy compared to SC or that the enemies are much dumber, I'm not afraid to admit that either. The bottom line that counts is that MGS is much more fun than SC can ever hope to be and much much more replayable.

 

[disabledHeliocentric]

I have been thinking about which games I will buy. I'e decided that MGS3 has the best mix of new and familiar gameplay; after all, the new outdoor environments and survival gameplay are a big change. Yet it bodes on delivering the type of fun experience we all expect and come packed with some great characters and story twists, and that's why I'm thinking this game will have the best single player experience of the big november titles. And, it's supposed to be much longer and have massive environments!

 

[Deg]

Both SC and MGS wont sell like they did before. Both were dissapointments.

 

[Brofist]

MGS series>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Splinter Cell

 

[disabledHeliocentric]

I've always felt that Metal Gear Solid had this puzzle like quality in how its stealth challenges were set up that Splinter cell lacked. Also every character in every MGS game owns every character in every Splinter Cell on down the line.

 

[Lord Error]

So let's stop comparing the SC and MGS for a bit and look at the issue at hand. The guy who started this 'hype campaign' knows that at his Gamestop, MGS3 has around 12-15 preorders so far. For the comparision, he says, games like Halo 2, GTA:SA or GT4 have that number in hundreds. Not a pretty picture.

Now that we have that out of the way...

or that the enemies are much dumber, I'm not afraid to admit that either.

If you are talking about their discovering tactics, then I can agree. In MGS and MGS2 they have limited cones of vision, can't hear you while you are running behind them and such. They are definitely dumbed down to make the game faster flowing. Once they discover you however, their AI is some of the best seen in any game. The pathfinding, the working in group, knowing how to track you down, surround you and shoot you is better than in any game of it's kind I can thnk of. When it comes to it, SC guards had way more holes in AI than MGS2 guards. At least the AI limitations in MGS2 were imposed by design, and you could have an understanding over them. All that said, the guard AI in mGS3 is on the entire new level of quality (and amusement).

 

[dark10x]

Ugh, I can't believe people are bringing up Splinter Cell again. :\

It had a wonderful multiplayer mode, but the single player mode just isn't very good. It's a trial and error fest and is as linear as you could possibly get. Not a good game...

Anyways, I don't think there is any reason to worry...

I mean, Half-Life 2, MGS3, and Prime 2 all hit next week...and all three of them aren't seeing a whole lot of hype at the moment. Halo 2 is just stealing the thunder of everything.

 

[Doom_Bringer]

There’s no hype for MGS3 because MGS2 sucked! Endless amount of long cuts cense, Raiden, Rose, endless amount of pointless codec conversations. A lot of people just gave up on the series.

I liked the gameplay in MGS2 and I think MGS1 was great and that’s why I am waiting for MGS3.

Splinter Cell games have much better graphics, music, gameplay compared to MGS 2 but they are weak on the story department.

WTF was Splinter Cell about again? I know Pandora Tomorrow was about small pox virus but the game was TOO SHORT.

 

[duckroll]

Yeah I'm talking about the arcade-like limitations of the MGS guards. Simple as that. I don't think anyone will doubt for a moment that MGS games don't have solid AI in comparison with anything in the same generations.

See the thing is, in Splinter Cell, if you're discovered, the game is usually over. So they don't need "AI" in that aspect.

 

[jett]

You know people, when you go out on a dog tag hunt in MGS2, it also becomes a trial and error fest. Not that I have a problem with that, if it weren't for dog tags MGS2 wouldn't be half as fun. Speaking of which, are there dogtags in MGS3?

 

[dark10x]

Splinter Cell games have much better graphics, music, gameplay compared to MGS 2 but they are weak on the story department.

MUSIC?! SC games have awful, generic music which does nothing for the games.

I'm not even going to get into the gameplay, as SC is just too flawed to analyze again...

You know people, when you go out on a dog tag hunt in MGS2, it also becomes a trial and error fest.

I didn't realize you were required to do that in order to get anywhere in the game. Splinter Cell is straight up trial and error the entire time you are playing. It's the reason why I believe many people dislike stealth games nowadays...

 

[Lakitu]

Speaking of which, are there dogtags in MGS3?

Don't think so.

 

[dorio]

Both Splinter Cell and MGS are boring as hell.


Edit: Actually Hell I would imagine wouldn't be that boring for the first millenium or so of occupance.

 

[Miburou]

Both SC and MGS wont sell like they did before. Both were dissapointments.

English please?

 

[king zell]

I support this campaign

 

[speedpop]

I always thought the MGS2 storyline was amazing and it perfectly set everything up or answered a few questions from MGS - much like MGS doing the same for Metal Gear's 1 and 2.

I have 100% faith that Kojima knows WTF he is doing, and will proceed to shit all over me when I play MGS3.

 

[Alf-Life]

I heard axxxj is a bit of a Snake Eater.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

a lot of you are going to be eating insane amounts of crow when this game comes out.

 

[Bishman]

I support this campaign

Yes!

Support MGS and Kojima!

 

[Necroscope]

Wow this card has never been played before!

HA HA HA HA, Snakex, u r funny. U r damn funny.

 

[KilledByBill]

The responses from the many haters in this thread underscore why I am personally glad MGS3 is coming in under the radar this year. MGS2 was so swept up in it's own hype that people came out in droves after it was released to tear the game down. Frankly I don't give a shit about the empty opinions a lot of people hold for the series. "OMG you watch more than you play!, A bunch of crack monkeys came up with the story!, This new character looks like a girl!"

I managed to avoid the hype for both MGS and MGS2 and I enjoyed them both immensely. I agree that they are both far from perfect but I think the overall experience and polished game play more than makes up for their flaws. Snake Eater looks like it was designed to address many of problems that held back Sons of Liberty (unnecessary and long codec conversations, overly convoluted storyline, confining game play environments) while also freshening up the game with a more varied setting and a bigger cast of characters.

If less hype means that fans of the Metal Gear series here at Gaming Age will be able to discuss and enjoy the game without worrying about idiots coming in and trolling (which seems to be inexplicably sanctioned by forum administrators) then I'll gladly take it.

P.S. Splinter Cell fans, what brings you to a Metal Gear Solid 3 thread? I played Splinter Cell on Xbox and PS2 and I didn't care for it much at all(great graphics though). But I could never justify wasting any of my time going into threads about the game and trashing it. Considering the MGS and SC are both "stealth games" I was surprised to find they had hardly anything in common, certainly very little worth arguing about IMO.

 

[Mr. Blonde]

MGS3 will easily be one of the five best games of the year along with Halo 2 GTA SA Ninja Gaiden and ESPN NFL 2k5