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Microsoft vs. Google.

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number386

Member
Interesting read, it's a six page article outlining why MS worries about competition from Google. I only quoted the first page because of spacial concerns, click the link for the whole article. We all know MS has been making a google killer for awhile now but this outlines why. I found it to be informitive hope you will too.




GATES VS. GOOGLE
Search and Destroy
Bill Gates is on a mission to build a Google killer. What got him so riled? The darling of search is moving into software—and that's Microsoft's turf.
By Fred Vogelstein




Microsoft was already months into A massive project aimed at taking down Google when the truth began to dawn on Bill Gates. It was December 2003. He was poking around on the Google company website and came across a help-wanted page with descriptions of all the open jobs at Google. Why, he wondered, were the qualifications for so many of them identical to Microsoft job specs? Google was a web search business, yet here on the screen were postings for engineers with backgrounds that had nothing to do with search and everything to do with Microsoft's core business—people trained in things like operating-system design, compiler optimization, and distributed-systems architecture. Gates wondered whether Microsoft might be facing much more than a war in search. An e-mail he sent to a handful of execs that day said, in effect, "We have to watch these guys. It looks like they are building something to compete with us."

He sure got that right. Today Google isn't just a hugely successful search engine; it has morphed into a software company and is emerging as a major threat to Microsoft's dominance. You can use Google software with any Internet browser to search the web and your desktop for just about anything; send and store up to two gigabytes of e-mail via Gmail (Hotmail, Microsoft's rival free e-mail service, offers 250 megabytes, a fraction of that); manage, edit, and send digital photographs using Google's Picasa software, easily the best PC photo software out there; and, through Google's Blogger, create, post online, and print formatted documents—all without applications from Microsoft.

While Google was launching those products—all of them free—Microsoft has been trying in vain to catch up in search. It has spent about $150 million on its search project, code-named Underdog. But Google and lately Yahoo keep leaping ahead with innovations like local-area search complete with maps and satellite photos, ways to search inside a video file, and search designed for cellphones.

Simply put, Google has become a new kind of foe, and that's what has Gates so riled. It has combined software innovation with a brand-new Internet business model—and it wounds Gates' pride that he didn't get there first. Since Google doesn't sell its search products (it makes its money from the ads that accompany its search results), Microsoft can't muscle it out of the marketplace the way it did rivals like Netscape. But what really bothers Gates is that Google is gaining the ability to attack the very core of Microsoft's franchise—control over what users do first when they turn on their computers.

Google co-founders Sergey Brin and Larry Page and CEO Eric Schmidt all say that any talk about supplanting Microsoft is ludicrous. But the idea that Google will one day marginalize Microsoft's operating system and bypass Windows applications is already starting to become reality. The most paranoid people at Microsoft even think "Google Office" is inevitable. Google is taking over operating system features too, like desktop search. There are fewer uses for the start button in Windows now that Google's desktop search can locate any program, document, photo, music file, or e-mail on a computer.

All of which helps explain why inside Microsoft, the battle with Google has become far more than a fight over search: It's a certifiable grudge match for king of the hill in high tech. "Google is interesting not just because of web search, but because they're going to try to take that and use it to get into other parts of software," says Gates as he leans forward in his chair, his body coiled as if he could spring to his feet at any second. "If all there was was search, you really shouldn't care so much about it. It's because they are a software company," he says. "In that sense," he adds later, "they are more like us than anyone else we have ever competed with."

Though CEO Steve Ballmer has been boss for five years, Gates, who is chairman and chief software architect, is leading the charge against Google. Forced to watch Google's stock soar the way Microsoft's used to, and Brin and Page enjoy their roles as tech's new rock stars, Gates brings to the fight a ferocity that nobody has seen since the Netscape war a decade ago. Their popularity gets under his skin. "There's companies that are just so cool that you just can't even deal with it," he says sarcastically, suggesting that Google is nothing more than the latest fad, adding, "At least they know to wear black."

http://www.fortune.com/fortune/technology/articles/0,15114,1050065,00.html?promoid=netscape
 

DarienA

The black man everyone at Activision can agree on
No mention of it in the article... but don't we also keep hearing recurring rumors of a google browser somewhere down the road?
 

xsarien

daedsiluap
DarienA said:
No mention of it in the article... but don't we also keep hearing recurring rumors of a google browser somewhere down the road?

A Google browser running the Mozilla/Gecko engine would rock my world.
 
D

Deleted member 1235

Unconfirmed Member
*googles google desktop search*
 
Google, with their newfound money from going public, has pretty much plucked every major research Computer Scientist from NASA, IBM, and universities, especially in AI. Microsoft is going to have to sling some of their money a little bit to catch up to them.
 
D

Deleted member 1235

Unconfirmed Member
wow. this google desktop search is quite cool, I got a plugin that triggers it when you hit the (shitty) windows explorer search button. It indexes your entire PC and even brings up net history in your searches so if you were looking for something you read a while ago, there it is.

Very good. the plugins are quite cool. I'm 11 % complete indexing my machine. Much better than the old google deskbar which was just a google search if I recall.
 

Ghost

Chili Con Carnage!
ConfusingJazz said:
Google, with their newfound money from going public, has pretty much plucked every major research Computer Scientist from NASA, IBM, and universities, especially in AI. Microsoft is going to have to sling some of their money a little bit to catch up to them.


Or hire second rate graduates...


/me goes to prepare CV
 

sonicfan

Venerable Member
manage, edit, and send digital photographs using Google's Picasa software, easily the best PC photo software

I didn't even know they had this. I just downloaded it. It seems pretty slick.
 

Mugen

Banned
Google > *.

It's true. I don't mind if the INTERNET become GOOGLE. Cause I know it's gonna kick ass anyways. :D
 
Mugen said:
Google > *.

It's true. I don't mind if the INTERNET become GOOGLE. Cause I know it's gonna kick ass anyways. :D

You know what would be awesome? If Google made a free operating system that's better than Windows/OSX. Now that would make Bill have a heart attack.

The only problem is trying to figure out a way to make profits on this model, invasive ads on an OS might not fly.
 

DarienA

The black man everyone at Activision can agree on
sonicfan said:
I didn't even know they had this. I just downloaded it. It seems pretty slick.

Yeah the missus uses it to manage all of the photos we have, mostly of our daughter... she's very impressed with it.
 

xsarien

daedsiluap
Pedigree Chum said:
You know what would be awesome? If Google made a free operating system that's better than Windows/OSX. Now that would make Bill have a heart attack.

The only problem is trying to figure out a way to make profits on this model, invasive ads on an OS might not fly.


What about a Google distribution of Linux? Googux...or something.
 

Pochacco

asking dangerous questions
Pedigree Chum said:
You know what would be awesome? If Google made a free operating system that's better than Windows/OSX. Now that would make Bill have a heart attack.

The only problem is trying to figure out a way to make profits on this model, invasive ads on an OS might not fly.
In a lot of peoples' opinions, this is what LINUX is.
Nevermind a Google distribution, Linux is already a great OS that happens to be free.

Anyway, Google rocks.
They make geeky stuff like computers and the internet exciting and fun.

I hope they branch out into more areas. It's true that they're going beyond search, but it's still their core business. They're an information retrieval company at heart.

Btw, I think online maps are terribly underated. They change EVERYTHING (especially satellite maps). Whenever I need to go somewhere nowadays, I do a quick google map search and print out the resulting map. In effect, people have no excuse to ever be lost again! (sort of)
 
In a lot of peoples' opinions, this is what LINUX is.
Nevermind a Google distribution, Linux is already a great OS that happens to be free.

That's true. I just hope that they have a good distribution model up, their Google brand is strong but if they do indeed make an operating system it won't mean shit if their marketshare is like Linux's.
 

axxxj

Animator in Waiting
Heh just tried out Picasa, it's amazing it kicks ACDsee in the nuts and it's free.
If this is what google keeps on putting out then I'm all for them to take over the net.
:D :D
 

Bishman

Member
I remember using Google since the 5th grade. Wish I could go back in time and buy Google stocks. So... much... money.
 

calder

Member
My favourite google moment of the past year was the first time I tried maps.google and was instantly blown away. Google's ability to come out of nowhere (to me anyway, I don't follow tech announcements so it was a complete surprise to me when I first saw it linked here) with a map feature that was SO MUCH better in every way than mapquest and it's ilk still amazes me.

Microsoft shouldn't be afraid per se, but you can see why they're so interested in where google's going to go next.
 
Bishman said:
I remember using Google since the 5th grade. Wish I could go back in time and buy Google stocks. So... much... money.

Well, you coudn't. Hasn't Google only recently become a publicly traded company?
 

GG-Duo

Member
I absolutely ADORE their user-centric designs.

I would argue that this is their real strength. Yes, the technology and functionalities are cool, but sweet toadstool their products are USABLE.
 

DarienA

The black man everyone at Activision can agree on
Google has local... maps... directions.. mail... but they don't have weather.google.com.... come on now....
 

Pochacco

asking dangerous questions
logo.gif


Google Web Accelerator?
Neat!

http://webaccelerator.google.com/
 
D

Deleted member 1235

Unconfirmed Member
Google, is there anything they can't do?
 

sprsk

force push the doodoo rock
catfish said:
Google, is there anything they can't do?


they cant make an awesome os better than windows and has all the best things of macos tiger!!!!!


they cant do it! nope! i dare em to even try!
 

Andy787

Banned
If it were as geniusly designed as pretty much everything else they touch, I would switch to a Google OS in a second.
 

GG-Duo

Member
DarienA said:
Google has local... maps... directions.. mail... but they don't have weather.google.com.... come on now....

I don't think there's an angle where the Google Search technology can benefit a weather site.

However, it would be pretty easy for them to integrate that into another piece of service though.
 

Pimpwerx

Member
I can't wait until Google becomes MS.... :( Let's not forget, Intel and MS werer pretty innovative and aggressive companies, until their got weighed down by their overwhelming success. PEACE.
 
DarienA said:
Google has local... maps... directions.. mail... but they don't have weather.google.com.... come on now....
You can have Google serve up some basic weather info by typing "weather" and your zip code or city. It's really convienent if you have Firefox or a browser with a search box built in.
 

Alcibiades

Member
going to msn.com just doesn't flow as easily off the keyboard, it's 2 consonant initials, whereas w/ yahoo.com and google.com something about typing them out seems really natural...

I could never imagine going to msn.com for anything, but yahoo and google seem like 2nd nature, and I have to say hotmail.com is more familiarized than msn...
 

retardboy

Member
Well, that's just cuz you're used to it google and yahoo. If you always used msn, you'd be used to that too. Although going to search.msn.com is annoying. That should've just made that the msn.com page, but I guess they wanted to go the yahoo way instead of the google way.
 

CaptainABAB

Member
No offense, but Google isn't the end all and be all of software development.

Some of their web stuff, like maps and google suggest rocks. And I've been using their toolbar for pop-up blocking in IE and the autofill forms feature.

On the other hand,
Desktop Search has serious deficiencies (at least for me). It only indexes the first 5000 words of your documents. It can't search external hard drives, doesn't look in Program Files, etc.

In addition, it doesn't support partial word searches. Searches for book will not find bookshelf or cookbook. This is true even for the google web search - their algorithm doesn't support stem searches.

And I'm not even going to go into the non-existent developer support for GDS plug-ins. Basically it's one html page and a forum that none of their developers visit.

Picasa always crashes at random time - probably due to how many images I have. Plus, it is has some weird UI conventions that are not standard. For example, could anyone explain the weird behavior of the scroll bar?

Blogger is pretty cool but it hasn't been updated in how long? Still slow to do posts, doesn't support features most blogging tools have (link lists, articles, images, etc.)

I use Hello to add images to my Blogger blog. It's interface is not what I would call user friendly. To upload a pic to your blogger site, you have to open the images for sharing and then send a picture to your "bloggerbot" friend? Yeah, thats intuitive.


Part of the reason why I see flaky stuff in Picasa & Hello that don't follow general UI standards is because these apps were acquisitions by google. Stuff they built themselves seems to have a higher level of quality.


I'm sorry but if Microsoft or Apple released software like this, they would be ridiculed to no end.
 

DarienA

The black man everyone at Activision can agree on
CaptainABAB said:
No offense, but Google isn't the end all and be all of software development.

Some of their web stuff, like maps and google suggest rocks. And I've been using their toolbar for pop-up blocking in IE and the autofill forms feature.

On the other hand,
Desktop Search has serious deficiencies (at least for me). It only indexes the first 5000 words of your documents. It can't search external hard drives, doesn't look in Program Files, etc.

In addition, it doesn't support partial word searches. Searches for book will not find bookshelf or cookbook. This is true even for the google web search - their algorithm doesn't support stem searches.

And I'm not even going to go into the non-existent developer support for GDS plug-ins. Basically it's one html page and a forum that none of their developers visit.

Picasa always crashes at random time - probably due to how many images I have. Plus, it is has some weird UI conventions that are not standard. For example, could anyone explain the weird behavior of the scroll bar?

Blogger is pretty cool but it hasn't been updated in how long? Still slow to do posts, doesn't support features most blogging tools have (link lists, articles, images, etc.)

I use Hello to add images to my Blogger blog. It's interface is not what I would call user friendly. To upload a pic to your blogger site, you have to open the images for sharing and then send a picture to your "bloggerbot" friend? Yeah, thats intuitive.


Part of the reason why I see flaky stuff in Picasa & Hello that don't follow general UI standards is because these apps were acquisitions by google. Stuff they built themselves seems to have a higher level of quality.


I'm sorry but if Microsoft or Apple released software like this, they would be ridiculed to no end.


You're kidding right? MS DOES release crappy software from time to time... and I'm not just talking about their OS'es

BTW Desktop Search is still a beta product... for some reason people always forget that.
 

xsarien

daedsiluap
CaptainABAB said:
Picasa always crashes at random time - probably due to how many images I have. Plus, it is has some weird UI conventions that are not standard. For example, could anyone explain the weird behavior of the scroll bar?

You mean the one in the main display window? What in the hell is so odd about it? You can treat it like a normal scrollbar, or use the slider in the middle to go up and down. Does it deviate from normal Windows UI conventions? Yeah, but it's also not so remarkably different that people can't use it normally. In fact, they can use it normally. Picasa doesn't require you to use the center slide.

Also, Apple has gone and done their own thing with scrollbars. In OS9 - and I think certain versions of X - they placed both arrows, both up and down, at the bottom of the window. That was irritating. I don't know if they were openly mocked for it; I don't know if they still do it, either.
 

Bregor

Member
Pimpwerx said:
Let's not forget, Intel and MS werer pretty innovative and aggressive companies, until their got weighed down by their overwhelming success.

Remind me what innovative things MS has done?
 

CaptainABAB

Member
The latest GDS is not in beta anymore - it wasn't in beta since early March or so.


In terms of picasa, I just installed the latest version...

- Why can't I drag the scrollbar?

- Why does it resize while I'm scrolling? It should only resize if content is added or removed. It gets smaller as it scrolls by a folder with many images and bigger for folder with few images - that would be like IE's scrollbar resizing if I go scroll down a page depending on which area of the page has text vs. white space. Makes no sense at all.

- and the center slider? Makes no sense - just let me drag the scrollbar thingy and I can get to where I want to faster.

- if I zoom in one a picture and click on the Red X that is in every Windows program - why does it zoom out instead of closing picasa? It's not like it opened a new window.


I find that the free Adobe Photoshop Album Starter Edition is a better product and has a much better way to view picture by timeline.
 

xsarien

daedsiluap
Pimpwerx said:
Let's not forget, Intel and MS werer pretty innovative and aggressive companies, until their got weighed down by their overwhelming success. PEACE.

One thing, and then a brief rant:
AMD's been a nice little wake up call to Intel.

Anyway, Microsoft, despite the corporate line, is not that innovative. DOS was bought and paid for in the early 80s; the only reason Windows exists is because IBM had asked Microsoft to join them in developing OS/2, but Microsoft bolted and did their own version. (I'm surprised IBM didn't try to sue.)

Internet Explorer - in the beginning - was largely based on technology from Spyglass, and was slowly (very) turned into Microsoft's own product. And even today, the program is largely stagnating. Why? Because Microsoft has no reason to update it, even with Firefox's feature list breathing down its neck.

WebTV was bought; their DVR service was designed to compete with TiVo, WinCE/Windows Mobile only exists because Microsoft couldn't stand to lose marketshare to Palm. There's nothing terribly innovative about the XBox, either. Look at its guts: It's a closed off PC running a modified version of NT. Hell, Microsoft Flight Simulator? Built on the subLogic empire of the 80s.

So what are we left with that's a truly original, "innovative" Microsoft product?

Bob.

Is this the innovation Microsoft was talking about at the anti-trust hearings? Do you notice a pattern? Microsoft rarely leads. They follow, mimic, and try to drown out the real innovators with marketing and nigh-illegal business practices.
 

DarienA

The black man everyone at Activision can agree on
CaptainABAB said:
The latest GDS is not in beta anymore - it wasn't in beta since early March or so.

Well hell where is that one? Because whenever I use a search from my desktop it says right on the web page.. Beta.
 

scorcho

testicles on a cold fall morning
picasa is great, but that was already a mature product that was only helped by added $$.

GDS is a great idea in concept, but i'll wait for microsoft's imlimentation first as i'm sure that more developers will provide compatibility for that version over GDS

webaccelerator is very nice for what it does so far, though i wish there was a mechanism to limit the cache size. it's already worked wonders on speeding up the overloaded servers of deviantart
 

Kon Tiki

Banned
· Google Web Accelerator sends requests for web pages, except for secure web pages (HTTPS), to Google, which logs these requests. Some web pages may embed personal information in these page requests.

· Google receives and temporarily caches cookie data that your computer sends with webpage requests in order to improve performance.

How about no. :lol
 

CaptainABAB

Member
DarienA said:
Well hell where is that one? Because whenever I use a search from my desktop it says right on the web page.. Beta.

You have to download the latest one - it doesn't update it for you automatically.

If you go to the About link within the desktop search page, you have the latest if it says...

"Google Desktop Search 20050227"
 
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