P:axMagellanic
Member
Downstairs is fine, my bedroom is absolutely sweltering though in this humidity lol
More Europeans die from the heat each year than Americans die from guns
- Thread starter EviLore
- Start date
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I was at a Home depot and saw an AC for just $150. The energy cost for it per year was $44.
If Europe cant afford that then they need to all retire and let the next generation handle things going forward. Complete and utter failure from everyone in charge.
We need a revolution in the streets. It's insane how complacent people have gotten in the today's world.
If Europe cant afford that then they need to all retire and let the next generation handle things going forward. Complete and utter failure from everyone in charge.
We need a revolution in the streets. It's insane how complacent people have gotten in the today's world.
Miles708
Member
Price here goes from 300€ to 8000€ (plus the mounting which ranges from 200 to 900 €) and you have to couple it with one of the priciest energy bills in the developed world, just to use 2 weeks and forget it.
I don't say it isn't useful but mama's got bills.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Right, but it shouldnt cost that much. i get that you have 20% VAT, but that should cover the higher import taxes. The tech inside these ACs is ancient by this point and is extremely cheap to manufacture. And like i said, VERY sustainable in terms of energy consumption. It's not the 80s or 90s anymore, these things dont even cost that much to run.
I installed a 16 SEER central HVAC system a few years ago and my energy bill went down after i upgraded from the OG system that was installed when the house was built in the 90s. The tech is better, its not about the environment, just let people survive.
Miles708
Member
I suspect costs are also tied to the fact that, as many said in the thread, AC was mainly and effectively a luxury accessory up until 5 or 6 years ago.
Up until 10 years ago, it was EXTREMELY rare for temperatures go above 30°C even in August. You could live with a fan, no problem.
This changed rapidly nowadays, temperatures have risen incredibly fast, faster than the market, and the general mindset, realized.
I am going to suspect the market for AC systems is going to get much more competitive in the coming years, driving prices down across the board.
Zathalus
Member
€210 for the cheapest unit (9k BTU) here on Amazon. Roughly €40 to run it for 12 hours per day for a full month straight. Well, at least in my city.
MisterFalcon
Member
Weird, I have not noticed any power cuts.
Of course if you go to the Daily Mail article this is not about rationing, as in cutting existing availibility of power, but limits on future capacity users.
And this is mostly due to the companies requesting capacity for future development hedging their bets and requesting capacity for their one new datacenter in multiple regions. This uses up even more future capacity as everyone else does the same thing to not be the one left out and before you know it there is a billion GW in requested capacity for only a fraction of that actually being built. The extra costs in requesting six locations instead of one are obviously way too low and some limits have to be set which is now being done.
Unknown Soldier
Member
If Europe isn't planning on building new datacenters and new electricity generation capacity they are finished
Both America and China are racing to dominate the AI driven future, Europe will just be left behind even more than it already has if they don't plan to do anything (and it sure doesn't seem like they are)
Bojji
Member
50% of people without jobs? What a fucking exciting future that is...
Europe is behind mostly because IT giants (Google, Meta, Apple, MS, Nvidia etc.), USA GDP skyrocketed because of them since 2008. Does much higher GDP means that average American has more money now than in 200x? Not really, all that money is in hands of the richest people.
MarV0
Member
I think Europe can survive without asking the "AI" what to cook for dinner for 5 people.
I live in the most multi cultural city of Europe and I've never met a rich American. The Americans I know that do have a bit of money are all terrified of getting ill and spending all their money on medical bills.
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Unknown Soldier
Member
In reality Americans have gotten richer than they have ever been50% of people without jobs? What a fucking exciting future that is...
Europe is behind mostly because IT giants (Google, Meta, Apple, MS, Nvidia etc.), USA GDP skyrocketed because of them since 2008. Does much higher GDP means that average American has more money now than in 200x? Not really, all that money is in hands of the richest people.
The U.S. added a thousand new millionaires a day in 2024: Report
America's millionaire population totals 23.8 million, the most of any country, according to a new study by UBS.
www.cnbc.com
The Death of the Amex Lounge: Why the Upper Middle Class Isn't Special Anymore
On the rise of the upper middle class and the problems that came with it.
ofdollarsanddata.com
There are 23.8 million millionaires in America. The country has a total population of around 334 million. This means 7.1% of the population of the United States are millionaires. If you haven't met a millionaire from America you just haven't tried very hard
Bojji
Member
In reality Americans have gotten richer than they have ever been
The U.S. added a thousand new millionaires a day in 2024: Report
America's millionaire population totals 23.8 million, the most of any country, according to a new study by UBS.
The Death of the Amex Lounge: Why the Upper Middle Class Isn't Special Anymore
On the rise of the upper middle class and the problems that came with it.
There are 23.8 million millionaires in America. The country has a total population of around 334 million. This means 7.1% of the population of the United States are millionaires. If you haven't met a millionaire from America you just haven't tried very hard
I was talking about average man/woman. Millionaires? Good for them I guess...
Zathalus
Member
Being a millionaire ain't that hot shit anymore, by that definition I am one as well. Naturally most of it is tied up in the value of my house. So I certainly don't feel like one, I'm well off but I'm certainly not going to be driving a Lambo anytime soon. I'm stuck with the company Tesla.
Also interestingly from that article " Luxembourg and Switzerland have higher concentrations of wealth. In both countries, more than one in seven adults are worth at least $1 million, according to UBS. "
As for datacenters, almost €120 billion worth are currently in construction/planning across Europe, but let's not have facts stand in the way of feelings.
Also interestingly from that article " Luxembourg and Switzerland have higher concentrations of wealth. In both countries, more than one in seven adults are worth at least $1 million, according to UBS. "
As for datacenters, almost €120 billion worth are currently in construction/planning across Europe, but let's not have facts stand in the way of feelings.
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Unknown Soldier
Member
StreetsofBeige
Member
As tweet says, you dont even have to invest in a structured way to hit a million by 65. Anyone can do anything whether it's stocks, ETF/index funds or real estate to make money at any age.
But also, there should lessons in building wealth by teaching people to save money too. Somehow people have giant credit card debt at 22% when that should be last thing to go on debt on with a balance because it's the highest interest paid. It should only be used for desperate situations, or if someone can pay it off every month then sure go use it and get reward pts. But people load up on buying shit they dont need and it gets to that tipping point the balance and interest is not payable vs their income and payments. So it's a forever spiral of debt unless they can scrape up funds from fam and friends to help pay it off.
Problem is a lot of people are live for today. So that's why gov's instituted pension funds and senior citizen payouts later in life. It's hard to fault someone saving if they truly never had a decent paying job or never even held a steady job due to health reasons, or being handicapped etc... But most people are able bodied, able minded, and work a decent enough job to save without needing gov help.
Gov takes money off your pay cheque acting like adult babysitters holding it. And then give you it back at old man age because they know most Joe and Jane Idiots cant save. It's literally no different than mom and dad telling their 6 year old to save all their bday money in a piggybank. And then crack it open years later. If you let Little Timmy go hog wild with his allowance and Xmas money, he'll likely not save up for when he's older and wants to buy his own clothes at the mall.
StreetsofBeige
Member
True.
The technical definition is $1M net asset value. Anyone with lots of their net worth tied up in home equity or a bunch of sports cars isnt going to be cash rich.
The definition my fam has always used is the cash rich way. A millionaire is any of us who are debt free with house and car paid off etc.... plus $1M in liquid assets. You are totally right with your definition though. And that millionaire view is the same thing my dad told us long time ago. Means jack shit if it's all tied up. Though technically if someone runs into a shitty situation, you can always sell and rake in the cash to use it for something else and in the meantime, downsize or rent.
MaestroMike
Gold Member
harder for blood to flow and oxygen to get to the muscles that need it you'll cramp more and become more stiff. green/fruits and other veggies contain the electrolytes and micronutrients the muscles will need and just consume that along with drinking more water and you'll replenish whatever is lost through sweat. when Im done working and sweating and ready to cool down a bit I'll eat more macros and calories and then keep warm until I'm ready to sleep and cool down more. that's what I'm doing now I still like wearing a shirt and sweater outside even when its hot and jacket when its a bit cooler in mourning or night
Sony
Banned
This is patently false. There is no EU regulation that bans the use of mobile or window AC unit use. They are being sold in many member states. Also, The EU cannot make rules on what applicances can hang out the window or not, that is local legislation. The only thing the EU can do is set energy related requirements for the energy labeling of products, but people can stills buy them.Window air conditioning units, the cheap, convenient, effective cooling solution in response to a heat wave, are effectively banned in Europe due to EU regulations on energy efficiency and noise (and having anything stick out of your window, and probably several other regulations I'm not aware of). Portable hose-exhaust type AC units are sold in stores, passing regulation for some reason, despite being almost useless. The typical recommended solution is a split duct wall-mounted AC, which is not a viable solution for renters lacking AC.
This seems...unreasonable.
The article or the post needs to be rectified on this point because it's absurd misinformation.
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Mattyp
Not the YouTuber
No battery yet but on absolute peak summer days I'll generate 240kWh in a single day.
We get paid for each kW we feed back into the grid so it covers night time usage as well. Have had a $0 electricity bill for 3 years now since install.
>According to the EcoDesign Directive 2009/125/EC and Commission Regulation (EU) No 206/2012, SEER thresholds for air conditioners were set at 3.6 from 2013, and 4.6 from 2014. Since window units can't meet these limits, particularly the 4.6 SEER, they effectively became non-compliant. Additionally, Commission Delegated Regulation (EU) No 626/2011, which sets energy class standards, prohibits air conditioners below class D (SEER < 2.6) starting in 2013. Therefore, window air conditioners fail to meet these requirements.
>Commission Regulation (EU) No 626/2011 sets energy class labels ranging from A+++ to G, but class G, while the lowest, doesn't prohibit units. The real restriction comes from EcoDesign Regulation (EU) No 206/2012, which imposes minimum efficiency thresholds, effectively phasing out less efficient units. These regulations are interconnected, with 206/2012 enforcing minimum standards. Directive 2002/31/EC previously governed labeling but got replaced in 2011. For detailed info, sources on lines from 206/2012 and 626/2011 referencing the energy label classification are useful to consult.
>The key regulations in the EU restricting window-style air conditioners are the EcoDesign Regulation 206/2012 and Energy Labelling Regulation 626/2011, part of broader directives 2009/125/EC and 2010/30/EU. These regulations set efficiency requirements such as the need for a Seasonal Energy Efficiency Ratio (SEER) of 4.6 starting January 2014, which window units typically can't meet, effectively banning them. These units are categorized under "room air conditioners" and face restrictions through Ecodesign tiers 1 and 2, impacting their market eligibility.
>According to the EU regulations, fixed single-package units, such as window air conditioners, need to meet specific energy efficiency standards. Regulations like the EcoDesign Regulation 206/2012 and Energy Labelling Regulation 626/2011 require a minimum SEER of 3.6 by 2013 and 4.6 by 2014, which most window AC units cannot achieve. These regulations effectively phase out inefficient units. Additionally, new labeling requirements further limit market competitiveness for low-efficiency units. We should double-check if "fixed single package" includes window ACs.
>Under EU regulations, the EcoDesign Regulation 206/2012 set minimum SEER thresholds of 3.6 for 2013 and 4.6 for 2014, which most window AC units couldn't meet. These units, often having EERs below 3, are effectively banned after 2014. The Energy Labelling Regulation 626/2011 ties into this by requiring a minimum efficiency class, and also banning F-G labels. These regulations together effectively exclude low-efficiency window air conditioners from the market.
>Window-style air conditioning units were effectively forced out of the EU market due to energy efficiency regulations. Commission Delegated Regulation (EU) No 626/2011 introduces energy labeling, scoring window units on a scale from A+++ to D. Typically, they fall under F or G, which were banned starting in 2013 under Ecodesign Regulation (EU) No 206/2012. Tier 1 (2013) set a SEER threshold of 3.6, while Tier 2 (2014) raised it to 4.6, a level many window units can't meet.
Sony
Banned
Read carefully what I said: "There is no EU regulation that bans the use of mobile or window AC unit use".
You can buy these or similar ACs and use them. They're on the market in EU. And if you use them, there is no EU police that will take them away from you.
You first.
TDiddyLive
Member
![L*][*N*K](/data/avatars/m/842/842515.jpg?1750247637){kind=avatar}
Unknown Soldier
Member
ForAcademicPurposes
Gold Member
I'm listening to snowy themed music to cope with the heatwaves blasting my ass.
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HeisenbergFX4
Member
Forsete
Member
IDKFA
I am Become Bilbo Baggins
It has nothing to do with Russia, does it? At least, I don't remember seeing Russia mentioned in the Financial Times article.
The reasons are due to the aggressive shift to heat pumps, EVs, solar, and hydrogen, which have dramatically increased electricity demand.
However, grid expansion has been under invested for decades and can't keep up with the increased demand. It can be fixed, but it will take years and cost hundreds of billions.
I guess Russia might be indirectly involved with the natural gas supply, but it's not the root cause.
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Zathalus
Member
One of the reasons. The various reasons are not enough investing into upgrading the grid, EVs taking off, solar power at home putting more pressure on the grid, and the general shift from gas (accelerated due to the gas cutoff from Russia). So the issue is the Netherlands has plenty of electricity but the grid is not equipped to handle the load. Thus the waiting time for new connections.
Senua
Member
TIL, don't argue with Evilore lol
Kenneth Haight
Gold Member
MarV0
Member
Not hard to find: https://www.mediamarkt.de/de/category/mobile-klimaanlagen-799.html
Mobile aIr cons are not banned within the EU by any means, they can be bought from anywhere.
They are trash though compared to proper split units.
Mobile aIr cons are not banned within the EU by any means, they can be bought from anywhere.
They are trash though compared to proper split units.
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MidGenRefresh
*Refreshes biennially
Might be trash but they can cool your bedroom from 30°C to comfortable 21°C without an issue. I use something like this in one of the bedrooms upstairs and it's a life saver. And yes, I'm in the EU and no EU police knocked on my door yet.
kevboard
Member
there are some really good ones tho,
if you have a way to place the outside part, the Porta Split is supposedly real damn good
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Ironbunny
Member
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kevboard
Member
Forsete
Member
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Unknown Soldier
Member
And I thought Korean Fan Death was wild...
StreetsofBeige
Member
So if it's 15 fahrenheit cooler indoors people go nuts.
Wow, who knew anyone with AC goes haywire. And this also includes all the people in Europe already who have AC at home, and all people who work, eat at retsuarants, go to school or drive a car with AC on.
Days like these...
Have a Blessed Day
I think Europe thinks Air Conditioning is American cultural imperialism and before they know it they'll all be shooting each other just like us. It's the only logical reason why so many are so vehemently opposed to it.
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NeoIkaruGAF
Gold Member
No, it's probably that most people in Europe think unbearably hot days are just a small part of an average summer. Plus, most of Europe is in the temperate zone, and there's quite a variety of climates in the continent, so the actual need for AC depends on where you are in Europe. Quite different from most of the Americas, especially the areas more interested by tourism.
"Europe" is too vague of a term here. The countries on the Mediterranean Sea naturally tend to be hotter, so the problem is much greater there and in the UK, where anything above 25C was practically hellfire up to a few years ago.
I don't know how it's going in the rest of Europe, but where I live, it's almost heaven compared to 2023 and 2024. I can go most days without using neither the AC, nor a fan. The AC has been broken for almost a month now at work, yet I can absolutely manage by keeping the windows open. In June, it was impossible without using at least a fan. I've been sleeping with just my window open for days now, and barely sweating. In 2023, even with a fan on, I would sweat like a pig and I'd wake up at 6AM because of the heat.
Considering this, I am not surprised if not a few people will delay their decision to put AC in their home for one more year.
Again, I'm really happy I had AC installed where I live, because it really makes the difference between getting stuff done and vegetating on the sofa all day long when it's really hot. But in a summer like this, I can't blame people for thinking it's not an absolute necessity.
Average temperatures have risen in the last decade, though. This is undeniable.
Days like these...
Have a Blessed Day
I should have said UK it seems like they're the ones more emphatic as to why it can't be done. At least from the responses on here. Summer comes every year but for some reason people love the "I'll only use it a few days" excuse