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[Ri'Orius]

The AMA has recently discovered a rare new medical condition called "Michaelson's Syndrome," affecting less than half of one percent of the population. In women, Michaelson's has been shown to cause an increase in muscle mass and bone density during puberty. The difference between a Michaelson's woman and the average woman decrease over time, but it is unclear if these changes ever entirely disappear.

Some sports organizations are considering banning Michaelson's women from competition, claiming that these physical differences constitute an unfair advantage. They suggest that Michaelson's women could compete in the men's division instead, although the physical advantages of men vastly outweigh those created by Michaelson's syndrome and such women would be at a severe disadvantage.

How crazy does that last paragraph sound in that context? Why does it suddenly make sense to people when we're talking about a different rare biological condition that happens to make some women stronger than the average?

 

[Retromelon]

dont west africans dominate marathon running because the elevation of where they lived gave them genetically higher capacity lungs, or something like that

 

[Jenov]

How crazy does that last paragraph sound in that context? Why does it suddenly make sense to people when we're talking about a different rare biological condition that happens to make some women stronger than the average?

What are you even quoting here? I can find no references to "Michaelson's Syndrome" on google.

 

[Althane]

What are you even quoting here? I can find no references to "Michaelson's Syndrome" on google.

He's describing transgenderism. Michaelson's not (to my knowledge) a real thing, he's making an example.

He's saying that if it were "Michaelson's Syndrome" people would treat it differently, but because it's a "Man wants to become a woman", people react poorly.

Spoiler

Or maybe I'm just wrong, Ri'Orius?

 

[Ketkat]

What are you even quoting here? I can find no references to "Michaelson's Syndrome" on google.

If such a syndrome existed, would you say that its okay to tell these women to just go compete in the men's? Nvm. Question lost its meaning by someone explaining it to you.

 

[Sunster]

I would lowkey love to see a 5'11 and under bball league. Would be interesting at least once to see

there is one, the PBA in Philippines is basically 5' 11 and under. It's got a lot of overseas talent specifically from US but most of the players are still under 6'. Not a lot of dunking going on.

dont west africans dominate marathon running because the elevation of where they lived gave them genetically higher capacity lungs, or something like that

That poster said black people, not West Africans.

 

[dr3upmushroom]

You mean separate but equal style of male, female, trans and colored ?

I mean there are some sports where black people have a HUGE genetic advantage...

Your posting in this thread has been treading on some very racist tones. Can you name these sports that Black people have a huge advantage?

 

[Poppy]

Your posting in this thread has been treading on some very racist tones. Can you name these sports that Black people have a huge advantage?

hoping that it is sarcasm, pretty sure that poster is brazilian so english is a second language

because that statement was literal racism

 

[Platy]

That poster said black people, not West Africans.

And people in this thread says trans people when they meant "trans people who transitioned in their late 30s" which they actualy meant as "humans who had higher testosterone than the average cis girls during puberty"

Like I said before, I was just using the same stuff people use to deny women to compete as women.

Sorry if it sounded bad.

Your posting in this thread has been treading on some very racist tones. Can you name these sports that Black people have a huge advantage?

If you read the other posts you would see that I was refering to the fact that there are more studies about Kenyans being better at racing than most people than there are studies showing that trans women are better than cis women.

 

[Sunster]

And people in this thread says trans people when they meant "trans people who transitioned in their late 30s" which they actualy meant as "humans who had higher testosterone than the average cis girls during puberty"

Like I said before, I was just using the same stuff people use to deny women to compete as women.

Sorry if it sounded bad.



If you read the other posts you would see that I was refering to the fact that there are more studies about Kenyans being better at racing than most people than there are studies showing that trans women are better than cis women.

but you said black people first, not Kenyans. That's some eugenics type shit. That's why you are getting dog piled.

 

[A Link to the Past]

It was inappropriate to say black people, but at the same time a lot of people find the debate about whether AMAB trans people should be able to compete in female Olympic games, mainly because it's not for any scientific reason, but rather emotional. So while I can understand the issues with what Platy originally posted (and clarified/corrected ultimately), people are still making rather offensive comments on trans people in this context.

 

[Ketkat]

but you said black people first, not Kenyans. That's some eugenics type shit. That's why you are getting dog piled.

And within 2 posts of the entire thread, was clarified to mean Kenyans. Even if Platy was talking about all black people, it still kind of illustrated the point perfectly.

You have an issue with people saying things that are racist, such as "Black people have a genetic advantage in sports" But you don't seem to have an issue with people saying transphobic things in the same vein?

Listen, it has been 610 posts in this thread. And no one has given a single article that shows transwomen have an advantage over ciswomen in sports. You can not condemn something that comes off offensive relating to race, and then pretend that people saying the exact same thing about transwomen isn't somehow offensive.

 

[Sunster]

It was inappropriate to say black people, but at the same time a lot of people find the debate about whether AMAB trans people should be able to compete in female Olympic games, mainly because it's not for any scientific reason, but rather emotional. So while I can understand the issues with what Platy originally posted (and clarified/corrected ultimately), people are still making rather offensive comments on trans people in this context.

yea this thread is almost completely science free. just bold claims.

And within 2 posts of the entire thread, was clarified to mean Kenyans. Even if Platy was talking about all black people, it still kind of illustrated the point perfectly.

You have an issue with people saying things that are racist, such as "Black people have a genetic advantage in sports" But you don't seem to have an issue with people saying transphobic things in the same vein?

Listen, it has been 610 posts in this thread. And no one has given a single article that shows transwomen have an advantage over ciswomen in sports. You can not condemn something that comes off offensive relating to race, and then pretend that people saying the exact same thing about transwomen isn't somehow offensive.

ahmmmmm have you read my posts ITT? I've been calling for evidence from people saying Trans athletes have an advantage I take issue with the tansphobia ITT and his connection to black people.

 

[hydrophilic attack]

This is a pretty genuine question. Now that you know trans people have been in the Olympics for 14 years, does that change your view on it?

For instance, if trans people really had such an overwhelming advantage when it came to the Olympics/competitive sports, would they not have been dominating it at some point since then? I mean, you didn't know it was even allowed, so I don't see how it could be problematic.

I'm not sure what is best. Regardless of what is best, it obviously wouldn't be fair to everyone involved to change overnight a system that has already been in place for 14 years. I'd probably argue a wait and see approach. Keep the current system, but be prepared to change it if a large proportion of future champions are trans females. If so, change it into a three or four bracket system

 

[CyclopsRock]

Do there just need to be four different divisions, rather than two, going forward?

Why not one? Genuinely. If we a) accept that gender is fluid but that b) sex can affect physical development, why not just a single division. Strongest person wins, next strongest comes second. Sure, someone born a woman will likely never win it, but then nor will someone born in a 5ft3 frame or with weak knees.

 

[UFO]

You mean separate but equal style of male, female, trans and colored ?

I mean there are some sports where black people have a HUGE genetic advantage...

The genetic difference between humans is very small. People from certain regions might average 2-3" taller, but overall it accounts for a very small "genetic advantage" in sports. People like the Kenyans have a conditioning advantage. From a young age they're expected to walk a lot, add to that living at high elevation, add to that a culture of long distance running, and you have a nation thats very successful in a certain sport. But this is not genetics at work.

 

[poppabk]

The genetic difference between humans is very small. People from certain regions might average 2-3" taller, but overall it accounts for a very small "genetic advantage" in sports. People like the Kenyans have a conditioning advantage. From a young age they're expected to walk a lot, add to that living at high elevation, add to that a culture of long distance running, and you have a nation thats very successful in a certain sport. But this is not genetics at work.

http://www.npr.org/sections/paralle...kenyan-tribe-produces-the-worlds-best-runners
https://www.theatlantic.com/interna...runners-a-story-of-genes-and-cultures/256015/
There is still a discussion about how a specific group of Kenyans dominate distance running, and it is likely that genetics plays a large role, albeit in a very small way.

 

[airmangataosenai]

Laurel Hubbard

 

[-Plasma Reus-]

dont west africans dominate marathon running because the elevation of where they lived gave them genetically higher capacity lungs, or something like that

That's east africans. And it's because of elongated and lighter bone structure.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Laurel Hubbard

Yes that's her

 

[Platy]

Laurel Hubbard

Yes, we had a pic on the first pages

 

[ipukespiders]

132kg is in a 90+ class? Heavier athletes need to be in heavier classes. A person of this size should be in a 105+ class or higher. I wouldn't want to compete with someone 42kg heavier than me. Sinclair score or otherwise.

That being said, Laurel only hits 123kg snatch and 145kg clean & jerk, which shouldn't be world class. I guess not enough women get into weightlifting.

Now Eileen Cikamatana hits 100kg snatch and 136kg clean & jerk @ 78kg bodyweight. That's impressive.