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[riskVSreward]

Tyler, thanks for reviewing my ban.

I'm gonna speak on this because I've been away for awhile. I'm sure it's been discussed to death, but I'd like to get it off my chest.

ResetERA resembles the absolute worst aspect of GAF's history, magnified, and blown completely out of proportion. You may think that October was the mass exodus of much of GAF's talent and allure, but I assure you, those people had quietly been swept out one at a time over the course of a decade. Interesting posters who created a lot of OC on the forums, as well as prominent game developers of all stripes, all removed slowly over time until it really accelerated around the election (for reasons most are aware of by now and I will refrain from getting into). I could sit here and rattle off names for the next two hours that almost everyone would remember fondly, but were banned or compelled to leave LONG before the election madness pushed this to critical mass.

When I first signed up, many moons ago and after a long period of lurking, GAF was a very different place. People were expected to learn the forum culture, Juniors were put in their place, and no one cried foul if you rustled their jimmies a little. Ideas could flourish and dissent was welcomed. Avatar quotes weren't taboo and usually hilarious. The sense of community was tremendous, and you felt like you were a part of something big. There were no protected classes or identity politics. There were no banned games. There were no topics beyond reproach. Still, somehow, people got along and mostly conducted themselves respectfully. Shocking, I know.

Over the course of my tenure here, a contingent of people slowly rotted GAF from the inside out. They pruned the best of the best posters, one-by-one, under the auspices of faulty morality or sometimes just by being vindictive and power-hungry. Whether they realized it at the time or not, they were killing the forum's culture. They succeeded in forming an echo chamber that would inevitably collapse in on it's self like a dying star, only to then reconstruct an ersatz GAF once they finally sabotaged it. Many who tried to warn of this very thing happening were dogpiled and banned where they stood, the hill they chose to die on so to speak. If you want to know what the outcome of ERA is going to be, look no further than 10/24/17. Purity spirals and thought police will once again weed out the interesting individualistic posters until all that's left is an echo chamber, only this time they don't have to infiltrate a site slowly over time, they get to be there from the very foundation.

The best thing we could do here is extend a hand of forgiveness to each person that gets pruned out of ERA for disagreeing with the mob. I think everyone should get one more chance, regardless of how shitty they went about their account suicide. Plenty of people will come to realize they backed the wrong horse when they are kicked off a gaming forum for not kowtowing to Orwellian group-think.

If authoritarian ban policies are an inevitable disaster, then why don't we institute the exact opposite policy? I would personally just clear out all the bans in the entire history of the site and allow people to come back at their will. I'm sure plenty would use that opportunity to hurl insults and suicide again, but in doing so will expose themselves and at least we will have taken the high road. I'm sure this will be a contentious idea, but here on Neo-NeoGAF I shouldn't worry about contentious ideas getting me permanently banned. Just tell me if you think it's a shit idea or not and we can talk about it.

The most important lesson to learn here is that you can co-exist with people who don't agree with you about everything, especially online. You can have disagreements respectfully, without running to a compromised mod to sort things out for you (ban people). It is through dialectic discourse that we can learn truth, but first you have to accept that you don't already know everything.

That's just my 2 doge coins on the matter. I personally never signed up at ERA.

Also, can we get the classic smileys back? :lol

 

[I'm new be nice]

NeoGAF's become a dumping ground for people banned from ResetERA and they spend their entire days bitching about ResetERA and it's moderation.

That's a little harsh dude.

I can only speak for myself, but I never signed up for Era or requested an account during the apocalypse because I seriously did not agree with the way things were going and I chose not to join them on principle, and I suspect a lot of users here felt the same way.

And even still, I wished them the best and felt sad to see them go, and I think we all would have been better off if we had figured out how to keep communicating.

 

[American]

Tyler, thanks for reviewing my ban.

I'm gonna speak on this because I've been away for awhile. I'm sure it's been discussed to death, but I'd like to get it off my chest.

ResetERA resembles the absolute worst aspect of GAF's history, magnified, and blown completely out of proportion. You may think that October was the mass exodus of much of GAF's talent and allure, but I assure you, those people had quietly been swept out one at a time over the course of a decade. Interesting posters who created a lot of OC on the forums, as well as prominent game developers of all stripes, all removed slowly over time until it really accelerated around the election (for reasons most are aware of by now and I will refrain from getting into). I could sit here and rattle off names for the next two hours that almost everyone would remember fondly, but were banned or compelled to leave LONG before the election madness pushed this to critical mass.

When I first signed up, many moons ago and after a long period of lurking, GAF was a very different place. People were expected to learn the forum culture, Juniors were put in their place, and no one cried foul if you rustled their jimmies a little. Ideas could flourish and dissent was welcomed. Avatar quotes weren't taboo and usually hilarious. The sense of community was tremendous, and you felt like you were a part of something big. There were no protected classes or identity politics. There were no banned games. There were no topics beyond reproach. Still, somehow, people got along and mostly conducted themselves respectfully. Shocking, I know.

Over the course of my tenure here, a contingent of people slowly rotted GAF from the inside out. They pruned the best of the best posters, one-by-one, under the auspices of faulty morality or sometimes just by being vindictive and power-hungry. Whether they realized it at the time or not, they were killing the forum's culture. They succeeded in forming an echo chamber that would inevitably collapse in on it's self like a dying star, only to then reconstruct an ersatz GAF once they finally sabotaged it. Many who tried to warn of this very thing happening were dogpiled and banned where they stood, the hill they chose to die on so to speak. If you want to know what the outcome of ERA is going to be, look no further than 10/24/17. Purity spirals and thought police will once again weed out the interesting individualistic posters until all that's left is an echo chamber, only this time they don't have to infiltrate a site slowly over time, they get to be there from the very foundation.

The best thing we could do here is extend a hand of forgiveness to each person that gets pruned out of ERA for disagreeing with the mob. I think everyone should get one more chance, regardless of how shitty they went about their account suicide. Plenty of people will come to realize they backed the wrong horse when they are kicked off a gaming forum for not kowtowing to Orwellian group-think.

If authoritarian ban policies are an inevitable disaster, then why don't we institute the exact opposite policy? I would personally just clear out all the bans in the entire history of the site and allow people to come back at their will. I'm sure plenty would use that opportunity to hurl insults and suicide again, but in doing so will expose themselves and at least we will have taken the high road. I'm sure this will be a contentious idea, but here on Neo-NeoGAF I shouldn't worry about contentious ideas getting me permanently banned. Just tell me if you think it's a shit idea or not and we can talk about it.

The most important lesson to learn here is that you can co-exist with people who don't agree with you about everything, especially online. You can have disagreements respectfully, without running to a compromised mod to sort things out for you (ban people). It is through dialectic discourse that we can learn truth, but first you have to accept that you don't already know everything.

That's just my 2 doge coins on the matter. I personally never signed up at ERA.

Also, can we get the classic smileys back? :lol

This is an excellent post and quite a few things you have written here sum up my feelings precisely. What you've written here is also useful in explaining to those* questioning why I only created an account recently. Aside from these posters* not knowing there is a type of member, both registered and unregistered, known as a 'lurker', who doesn't feel any burning desire to post obsessively, the simple fact is you didn't need an account to enjoy NeoGAF. Simply reading it was fun and interesting.

Off-topic was rich and varied, especially around 2009-2014, with many awesome threads and members. My personal favourite members were Mama Robotnik, viciouskillerquirrel and JaseC for his tremendous knowledge/guesswork on all things related to Steam.

Although members here strangely celebrate the October event as something 'that needed to happen', it's effects will leave a permanent and irreversible impact on NeoGAF. This place won't ever be as big as it was, and that's not due to any lack of effort on Evilore, who does seem to be trying.

There's one HUGE reason for that, but a smaller, but important, one is because there's simply too many different avenues to discuss games nowadays. In the past, NeoGAF was the single biggest and active place, but now you have Twitch, Discord, Twitter, Youtube, and especially Reddit (as well as individual forums of massive games such as LoL or Overwatch, Fortnite, etc...). Some banned people will come back, but most will have found new places, forged new online friendships and people they play online with, etc... NeoGAF refugees will have found new places to settle down and create happy homes. Publishers themselves promote their titles subreddits as a place to have discussions. I myself love Stardew Valley and the subreddit there is warm and friendly. With no politics either, thank fuck.

So October event... not really something people should be glad for. In my humblest of opinion.


*mod edit: replaced dimwits with new words. If you are genuinely interested in posting in this thread, do not carry over prejudices from other interactions with posters. You are new here, but if you want to really be heard and instigate change think how you present yourself and how you are perceived based on your first few posts.

 

[Kadayi]

That's a little harsh dude.

I can only speak for myself, but I never signed up for Era or requested an account during the apocalypse because I seriously did not agree with the way things were going and I chose not to join them on principle, and I suspect a lot of users here felt the same way.

And even still, I wished them the best and felt sad to see them go, and I think we all would have been better off if we had figured out how to keep communicating.

This.

The fiction that GAF is now somehow the refugee Centre for all that's unacceptable at Reset is such a laughable reach. One look at who they were appointing as moderators was enough to know for anyone not on board with the group think that registering there was a waste of time.

 

[Redneckerz]

I don't recollect being abusive first, or throwing around accusations of trolling. 'Picking a fight with other people when you clearly aren't doing that with good intentions'? Why, that almost sounds like something I'd read on Restera.

Not that i said anything to the sort, rather than that your tone of posting (As the rest of your post shows) does not seem been based out good good intentions.

But, you redeemed yourself later on (somewhat), so there is that.

NeoGAF's become a dumping ground for people banned from ResetERA and they spend their entire days bitching about ResetERA and it's moderation.

Kinda ironic how that worked out.

Yes, i am sure many of use do. Or, people are also great threads worthy of discussion. And aside that, there is enough to bitch about ERA in a reasonable manner, unlike most of Voat and a lot of on Kiwi.

Although members here strangely celebrate the October event as something 'that needed to happen', it's effects will leave a permanent and irreversible impact on NeoGAF. This place won't ever be as big as it was, and that's not due to any lack of effort on Evilore, who does seem to be trying.

Nor does it have to be as big as it used to be. What i care about more is that users and moderators and admins can take a swing and you dont instantly jump against the ceiling. Atleast on that, Evilore has been making work.

Do i think the October event would have occurred if everyone stayed afloat? Eventually, yes, i think it would have. At some point you reach a boiling point where every thing that can be deemed significant will be used as a tool of resistance. The October Carnage was one such outburst.

And no, that does not excuse the behaviors of OldGAF, far and large, but it also means that at some point the spite has to stop. Else you get the US political system if you don't.

 

[dolabla]

That's a little harsh dude.

I can only speak for myself, but I never signed up for Era or requested an account during the apocalypse because I seriously did not agree with the way things were going and I chose not to join them on principle, and I suspect a lot of users here felt the same way.

And even still, I wished them the best and felt sad to see them go, and I think we all would have been better off if we had figured out how to keep communicating.

100% agree

I have never signed up for an account and never will sign up for an account over there. All the trouble that made this site what it became left with them. And they're doing the same things over there, but I think this time it is actually worse than what GAF even became.

I'll laugh at them from afar though because some of the most outrageous shit you'll ever read on internet is posted there. So outrageous it reads like satire............. but it's not . There's pretty much a Nazi on every corner.......... at least according to them. The site would make a great South Park episode

 

[American]

Not that i said anything to the sort, rather than that your tone of posting (As the rest of your post shows) does not seem been based out good good intentions.

But, you redeemed yourself later on (somewhat), so there is that.


Yes, i am sure many of use do. Or, people are also great threads worthy of discussion. And aside that, there is enough to bitch about ERA in a reasonable manner, unlike most of Voat and a lot of on Kiwi.


Nor does it have to be as big as it used to be. What i care about more is that users and moderators and admins can take a swing and you dont instantly jump against the ceiling. Atleast on that, Evilore has been making work.

Do i think the October event would have occurred if everyone stayed afloat? Eventually, yes, i think it would have. At some point you reach a boiling point where every thing that can be deemed significant will be used as a tool of resistance. The October Carnage was one such outburst.

And no, that does not excuse the behaviors of OldGAF, far and large, but it also means that at some point the spite has to stop. Else you get the US political system if you don't.

You seem like an alright and very friendly, nice guy

 

[Bill O'Rights]

Thanks for your post riskVSreward , it is insightful and helps when we discuss which direction to take the site in. Obviously our owner and overlord EviLore has taken his share of the blame for the events that were allowed to unfold and did unfold. He has also provided context for a lot of behind the scenes issues that were obfuscated. Although you do not have full sight of the complexities and volume of data, logs and records they are quite sizeable and he is seeing to each one personally to make amends and provide a sense of justice.


The moderation should not shape the community, but equally good moderation cannot be held hostage to the community either. Over the course of the last few years what you describe is an accurate reflection of certain aspects of the sub communities.


You are also right in that a lot of really good contributors were driven out or ban baited due to issues being dealt with in this thread. And we are aware that not everyone chose to burn all bridges when they left. And we have no vindictive feelings towards them. There were/are some very good level headed posters that we do lament the loss of, and they will always welcome back.


We have a lot of exciting things in the pipeline, a full redesign is currently in concept stages with working alpha and is progressing in the background. We will be introducing more integration along the way.


As our friend American points out, sites that are just forums are being superceded and need to offer something a bit different. Just before the end, GAF was essentially a news aggregator (which was useful), followed by mainly off-the-cuff reaction posts. There were the odd nuanced and long posts but they were either in narrowly focused topics or between posters with a long established affinity.


What I can say is that the new iteration is a direct response to what we see an online community being and how it can interact better than inline threads and pages upon pages of community chat. These familiar feels will still be there as they serve a purpose, but we're really attempting to build something new for the modern age. Believe.


History can teach us lessons, and they are often harsh. What's important is that we take stock of them and move forward positively. Some will see this as a response to an undesiriable event, some will be cynical. And rightly so. The moderation team are very balanced, vary fair and only hand out bans as a last resort. People have mentioned the anonymity of mods and this was a conscious decision. It's not fair for a moderator to come into a thread and take a view for either side. Moderator's should be impartial and be able to moderate based on the content of the post and not the alignment of the argument. We don't want to be in the identity game of trying to build up a 'persona' of being a certain type of mod that people can call on because their views align with the poster.


It's been heartening to see the uptick in activity and users, and make no mistake old usernames are recognised and respected for previous contributions. Likewise some other posters ( Kadayi , @Claus Grimhildyr , Redneckerz IbizaPocholo , GoldenEye98 Corrik and too many others to namedrop), have started out on very good footings and show that there are enough level headed people that do just want to talk about video games and chew the fat over other topics without a huge personal investment or crusader label.

 

[AquaticSquirrel]

Tyler, thanks for reviewing my ban.

I'm gonna speak on this because I've been away for awhile. I'm sure it's been discussed to death, but I'd like to get it off my chest.

ResetERA resembles the absolute worst aspect of GAF's history, magnified, and blown completely out of proportion. You may think that October was the mass exodus of much of GAF's talent and allure, but I assure you, those people had quietly been swept out one at a time over the course of a decade. Interesting posters who created a lot of OC on the forums, as well as prominent game developers of all stripes, all removed slowly over time until it really accelerated around the election (for reasons most are aware of by now and I will refrain from getting into). I could sit here and rattle off names for the next two hours that almost everyone would remember fondly, but were banned or compelled to leave LONG before the election madness pushed this to critical mass.

When I first signed up, many moons ago and after a long period of lurking, GAF was a very different place. People were expected to learn the forum culture, Juniors were put in their place, and no one cried foul if you rustled their jimmies a little. Ideas could flourish and dissent was welcomed. Avatar quotes weren't taboo and usually hilarious. The sense of community was tremendous, and you felt like you were a part of something big. There were no protected classes or identity politics. There were no banned games. There were no topics beyond reproach. Still, somehow, people got along and mostly conducted themselves respectfully. Shocking, I know.

Over the course of my tenure here, a contingent of people slowly rotted GAF from the inside out. They pruned the best of the best posters, one-by-one, under the auspices of faulty morality or sometimes just by being vindictive and power-hungry. Whether they realized it at the time or not, they were killing the forum's culture. They succeeded in forming an echo chamber that would inevitably collapse in on it's self like a dying star, only to then reconstruct an ersatz GAF once they finally sabotaged it. Many who tried to warn of this very thing happening were dogpiled and banned where they stood, the hill they chose to die on so to speak. If you want to know what the outcome of ERA is going to be, look no further than 10/24/17. Purity spirals and thought police will once again weed out the interesting individualistic posters until all that's left is an echo chamber, only this time they don't have to infiltrate a site slowly over time, they get to be there from the very foundation.

The best thing we could do here is extend a hand of forgiveness to each person that gets pruned out of ERA for disagreeing with the mob. I think everyone should get one more chance, regardless of how shitty they went about their account suicide. Plenty of people will come to realize they backed the wrong horse when they are kicked off a gaming forum for not kowtowing to Orwellian group-think.

If authoritarian ban policies are an inevitable disaster, then why don't we institute the exact opposite policy? I would personally just clear out all the bans in the entire history of the site and allow people to come back at their will. I'm sure plenty would use that opportunity to hurl insults and suicide again, but in doing so will expose themselves and at least we will have taken the high road. I'm sure this will be a contentious idea, but here on Neo-NeoGAF I shouldn't worry about contentious ideas getting me permanently banned. Just tell me if you think it's a shit idea or not and we can talk about it.

The most important lesson to learn here is that you can co-exist with people who don't agree with you about everything, especially online. You can have disagreements respectfully, without running to a compromised mod to sort things out for you (ban people). It is through dialectic discourse that we can learn truth, but first you have to accept that you don't already know everything.

That's just my 2 doge coins on the matter. I personally never signed up at ERA.

Also, can we get the classic smileys back? :lol

Amazing post and echoes my thoughts exactly. Very well said. I think it's very important to not just look at the point of critical mass (elections to October 2017) it is also very important to look at the formative stages of what happened, it was very much a boiled frog situation. Slowly but surely unfolding before our eyes. I think it is important not to lose sight of the root when deciding the tree has grown too large and blocked out all light.

Which is why I keep bringing up the past long before 2016 elections because that is where everyone focuses too much attention. It is also why I keep mentioning about eventually unbanning tons of great posters who helped make NeoGaf what it was from the past. An interesting starting point could be the Den of Cunts thread, maybe un-ban anyone who seemed not too happy with the "PC Police" as they were known at the time who were eventually banned for not conforming to group think.

 

[Captain Zyrain]

Thanks for your post riskVSreward , it is insightful and helps when we discuss which direction to take the site in. Obviously our owner and overlord EviLore has taken his share of the blame for the events that were allowed to unfold and did unfold. He has also provided context for a lot of behind the scenes issues that were obfuscated. Although you do not have full sight of the complexities and volume of data, logs and records they are quite sizeable and he is seeing to each one personally to make amends and provide a sense of justice.


The moderation should not shape the community, but equally good moderation cannot be held hostage to the community either. Over the course of the last few years what you describe is an accurate reflection of certain aspects of the sub communities.


You are also right in that a lot of really good contributors were driven out or ban baited due to issues being dealt with in this thread. And we are aware that not everyone chose to burn all bridges when they left. And we have no vindictive feelings towards them. There were/are some very good level headed posters that we do lament the loss of, and they will always welcome back.


We have a lot of exciting things in the pipeline, a full redesign is currently in concept stages with working alpha and is progressing in the background. We will be introducing more integration along the way.


As our friend American points out, sites that are just forums are being superceded and need to offer something a bit different. Just before the end, GAF was essentially a news aggregator (which was useful), followed by mainly off-the-cuff reaction posts. There were the odd nuanced and long posts but they were either in narrowly focused topics or between posters with a long established affinity.


What I can say is that the new iteration is a direct response to what we see an online community being and how it can interact better than inline threads and pages upon pages of community chat. These familiar feels will still be there as they serve a purpose, but we're really attempting to build something new for the modern age. Believe.


History can teach us lessons, and they are often harsh. What's important is that we take stock of them and move forward positively. Some will see this as a response to an undesiriable event, some will be cynical. And rightly so. The moderation team are very balanced, vary fair and only hand out bans as a last resort. People have mentioned the anonymity of mods and this was a conscious decision. It's not fair for a moderator to come into a thread and take a view for either side. Moderator's should be impartial and be able to moderate based on the content of the post and not the alignment of the argument. We don't want to be in the identity game of trying to build up a 'persona' of being a certain type of mod that people can call on because their views align with the poster.


It's been heartening to see the uptick in activity and users, and make no mistake old usernames are recognised and respected for previous contributions. Likewise some other posters ( Kadayi , @Claus Grimhildyr , Redneckerz IbizaPocholo , GoldenEye98 Corrik and too many others to namedrop), have started out on very good footings and show that there are enough level headed people that do just want to talk about video games and chew the fat over other topics without a huge personal investment or crusader label.

Well said, looking forward to see what you have cooking!

I do think there is a point where an old-school forum hits a critical mass, and old-NeoGAF was certainly there. When topics can get blown off the first page in seconds, or comments never seen due to the sheer volume of posts and comments.. it turns into a different beast. I've ran smaller forums that had smaller examples of this, and it's hard to manage, especially with the old vBulletin software. It's a pleasant (for us users) side effect that things have slowed down here, as you can take your time to read the threads and take time responding and have a good conversation/interaction without 45 "fuck trump!" comments between the one you quoted and your response.

Obviously things will have an uptick and more people will come, so finding a way to shepherd the community forward without losing the community feeling will be key I think.

 

[Kagey K]

Hi Tyler,

I just wanted to come in here and say thank you for reviewing my ban. I'm happy to be back and look forward to seeing whats coming down the pipeline in the future.

 

[EviLore]

Confirmed: everyone who was temp banned at the time of the XF migration in January became inadvertently permabanned due to a permissions quirk between vb3 and xf2. Keep in mind that perms were being machine gunned out to people October-December with very little nuance (I was in anxiety mode and working on personal recovery...but I should've drank a bottle of vodka and done it all myself apparently lol, sans our present heroic sysadmins and a couple other folks -- you know who you are -- who all did a great job under duress back then), so while this is a small list of people, it's a small list of people whom I almost entirely recognize immediately as long-time regulars. And someone involved at the time thought each of those folks was a valuable contributor who should specifically *not* be permanently banned. It's "only" about 30 people but today I will contact them and explain what happened.

 

[AquaticSquirrel]

EviLore

Also...to speak 100% seriously at the risk of a possible ban: I honestly do think you should free laramie. Not because of some silly meme but the dude has been banned for almost 10 years I think. A banning so unjust that I still remember it to this day (mostly).

Obviously I'm not trying to make demands or something silly and maybe there is something behind the scenes I'm not aware of or some bad behavior but the fact that 10 years on I still remember the guy and still think his ban was bullshit says something I think. Anyway that's the last time I bring it up, just thought it was worth highlighting.

 

[EviLore]

Fair. I will evaluate Laramie's ban presently.

 

[EviLore]

EviLore

Also...to speak 100% seriously at the risk of a possible ban: I honestly do think you should free laramie. Not because of some silly meme but the dude has been banned for almost 10 years I think. A banning so unjust that I still remember it to this day (mostly).

Obviously I'm not trying to make demands or something silly and maybe there is something behind the scenes I'm not aware of or some bad behavior but the fact that 10 years on I still remember the guy and still think his ban was bullshit says something I think. Anyway that's the last time I bring it up, just thought it was worth highlighting.

Hrmmm. There's no actual Laramie in the database. I remember the user though and I don't think this was some ancient pre-2004 situation so it *should* be in the database.. There is a Laramie II who registered in 2013 and last visited in 2015 but hasn't posted; probably the same user. Any thoughts?

 

[Wheeljack539]

I got curious and actually tried to look it up and came across a thread from thebore circa 2008 and it seemed it was due to something with Dragona and that the threads themselves got deleted. From comments (from other FREE Laramie comments in GAF history) it sounded like the ban was considered bullshit but nothing exists anymore since the actual threads seemingly got nuked.

 

[AquaticSquirrel]

Hrmmm. There's no actual Laramie in the database. I remember the user though and I don't think this was some ancient pre-2004 situation so it *should* be in the database.. There is a Laramie II who registered in 2013 and last visited in 2015 but hasn't posted; probably the same user. Any thoughts?

Huh...I'm speechless. I definitely remember a poster called Laramie and it definitely happened after 2006 as I had only joined NeoGaf in 2006.

Could someone have deleted him from the database because everyone kept posting "free laramie" for a few years?

I've no idea if that functionality was present back then.

Oh well, if his account doesn't exist there is not much to review. I really do appreciate you trying though.

 

[Captain Zyrain]

Hrmmm. There's no actual Laramie in the database. I remember the user though and I don't think this was some ancient pre-2004 situation so it *should* be in the database.. There is a Laramie II who registered in 2013 and last visited in 2015 but hasn't posted; probably the same user. Any thoughts?

If you look here:

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/darw...-man-trying-to-kill-woman.157749/post-6490308

The quote says "Laramie said:" but the actual user is "Umino". Last post was July 2007.

Could the user name have been changed?

(Pardon the necrothread, it was the first I could find)

 

[EviLore]

If you look here:

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/darw...-man-trying-to-kill-woman.157749/post-6490308

The quote says "Laramie said:" but the actual user is "Umino". Last post was July 2007.

Could the user name have been changed?

(Pardon the necrothread, it was the first I could find)

That would be it, username change, yeah. I implemented a username change record in 2009 lol. Thanks.

 

[Captain Zyrain]

That would be it, username change, yeah. I implemented a username change record in 2009 lol. Thanks.

NP. VB3.. the devil.

This old thread: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/18-y...is-forzas-i-beg-to-differ.178886/post-7385648

Seems to imply Laramie used the word "homie" in perhaps a racially insensitive way? I dunno. The thread it links to doesn't seem to exist anymore, as it's something else now.

 

[AquaticSquirrel]

Detective GAF back in action! And for a good cause this time! Nicely spotted guys!

 

[American]

That would be it, username change, yeah. I implemented a username change record in 2009 lol. Thanks.

Any chance you could reply to my post from the previous page, boss?

I've been eagerly anticipating what you have to say

 

[EviLore]

Any chance you could reply to my post from the previous page, boss?

I've been eagerly anticipating what you have to say

Productivity or interviews with journalists; can't do both concurrently.

 

[AquaticSquirrel]

Any chance you could reply to my post from the previous page, boss?

I've been eagerly anticipating what you have to say

Damn it man! We may finally be able to correct a miscarriage of justice 10 years in the making. Your drama can wait!

 

[American]

Productivity or interviews with journalists; can't do both concurrently.

Very well. I shall wait patiently until you have more time to reply and will send you an occasional reminder.

By the way, since you're unbanning people... in an earlier post you mentioned the Tupac thread. I remember it well and re-read it. You should probably consider unbanning all the people you disagreed with, since none were abusive or nasty towards you (at least not that I can see)

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/tupac-blamed-race-in-madonna-breakup-letter.1402528/page-4

I've noticed the vast majority of black people feel passionate about Tupac, in ways that perhaps people from other backgrounds may never understand. I do feel these folks were arguing with you from that defensive point of view.

 

[Rentahamster]

NP. VB3.. the devil.

This old thread: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/18-y...is-forzas-i-beg-to-differ.178886/post-7385648

Seems to imply Laramie used the word "homie" in perhaps a racially insensitive way? I dunno. The thread it links to doesn't seem to exist anymore, as it's something else now.

If I remember correctly, Laramie said he would pour out a 40 for his homies or something like that, and Dragona banned him. I don't think the thread where that happened exists anymore.

 

[EviLore]

Good ol Dragona haha. "Goodbye misogynistic AND racist fuckwads." <---Laramie/Umino's ban message.

No offense, Dragona, but you literally didn't know what a tachometer was for in cars and told me they should all be removed *after* I explained all the technical benefits to a tach gauge in driving and racing. I know a female Indy 500 driver who is badass as fuck. Learn how to drive.

Ahem. Ancient history haha, but adjudication complete.

 

[Rentahamster]

EviLore did fistfulofmetal ever Paypal you that $20? :lol

 

[Corrik]

If authoritarian ban policies are an inevitable disaster, then why don't we institute the exact opposite policy? I would personally just clear out all the bans in the entire history of the site and allow people to come back at their will. I'm sure plenty would use that opportunity to hurl insults and suicide again, but in doing so will expose themselves and at least we will have taken the high road

I agree with this because inevitably a lot of good people got swept away in the chaos. There will be attacks and mods will have to be on their game, but it is worth it to let everyone who got wrongfully punished or rode a wave of emotions to have a chance to come back.

 

[AquaticSquirrel]

Good ol Dragona haha. "Goodbye misogynistic AND racist fuckwads." <---Laramie/Umino's ban message.

No offense, Dragona, but you literally didn't know what a tachometer was for in cars and told me they should all be removed *after* I explained all the technical benefits to a tach gauge in driving and racing. I know a female Indy 500 driver who is badass as fuck. Learn how to drive.

Ahem. Ancient history haha, but adjudication complete.

Does that mean what I think it means? Laramie is finally free?

Fantastic news, I know it shouldn't have but for whatever reason that ban really bothered me for years, being 100% serious.

I'm going to have a drink to celebrate! (Also being quite serious)

 

[EviLore]

EviLore did fistfulofmetal ever Paypal you that $20? :lol

Nope. Wasn't it $50? Hah. Mind you, I was trolling him and didn't actually want his money but I would've gone through with unbanning him of course if he did his part. The main part of the problem was his anti-gaf sentiment and constant metacommentary at that point. Whatever prompted that whole demand was in the context of his salt at the time. It's been a really long time so damned if I remember but the posts in question should still be in the archive for detectiving.

Also the key between h and k -ust died on my mbp omg CRUEL FATESjjjjjjjjjjjjjj okay never mind it's back now phew.

AquaticSquirrel I'll email him at his associated emails for the two accounts letting him know things are fixed up, but it's been ages so those emails might not be monitored anymore. But yes.

 

[Rentahamster]

Nope. Wasn't it $50? Hah. Mind you, I was trolling him and didn't actually want his money but I would've gone through with unbanning him of course if he did his part. The main part of the problem was his anti-gaf sentiment and constant metacommentary at that point. Whatever prompted that whole demand was in the context of his salt at the time. It's been a really long time so damned if I remember but the posts in question should still be in the archive for detectiving.

Oh right it might have been $50, haha. If I remember that incident correctly, he was advocating that members use adblock. There might have been something else. That dude like to push buttons though. Personally speaking, I thought he was hilarious

 

[EviLore]

Oh right it might have been $50, haha. If I remember that incident correctly, he was advocating that members use adblock. There might have been something else. That dude like to push buttons though. Personally speaking, I thought he was hilarious

Ah right, yeah, the adblock stuff. Keep in mind we've banned like less than 10 users ever for that sort of thing. I hate ads too. It's just a dick move to vocally advocate for adblock on a site that's free and ad-supported with no alternate revenue stream, and I've been a hardass about minimal ad footprint the whole time too and have done everything I can to non-commercialize the site over the years. That was my way of trolling him slash offering an olive branch to make things fair and balanced.

(emails to laramie sent)

 

[Captain Zyrain]

Way to go, glad you got that Laramie business sorted. That's cool.

Never too late to right a wrong! Miscarriages of justice breathe new life!

Ew.. nevermind.

 

[davepoobond]

i'll also insert my opinion to agree with riskVSreward to unban everyone, but i'm sure there are people who still deserve to be banned depending on the offense. glad to see that any sort of ban review is occurring though, considering what was going on.

 

[AquaticSquirrel]

AquaticSquirrel I'll email him at his associated emails for the two accounts letting him know things are fixed up, but it's been ages so those emails might not be monitored anymore. But yes.

(emails to laramie sent)

 

[Kadayi]

i'll also insert my opinion to agree with riskVSreward to unban everyone, but i'm sure there are people who still deserve to be banned depending on the offense. glad to see that any sort of ban review is occurring though, considering what was going on.

On paper, it sounds great, but let's just assume that from the most part and for a very long time the bulk of moderators were doing a good job and most of the people who were permanently banned over the years likely deserved it. Right now there's a nice steady growth to the site in terms of active members. I'd rather see management work through the bans list and bring back people who were banned unjustly who have something positive to contribute to the site and build upon that in some fashion versus giving a second chance to a lot of people who are likely interested in quite the opposite.

 

[bitbydeath]

i'll also insert my opinion to agree with riskVSreward to unban everyone, but i'm sure there are people who still deserve to be banned depending on the offense. glad to see that any sort of ban review is occurring though, considering what was going on.

I like the idea, but I won’t be the one cleaning up the huge mess it makes.

The entertainment value would be priceless though.

How many accounts would that be EviLore ?

 

[Tornado Condor]

Free MAF

 

[Corrik]

On paper, it sounds great, but let's just assume that from the most part and for a very long time the bulk of moderators were doing a good job and most of the people who were permanently banned over the years likely deserved it. Right now there's a nice steady growth to the site in terms of active members. I'd rather see management work through the bans list and bring back people who were banned unjustly who have something positive to contribute to the site and build upon that in some fashion versus giving a second chance to a lot of people who are likely interested in quite the opposite.

Let's be honest. How many people who got banned years ago care to come back and make a big stink. Some people have grown up. Lifetime bans always seem weird to me. Some of these people were probably banned when just kids and are adults now.

The main people who will take advantage of it will be the people who split recently, but it might be worth it to get all the proper people sorta out, figuring you had rampant moderator abuse and cannot trust really any bans at this point.

 

[Rentahamster]

i'll also insert my opinion to agree with riskVSreward to unban everyone, but i'm sure there are people who still deserve to be banned depending on the offense. glad to see that any sort of ban review is occurring though, considering what was going on.

I just want to see GreatnessGone run free again. lol.

Thinking about past bans, for some reason ToxicAdam and speculawyer come to mind in the sense that I don't remember why they got banned, but I remember them being pretty decent folk.

 

[Musky_Cheese]

It’s awesome to see everyone working together

 

[Kadayi]

Let's be honest. How many people who got banned years ago care to come back and make a big stink. Some people have grown up. Lifetime bans always seem weird to me. Some of these people were probably banned when just kids and are adults now.

The main people who will take advantage of it will be the people who split recently, but it might be worth it to get all the proper people sorta out, figuring you had rampant moderator abuse and cannot trust really any bans at this point.

I'm not generally a fan of perm bans as a rule, and that they should be used only as a last resort versus temps so people can have a timeout when things get heated, but the internet is a big place and one, therefore, has to account for a certain amount of crazy, unhinged and reluctant to change that just refuse to observe rules time and time again.

 

[American]

Nope. Wasn't it $50? Hah. Mind you, I was trolling him and didn't actually want his money but I would've gone through with unbanning him of course if he did his part. The main part of the problem was his anti-gaf sentiment and constant metacommentary at that point. Whatever prompted that whole demand was in the context of his salt at the time. It's been a really long time so damned if I remember but the posts in question should still be in the archive for detectiving.

Everyone of course remembers fistfulofmetal and his creepy Natalie Portman obsession, but his banning made you look pretty spiteful and dictatorial. You have often said that you troll your members, but quite a few have ended up being banned after having interactions where they disagree with what you say, yet they are not saying anything that contravenes your Terms of Service. There are many examples of this, but fistful and the aforementioned Tupac fans are a perfect example of this. It never seems fair, banning people for reasons that are made up on the set, and probably contributed to the huge anti-NeoGAF (and unfortunately anti-Tyler) sentiment that built up over the years.

Of course, I have no doubt you have changed for the better now. Here I am disagreeing with your past actions, for example. I did like fistful. Bemusing and a weird character, but people like that add personality to a forum.

 

[EviLore]

Free MAF

I'd be willing. As soon as he apologizes for that post where he insinuated that Hitokage (RIP) had Down's Syndrome. I had a MAF t-shirt that I wore regularly! MAF was the dude who made me a GAF admin, even though he was trolling haha. But my ex-gfs end up taking all my NeoGAF tees. :| Speaking of, our current awesome moderators have asked me about the status of neogaf tees and I'm working on relaunching those through a better distributor than our old one. I don't care if no one else wants any! I don't have any neogaf tees left anymore and there's one professional design I commissioned that I never even got to publish. Hrmph. Will be relaunched and sold at-cost as before and integrated into our upcoming 2.1 design relaunch.

I like the idea, but I won’t be the one cleaning up the huge mess it makes.

The entertainment value would be priceless though.

How many accounts would that be EviLore ?

Full ban amnesty? lol, oh god, tens of thousands. We'll discuss the idea of limited amnesty during certain specific time frames potentially later if it comes to that. I'd rather continue handling everything one-by-one on a case-by-case basis however.

 

[American]

I'm not generally a fan of perm bans as a rule, and that they should be used only as a last resort versus temps so people can have a timeout when things get heated, but the internet is a big place and one, therefore, has to account for a certain amount of crazy, unhinged and reluctant to change that just refuse to observe rules time and time again.

I think permanent bans are fine if they explicitly violate the Terms of Service for a website or forum, but not for reasons made up on the spot, or extremely vague reasons (exactly like ResetERA is now) or if a moderator is in a bad mood.

 

[EviLore]

Everyone of course remembers fistfulofmetal and his creepy Natalie Portman obsession, but his banning made you look pretty spiteful and dictatorial. You have often said that you troll your members, but quite a few have ended up being banned after having interactions where they disagree with what you say, yet they are not saying anything that contravenes your Terms of Service. There are many examples of this, but fistful and the aforementioned Tupac fans are a perfect example of this. It never seems fair, banning people for reasons that are made up on the set, and probably contributed to the huge anti-NeoGAF (and unfortunately anti-Tyler) sentiment that built up over the years.

Of course, I have no doubt you have changed for the better now. Here I am disagreeing with your past actions, for example. I did like fistful. Bemusing and a weird character, but people like that add personality to a forum.

Natalie Portman is one of the most beautiful women in the world. If being attracted to her is a crime then lock me up in Portman Prison, obvs. Also I never actually wanted money from him. He and I can certainly have a conversation about all that silly internet drama ancient history if he's down.

 

[RiccochetJ]

I appreciate that you're doing this EviLore . This is why GAF is still one of the best places on the net to converge and talk/debate about videogames and life.

I feel lucky that I didn't get permed during that time, but I had pretty much stepped away from OT at the end there. I'd like to think my little spurt of month long bans was because of this, but it's more likely that I fully deserved them. Except for the one I got for shitting on Destiny

I do wonder if Manos: The Hans of Fate fell victim to this, but his or her ban was way before this timeframe. I liked that user. They did tiptoe the line a lot though.

 

[Wheeljack539]

I do wonder if Manos: The Hans of Fate fell victim to this, but his or her ban was way before this timeframe. I liked that user. They did tiptoe the line a lot though.

That name sounds familiar. Was that the person who had a few gun threads or posted in them?

 

[Rentahamster]

Found it lol

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/ban-age-unwritten-rules-of-neogaf.381926/page-16#post-18876752

Being banned because you don't want to see ads is one of the silliest things I can imagine. It's also extremely petty. I'm not here to make this forum money. If they want that then they should start charging us. It's not my problem or responsibility to keep this forum afloat financially.

The OP of that thread is actually a pretty good snapshot in time of what the "rules" were like back then.