Tivor Tontomo
Member
Or is Carson, who doesn't attack anybody during the debate, yet...
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New GOP National Poll. 1st Place: Trump - 41%. 2nd Place: Carson - 12%.
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Or is Carson, who doesn't attack anybody during the debate, yet...
That's because most of what he says is bullshit full stop. So it's less about him having a no bullshit filter and more about him having a constant bullshit creator.
Veritigo_X
Member
I agree, and sorta went into this in my post that followed. It's reassuring that they are a minority that probably won't even vote, but it's still disheartening to see someone flip between someone that actually wants to fix these problems and someone that would make these problems worse. It's an opinion that comes from a place of privilege.
What the hell?
Sure you don't trust the Clintons -- but you trust Trump instead? You actually think he's more authentic than Hillary?
gutter_trash
Banned
those guys have all slammed the door on the refugee crisis just like Trump did, it's just that they didn't use the same direct language; they used coded language but said the same thing as Trump on the issue of refugees
Mass Effect
Member
Or, you know, a minority.
Well, exactly.
gutter_trash
Banned
your user name is so fitting with your post
plus your post makes no sense. who with a brain would vote against their best interests?
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
I'm not sure how great Morning Consult is overall, and with the caveat that these did come in during a terrorist attack, the other survey results are pretty wacky too. Wrong track at 74% when the RCP average is 63%, Obama job approval at 38% when the average is 45%, etc.
gutter_trash
Banned
two peas in the same pod who love walls
Abinash117
Member
The ideology is just an excuse. I doubt they are really loyal to their liberal beliefs.
gutter_trash
Banned
more like ''flavor of the month'' type of deal
BertramCooper
Banned
Yeah, that's pretty nuts.
Jack Remington
Banned
Pretty sure he said liberal.
But you have to look at things in context. The U.S. Democratic party is to the right of the Conservative party in the UK on numerous issues. They would probably be acceptable to Churchill.
Bernie is like the definition of establishment though haha. The only possible link I could see is they both are seen to "speak their mind", but if that's your only reason for voting for someone you probably have no business voting in the first place.
AnotherDayAnotherDollar
Banned
Don't mean to pick on you guys, but one of the most annoying things from Clinton supporter is that they seem to think that Clinton is entitled to get Sanders voters because they are both in the same party. Not saying Sanders, Trump etc fans are not annoying as well, but that's the one thing that stands out to me from all supporters and I don't see that from the Republican party (i.e. if Cruz doesn't get the nomination, you better vote for Trump in the general).
I'm not a Sanders supporter, but so far he is the one that most closely mirrors my views. I can't say I am going to vote for him yet because I can't vote for someone until I see a detailed tax plan. I also need to better understand his "speculation on wall street" plan because it sounds like I would get taxed $.50 for every $100 bucks every time I trade on scottrade and that would be an issue for me. With that said, I would be okay changing my party affiliation to democrat to vote for him in the primaries if the above get cleared up and is something that I like. I then don't know if I would vote D, R, or I in the general if he doesn't get the nomination.
I have done some research in the past few months and Clinton is losing me because:
- She is republican like in her hawkish views. I feel very uncomfortable knowing that she would most likely send ground troops to Syria to fight ISIS
- Her non-answers to straight questions (i.e. her wall street/pharma ties, her biggest backers, Iraq war, etc) greatly concern me
- She is against universal health care, a huge issue for me. From what I have been told, even Carson and Trump are closer to UHC than she is (though I haven't researched enough on the latter to say with certainty)
- Her recent stance changes on many issues are a major turn off for me. I view Clinton as a demagogue that will do and say what you want to get votes.
- She had one of her infamous "No" when Matthews asked her about gay marriage in NY and has only been for gay marriage since 2013 and now she speaks for LGBT community? Nawww.
- I would not be surprised if she became president she would change her stance on TPP and Keystone after a couple of years.
- She had said "republicans are some my biggest enemies" and when a republican woman asked her that, she backtracked.
- Recently said she is against "for profit prisons" after taking huge amount of money from them
- She has publicly said she is against citizen's united though she has raised millions through big super pacs
- She supported offshore oil drilling until recently
- Her backers and her super pacs suggest to me that she will not get money out of politics and won't address how our political campaign system is very corrupt. Trump has called out other people who get bought out by big money as being puppets, I don't think that's fair, but it's not a 100% false statement either
- She is against breaking up the big banks and reinstating glass steagall
- She is against legalization of recreational marijuana. Still hasn't taken a strong stance on medical marijuana legalization saying we need more research
- She only wants to raise the minimum wage to $12/hr (IIRC). That's still not enough. To b kinda fair, I don't think $15 suggested by Sanders and O'Malley is enough either and we should push it further
- No tax plan. Read above, it's the same concern that I have with Sanders and O'Malley as well
- She is wealthy and part of the one percent. I am not sure I believe her when she says she will make the top earners pay their fair share
There are probably more, but that's all I can think off the top of my head right now. I am still not saying I wouldn't vote for her if she got the nomination, but I would need to reassess when the time comes. If I decided on it, I don't think it would be hard to understand at that point why I would vote for Sanders in the primary and not for Clinton in the general.
Mind you, I registered to vote because friends convinced me I should and Clinton got in the race (that is, she was my first choice, initially).
This is ridiculous. None of the posts you quoted suggest any form of misogyny. That's like saying it's misandry if someone says he/she wouldn't vote for Bush because they don't trust them and don't want another Bush in office. Please elaborate what you mean.
I know one guy who is a Sanders primary voter, but would only vote for Trump if Sanders is not the nominee. His reasoning is hate for establishment and money in politics. Billionaires and big corporations buying candidates is the one single issue for him. In that sense, I can see why he would go to Sanders or Trump, but I am sure a lot of people here won't.
In Churchill's time, conservatives weren't anywhere near as fucking insane as they are now - in fact, they were quite reasonable and I could have considered myself being willing to vote for some of them. Before Reagan's brand of conservatism came to prominence, conservatives would actually negotiate and compromise with the left, and generally weren't the science denying, Jesus-obsessed nutjobs that they are today. These days, if you're any age and support the Republican party, then there's just something wrong - it's an acceptance of bigotry, racism and Islamophobia (among many other things).
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Voting in trump as an anti-corporate move makes no sense either.
Instead of voting in the politicians controlled by billionaires... you vote in the billionaires instead?
At least you cut out the middle man I guess.
Instead of voting in the politicians controlled by billionaires... you vote in the billionaires instead?
At least you cut out the middle man I guess.
War Peaceman
You're a big guy.
You do know when Churchill's time was right
Oh boy.
BertramCooper
Banned
How is it ridiculous? If a person is supposedly a Bernie Sanders supporter and actually believes in what he stands for, and that person says he's going to vote for Donald Fucking Trump in the general election over Hillary Clinton, something is amiss.
The easiest explanations are often the most accurate, so I find very little reason not to assume that sexism is a primary motivating factor behind such perverse logic.
War Peaceman
You're a big guy.
Isn't the simplest answer that they are a fucking imbecile?
Whilst there is a lot of overlap between that and sexists, they aren't identical
Oh god please no don't even suggest that shit... we won't even make it into week one of 2017 if that happens.
I don't have time to respond to your points individually, but the post I was responding to is this:
There are almost no issues in which Trump and Bernie have any sort of overlap on, in case you believe that there needs to be someone "anti-establishment" who doesn't take money from SuperPACs (Trump is not self-funded, and the fact that Bernie's anti-establishment credentials are being a career politician himself).
So what could actually drive a Bernie supporter to vote for Trump besides some bizarre idea of "anti-establishment"?
Hexa
Member
The next president isn't sworn in until January 20th so we'd be fine for about 3 weeks.
benjipwns
Banned
Before 1937, it was March.
Sirpopopop
Member
LMAO @ this outdated (and completely wrong) quote. Churchill is at least 40 years ago. Things have changed. Anyone spouting you have no brain for being against the current conservative party is, to quote Churchill back at you: The one without a brain.
benjipwns
Banned
Churchill died 50 years ago, and was last Prime Minister 60 years ago.
Thankfully, we now have Trump, the Winston Churchill of Our Time.
Thankfully, we now have Trump, the Winston Churchill of Our Time.
CopperPuppy
Member
"If you're 19 and a political science major, you actually think this quote holds some clever meaning."
Considering Trump's rhetoric consists mainly of emotional appeals, I don't think you sit where you think you do on that scale.
Right?! I even eye rolled at the idea that somehow political discourse was more polite pre-Reagan.
Hexa
Member
Trump's Instagram game is still on point, and Jeb's lack of ability to not say the wrong things is still astounding.
https://www.instagram.com/p/_FN2L3GhZi/
https://www.instagram.com/p/_FN2L3GhZi/
Paul Ryan is trying to restore sanity to the party, standing up for Muslims and freedom of religion.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZGIhGPFKS0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZGIhGPFKS0
Even America's national symbol doesn't want a Trump presidency.
Source?
Aaron Strife
Banned
His beard is amazing. Wish more politicians would rock facial hair.
Obama had some peach fuzz at his last rally in 2012 and I just thought "please keep this"
water_wendi
Water is not wet!
Youtube comments.. want to believe its sarcasm but i know the truth of it. Madness and stupidity.
Yeah that shit was depressing. I know I know, youtube comments and all. But when youtube comments are reflecting very well what you hear every day, shit gets depressing really quick.
It's hard (and devastating) to come to grips with the fact that so many people are that stupid.
That comment section is a riot.
Ampersands
Member
oh Jeb!
Emperor_Uriel
Member
Conservatism then and conservatism now are two VERY different things. The Nixon and Reagan eras are responsible for the racism and corruption that define the party now.
The democrats aren't saints either, but the middle and working classes have always done better under liberal presidents than conservative ones.
I'm glad he did this, but fucking hell at the sheer volume of grotesque comments. America, what have you created? Also, this is why outlets like Fox News need to be held to higher standards. It is outrageous that they are the most popular American TV news channel. They've made a career out of selling hate, xenophobia, racism, Islamaphobia, fear, bigotry and misinformation.
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