No Man's Sky is the featured game for IGN's First of July

Have we talked about the fanart tho.

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Amir0x said:
There have been games that are 4 hours long that are considered all-time classics and were made by AAA developers and sold at full price. There are indie games that literally are over in 4 hours that I would have paid $80 for if possible because they delivered experiences that are unparalleled in the industry. Your independent evaluation of the value of indie games on PS+ is just meaningless. Many of the PS+ games I've played are infinitely better than retail games I've payed $60 on the same platform. Oops, guess I canceled out your view and win by default! This is why such commentary is meaningless in determining the truth of how dumb it is that some gamers want to pin an inherently inferior value on indies.

Indies, like AAAs, cover the full gamut of quality and genre types, and have pushed some of the most groundbreaking gameplay types of the last ten years. They come in every size, shape and visual quality. So do AAAs. Indies should not have pressure to price lower just because some gamers are insane and try to connect value of product with staff size or budget or whatever. If they want to be priced lower, that's cool... but this stigma needs to end. It is suffocating the industry. Infantile gamers.

I mean in your comment you're essentially saying that because many gamers are literally grown children incapable of viewing the relationship between price and content delivered in the same way that mature adults do for every other medium - including books, tv and movies - that this expectation should be codified and encouraged. Here once again you try to push the narrative that budget should be related to price you get for the game ("they are cheaper") and that there should be some expectation regarding indie game price. Nobody else thinks this way in any other of the major mediums (tv, books, movies). Gamers are wrong for thinking that way, and the industry needs to push back against such unashamed nonsense.
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What is wrong with you? Why do you keep calling people that disagree with you immature children?
 
Walpurgis said:
What is wrong with you? Why do you keep calling people that disagree with you immature children?
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Because people who assign value to games based on size of staff and budget are inherently immature. It is so ridiculous that we as gamers even have to discuss such a concept, but because of the way some gamers are it is actually a thing. Can you explain why only games developers have to even hear such garbage, where creators/artists in other industries like movies, books and tv do not (at least not as part of any major, community-based movement)? Can you establish what the difference is besides a lack of nuanced contemplation on the subject and the relative maturity of these industries?

There has been much discussion about how this industry needs to "grow up." This is one such reason. These types of gamers suffocate the industry with their perplexingly short sighted ideology about what value means. Sometimes a type of belief is based on thoughts that aren't maturely developed; this is one such belief.
 
Gruso said:
I dunno. It's ruined threads for me, and I'd rather not perpetuate it.
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I agree. At this point it feels like people either trying to make a bad joke or deliberately trying to derail the topic. There's so much good information out there that if anyone's genuinely asking the question then they obviously haven't even tried looking anything up.
 
TheJoRu said:
Bam. There it is.

Works on so many levels.
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Yep. Hello Games. "Hello, World" (reference to computer programming.) A game with over 18 quintillion worlds.

It will be disappointing if a "what do you do?" title is picked instead. Exploration games such as this call for some initiative from the player, "what do you do?" only shows a lack of it.
 
There's no way this game will be sold for more than $20. Graphically it's unimpressive and there seems to be a lot of confusion over what it actually is. The real killer though is that it's not online in the traditional sense. Not being able to team up and search planets with friends seems like a missed opportunity to me. The other very real problem is audience fatigue. They've been talking and talking and talking about this game for a long time now and there's still no release date as far as I know. Personally I'll be waiting for the reviews before I put any money down.
 
I can't tell if you're being sarcastic Winter John, so apologies if you are:

Winter John said:
There's no way this game will be sold for more than $20. Graphically it's unimpressive and there seems to be a lot of confusion over what it actually is. The real killer though is that it's not online in the traditional sense. Not being able to team up and search planets with friends seems like a missed opportunity to me. The other very real problem is audience fatigue. They've been talking and talking and talking about this game for a long time now and there's still no release date as far as I know. Personally I'll be waiting for the reviews before I put any money down.
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Graphics are not a determination of game value, "amount of media about a game" has never in life decided the value of a product release, and extent and depth of online modes has no baring on the price something should be in of itself. And the only people confused about the game are those who are trying intentionally to remain ignorant... and by the way, that point is in direct conflict with your idea that there is audience fatigue. How can there be fatigue if there is confusion about what it is?

I swear this games industry is simply bizarro world. It's not about "hey this game is really fantastic and provides hours of enjoyment and replay value", it's "how many people were on staff?" and "is it using the most modern shaders available?" Only in the games industry can this be a thing.
 
Winter John said:
There's no way this game will be sold for more than $20. Graphically it's unimpressive and there seems to be a lot of confusion over what it actually is. The real killer though is that it's not online in the traditional sense. Not being able to team up and search planets with friends seems like a missed opportunity to me. The other very real problem is audience fatigue. They've been talking and talking and talking about this game for a long time now and there's still no release date as far as I know. Personally I'll be waiting for the reviews before I put any money down.
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I disagree with every single thing you said in that post. Impressive.
 
Do people still think this game is coming to Xbox? I doubt it. Anyways, I'd like for a release date but one can assume it'll probably also be 2016.
 
Winter John said:
There's no way this game will be sold for more than $20. Graphically it's unimpressive and there seems to be a lot of confusion over what it actually is. The real killer though is that it's not online in the traditional sense. Not being able to team up and search planets with friends seems like a missed opportunity to me. The other very real problem is audience fatigue. They've been talking and talking and talking about this game for a long time now and there's still no release date as far as I know. Personally I'll be waiting for the reviews before I put any money down.
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Everything you said is what's wrong with gaming and why publishers don't take risks.

Congrats, you are the personification where games went wrong.
 
mechphree said:
Do people still think this game is coming to Xbox? I doubt it. Anyways, I'd like for a release date but one can assume it'll probably also be 2016.
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It seems unlikely, and there's people that still think Bloodborne is coming to PC, people think a lot of things...

Anyway I'm guessing a Holiday 2015 release.
 
I don't know man. The games Murray keeps comparing NMS to seem to hover around the $15-$20 mark. It's certainly possible it could be around $30 like ARK: Survival Evolved or DayZ.

I wouldn't be totally surprised if it was $60, but right now I think I'm putting my expectation at $35 max, digital-only at first, physical later.
 
RedSwirl said:
I don't know man. The games Murray keeps comparing NMS to seem to hover around the $15-$20 mark. It's certainly possible it could be around $30 like ARK: Survival Evolved or DayZ.

I wouldn't be totally surprised if it was $60, but right now I think I'm putting my expectation at $35 max, digital-only at first, physical later.
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If the experience is as good as I am anticipating it will be, I would drop $100 for it- $60 will be just fine for me in that case.
 
Winter John said:
There's no way this game will be sold for more than $20. Graphically it's unimpressive and there seems to be a lot of confusion over what it actually is. The real killer though is that it's not online in the traditional sense. Not being able to team up and search planets with friends seems like a missed opportunity to me. The other very real problem is audience fatigue. They've been talking and talking and talking about this game for a long time now and there's still no release date as far as I know. Personally I'll be waiting for the reviews before I put any money down.
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I can't tell who is trolling who anymore :/
 
if this game lives up to what it's promising, it'd be worth 100 bucks, forget 60.

But I'm cheap as hell so I'd only pay 60.

But it won't be 60, it'll be 40.
 
I will gladly pay extra for a pre-order! So much content, so much ambition, and so innovative! It is very hard to explain my hype for this game. 1st time in a long time that I felt this excited for a video game!
 
Amir0x said:
There have been games that are 4 hours long that are considered all-time classics and were made by AAA developers and sold at full price. There are indie games that literally are over in 4 hours that I would have paid $80 for if possible because they delivered experiences that are unparalleled in the industry. Your independent evaluation of the value of indie games on PS+ is just meaningless. Many of the PS+ games I've played are infinitely better than retail games I've payed $60 on the same platform. Oops, guess I canceled out your view and win by default! This is why such commentary is meaningless in determining the truth of how dumb it is that some gamers want to pin an inherently inferior value on indies.

Indies, like AAAs, cover the full gamut of quality and genre types, and have pushed some of the most groundbreaking gameplay types of the last ten years. They come in every size, shape and visual quality. So do AAAs. Indies should not have pressure to price lower just because some gamers are insane and try to connect value of product with staff size or budget or whatever. If they want to be priced lower, that's cool... but this stigma needs to end. It is suffocating the industry. Infantile gamers.

I mean in your comment you're essentially saying that because many gamers are literally grown children incapable of viewing the relationship between price and content delivered in the same way that mature adults do for every other medium - including books, tv and movies - that this expectation should be codified and encouraged. Here once again you try to push the narrative that budget should be related to price you get for the game ("they are cheaper") and that there should be some expectation regarding indie game price. Nobody else thinks this way in any other of the major mediums (tv, books, movies). Gamers are wrong for thinking that way, and the industry needs to push back against such unashamed nonsense.
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I think you're onto something re: price differences, but you're way off base in terms of how your average consumer views these things. Maybe you would pay $80 for an indie, but it's unreasonable to think that all but the most dedicated and/or profligate gamers would do the same.

Given what No Man's Sky has presented so far, i can see myself spending full price on it, possibly, based on reviews, but it's a unique situation. I've played a ton of hours of The Binding of Isaac, but I'd be embarrassed to say that I spent $60 on it, because it's clearly not a $60 game in terms of value put into the thing.

And that argument WOULD be invalid, except that the other major examples of media that people consume don't ever cost $60 for your average consumer. I can see a 2 hour movie for $8 in my area, read a hardcover book for $25, or watch TV for a basic monthly subscription that's still less than the cost of a new AAA game. Only games are that expensive.

Part of that is production costs vs. consumer return, sure, but it's still a LOT of money to most people, and to date indies have been a good middle ground for consumers who want unique experiences AND lower price tags--it's easy to check out unique indie titles when you can nab them on Steam or during PSN sales for the cost of a fast food value meal, because the risk (finding it boring, it not working the way it's supposed to, whatever) is extremely low relative to the cost.

People create separate mental categories between AAA and indies for a reason that goes way beyond the unfair distinction between them as being the difference between a "real" game and an indie.

You're right that there shouldn't be PRESSURE on indies to price lower than AAA, but there also shouldn't be an expectation that every AAA is worth a $60 price tag. It's just how the industry works at present, unfortunately. Should budget be related to price? Given the exorbitant cost of game purchasing, maybe? It certainly doesn't have to be that way, but I can see an argument for both sides.

The thing is, though, regardless of your stance on how games should be priced, and regardless of how you feel about the economics of the indie gaming landscape, you don't have to use priggish language to make your point. It's kind of embarrassing to read.
 
Just to put it out there for some conversation and/or insight:

  • It has been said that every time your character dies in the game, a quote by Sagan or Jayden Smith will pop up.

Any thoughts?
 
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