Thunder Monkey
Banned
The unfortunate part is I'm not sure consoles are going to be shielded from the cannibalization of the market by these emerging competing avenues.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
NPD December 2012 Sales Results [Up2: Xbox 360, All Nintendo Hardware, NSMB Wii U]
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
Conversely, it also means being disappointed when it doesn't happen. Looking at those 3rd party sales, niche localisations don't seem all that likely.
I think consoles, tablets & the Steambox (whether hardware or some sort of certification) will be fighting tooth & nail. If Sony have any sense they'll migrate to some sort of 'Playstation Platform' that works on all of 'em.
metalslimer
Member
Soul Hackers is already happening and that's one of the games I thought was impossible to come over. Depends on what your definition of niche is. Also the eshop is a good way to take less risks than at retail. Also look at how many localizations the PSP got despite the shit software sales the last few years
AdventureRacing
Member
I think they will do very well but it's almost impossible to tell this far out.
electroplankton
Banned
If you like Western style games, handheld devices are not for you to begin with. Secondly, more third parties games in Japan means more likelihood to have third parties games in the West. Many of them will remain in Japan, but many other will be released. So far, 90% of all important third parties games for 3DS are arriving (also stuffs like Devil Summoner and Code of Princess) so why worrying? Lastly, also if you like Japanese games and you have a region-unlocked hardware, if you're inteested in games other than rhythm'n'games and puzzle game, that doesn't really help if you don't know Japanese. And if you can speak Japanese, why not buy a Japanese device to begin with?
niche localizations don't need a whole lot to be considered successful. sometimes even 20k is enough to make a profit or at least break even.
Even considering the rest of the world (so basically, Europe, since PS3 isn't huge in Japan), I'd bet Microsoft still sells more games while spending less.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
I'm not saying they'll peter out in a generation or anything.
But handhelds have generally been the bastion of the "casual" gamer. Consoles have their share generally as well. The tech inside these emerging gaming platforms is quickly advancing. Their share of the market is as well. There could come a time that this competing market is larger than those of "traditional" gaming venues.
Publishers go where the money is and will iterate until the horse corpse is beaten well and good.
Or channel stuffing?
electroplankton
Banned
This.
Many DS games / series sold around 40k units, and they were profitable in US. Look at Etrian Odyssey, Rune Factory, Devil Survivor, Knights in the Nightmare, etc. People are overreacting as usual. The only big flop is Revelations, all the others are selling nicely. People also tend to forget how much more legs handheld titles have in the West.
Yup, because we didn't get Code of Princess, Virtue's Last Reward and we're not getting Soul Hackers. So exactly what games are you referring to?
they're sorta notorious for that. plus they just released a new model, sooooo
casinoman921
Member
I can see that, but for a new console with no "epic" must-have game (e.g. 3D Mario, Zelda), you need a steady flow of mid-card titles to keep things interesting. It's not happening, and Wii U sales for the next few months will be painful.
EDIT: Maybe mid-card isn't the right word, but just good, fun games, lol.
michaelius
Banned
3DS SW 3rd party LTD
bird (Yes it's no.1) // kid friendly, low price
400k
ssf4 // core title, biggest best launch game
logo sw3 // kid friendly
kh3d // disney, kid friendly
sonic // core game but visuals make it look like it's good for kids
300k
mario sonic //kid friendly
skylanders // IP dedicated for kids
logo potc //kid friendly
200k
re:r // core title
asphalt // WTF ?
logo batman2 // kid friendly
rayman // core game but visuals make it look like it's good for kids
cars2 // IP for kids
150k
I think i see a pattern here
bird (Yes it's no.1) // kid friendly, low price
400k
ssf4 // core title, biggest best launch game
logo sw3 // kid friendly
kh3d // disney, kid friendly
sonic // core game but visuals make it look like it's good for kids
300k
mario sonic //kid friendly
skylanders // IP dedicated for kids
logo potc //kid friendly
200k
re:r // core title
asphalt // WTF ?
logo batman2 // kid friendly
rayman // core game but visuals make it look like it's good for kids
cars2 // IP for kids
150k
I think i see a pattern here
Not true. iOS and Vita serve me just fine.
That's very true. Good job really!
Ask the people that are always grumbling about localisations, the Japanese 3DS library is of no interest to me. Bravely Default seems to be the big one people want.
That's what I was saying to electroplankton originally. The 3DS western 3rd party sales are important to a western gamer living in the west that enjoys western games. The fact that 3rd parties do OK in Japan is irrelevant.
with the way Nintendo announces games, a huge title could be coming out next month, you never know.
won't matter if Nintendo doesn't advertise it, though.
if I had to guess, I'd say the Wii U won't gain a lead that an Xbox successor released this November can't erase in four months. The market clearly isn't salivating over what Nintendo's offering and, at risk of sounding like a Pachter, I'd say it might lead to a Wii U successor being released by the end of 2015.
electroplankton
Banned
Yeah, right. Where are 2013 Western Vita games, outside Killzone?
It's not irrelevant at all, in particular for niche games. And data are speaking against you.
Baconsammy
Banned
I don't remember announcing huge games and then releasing them within mere weeks. That's Apple's game. Nintendo generally announces months in advance.
Is it really a shock to you? The primary audience of the 3DS, especially outside Japan, is kids. If you buy your kid a 3DS, you probably buy a title you know is kid-friendly.
I was talking in present tense, not future. Vita future software support is looking dismal right now. Obviously there will be a handful of titles but at this time, it's anyone's guess what they'll be. iOS on the other hand will see new stuff every farts end.
It is irrelevant because this is the NPD thread. How do you think it would go down if I pointed out third party sales were shite (in the west) in a Media Create thread?
I can't imagine what data you're referring to.
Simply incredible how many consoles were sold last gen.
Will the current one match it?
Thanks. Especially about titles having legs: Sonic started with less than 20k, Angry Birds with less than 23k, even Tales of the Abyss had some legs despite being a JRPG with a limited shipment (now it's around 55k, very near to how the original performed on PS2, 72k). Lego titles are selling through time too, despite DS SKUs priced $10 less. And the biggest Japanese third party release is selling at least decently (KH3D). The third party list is not so bad, it's obvious you can't see lots of Western third party titles doing one million in US considering what they release on the platform. At least, not in the short term: it's a handheld console, software sells much longer than elsewhere. Heck, seeing Angry Birds near 500k is actually kind of amazing, all things considered :lol So far, looking at some results, it seems part of the casual audience ( AB, Lego titles, Sonic in part) and part of the core handheld audience ( KH3D, Tales of the Abyss, Code of Princess) are already on 3DS, despite less than 10 million userbase. It's obvious hardware sales needs to be higher next year with more good / big releases , and there are good feelings about it looking at things like the FE bundle (i.e.: NoA is serious now...maybe), in order to have much higher software sales.
Still, I'm not saying those sales are amazing overall, not at all. I'd say they're not bad / good in some cases, but Nintendo needs to lower prices to $29.99 for most of third party offering, though. Especially looking at how much Angry Birds did.
Metal Gear?!
Member
Asphalt is a racing game, ported from mobile.
And how are ssf4 and rayman not kid-friendly too?
Hard to believe the PS3 would overtake WW by 1 mill when the US and UK combined probably just outsold them by a mill in one month.
michaelius
Banned
I know what asphalt is - but it's a crappy game that has nothing going for it apart from being semi big smartphone port.
And Rayman is rather hard so not exactly best game for kids
And Rayman is rather hard so not exactly best game for kids
I was being somewhat facetious. In the last several years, though, Nintendo has announced many of its games two or three months before releasing them.
I guess if you want a racing game that's not Mario Kart, you either get Asphalt or you get Sonic Transformed.
So you make a broad, blanket statement and tell me to ask other people who aren't making that statement in this thread? Right. Also Bravely Default just came out in Japan three months ago, it's too early to say that it's never going to come out. But that's up to Square-Enix and PSP owners are still waiting on FF Type-0. Should people blame Sony for that?
So you don't think there are western gamers living in the west that enjoy Japanese games? Really?
metalslimer
Member
You can't be kid friendly and a core title now? I get your overall point though. M rated games at least like resident evil are not a good fit for the platform.
I replied that the 'hope' of localisations was a double-edged sword because they don't always happen. I fail to see what is unreasonable about that.
Where did I say that?
Why? SFxT (psv) is the complete version with all DLC characters and some extra ones. At least now they know that they actually made the right call and put most of their handheld resources on the successful system instead of a disaster PSV has been so far.
I think the same 3rd party games that sold well on Wii will sell well on Wii U. Just Dance. Sonic.
Those kind of games, the console is aimed at that audience. Just like the previous Nintendo consoles. Don't expect much else.
Thats a niche audience, just like Japanese gamers that like Western games.
i doubt it. the xbox 360, wii, and ds all took off like crazy, when the third place system outsold what the n64 and snes did in america. oh, and the psp even managed to come close to that number too.
i think the smartphone/tablet gaming is going to eat into console gaming, and it already might be happening- though it's hard to tell when game manufacturers don't drop the price of their consoles a significant amount over the course of six or seven years. the wii u probably won't be a repeat of the wii at least, and the 3ds is going to have to be amazing real soon to do what the ds did. the vita is already lagging behind the psp as well.
i think microsoft and sony will do relatively okay- with maybe just one of them really taking off, much like this generation. who knows what sort of splash valve might make, but i doubt it'll be enough to offset the handheld sector and nintendo's presence in the console market.
They don't always but you're talking as like the 3DS hasn't gotten a lot of big titles localized, which is false. In fact pretty much everyone was in agreement that Guild 01 was never going to come out in the west and look, they not only released them via the eShop but made it so you could get them piecemeal at a reasonable price. The only game we definitely know isn't coming from a major third party is EX Troopers and that's because of Capcom being dumb as usual.
You implied it through the post where you said third parties doing okay in Japan is irrelevant to westerners when it clearly matters since a successful third party title is more likely to be localized.
TheDrowningMan
Member
If an audience is cultivated, games will find sales. We had stuff like Resident Evil 4 selling over a million and even House of the Dead 2 & 3 doing respectable numbers on Wii, before it started to get insulted.
Wii U isn't the worldwide phenomenon that its predecessor was and games are generally much more expensive for some reason best left to the publishers to explain.
I do think Nintendo have missed a trick by not expanding and diversifying more when the opportunity was there; they had the chance to really cover most bases, to have top quality western teams in place nurturing an audience for FPSs and racers, but no.
The problem is the DLC debacle that was more than likely caused by the Vita version.
The Wii U already lost that audience before it came out because it doesn't have the right hardware.
The hardcore/online audience won't abandon the PS360 for a platform with similar performance and worse online experience.
Why would someone that is invested in PS360 and has friends there spend 300 bucks on something thats basicly the same? This battle was lost form the get go.
GCN was totally different in that regard as it had some of the best looking games of that gen.
Nintendo went the power route it doesn't matter. Power route led to generations in succession being smaller than the last sales wise.
Nintendo needs to be taken seriously by publishers and treated properly and then things sort themselves out. Why would a gamer who buys Nintendo consoles give a fuck what any publisher does if the publishers always treat the gamers as shit.
3rd parties make the bed they get to fuck themselves in. Even after multiple million copy sellers on the Wii Publishers would still neuter and shit all over the gamers by releasing half ass on rail attempts etc and then wonder why owners stopped caring. Just like EA now. Why would I as a Wii U owner give a rats ass about anything EA? They put out a port of MAss Effect 3 at fullprice while announcing 1,2 and 3 for the other consoles for the same price. They deliberately sit on and refuse to release need for speed til months later
ShockingAlberto
Member
SFxT as a whole, but especially SFxT and the relationship that game has to Sony, is such a mindboggling clusterfuck.
I think back to it all in retrospect and I still can't piece together how Sony convinced Capcom everything that happened with that game wouldn't affect sales or why Sony themselves thought this game was a huge get for them.
Basically it worked out for no one.
I don't understand. Does that mean Sony had 7 PS3 exclusives that sold more than a million each in 2012?
no, this means they have had 7 ps3 exclusives to sell over 1 million in the us, ever.
michaelius
Banned
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0088I86SO/?tag=neogaf0e-20
Just Dance is already discounted 20$ after release.
Every single version of the game is $30 on amazon so that's not really a good example. Even then I don't know why anyone would buy the Wii U version when they can just get the Wii version at a cheaper price and play it on the Wii U(which I'm guessing is what happened due to the amount of copies it sold this month).
Its that way across all platforms basically due to the Wii version being the God of Sales. Just Dance 4 Wii outsells Halo 4.
Wii version was only 29.99 so they had to reduce to compete with itself
MaxwellParrish
Member
Opus Angelorum
Member
Even if each title had +50% digital sales, the PSVita software data would still look horrendous. The bundled software is deceptive.
Oh, thought all that stats was for 2012, pft.