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[Kenka]

When did I say anything about the "new Wii audience"? I thought I made it clear that I was talking about the core Nintendo games and core Nintendo fans. Sorry if I didn't make it clear enough.

Nintendo fans care about third party games, they are the ones signing petitions in order to have Street Fighter on Wii (and a non-gimped one please) for example. The Wii crowd on the other hand is largely uneducated about third-parties and buy what they see and find cool in ads.

Third parties will always enjoy success on Wii, as long as they propose quality titles for the core and/or well advertised crap fot the rest. But if you target something inbetween like let's say Madden 09 All-Play it may not catch interest of the public and burn the Wii core audiance.

 

[legend166]

I really want to know what segment of the market actually knows who develops and publishes the games they buy, off the top of the head.

Do you guys really think someone walks into a Gamestop and looks at the rack, sees a title they want, only to dismiss it because it doesn't have Nintendo on the box? Really? I wish someone did research on this, because I can almost guarantee it's really low.

Nintendo games sell on the Wii, and every other Nintendo console because they are generally:

- Quality
- Advertised
- Have an attached brandname


I've made this argument before, that you really need combination of these factors to have a successful game. Across every platform. Although, there's enough cases to show you could probably get by just on advertisment alone. You can't get by on quality alone, as shown by numerous failures on all consoles, and you can't get by on brandname alone if the game sucks, as shown by the latest Sonic game.

So, with that said, I would like a list of all third party games who have a combination on the two. Did Madworld? It had quality, it seems, but did it have advertisment? I couldn't tell you, since I don't live in America. I haven't seen any ads for it in Australia, though.

 

[jvm]

I don't know that it's particularly important to most folks, but my article will be up in the morning (Monday). Last month it went up on Sunday because GDC coverage was going to swamp the system the following Monday. Things are different this month.

Looks like a lively discussion this month in here.

 

[Balb]

Nintendo fans care about third party games, they are the ones signing petitions in order to have Street Fighter on Wii (and a non-gimped one please) for example. The Wii crowd on the other hand is largely uneducated about third-parties and buy what they see and find cool in ads.

Third parties will always enjoy success on Wii, as long as they propose quality titles for the core and/or well advertised crap fot the rest. But if you target something inbetween like let's say Madden 09 All-Play it may not catch interest of the public and burn the Wii core audiance.

You're equating Nintendo fans to 500-1000 people on the internet? This is the first I've heard of this petition.

I really want to know what segment of the market actually knows who develops and publishes the games they buy, off the top of the head.

Do you guys really think someone walks into a Gamestop and looks at the rack, sees a title they want, only to dismiss it because it doesn't have Nintendo on the box? Really? I wish someone did research on this, because I can almost guarantee it's really low.

Nintendo games sell on the Wii, and every other Nintendo console because they are generally:

- Quality
- Advertised
- Have an attached brandname


I've made this argument before, that you really need combination of these factors to have a successful game. Across every platform. Although, there's enough cases to show you could probably get by just on advertisment alone. You can't get by on quality alone, as shown by numerous failures on all consoles, and you can't get by on brandname alone if the game sucks, as shown by the latest Sonic game.

So, with that said, I would like a list of all third party games who have a combination on the two. Did Madworld? It had quality, it seems, but did it have advertisment? I couldn't tell you, since I don't live in America. I haven't seen any ads for it in Australia, though.

I'd say that more people know what games Nintendo makes than you'd think, but that wasn't part of my argument regardless. I'm saying that Nintendo knows how to market to their audience which is a huge part of their success and they're doing little to help third party developers with communicating with the Wii userbase.

 

[SovanJedi]

Competing controllers have more. Left thumb on stick and right stick on buttons gives you four face buttons + four shoulder buttons + one clickable stick even. Motions not larger than reaching for the Wiimote d-pad or "minus" button give you another analog stick (which is clickable too) and a d-pad.

And FWIW, many games I've played lately find ways to use all of that, among them Dead Space, a popular request for a more direct conversion to the Wii. Games even expect regular use of the clickable sticks (for melee and sprint functions in certain fps franchises), which I find somewhat irritating personally because those aren't good inputs. But apparently developers are happy to map every button they can find.
I think flower, Valkyria Chronicles and a couple twin-stick shooters are the only not-Wii games I've played this year so far that left any buttons unused.

Well that can be argued to be a negative against games design of this day and age. Dead Space uses one of the analogue stick click buttons to show you the way to go to your next mission objective... Something which could be resolved with, y'know, actually designing the game more intuitively so you wouldn't get lost and need to call up an instant "show me where to go" button.

 

[Kenka]

I really want to know what segment of the market actually knows who develops and publishes the games they buy, off the top of the head.

Do you guys really think someone walks into a Gamestop and looks at the rack, sees a title they want, only to dismiss it because it doesn't have Nintendo on the box? Really? I wish someone did research on this, because I can almost guarantee it's really low.

Nintendo games sell on the Wii, and every other Nintendo console because they are generally:

- Quality
- Advertised
- Have an attached brandname

Good post.

But are the third-parties willing to spend money on advertisement for genres that still haven't reached the Wii mass-market like FPS and plateform ? And tailor these games in order to make them playable for people uneducated about them ?

Yes/no ?

 

[Balb]

Good post.

But are the third-parties willing to spend money on advertisement for genres that still haven't reached the Wii mass-market like FPS and plateform ? And tailor these games in order to make them playable for people uneducated about them ?

Yes/no ?

I don't know why you seem to think that third parties have to market to casual gamers. SSBB sold 2.7 million in NA in its first month, and I doubt many of those sales could be attributed to casual gamers who just play Wii Sports and Wii Fit.

There is a core userbase for the Wii that is largely untapped by third party developers and it shows.

 

[Alcibiades]

RE4 and CoD WaW are AAA and high budget Wii games? Interesting.

You can attribute RE4 Wii's success to being part of a brand that Capcom built heavily on the GameCube with all the RE games that were released (which Nintendo helped promote back then). The $30 price point helped as well.

well, let's leave RE out of it, World at War is about as close as an epic, mainstream, AAA franchise on Wii has come to sharing the experience of the 360/PS3 versions and it was one of the top-selling 3rd party titles this past holiday...

the point is, Nintendo caring or not caring has little bearing on the success of blockbuster, mainstream titles on Wii, regardless of the budget...

major franchise "core" titles do sell on Wii if they are great games... we have yet to see a single example of a AAA, epic, major franchise title failing on Wii...

 

[legend166]

You're equating Nintendo fans to 500-1000 people on the internet? This is the first I've heard of this petition.



I'd say that more people know what games Nintendo makes than you'd think, but that wasn't part of my argument regardless. I'm saying that Nintendo knows how to market to their audience which is a huge part of their success and they're doing little to help third party developers with communicating with the Wii userbase.

I agree Nintendo could do more in that regard.

But it's not like Nintendo has had years and years of selling to these people. These people that aren't buying 3rd party games on the Wii are not the same people who didn't buy 3rd party games on the GCN.

That's what people need to realise. The audience is not a continuation of the GCN. There's atleast 30 million Wii owners who didn't own a GCN, and that's if we assume every single person who owned a GCN went and bought a Wii, which very likely isn't true. So this idea that Nintendo somehow has an amazing insight into an audience they've been hoarding for 20 years is disingenuous. They haven't sold to a console audience of this size since the NES.

And it's not exactly hard to see their marketing plan anyway. On the casual side, make accessible, enjoyable games that makes sensible use of the Wii remote with a leaning towards social play. Market the game as such - show several people playing the game with the intuitive controls. On the traditional side, make high quality games with attached brand names. That's pretty much all they've done this gen, and they have become the largest publisher by a landslide.

And look, my argument here isn't that 3rd party games are a success on the Wii. Obviously some are, and some are very disappointing. My argument is that by simply looking at the financial state of many publishers, I just don't think they can afford to cover their eyes and walk away simply because they didn't succeed on the first try. They'll have to find a way to crack the market or they'll be in a pretty bad shape by the end of the gen. The only exceptions seem to be Capcom and Activison Blizzard.

So this isn't an argument out of wanting more games on the Wii (though it is my primary console along with my DS, I own a 360 and a gaming PC). It's an argument out the fact I don't want to see what AniHawk said earlier - by the end of the gen there being only 4-5 publishers because they all had to merge.

 

[Kenka]

I don't know why you seem to think that third parties have to market to casual gamers. SSBB sold 2.7 million in NA in its first month, and I doubt many of those sales could be attributed to casual gamers who just play Wii Sports and Wii Fit.

There is a core userbase for the Wii that is largely untapped by third party developers and it shows.

True. Smash Bros was a big hit.

According to me, it :

- appealed to the core audience
- appealed to the casual audiance which recognized the brand, the characters, the whole stuff
- is easy to play and the mechanics are not an obstacle for the uneducated crowd.
- had tons of exposure, with explanations about the gameplay (look at the ads)


In result, it successfully gathered mass and core audience. The key point left to prove is if a sizebale proportion of players who picked up SSBB did indeed not pick up any combat game before.

There must be a possibility for third-parties to reproduce equal success by using SSBB as an example.

 

[Balb]

well, let's leave RE out of it, World at War is about as close as an epic, mainstream, AAA franchise on Wii has come to sharing the experience of the 360/PS3 versions and it was one of the top-selling 3rd party titles this past holiday...

the point is, Nintendo caring or not caring has little bearing on the success of blockbuster, mainstream titles on Wii, regardless of the budget...

major franchise "core" titles do sell on Wii if they are great games... we have yet to see a single example of a AAA, epic, major franchise title failing on Wii...

Well let's not get ahead of ourselves, WaW on Wii wasn't one of the top selling third party games; maybe for the Wii, but not overall. It sold pretty well on the Wii overall (I would guess that it's around 1 million WW right now) but if the argument is about whether or not third party companies should primarily develop for the Wii, I don't see how WaW could be shown as evidence, considering WaW sold way better on the 360 and PS3.

 

[EDarkness]

Well let's not get ahead of ourselves, WaW on Wii wasn't one of the top selling third party games; maybe for the Wii, but not overall. It sold pretty well on the Wii overall (I would guess that it's around 1 million WW right now) but if the argument is about whether or not third party companies should primarily develop for the Wii, I don't see how WaW could be shown as evidence, considering WaW sold way better on the 360 and PS3.

The fact that a gimped version of the game even sold as much as it did is pretty impressive. I think it does show that if it was more in line with the 360/PS3 versions, it would have done better. Which is why I hope Modern Warfare 2 is coming out on the Wii with the same feature set as the 360/PS3 versions. I'll be first in line for that assuming it's good quality.

 

[Kenka]

The fact that a gimped version of the game even sold as much as it did is pretty impressive. I think it does show that if it was more in line with the 360/PS3 versions, it would have done better. Which is why I hope Modern Warfare 2 is coming out on the Wii with the same feature set as the 360/PS3 versions. I'll be first in line for that assuming it's good quality.

Sorry, it's not exactly a gimped version. I didn't play it extensively nor on Wii nor on the HD twins but I played it enough to say that calling it "gimped" is going a bit far.

So, what does Activision want to do this time ? Push the MW2 on Wii with advertisements in order to reach the untapped audience or simply drop the ball ? All options are available.

The next interesting thing will be Rabbids. Ubisoft is really close to get a huge hit with this game. It is polished, the brand is known from the mass market and it looks fairly attractive for the core.

I think that it may reach 5 millions units sold. It has a damn good profile.

 

[Rolf NB]

Well that can be argued to be a negative against games design of this day and age. Dead Space uses one of the analogue stick click buttons to show you the way to go to your next mission objective... Something which could be resolved with, y'know, actually designing the game more intuitively so you wouldn't get lost and need to call up an instant "show me where to go" button.

Have you played the game?

Because actually there's a ton of guidance. Boss dude will remind you over the radio to "take that elevator up to X level" or to "come back down here", doors will be locked (and lit up red) when areas close off, and of course it's still a sequence of levels set in different sections of the ship, segregated by one-way-ticket tram rides. You can't backtrack to a done level, accidentally or otherwise.

The only times where you can choose your own way is when you have multiple objectives in a level that you can do in any order, and that's three times in the game IIRC. The arboretum or whatsitcalled is the biggest "offender", and there it even allows you to circle around the level checking off the objectives as you pass them by, and then you're right back where you need to be to proceed.

They used the clicky stick because they had it free and conjured up something they thought would be useful and make the game more accessible. It's a "why not", not a "must include". You might as well complain about RE4 including a map.

 

[EDarkness]

Sorry, it's not exactly a gimped version. I didn't play it extensively nor on Wii nor on the HD twins but I played it enough to say that calling it "gimped" is going a bit far.

So, what does Activision want to do this time ? Push the MW2 on Wii with advertisements in order to reach the untapped audience or simply drop the ball ? All options are available.

The next interesting thing will be Rabbids. Ubisoft is really close to get a huge hit with this game. It is polished, the brand is known from the mass market and it looks fairly attractive for the core.

I think that it may reach 5 millions units sold. It has a damn good profile.

Heh, I own the Wii version, so they got my money. It's fun, don't get me wrong, but it's missing a lot of stuff. I wanted the zombie mode and it isn't there. No vehicles, co-op is pretty bad (in my opinion). No online co-op, lower number of players overall, etc. I liked the game and have logged in a lot of hours, but lets not kid ourselves...it's gimped in the features department compared to the other versions. I couldn't even convince my friends to pick it up due to those reasons. If all versions were created as equal as possible, I have a feeling the Wii version would have sold better. <sniff, sniff>

 

[ksamedi]

You're equating Nintendo fans to 500-1000 people on the internet? This is the first I've heard of this petition.

And what are you basing your claims of exactly? I doubt you know Nintendo fans who don't buy third party games.

 

[vanguardian1]

Sorry, it's not exactly a gimped version. I didn't play it extensively nor on Wii nor on the HD twins but I played it enough to say that calling it "gimped" is going a bit far.

So, what does Activision want to do this time ? Push the MW2 on Wii with advertisements in order to reach the untapped audience or simply drop the ball ? All options are available.

Losing several of the most popular multiplayer modes certainly didn't help.

I gotta admit though, considering the fact that the "breakout" game in the series that created a massive install base for the series on other platforms (Cod4), I'm suprised W@W Wii sold as well as it has.

I would have bought it if it had some good local multiplayer stuff. I know I'm not the only one who feels that way.

The next interesting thing will be Rabbids. Ubisoft is really close to get a huge hit with this game. It is polished, the brand is known from the mass market and it looks fairly attractive for the core.

I think that it may reach 5 millions units sold. It has a damn good profile.

5 million? No way. I'd call that a completely unrealistic expectation.

 

[Kenka]

5 million? No way. I'd call that a completely unrealistic expectation.

We'll see, it's just an estimate led by my model. And it assumes Rabbids will be attractive to each layer of customers.

 

[Htown]

And what are you basing your claims of exactly? I doubt you know Nintendo fans who don't buy third party games.

It's not people that use a Wii as their primary console that don't buy third party games. It's people who own a 360 or ps3 and have the wii as a secondary console that only buy the big Nintendo hits.

 

[SovanJedi]

Have you played the game?

Because actually there's a ton of guidance. Boss dude will remind you over the radio to "take that elevator up to X level" or to "come back down here", doors will be locked (and lit up red) when areas close off, and of course it's still a sequence of levels set in different sections of the ship, segregated by one-way-ticket tram rides. You can't backtrack to a done level, accidentally or otherwise.

The only times where you can choose your own way is when you have multiple objectives in a level that you can do in any order, and that's three times in the game IIRC. The arboretum or whatsitcalled is the biggest "offender", and there it even allows you to circle around the level checking off the objectives as you pass them by, and then you're right back where you need to be to proceed.

They used the clicky stick because they had it free and conjured up something they thought would be useful and make the game more accessible. It's a "why not", not a "must include". You might as well complain about RE4 including a map.

Why yes, I have played the game. In fact I've finished it with my dad on his copy, so I know full well about people telling you over the radio what must be done and what isn't. The clicky stick guidance isn't necessary for most of it, so why bother mapping it? It's not really a good argument for more buttons if it's being used for redundant features such as that.

Anyway your argument was originally that Soul Calibur couldn't be done with the Wii's controls. I've not played SC4 but a quick look on GameFAQs shows you have four buttons needed to play the game, plus the analogue stick. Surprise surprise, there are four buttons available to you instantly on the Wiimote + Nunchuck control setup, plus the analogue stick. If you're going to argue for extra fluff in the game like a taunt, just map it to the D-Pad.

 

[lowlylowlycook]

It's not people that use a Wii as their primary console that don't buy third party games. It's people who own a 360 or ps3 and have the wii as a secondary console that only buy the big Nintendo hits.

But that's too small a fraction of the Wii install base to matter for sales of 3rd party games.

 

[Sadist]

We'll see, it's just an estimate led by my model. And it assumes Rabbids will be attractive to each layer of customers.

Well, your model is kind of flawed then. Seeing the past three "Raving Rabbids" installment reaching all 1 million in sales, I think a million for Rabbids Go Home would be more likely.

 

[Yes Boss!]

It's not people that use a Wii as their primary console that don't buy third party games. It's people who own a 360 or ps3 and have the wii as a secondary console that only buy the big Nintendo hits.

I don't buy this...just look at GAF's own "setup" thread. Most folks have a Wii and 360 and a PS3 with plenty of non-nintendo games. Of the fifty-five Wii games I've got well over 50% are third-party, and I've got the HD systems.

 

[Kenka]

Well, your model is kind of flawed then. Seeing the past three "Raving Rabbids" installment reaching all 1 million in sales, I think a million for Rabbids Go Home would be more likely.

Ubi said 6.5 millions for the Rabbids franchise. And this time, the game is backed by the intrusion of the Rabbids in the mass media aka the Renault Megane advertisements. The brand recognition will surely rise at unprecedented levels. And in addition, what we know of the game makes it look quite promising.

 

[Gaborn]

It's not people that use a Wii as their primary console that don't buy third party games. It's people who own a 360 or ps3 and have the wii as a secondary console that only buy the big Nintendo hits.

I'd think on average those people would be more informed gamers. So, are you telling me they're deliberately and consciously ignoring the quality of SOME 3rd party games on the Wii because they're not Nintendo games? Because that's pretty ignorant of them and seems unlikely.

 

[Cheech]

The Wii will continue getting gimped and PS2-level games (asset and gameplay wise) because

a) It's all the machine is capable of, and
b) The audience does not demand better. It simply isn't that discriminating.

I'm not knocking the overall Wii audience even though it sounds like it. Just basing it off what I've seen first-hand and in the NPDs. My parents and many, MANY non-gamers like them own Wiis and love them. My mother is in love with We Skii and Tetris Party. Dad loves Wii Bowling. This is the entirety of their game catalog. I do not foresee Street Fighter IV in their future, "fully featured" or otherwise.

I know there are a few "primary" Wii owners here, and you guys are going to realize at some point that Nintendo and the third parties are no longer interested in you as a Wii consumer. If the last E3 didn't shed light on this for you, I'm sure THIS E3 will seal the deal.

I cringe when I think about what a new Wii Zelda is going to look like. I'm sure it is going to make Twilight Princess look like Fallout 3 in terms of expansiveness and complexity.

I own a Wii, and have a great time playing Mario Kart on it with my 5 year old. In a lot of ways it's replaced the board game for modern families, but a hardcore gaming platform it's not.

 

[Rolf NB]

Why yes, I have played the game. In fact I've finished it with my dad on his copy, so I know full well about people telling you over the radio what must be done and what isn't. The clicky stick guidance isn't necessary for most of it, so why bother mapping it? It's not really a good argument for more buttons if it's being used for redundant features such as that.

...

Fire, alt-fire, iron-sight aim, reload, telekinesis, stasis, instant melee, explicit run, weapon switching, free camera, free aimmovement. The game needs many buttons. Yes, the game has extra convenience features on buttons you wouldn't want for the core mechanics, but the core mechanics themselves need many buttons. I'm used to Wii-only guys mentally blocking that out, but I can't believe I'm having to have this argument with someone who played the game.

But OH GOD IT HAS A MENU IT DOESN'T REALLY NEED TEH WASTE!

Guess what, Wii games have maps and menus and utility shit too, and you wouldn't want them to be removed either. I swear I'll start a riot if the next Zelda game includes an objective marker.
"Hey Midna, mind telling me where to go next?" - that's a paddlin'.

But that's too small a fraction of the Wii install base to matter for sales of 3rd party games.

I'd love some updated research on this. I just can't believe the old "1%" multi-console ownership figure that's usually thrown around.

 

[Sadist]

Ubi said 6.5 millions for the Rabbids franchise. And this time, the game is backed by the intrusion of the Rabbids in the mass media aka the Renault Megane advertisements. The brand recognition will surely rise at unprecedented levels. And in addition, what we know of the game makes it look quite promising.

Maybe. Will have to wait for it right?

 

[AniHawk]

The Wii will continue getting gimped and PS2-level games (asset and gameplay wise) because

a) It's all the machine is capable of, and
b) The audience does not demand better. It simply isn't that discriminating.

I'm not knocking the overall Wii audience even though it sounds like it. Just basing it off what I've seen first-hand and in the NPDs. My parents and many, MANY non-gamers like them own Wiis and love them. My mother is in love with We Skii and Tetris Party. Dad loves Wii Bowling. This is the entirety of their game catalog. I do not foresee Street Fighter IV in their future, "fully featured" or otherwise.

I know there are a few "primary" Wii owners here, and you guys are going to realize at some point that Nintendo and the third parties are no longer interested in you as a Wii consumer. If the last E3 didn't shed light on this for you, I'm sure THIS E3 will seal the deal.

I cringe when I think about what a new Wii Zelda is going to look like. I'm sure it is going to make Twilight Princess look like Fallout 3 in terms of expansiveness and complexity.

I own a Wii, and have a great time playing Mario Kart on it with my 5 year old. In a lot of ways it's replaced the board game for modern families, but a hardcore gaming platform it's not.

Nintendo knows they have a hardcore fanbase, and they're not going to stop making games for them.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

To an extent, he might be right. Nothing we've seen out of EAD proper in the last 12 months has been particularly hardcore geared.

Then again, we've barely seen anything out of EAD proper aside from Animal Crossing and Wii Fit. Next Level, Treasure, Monster, etc. have all been working on games that I know I will enjoy and are funded and guided by Nintendo, so I guess I must not be much of a hardcore gamer.

 

[BishopLamont]

It's not people that use a Wii as their primary console that don't buy third party games. It's people who own a 360 or ps3 and have the wii as a secondary console that only buy the big Nintendo hits.

The number of people who own multiple next-gen consoles aren't as high as you may think.

The Wii will continue getting gimped and PS2-level games (asset and gameplay wise) because

a) It's all the machine is capable of, and
b) The audience does not demand better. It simply isn't that discriminating.

:lol

Where's Wii Sports for PS2?

 

[lowlylowlycook]

So I wanted to do a bit a research to find out what kind of effect the timing of Easter had in past years but the vgsales wiki doesn't seem to have monthly hardware sales from very long ago.

Is there any place to find that data?

 

[ShockingAlberto]

So I wanted to do a bit a research to find out what kind of effect the timing of Easter had in past years but the vgsales wiki doesn't seem to have monthly hardware sales from very long ago.

Is there any place to find that data?

Did you check Sales Archive?

 

[lowlylowlycook]

Did you check Sales Archive?

I looked there but as far as I could see threads from before NPD data became "official" have been purged. Maybe I'm blind.

 

[Archie]

So I wanted to do a bit a research to find out what kind of effect the timing of Easter had in past years but the vgsales wiki doesn't seem to have monthly hardware sales from very long ago.

Is there any place to find that data?

That only affects Japan.

 

[lowlylowlycook]

That only affects Japan.

Well if school children in the UK get time off for Easter then I'd have to suppose that it would effect sales in the UK as well.

 

[Cheech]

Nintendo knows they have a hardcore fanbase, and they're not going to stop making games for them.

Super Mario Galaxy was a 2007 title, and the last game Nintendo published for this fanbase.

Contrary to what you think or what they're publicly hinting at, for all its sales the Wii is GameCube 2.0 for the "hardcore fanbase".

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

Competing controllers have more. Left thumb on stick and right stick on buttons gives you four face buttons + four shoulder buttons + one clickable stick even.

Yes, but that's irrelevant for Soul Calibur, which is what this string of replies was regarding.

Super Mario Galaxy was a 2007 title, and the last game Nintendo published for this fanbase.

How is that this well-reviewed multi-million-selling Mario-heavy game counts, but not the two from early 2008?

 

[Cheech]

Where's Wii Sports for PS2?

Yeah, please read my post for content and then respond.

 

[Volcynika]

Super Mario Galaxy was a 2007 title, and the last game Nintendo published for this fanbase.

Contrary to what you think or what they're publicly hinting at, for all its sales the Wii is GameCube 2.0 for the "hardcore fanbase".

Uh, Mario Kart Wii and Smash Bros Brawl?

But it's ok, you can just be blind to those two 2008 titles.

 

[Cheech]

How is that this well-reviewed multi-million-selling Mario-heavy game counts, but not the two from early 2008?

Smash Brothers and Mario Kart are not the "hardcore" Wii games Anihawk was referring to.

My five year old considers them "hardcore", but again, he is not part of the fanbase in question.

 

[schuelma]

Smash Brothers and Mario Kart are not the "hardcore" Wii games Anihawk was referring to.

My five year old considers them "hardcore", but again, he is not part of the fanbase in question.

Wow

 

[scitek]

I don't understand this whole mentality that people have to separate a "casual" gamer from a "hardcore" one. I mean, I get that there are people out there that only play Wii Sports, and the game is so replayable they may not need another game for a long time, but there are plenty of people out there like myself that just play games to enjoy themselves. I have all three consoles and I enjoy games like De Blob and Zack & Wiki just as much as I enjoy World at War on my 360. There's no barrier in my mind telling me I can't play them all. How can people think this way?

 

[nincompoop]

Smash Brothers and Mario Kart are not the "hardcore" Wii games Anihawk was referring to.

My five year old considers them "hardcore", but again, he is not part of the fanbase in question.

:lol :lol :lol

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Smash Brothers and Mario Kart are not the "hardcore" Wii games Anihawk was referring to.

My five year old considers them "hardcore", but again, he is not part of the fanbase in question.

You're either stupid or trolling.

Or both!

 

[Sadist]

I don't understand this whole mentality that people have to separate a "casual" gamer from a "hardcore" one. I mean, I get that there are people out there that only play Wii Sports, and the game is so replayable they may not need another game for a long time, but there are plenty of people out there like myself that just play games to enjoy themselves. I have all three consoles and I enjoy games like De Blob and Zack & Wiki just as much as I enjoy World at War on my 360. There's no barrier in my mind telling me I can't play them all. How can people think this way?

Its called stereotyping.

 

[AniHawk]

Super Mario Galaxy was a 2007 title, and the last game Nintendo published for this fanbase.

Contrary to what you think or what they're publicly hinting at, for all its sales the Wii is GameCube 2.0 for the "hardcore fanbase".

I understand that this is a conversation about the Wii in particular, but Nintendo's output in general has been relatively consistent. Smash Bros and Mario Kart are games that appeal to a wider range of folks than the traditional casual market (although I don't care much for Smash Bros). Fire Emblem and Advance Wars: Days of Ruin hit the DS about a year apart. Wario Land Shake It was published by them in September of last year, and despite them not hitting North America, they did publish Disaster: Of Crisis Day and Fatal Frame IV. Looking further, there's Sin & Punishment 2 and Excitebots (arcadey =/= casual).

From EAD itself, we know pretty much nothing. All that's been released since E308 from EAD has been from one team. Wii Sports Resort, Wii Music, and AC were all done by the same guys, leaving the Pikmin, Zelda, SMG, and whoever the other team is open. Retro's working on something new, and Sora's looking for people to make a hardcore game for the Wii in particular. Nintendo isn't ignoring their hardcore base.

Notice I was saying Nintendo has a hardcore base that they're not ignoring, not that they're going for the Xbox 360's and PS3's hardcore base. They please their base with games like Mario Kart and Smash Bros. The 360's and PS3's hardcore base might like something more along the lines of Sin & Punishment 2, but it's also something their hardcore base is more familiar with and will probably buy because it's what it is.

 

[Cygnus X-1]

Whats wrong with LoZ:ST?

Everything. Outside the art style.

 

[Cheech]

I have all three consoles and I enjoy games like De Blob and Zack & Wiki just as much as I enjoy World at War on my 360. There's no barrier in my mind telling me I can't play them all. How can people think this way?

Given that it's a sales-age thread, it primarily has to do with how well these games sell on the Wii so more will be made. It's interesting you mention Zack & Wiki, because I'm pretty sure even the lowest selling Babyzzzz game on the Wii sold more copies.

So, nobody is saying don't buy and enjoy games like Zack & Wiki. What I AM saying, though, is that you aren't going to see that type of game on the Wii regularly, if ever. They simply do not sell.

 

[BishopLamont]

Yeah, please read my post for content and then respond.

Done and done, your turn.