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NPD Sales Results for May 2016

?

This is PS4's best May in its lifespan and is on track for its biggest year ever

I wasn't speaking with just the PS4 in mind. The total sum, of all hardware sold, is disappointing.

Some years back 200K, for a single platform, would've been considered "decent", if not low, for a month. Now its presented as very good numbers.

Overall console sales seem to be on a consecutive YOY decline.
 
More powerful and cheaper, rumor GPU upgrade to 2TF and 4K Bluray/output support.
If that thing price at $249 or lower, it will fly off shelf.
Plus best line up in Xbox history that rival last year with Gears 4, Forza horizon 3, Recore, Halo wars 2 and more, I mean, Halo, Gears and Forza in the same holiday! I think it will be the best holiday for Xbox one.

Okay, i'm just gonna put this out there - the market does not care about any of this. MS has been trying for years to throw IP in front of its console, which has already attracted a large audience but is not pulling in new members. Couple this with the fact that every game you just mentioned is also launching on PC, giving users even less of a reason to actually buy an Xbox, and there is no way they regain market momentum.

Power is not why the console is selling lower. Market perception is. They need to find a way to make their brand more attractive. Understand, Microsoft's problem with selling the Xbox currently is the same problem Microsoft has always had whenever they have attempted to sell hardware.
 
Again you are attributing things to me that were never stated.

I literally quoted what you said. Not the portions of me paraphrasing between the apostrophes, I mean the actual posts I quoted. How can you say I attributed your own posts to you unfairly? o.0

In no way is my post dismissive. It is informative.

Maybe that was your intention, but to me it came off as I paraphrased it.

I simply stated there is more context to consider than just the number of days each title was on sale for and directed them to my earlier Post breaking down those additional points of context.

No. That is NOT all there was to your post. You also stated that the post you referenced included 'all the relevant info' after he brought up something you didn't include in said post.

You are manufacturing and assigning intent that was not present in my post or my words.

It is present in your words. Are you trying to claim that when you said your post contained 'all the relevant info' that we are to take that as in fact meaning that it does NOT actually contain 'all the relevant info'?!
You are informing me that my post which had no dismissive, insulting or demeaning rhetoric whatsoever is somehow dismissive and therefore means something I never stated.

Yes, I am telling you how it reads (note: I am among your audience). It has a tones against the context of the post you were replying to and the post you referenced therein.

But I'm done sidetracking this thread with this nonsense. Should you want to continue this conversation feel free to do so over PM but I will no longer be engaging you or this topic in this thread.

Ok. :)
 

Welfare

Member
Okay before I read the rest of the thread, UC4 is, ok? Looks like the US doesn't care for UC like the ROTW does.

Halo is still top dog it looks like, even in its severely weakened state.

Gears of War 4 and God of War 4 will be very interesting see.
 
Looks like this is the second worst month ever for XBO. (Only May 2014 was worse with 77,000, that's because was the pre pricedrop month).

It's also the worst month ever for Wii U.


...Yeah, lucky for us we have PS4.
Something tells me there will be many more "worst month ever" for the WiiU from now until the NX is announced, let alone launch.
 
Okay before I read the rest of the thread, UC4 is, ok? Looks like the US doesn't care for UC like the ROTW does.

Halo is still top dog it looks like, even in it's severely weakened state.

Gears of War 4 and God of War 4 will be very interesting see.
Uncharted 4 just batted at #1 on NPD, what are you talking about? Or am I missing something here?
 
I wasn't speaking with just the PS4 in mind. The total sum, of all hardware sold, is disappointing.

Some years back 200K, for a single platform, would've been considered "decent", if not low, for a month. Now its presented as very good numbers.

Overall console sales seem to be on a consecutive YOY decline.

I can see where you are coming from in terms of total hardware yeah. Wii U is abysmal and Xbone isn't doing well at all currently. PS4 really is the only thing performing well in terms of hardware.
 

RexNovis

Banned
I wasn't speaking with just the PS4 in mind. The total sum, of all hardware sold, is disappointing.

Some years back 200K, for a single platform, would've been considered "decent", if not low, for a month. Now its presented as very good numbers.

Overall console sales seem to be on a consecutive YOY decline.

How many years do you consider "some years back" exactly? Because unless you are talking about the PS2 200k or more units sold in May has been fairly rare.

As far as the total sum goes yea there is currently a lame duck of a platform dragging everyone down with it. I don't see how that diminishes the success of a different platform though.
 
I wasn't speaking with just the PS4 in mind. The total sum, of all hardware sold, is disappointing.

Some years back 200K, for a single platform, would've been considered "decent", if not low, for a month. Now its presented as very good numbers.


Overall console sales seem to be on a consecutive YOY decline.

Well there is obviously decline from last gen but the other reason for this is that holidays make up for bigger part of the total sales than before and the ratio grows pretty much every year. For example PS4 wasn't that much ahead of PS3s 2008 sales last year before october but crushed it during the holiday season. Same happened with Xbox One vs X360 to smaller degree..
 
I'm not arguing with you, btw. In fact, I'm agreeing with most of what you're saying, except that I think you're not taking it far enough.

I'm not sure what you mean specifically here. Maybe explain the methodology you are thinking about a bit more. It sounds like you are saying we should take the incrementally boosts figure and subtract from it the baseline figure (which is what I was advocating), so I must not be understanding your diction here unless you mean to agree with me, heh.

Ehhhhh, not really. Total Demand = Baseline Demand + Incremental Demand. This rule can be applied to any consumer good. Cheese, game consoles, patio sets. Whatever.

Baseline Demand = "Normal" demand of a good driven by Base Price, Distribution (how available a product is), brand marketing, etc. What a product would sell normally.

Incremental Demand = "Abnormal" short-term, elevated demand of a good. This is driven by Promotion (sales), incremental placement (like an end cap or shelf at the front of a store), short-term advertising blitzes.

Think French Bread at your supermarket. Now, French Bread is located in the bakery section of your store, right? You could go over there, where it lives normally, and where there's a sign and a price. The sales of French Bread in this case is "Baseline" demand. Say you sell 10 loaves a day this way.

Now, the baker says, hey, I think I could sell some more French Bread if I put a basket up front near the registers (incremental distribution) and I'll mark it off -25% (price promotion) and make sure that someone announces it's available over the loudpseaker (short-term marketing blitz).

At the end of that day, the store realizes it sold 30 loaves of bread.

Therefore, Total Demand (30 Loaves) = Baseline Demand (10 Loaves) + Incremental Demand (20 Loaves).

The store would have sold 10 loaves by doing nothing. That's the baseline I'm talking about. But it sold 30. So, 10 baseline, 20 incremental.

With Consoles... same idea. If you're comparing May 2016 to May 2015, we first have to determine what the baseline demand would be (considering Base Price, marketing and distribution) and what the incremental demand would be (considering Promotional/Sale Price, short-term marketing and any additional distribution or promotion surrounding something like New Release Software.)

What I'm saying is you can't compare the two periods unless you strip out and measure the factors that impact both Base and Incremental demand, something the available data makes impossible. (Well, maybe not impossible, but certainly pointless).

Sure, but I'm not sure asking about what kind of boost PS4 enjoyed relative to last May requires anything beyond rudimentary analytics.

But when we're talking about such small numbers and small %, the rudimentary analytics really tells us nothing significant.
 
I'm confused, is crab against using percentages as a barometer for loss and growth?

If you want to address the following question, I am insisting we don't rely on percentages but instead use absolute differences in unit sales:

Question: How much did conditions XYZ increase/boost PS4 sales in May 2016 compared to May 2015?

My position is that this is a mathematical statement specifying that we are to measure said boost via the difference in unit sales between May 2016 and May 2015. That delta in absolute unit sales is the appropriate basis for judging how impressive of a 'boost' conditions XYZ gave PS4. The question as posed demands a measure of the absolute differences, so obscuring that measure by relying on percentages is not only not helpful, but can be incredibly misleading.

You can see my point if you take the 'percentage based argument' to its logical extremes. You will find it is inconsistent unless you decide going from zero units --> 1 unit is a far more impressive feat than going from, say 1 unit --> 1million units. Presuming that nobody would agree the former is more impressive than the latter, the 'percentage based logic' is internally inconsistent whereas the absolute deltas are not.
 
Sorry for double, but the block o' text below is unwieldy.

Overall console sales seem to be on a consecutive YOY decline.

Actually, not really.

Yes, there were HUGE declines yearly from 2010 through 2013, including a massive -28% decrease in HW units sold in 2012. However, since 2013, hardware sales are remarkably stable. We had <2% decreases in HW units in 2014 and 2015.

HW units peaked in 2008. Over 34m HW units sold across all devices that year. In contrast, for 3 years running we've been sitting at 16m units. (2013-2015).

By the looks of things, the market's bottomed out, at least for now.

Prior to 2013, the last year to fall below 16m units of HW annually? You have to go back to 2000.

We could still go down from here, sure. If the NX does Wii U numbers, or MS leaves the console space, then it should be expected. However, if the number of manufcaturers stays constant over the next cycle, this should be the bottom.
 
Actually, not really.

Yes, there were HUGE declines yearly from 2010 through 2013, including a massive -28% decrease in HW units sold in 2012. However, since 2013, hardware sales are remarkably stable. We had <2% decreases in HW units in 2014 and 2015.

HW units peaked in 2008. Over 34m HW units sold across all devices that year. In contrast, for 3 years running we've been sitting at 16m units. (2013-2015).

By the looks of things, the market's bottomed out, at least for now.

Prior to 2013, the last year to fall below 16m units of HW annually? You have to go back to 2000.

We could still go down from here, sure. If the NX does Wii U numbers, or MS leaves the console space, then it should be expected. However, if the number of manufcaturers stays constant over the next cycle, this should be the bottom.

Nice breakdown here Cosmic. Puts some things in perspective. I think you might be right, looking at this. It appears at least that the market has already bottomed out and is relatively stable at this point. Like you said there is a chance it could dip more but I don't see a strong indication of that happening in the short term. Not with NX, Scorpio, and Neo coming
 
What are the chances the X1 slim is announced alongside another pricecut? I mean they just gave the X1 the pricecut to $299 officially, so I dunno if it gets another price cut before the holidays.
 
I must be missing something, LTD, XOne's still ahead of 360. Or are we just comparing one month from gen to gen?

Month to month, though I think this has been true for a few months now.

What are the chances the X1 slim is announced alongside another pricecut? I mean they just gave the X1 the pricecut to $299 officially, so I dunno if it gets another price cut before the holidays.

I can't see it. They just dropped the price officially like you said, another drop would be massively devaluing the console.

They should hold on $300 and bank on the Slim being a shiny, new (but not new) system.
 
I'm not arguing with you, btw. In fact, I'm agreeing with most of what you're saying, except that I think you're not taking it far enough.

I'm aware. Still can be fruitful discussing stuff though. :)

Ehhhhh, not really. Total Demand = Baseline Demand + Incremental Demand. This rule can be applied to any consumer good. Cheese, game consoles, patio sets. Whatever.

Ah, I was thinking your term for 'incremental demand' was referring to demand after the increment (same as your total demand). Gothcya. In that sense what I was advocating was to take total demand minus baseline to get to an incremental demand and then judge that.

If you're comparing May 2016 to May 2015, we first have to determine what the baseline demand would be (considering Base Price, marketing and distribution) and what the incremental demand would be (considering Promotional/Sale Price, short-term marketing and any additional distribution or promotion surrounding something like New Release Software.

What I'm saying is you can't compare the two periods unless you strip out and measure the factors that impact both Base and Incremental demand, something the available data makes impossible.

This is equivalent to my comment about a more well defined baseline, though I'm not sure what measurable factors we have that influence both baseline and incremental. The former may have some (trends in monthly performance tracking YoY) and the latter may have others (typical unit sales boosts alongside major game launches, price drops, bundles, etc) but I can't think of any off the top of my head right now that would have much overlap.

But when we're talking about such small numbers and small %, the rudimentary analytics really tells us nothing significant.

This is not at all true. So long as the variances are likewise small we can still draw the exact same conclusions with the same confidence as we could with distributions that have been scaled up (note: I am talking about scaling the distributions, not the sample size alone). The variance relative to the mean is what matters. In my example it would be 1 unit out of 1380 units, which is more than tiny enough to draw conclusions with pretty good confidence levels.
 

Kill3r7

Member
So here a graph which show the performance of all Uncharted games first month in the US. :p



  • Uncharted - 117,000
  • Uncharted 2 - 537,000
  • Uncharted 3 - 838,000
  • Uncharted: Golden abiss - 93,000
  • Uncharted: The Nathan Drake collection - 300,000
  • Uncharted 4 - 879,000


And here you can see an inferior graph from Zhuge :p (joke :D)

https://twitter.com/ZhugeEX/status/741330537147699201

Does UC3 include bundles?

EDIT: Never mind I saw Zhuge's tweet.
 
Month to month, though I think this has been true for a few months now.

Time aligned, 5 of the past 12 months.

This is not at all true. So long as the variances are likewise small we can still draw the exact same conclusions with the same confidence as we could with distributions that have been scaled up (note: I am talking about scaling the distributions, not the sample size alone). The variance relative to the mean is what matters. In my example it would be 1 unit out of 1380 units, which is more than tiny enough to draw conclusions with pretty good confidence levels.

I think I'm grasping what you're saying, but I'm not totally certain.

And I should have been more specific when I used the term "significant" at the end there. I was referring more to the real-world application of the findings, rather than testing for actual statistical significance.

Yeah, I imagine one could get to where they could have some confidence with the tests, I just don't know what one would do with those findings in either this discussion or within the market?

To sum up my own judgment of the month, it's pretty good but not good good, and certainly not great, but better than okay, and much better than meh. I am neither impressed nor unimpressed. I am mostly ambivalent, but slightly more positive than that because it was >200k and that's rare, but not way over 200k, which pulls me back to ambivalence and all I really kinda know is that everything else sucked, and since this didn't suck, relatively it's better. SCIENCE!
 

Ryng_tolu

Banned
Another news i forgot to mention from aquamarine: :p

All Nintendo games sold under 35k this month, the bigger Nintendo game was Pokken Tournament.

Nintendo sales were -38% down MOM and 29% down YOY.
 
Ouch. Poor Remedy. And now they are making 2 more games and neither are the ones their fans really want which is Alan Wake. Don't get me wrong that title wouldn't light the charts on fire either but I'm pretty confident it would perform better than Quantum Break

Hope they're not in trouble now...
 
Not surprised... I've beaten the game and thought it was okay, nothing special. Alan wake 2 would have made a bigger splash.

Yeah its weird to me they are steadfast against using the IP. At one point they really wanted to, and I was convinced they were gonna after wrapping QB but with their recent announcement they aren't doing it, it just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Like I said AW2 wouldn't be a monster on the sales charts, but there is a userbase there that want's that game. And for Remedy who is a studio that really doesn't sell a whole lot of units in general its their safest bet. As long as they budgeted it ok they could have an easy semi-hit / success with AW2
 

Evazan

aka [CFD] El Capitan
Okay before I read the rest of the thread, UC4 is, ok? Looks like the US doesn't care for UC like the ROTW does.

Halo is still top dog it looks like, even in its severely weakened state.

Gears of War 4 and God of War 4 will be very interesting see.

I have read this about 3 times and I still can't understand what your talking about
 

Curufinwe

Member
I think a few things hurt Uncharted sales:

- franchise fatigue was present for the last entry, and while it was a well-received game, all the games are now cheap and quite fulfilling on their own. I think releasing the collection didn't help matters, although it made all the sense in the world to do so regardless of whether it hurt UC4 or not

- the marketing was very generic and non-specific, same for the title

- the multiplayer is great, but most people are buying to play through the single player and the market has learned you don't need to pay $60 to do so unless there is a particular zeitgeist. I didn't feel that for the game.

I doubt Sony brings the series back for a long time whereas a more positive result could have changed that.

That explains why it's the best launch in the history of the franchise.
 

allan-bh

Member
Okay before I read the rest of the thread, UC4 is, ok? Looks like the US doesn't care for UC like the ROTW does.

Halo is still top dog it looks like, even in its severely weakened state.

Gears of War 4 and God of War 4 will be very interesting see.

I believe the general sense was that U4 would sell better on NPD, but is a record result for the franchise.

Halo 5 did better in 5 days, so yeah, in US Uncharted can't compete, at least on launch.
 

Evazan

aka [CFD] El Capitan
I believe the general sense was that U4 would sell better on NPD, but is a record result for the franchise.

Halo 5 did better in 5 days, so yeah, in US Uncharted can't compete, at least on launch.

Oh is that what he is saying?
That UC4 didn't do as much as Halo 5 at launch?

Oh than yeah your right. I'm willing to be though it outsells H5 and the next Gears by a significant margin overall.
 

cakely

Member
This is the second time in the last week I've seen a long argument against comparing two values with a ratio instead of an absolute value.

Both methods are equally valid. They convey the same information in a slightly different fashion.
 

Fady K

Member
It's also worth mentioning that the last time a console sold more than 200k units in May was 360 back in 2011 shortly after the release of the Kinect so it's a fairly rare feat. I certainly wouldn't consider it disappointing.

That is pretty impressive. People need to be reminded of such things to put things into perspective.
 

Crawl

Member
I think the positive WOM surrounding Wolfenstein helped Doom out a lot. People were more willing to consider purchasing after all the positive reviews given the surprise success of a previous rebooted classic FOS from the same publisher. I fully expect Wolfenstein 2 to debut even better still.

Probably. TNO is such a great game, once you get past the intro level lol.



Did some digging in the archive.

This is what I found for first month TNO sales, which ironically came out also in may two years ago in 2014, so maybe TNO2 will come out may 2017?

Mpl90 said:
So, given the numbers we have


Wolfenstein: The New Order - < 352,000
Wolfenstein PS4 - < 144,320
Wolfenstein One - < 133,760
Wolfenstein 360 - < 45,760
Wolfenstein PS3 - < 28,160

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=116950709#post116950709

So with Doom Selling 525k in its first month alone, along with steamspy having it at 580k+ or so before deep discounts ( http://steamspy.com/app/379720 ) it should definitely get sequel since bethesda greenlit a Wolfe Sequel; which will be debuted this weekend at their press conference.
 

Kill3r7

Member
Did some digging in the archive.

This is what I found for first month TNO sales, which ironically came out also in may two years ago in 2014, so maybe TNO2 will come out may 2017?



http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=116950709#post116950709

So with Doom Selling 525k in its first month alone, along with steamspy having it at 580k+ or so before deep discounts ( http://steamspy.com/app/379720 ) it should definitely get sequel since bethesda greenlit a Wolfe Sequel; which will be debuted this weekend at their press conference.

I don't think a sequel is in question. The game sold really well. It is basically DSIII from last month.
 
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