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[RichiRamjag]

I'm not going to re-quote the ten or so people that responded to my posts with precisely that attitude because they couldn't stomach hearing someone be mean about TR because it was "reviewed well" and because it's "mean" to be happy something you think is shit bombs. You'll just have to read the conversation again and put the words together.

Yep, I've stated multiple times now that I'd be fine if it sold well, but I'm certainly not sorry that the sales lined up with my opinions, yet folks keep coming at me with extremist examples like I'm throwing a parade. If the market thought it was good, then fine. I'm not performing voodoo rituals in the hopes of the game flopping, but I'm not sorry it flopped either. They made what I consider bad choices and they were punished for them. I don't owe SE anything.

 

[Amir0x]

I don't have a problem with criticism. Hell, I love reading reviews and critiques of games, music, movies, etc. that tear the content of the media apart. I just think gleefully swearing about how much a game or movie sucks when it sells poorly is a bit childish. It's not a very meaningful way of critiquing the art form. You can do what you want, and I even see where you're coming from here, though, so I don't have a problem with it or have my feelings hurt.

Though, to counteract your point, I don't think the Eidos marketing team is going to see these Tomb Raider sales and think "well, I guess we need to go back to what made the old games great," because really, when was the last time a classic Tomb Raider-style game sold well anyways? Though I could be wrong, who knows, we are getting a Psyconauts 2 so anything could happen.

Also for the record I've never played a Tomb Raider game in my life, originals or reboot, so I don't have a dog in this race either way.

See, this is where you're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't. Anyone who participates in the reboot TR topics can tell you I've been a consistent body criticizing the reboot in great detail. I have endless long posts detailing what I find wrong with the series, and why I would be happy the series bombed. There's gotta be at least a hundred of those types of posts in my post history about the reboot. But this isn't the topic for detailing why I don't like it, it's an NPD topic. The topic is sales, and what your reaction is to it. My reaction is I'm happy, and I've laid out the reasons I would be happy about such a scenario in endless ancient reboot TR topics. Thousands of words on the subject.

So if I broke it down here everything that sucks about the reboot, I would be accused of derailing the thread. But just celebrate, and I'm accused of being mean spirited. All anyone needs to know is hoping a series - tv, book, movie or game - bombs is as old as time, fucking everyone does it, and if you can't deal with that please actually say something meaningful about it instead of whining. This is not a charity. This is stuff people pay hard earned cash for, and a lot of cash. If they can't deal with people hating their product, they should stop making games.

 

[Nimby]

Any estimates for TR? Where does it fall, approximate sales?

 

[Welfare]

If consumers pay $60 for HD remasters like The Last of Us, I don't see why that would stop people from buying rise of the tomb raider just because it was out on another platform a year back. Most will probably see it as a new game (not knowing of the xbox ones exclusivity /not caring) and considering a lot of people bought the 2013 reboot: I don't think it will necessarily bomb again

Last of Us Remastered launched in July with absolutely no competition and with not a lot of game on the PS4.

Holiday 2016 is going to be when TR PS4 launches and it'll go up against even more high profile games. It'll probably do worse than the Xbox One version.

 

[Kyoufu]

Square made their bed now it's time to lay in it. I have absolutely no sympathy That TR bombed.

I don't have any sympathy either. You know you fucked up when even folks on an internet message board knew you fucked up back at Gamescom 2014.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

What's really sad about the Tomb Raider deal is that I think it could have pushed REALLY good numbers on the PS4 this holiday.

Since Sony basically had no exclusives this fall, and Uncharted 4 got delayed till 2016, there was a pretty big void left for this type of game on a platform that has the biggest fanbase for this genre. I'd imagine it could have at least done 500K+ on PS4 this month.

The only positive about Tomb Raider bombing is is that it essentially ends any sort of exclusivity discussion for these big budget third party titles. It's simply never going to happen again given how this turned out. I'm just worried that it backfired and bombed so bad that it puts the TR series in jeopardy since I really enjoyed the reboot and am eagerly anticipating when I can play the sequel on the PS4.

 

[jaypah]

I can't believe people care that much about an Amir0x opinion in 2015. Do you know how many people wish for shit to fail? Even if they don't actually type it out? At least he has reasons other than "because it competes with thing I love". He doesn't like it. Big. Fucking. Deal.

For what it's worth I thought it was dope. Bought it twice. The reboot that is, still waiting on the PC version of the latest game.

 

[Mr Moose]

Any estimates for TR? Where does it fall, approximate sales?

~200k I believe.

 

[SeanR1221]

Now that we actually have the Nintendo numbers it stings even worse. Your competition just both sold 5-6x as much as you during the holidays.

 

[Jigolo]

tomb raider is cool

 

[jjonez18]

I know I'm late to the party but WOW.

3m combined. With both PS4/XB1 over 1.23m! Excellent news.

Well...maybe not for Wii U.

 

[Alienfan]

I was under the impression the deal primarily involved 'offsetting' the apparently expensive task of marketing. I didn't see much of any marketing, though.

Unless Square Enix really didn't think it through, it was probably more than just a marketing deal. Third party games often do marketing deals with Microsoft (Witcher 3, Fallout 4), but that doesn't stop them releasing on other consoles. This deal just seems like it probably would be different/involve money exchanging hands

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

So in the end the $299 Uncharted bundle was a fantastic idea.

I have no idea why it was criticize by some people all consumers care about is the price.

The price was the smart part because now a ton of people will get exposed to Uncharted (just like a huge batch got exposed to The Last of Us in the last long-term bundle). Sony's not seeing Uncharted as a selling point for the bundle, they're seeing it as an ad for Uncharted 4.

Some people are just haters, better to leave them to it in that instance.

Absolutely not. You want NeoGAF to be a better forum? Then call out shitty posts when you see them.

 

[Cess007]

https://twitter.com/ZhugeEX/status/675150908544651264

Yikes, it seems that gap ain't going down anytime soon :/

 

[DriftingSpirit]

Any estimates for TR? Where does it fall, approximate sales?

X1/360 = 200K.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

Amir0x Is being a bit abrasive here, but I get the sentiment. The TR reboot feels like nothing like the originals. I feel a similar growing resentment towards old series I liked being reborn (cough Fire Emblem cough).

 

[Mikey Jr.]

Also I think halo needs a break. Take 5 years off, let 343 do something else or something smaller.

Ummm, not going to happen. 343 was created simply to make Halo. They are a Halo factory, and will be for a long time. The games still sell a lot, so yeah. Halo ain't going anywhere.

The Coalition is also now a Gears of War factory. Don't expect much deviation from them.

 

[renjworks]

Tomb Raider Bomba. The series is dead guys.

on Xbox perhaps. Let's see it on PS4.
Still, amazing job Sony!

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

The price was the smart part because now a ton of people will get exposed to Uncharted (just like a huge batch got exposed to The Last of Us in the last long-term bundle). Sony's not seeing Uncharted as a selling point for the bundle, they're seeing it as an ad for Uncharted 4.



Absolutely not. You want NeoGAF to be a better forum? Then call out shitty posts when you see them.

Yup and it's a brilliant ad for Uncharted 4. I'm wondering if UC4 will match TLOU first month numbers now. No Uncharted game has managed to do that (UC3 had 700K sales, TLOU had 1 million).

I'm expecting somewhere inbetween UC3 and TLOU, but if they exceed 1 million greatly...wow, it just goes to show you how powerful the Naughty Dog brand has become.

 

[Nimby]

X1/360 = 200K.

Any other estimates floating about?

 

[ninjablade]

200k for Wiiu in the biggest month of the year. PS4 does that in a shit month.

This console from a sales perspective, has been a colossal failure. It is almost surreal. They went from an all-time high to an absolute low. Crazy.

I saw this coming, the Wii causal audience, wanted motion controls, got there fill and moved on, there was no hype for the successor, because the wii audience is not the type to care about successor or a powerful machine. All the hype was for ps4 and XB1 in the us.

 

[GribbleGrunger]

That seems a bit low, though I confess, I don't know how worldwide sales typically operate in November/December.

PS4 has been typically doing 1 million per month so far. Now, it's done about 1.5 million in NA alone. I feel like the WW number is closer to 3-3.5 million for the month.

Yeah, it's probably over, that's why I said 'comfortably'. It's just incredible how this thing is selling.

 

[RichiRamjag]

Oh me neither, the market worked as it should, I suppose! His repercussion is a bit over the board, in my opinion. I mean I respect that he hates the modern incarnation of some games, and that's completely acceptable, I simply don't think that this game bombing will give him what he wants, which is another classical TR game, or happened because it was not a classic TR game.

I don't think we're disagreeing, BTW! Also, I haven't even touched the game, or even liked the reboot all that much, so I'm not really saying he's being mean to whatever opinion I might have.

Yeah, I feel you man. I don't think we're in disagreement either. I don't care for where the series went overall and I'm not a fan of the choices they made. Someone used hit man absolution as an example. Personally, I'm not sorry that I don't want the market to reward what I consider bad decisions. I understand that it is my opinion, and if the market disagrees with me, then I'm perfectly fine with it just the same.

 

[Welfare]

For comparison, what about Just Dance 2016?

>300k

 

[kswiston]

Yikes, it seems that gap ain't going down anytime soon :/

I think it is impressive that Microsoft has kept the gap that small two years into the generation given how things were going for most of 2014.

I expect PS4 to eventually finish several million ahead of the XB1 in the US, but it doesn't look like we are getting the reversal of the 360/PS3 situation that everyone predicted 16 months ago.

 

[7DollarHagane]

Whoa where'd you get 50 for that trade in?

A Midwest chain called meijers has a double trade in promo this week. Look it up on cheapassgamer.

They are only in a few states though. Was nice to flip it for credit towards dariusburst.

 

[Mikey Jr.]

https://twitter.com/ZhugeEX/status/675150908544651264

I can honestly say, this line will never actually go down anymore. Don't see it happening anymore. PS4 in 2016 is firing on all cylinders.

 

[DecoReturns]

Amir0x Is being a bit abrasive here, but I get the sentiment. The TR reboot feels like nothing like the originals. I feel a similar growing resentment towards old series I liked being reborn (cough Fire Emblem cough).

that one wasn't reborn, certain aspects went in a different direction.
But it still plays like a Fire Emblem game

 

[Loudninja]

UK Black Friday week:
PS4:139,000
Xbox One: 134,000
http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/over-300-000-consoles-sold-during-black-friday-week-in-the-uk/0159898

Japan for the last week:
PS4:26.598
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1149348

 

[SatelliteOfLove]

I didn't get schadenfrueden over the series; just bought OG Tomb Raider offa Steam for a buck 50.

 

[Duxxy3]

It's too bad that more people didn't get to play the new Tomb Raider. It was my GOTY.

 

[Elios83]

If consumers pay $60 for HD remasters like The Last of Us, I don't see why that would stop people from buying rise of the tomb raider just because it was out on another platform a year back. Most will probably see it as a new game (not knowing of the xbox ones exclusivity /not caring) and considering a lot of people bought the 2013 reboot: I don't think it will necessarily bomb again

It will be really hard for a year late port to compete with all the new games that will be released next year.
2016 holiday season will also have big japanese games like Final Fantasy XV and Persona 5 and Sony exclusives like Horizon and The Last Guardian. It will be more crowded than this year for PS4.
It will be really hard for Tomb Raider to compete. The risk is bombing like some late ports on PS3. Too little too late at full price.
Right now PC version next spring is their best chance at selling and making money with this game.
That or if they can renegotiate their contract to a 6 months exclusive due to unexpected really low sales.

 

[CrichtonKicks]

Though, to counteract your point, I don't think the Eidos marketing team is going to see these Tomb Raider sales and think "well, I guess we need to go back to what made the old games great," because really, when was the last time a classic Tomb Raider-style game sold well anyways? Though I could be wrong, who knows, we are getting a Psyconauts 2 so anything could happen.
.

That's the thing to me. When was the last time that a "classic style" Tomb Raider really released and hit on all cylinders? Anniversary is arguable because of the remake aspect. Before that you probably have to go all the way back to The Last Revelation in 1999. 16 years! And I seem to recall that the series was already in heavy sales decline at that point. Not sure how TLR did but Chronicles did bad enough to prompt the first of many soft reboots.

I love Tomb Raider in most of its incarnations but it's a series that peaked in terms of relevancy in the late '90s or early 2000s.

 

[JayhawkerStL]

Come on about what? Are we really trying to get to a point where anyone thinks it's OK to try to tell others they can't be happy when something they believe is trash bombs? Is this what the gaming community is now? That's where we are at with sharing opinions now? Only happy unicorns and rainbows? We're only allowed to say "well someone somewhere must like this crap, and people worked hard on it! Therefore, I hope this thing which I believe is atrocious still succeeds and I am not happy in any way to see it not do well!"

Sorry, that's just not the real world. I think the reboot sucks, it destroyed an original series, and I'm absolutely ecstatic it bombed. Could not be any happier if I tried. Why do games keep getting treated differently than movies, tv shows and books? I can write a novel over the amount of GAF posts I've seen happy over a crappy movie bombing or a crappy tv show bombing. Well, I think this is crappy. And I can define WHY.

In the real world, the crappy TR games killed the franchise. It was already dead. Legend and Underworld revived it, and the reboot made it great again.

And no, acting like gloating idiot when something you don't like fails will never be something the decent people respect.

At least you are in the right thread. 99% of the negative image GAF has comes from the cheerleaders in the NPD threads.

 

[Nimby]

>300k

I edited my post. Didn't think that was a suitable comparison to RoTTR.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

that one wasn't reborn, certain aspects went in a different direction.
But it still plays like a Fire Emblem game

It was reborn in a baptism of otaku and fan service fire. Bleugh.

But yeah. At least the core gameplay is fairly intact.

Yayyyyy.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

UK Black Friday week:
PS4:139,000
Xbox One: 134,000
http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/over-300-000-consoles-sold-during-black-friday-week-in-the-uk/0159898

Japan:
PS4:116,403 * I think*

So if we add those up it at 32 million sold WW give or take just counting them .

 

[kswiston]

Amir0x Is being a bit abrasive here, but I get the sentiment. The TR reboot feels like nothing like the originals. I feel a similar growing resentment towards old series I liked being reborn (cough Fire Emblem cough).

Awakening (and presumably Fates) are way closer to OG Fire Emblem than TR 2013/Rise are to classic Tomb Raider.

 

[rokkerkory]

I see expanding ps4 lead in NA now. Halo 5 did not help. Maybe $200 price point will.

 

[DriftingSpirit]

I think it is impressive that Microsoft has kept the gap that small two years into the generation given how things were going for most of 2014.

I expect PS4 to eventually finish several million ahead of the XB1 in the US, but it doesn't look like we are getting the reversal of the 360/PS3 situation that everyone predicted 16 months ago.

The PS3 got trounced in the US last generation so I think ending slightly above the X1 in their strongest territory is a great accomplishment.

 

[BokehKing]

What's really sad about the Tomb Raider deal is that I think it could have pushed REALLY good numbers on the PS4 this holiday.

Since Sony basically had no exclusives this fall, and Uncharted 4 got delayed till 2016, there was a pretty big void left for this type of game on a platform that has the biggest fanbase for this genre. I'd imagine it could have at least done 500K+ on PS4 this month.

The only positive about Tomb Raider bombing is is that it essentially ends any sort of exclusivity discussion for these big budget third party titles. It's simply never going to happen again given how this turned out. I'm just worried that it backfired and bombed so bad that it puts the TR series in jeopardy since I really enjoyed the reboot and am eagerly anticipating when I can play the sequel on the PS4.

And if Street Fighter 5 does good numbers? Isn't it relatively the same type of deal in the long run?

A usually multi play game on consoles only coming out on one?

I could be wrong

 

[RichiRamjag]

Awakening (and presumably Fates) are way closer to OG Fire Emblem than TR 2013/Rise are to classic Tomb Raider.

Yeah, I heard the villain side of the sequel was much closer to OG fire emblem as well.

And if Street Fighter 5 does good numbers? Isn't it relatively the same type of deal in the long run?

A usually multi play game on consoles only coming out on one?

I could be wrong

It's close and I'd be bit more pissy about if it was a one year exclusive rather than what it is. I don't like those in destiny or any other game tbh.

 

[Mr Moose]

Amir0x Is being a bit abrasive here, but I get the sentiment. The TR reboot feels like nothing like the originals. I feel a similar growing resentment towards old series I liked being reborn (cough Fire Emblem cough).

I might be one of the few that loved the reboot (hated the old Tomb Raider games), I guess I am one of them that Square-Enix/Crystal Dynamics fucked over, I would've bought RotTR day one. Now that its a year later? Fuck no, they can suck it, it deserves to bomb. I won't buy it next year (probably).

CoD is taking up a lot of my gaming time this time of the year, it might be the same next year too. (Also been playing some Fat Princess, and will start FFVII soon-ish, after double XP weekend).

 

[johnny956]

on Xbox perhaps. Let's see it on PS4.
Still, amazing job Sony!

If they priced it right and released in a slower time it could work okay but no where near numbers of TR 2013. We're at what 15 million Xbox One? PS4 will be 45+ million at release?

 

[Glorified G]

Goddamn at PS4 & XB1 alone pushing almost 3 million consoles this month. That's insane. Whether you admit it or not is irrelevant, Facts are facts. Consoles are fully healthy in 2015 and going forward in the foreseeable future. $299 is a good number two years after launch and both Sony & MS should stick with it for next year.

Other notes:

Nice to see Halo 5 still chart. It's a big decline from previous entries obviously, but doesn't look like a complete disaster.

And smh at Need for Speed. I can only hope online only titles dies this gen.

 

[DriftingSpirit]

I am pretty interested in seeing how MS will handle things from this point forward. Their strongest IP couldn't make a difference. So, I imagine the focus will be on price from now on. Just keep lowering it and/or adding incentives.

 

[DecoReturns]

It was reborn in a baptism of otaku and fan service fire. Bleugh.

But yeah. At least the core gameplay is fairly intact.

Yayyyyy.

Rather have that, then what they did with Shadow Dragon.
Besides if this popularity gets us Genealogy of the Holy War remake, I'm all for it.

 

[Loudninja]

So if we add those up it at 32 million sold WW give or take just counting them .

Nah thats not right Japan number is th for Sony sold over 30 million up to November 22 in Japan.

My bad!
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=186709793&postcount=5

 

[watdaeff4]

On one hand I sorta respect the passion of people wishing the old school Tomb Raider would return.

Bht on the other hand the change in direction was due to the franchise dying and the reboot trying to make the series relevant with the modern gaming fanbase.

So now these people gloating about the "failure" are coming across.....to me.... As "If I can't have Tomb Raider the way I want it; I hope nobody gets it"

 

[BabyFaceKillah]

people still crying bout tomb raider?