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[Randolph Freelander]

Btw, I'm wondering what's up with the gloom and doom on this NPD thread for the Wii U compared to last month. Were people actually expecting sales to go up this month? I'm just wondering. Do sales typically go up in October from September? It is possible that GTA V and Pokemon/3DS sales cannibalized all other sales this month...

...

Was the idea that the price cut in its 2nd month plus these (mostly multiplatform) games would increase the sales? Considering the sales of even the most popular multiplats probably didn't cross 800k across 3-5 platforms, I really doubt the Wii U sales for those titles would suddenly make people buy a Wii U. I think pretty much only a special GTA Wii U DLC may have done something.

Anyways, if the Wii U is now suddenly doomed, nothing has changed since last month. Thus it was doomed last month by the logic that the price cut didn't do enough.

Wii U hasn't stopped being "doomed" since January, or mid-December if you were paying enough attention last year. It's just that month after month, it becomes more evident. Personally, my expectations as stated September 1 and restated October 18 were roughly what we saw here. Perhaps the actual weekly averages might be closer to 15K, depending on which end of the 50-60K range the Wii U actually is.

However, absent expectations, most of us are simply looking for a sign of life. Perhaps one that, yes, defies expectations. So far, it hasn't happened, and it's perfectly acceptable to analyze even expected realities.

 

[SporeCrawler]

That's the thing. The Wii U wasn't doing well last year. It debuted worse than the GameCube, sold decently in December, and then just died.


Also doesn't it seem like Nintendo was far more desperate with the GameCube than they are with the Wii U? They seemed to be firing on all cylinders with the GameCube despite all their issues, at least game-wise. Not sure why Nintendo seems so calm with the Wii U in a terrible state like this...

The difference is that gamecube released late. Ps2 was already on the market and established a dominant market position. With wiiu nintendo had a year to establish a software lineup and userbase before the other consoles launch.

I dont think the launch for wiiu was bad. It was pretty good. It was january and beyond that was desastrous,

 

[Lumyst]

Hah, come to think of it, maybe Nintendo will do like what happened with Wii Sports Club and just "auto download" demos onto people's consoles to force them to look at new games.

 

[kobashi100]

God those vita sales numbers break my heart. Really hope remote play sells the system, it deserves better. I also hope Wii U does better.

remote play wont sell units.

Vita is dead in the USA.

 

[SporeCrawler]

Hah, come to think of it, maybe Nintendo will do like what happened with Wii Sports Club and just "auto download" demos onto people's consoles to force them to look at new games.

That works if they already have wiius. A better way would be to autodownload wiiu commercials on 3ds or something.

As it looks like people dont even have wiiu in mind at the moment.

 

[Tookay]

Hah, come to think of it, maybe Nintendo will do like what happened with Wii Sports Club and just "auto download" demos onto people's consoles to force them to look at new games.

Owners have to actually turn on their Wii U systems for this to make a difference. That's what I think the problem here is, that the userbase has completely tuned out after the eight month drought wasteland.

 

[Randolph Freelander]

That works if they already have wiius. A better way would be to autodownload wiiu commercials on 3ds or something.

As it looks like people dont even have wiiu in mind at the moment.

Auto-download Wii U and the rest takes care of itself, really.

 

[marc^o^]

If it can't even sell 200k in November and the same or more in December I'll jump on the they should start investing in a new console immediately.

Wii U will probably take a long time to take off to decent numbers. With the 3DS profits they have the luxuary to stick with the Wii U platform, build their HD assets and processes, while releasing games with faster development cycles than if they went the high end Sony route. And Nintendo needs current gen assets for their next handheld, assets they will reuse like they always proceed.


They mostly need to keep releasing gems for it. At one point people will notice! First there will be a before/after Mario 3D World/Mario Kart 8 combo, no doubt about that.

Smash or Zelda will seal the deal for millions of fans, and their R&D teams are capable of greatness, some of it must be planned for 2014.

I predict a weird lifecycle for Wii U, an obligatory long, slow burning one.

 

[ZSaberLink]

I have to wonder though, at this point hasn't most non-Nintendo software done relatively badly this year? Nintendo's 3DS titles have been doing better than expected (Animal Crossing, Fire Emblem & Luigi's Mansion), Pokemon did as expected but did wonders for hardware.

For non-Nintendo titles, we've got GTAV obviously, and then the Last of Us seemed to do well. Anything else honestly? I think everyone is hopefully pegging this year's bad results on the fact that the PS4/XB1 are about to release, which I guess time will tell.

 

[Mory Dunz]

That works if they already have wiius. A better way would be to autodownload wiiu commercials on 3ds or something.

As it looks like people dont even have wiiu in mind at the moment.

Yeah, but even the current Wii U owners (as small a number as they are) are not buying the good games at a large enough amount. As shown by recent releases.

 

[AdventureRacing]

Wow at those vita numbers, it's almost moving that much a week in Japan. Sony will have to pull off a miracle to turn this thing around. Wii U is basically in the same boat.

 

[liger05]

Wii u and Vita are dead. I know many seem to think remote play will help the Vita but it's not going to suddenly turn it around from the absolute disaster it is in America. When was the last time the Vita did 100k for the month? Black Friday?

As for the Wii u, it's over. Relying on wii_ titles and Mario to save the day is clueless. The damage has already been done.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Oh I dont know, 10k being a number most of those titles wish they could have sold being a factor perhaps.

I simply dont get why literally no one is buying an software. The quality is certainly there. Why aren't you buying? All talk like Pachter not unfairly says? Haha Can't imagine what nintendo thinks.

They probably saw it coming and in an effort to hit contribution goals are only spending against Pokemon and 3d world to get the best return for their spends.

10k? Holy shit. I don't know why anyone expects Wii U to do substantially better than Vita last year. There is literally one game people give a crap about the rest of the year, and it's the same ip as the current bestseller. 300k November is optimistic as fuck.

 

[Trevelyan9999]

Nintendo has stated that they think Nintendo Directs are enough to advertise the games on Wii U. Well guess what? It only is watched by fans of Nintendo that are looking, scraping and hoping for any news on what the company is doing. Consumers don't know what the fuck they are doing, they probably think the 2DS/3DS is all Nintendo makes games for now and the Wii U is Nintendo's afterthought device that is optional with the original Wii - a non essential purchase.

Super Mario 3D World should sell on every Wii U that has already sold so it's numbers will be great regardless. If Nintendo can just try some marketing in the real world and not just Nintendo Direct's all the time, I think they will do better in getting people aware of this console. Management of the company is going to be a hot topic next year and we could see a few big changes - hopefully for the better.

 

[liger05]

Wasn't there another Sonic title planned for the Wii u as well? Doubt they will even bother now.

 

[Tookay]

Nintendo has stated that they think Nintendo Directs are enough to advertise the games on Wii U. Well guess what? It only is watched by fans of Nintendo that are looking, scraping and hoping for any news on what the company is doing. Consumers don't know what the fuck they are doing, they probably think the 2DS/3DS is all Nintendo makes games for now and the Wii U is Nintendo's afterthought device that is optional with the original Wii - a non essential purchase.

Super Mario 3D World should sell on every Wii U that has already sold so it's numbers will be great regardless. If Nintendo can just try some marketing in the real world and not just Nintendo Direct's all the time, I think they will do better in getting people aware of this console. Management of the company is going to be a hot topic next year and we could see a few big changes - hopefully for the better.

Yeah, I think the Directs are overly insular at this point. Coverage of them gets out to enthusiast sites, but it doesn't penetrate much anywhere else.

Nintendo needs traditional marketing as much as it needs ND. I don't know why they think it's sufficient.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

Someone put the Vita and WiiU out of their misery.

 

[metalslimer]

Has Sony made any projections for the Vita this year and how close are they to it?



I doubt this of much interest anyway.

Sony is going to miss their projections by quite a bit for Vita/PSP

Smash or Zelda will seal the deal for millions of fans, and their R&D teams are capable of greatness, some of it must be planned for 2014.

This is the entire problem. They are only appealing to Nintendo console fans with this system and no that is not a very large number by itself.

Harker asks why people aren't buying Wii U software. It's time to face the facts. No one outside of a few hardcore Nintendo fans want to play 3rd party games on Wii U. The online communities are worse than on 360. The graphics will be better on next gen or PC. Sorry I'm not buying Batman, AC, or Watch Dogs on Wii U when there are better options. Will this hurt Nintendo's future? Yes, but that's Nintendo's fault. People have options and expecting millions of people to switch over to the Wii U for multiplatform games was always a pipe dream based on what Nintendo did with Wii U.It doesn't help that Nintendo's marketing of the system has been horrendous. This is why putting the blame on 3rd parties for the abysmal sales on Wii U is laughable.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Owners have to actually turn on their Wii U systems for this to make a difference. That's what I think the problem here is, that the userbase has completely tuned out after the eight month drought wasteland.

That's what I was thinking. Nintendo may have been trying to stay low key until they had stuff to sell, but the result was their mindshare just shriveling up to the point that nobody even noticed when stuff actually came out.

The way to get people to notice would be aggressive advertisement, but I guess NCL went to a fortune teller who predicated grave misfortune if they ever promoted their releases. That or their marketing heads are all comical airheads who keep losing all the ads they make via a series of wacky hijinks.

 

[Lumyst]

Yeah, I think the Directs are overly insular at this point. Coverage of them gets out to enthusiast sites, but it doesn't penetrate much anywhere else.

Nintendo needs traditional marketing as much as it needs ND. I don't know why they think it's sufficient.

Heh, last year I was in the "Casual Gamer" boat, I had no idea about Nintendo Directs until I happened to check Siliconera this January. Come to think of it, the only things I heard about the WiiU before it launched was that it had a touchscreen gamepad controller, an energy efficient IBM chip possibly based on the Watson thing that was on Jeopardy, and you could scan your credit cards using a chip in the gamepad. What sold me on the WiiU was after I played Xenoblade last Winter and my preconceptions about what a "Nintendo game" had to be were shattered, they can thank IGN.com for reporting on Operation Rainfall otherwise I wouldn't have known about that game. So I'm one to say "The userbase should buy more games" when it was Mario and Zelda that I myself thought of when I saw the "Nintendo" brand on a console, last year. It has me thinking that when a casual gamer sees the "Nintendo" brand on a console, the 3DS for instance, they feel compelled to buy Nintendo games even though games such as Resident Evil and Splinter Cell were available, and maybe even people who would be interested in those games didn't know that it is possible to own a Nintendo console for games other than Nintendo's.

Type "Video game news" into Google and that's an idea about where myself as a casual Nintendo gamer learned about games when I cared to learn about them. What do you find? The typical games sites.

edit: Oh, and I say that as a 22 year old. Who knows how parents find out about what games to buy for their kids, if the userbase is made up of parents who bought WiiU's for their kid, then I doubt they'd watch Nintendo Direct to find out about games for their kid, they'd know about Mario, and as a treat get their kid maybe one or two $60 games a year, which happen to be the Mario games (just speculating).

 

[Htown]

Yeah, I think the Directs are overly insular at this point. Coverage of them gets out to enthusiast sites, but it doesn't penetrate much anywhere else.

Nintendo needs traditional marketing as much as it needs ND. I don't know why they think it's sufficient.

Uh, Nintendo is definitely buying television ads.

I don't know why people think Nintendo Directs are literally the only things they do any more.

NDs have replaced press conferences and game media events, not mainstream advertising.

 

[AniHawk]

That's what I was thinking. Nintendo may have been trying to stay low key until they had stuff to sell, but the result was their mindshare just shriveling up to the point that nobody even noticed when stuff actually came out.

The way to get people to notice would be aggressive advertisement, but I guess NCL went to a fortune teller who predicated grave misfortune if they ever promoted their releases. That or their marketing heads are all comical airheads who keep losing all the ads they make via a series of wacky hijinks.

but they gave wonderful 101 a twenty minute nintendo direct. what went wrong?

 

[Lumyst]

Uh, Nintendo is definitely buying television ads.

Ah, then I'd imagine that that is where parents would hear about what games are on the WiiU, that or browsing the game section at the store. I admit I haven't watched TV in a long while so I can't comment on the scale of Nintendo's traditional advertising.

 

[ZSaberLink]

Just for some other September -> October -> November -> December comparisons

I tried to pick some non DS/Wii Nintendo consoles, and other consoles when not doing well. Couldn't find the GameCube numbers in the gaf archive.

3DS 2011 -
September - 260K
October - >250k
November - 795k (Mario 3D Land sold 625k copies but didn't even hit the top 10)
December - 1.60m

3DS 2012 -
September - 213K+
October - 213K < x < 250K
November - 540K
December - 1.25M

Vita 2012 -
September - < 61k
October - 35k
November - 210K-225K
December - Between 200-250k

PS3 2007 -
September - 119.4k (heavenly sword at 10)
October - 121k
November - 466k - (CoD: MW and Assassin's Creed)
December - 797.6 K (Nothing in top 10 apparently)

Wii U 2013
September - 90k
October - 50-60k
November ? (Mario 3D World & Mario & Sonic along with hopefully some advertising...)
December ?

Did the Vita have anything release in November 2012 for its spike? If the Vita didn't have any big titles (AC3:Liberation was its biggest?), it may be possible for Mario to pull off a miracle, but people need to know about the system at the very least...

 

[CoffeeGames]

The way to get people to notice would be aggressive advertisement, but I guess NCL went to a fortune teller who predicated grave misfortune if they ever promoted their releases. That or their marketing heads are all comical airheads who keep losing all the ads they make via a series of wacky hijinks.

Here's another good example I think, and an area NCL is better than NOA. Marketing/advertising.
Which region had the best Wii U launch ad IMO? NCL's. (Watch it HERE.)
Which region has the most Super Mario 3D World ads? NCL's.

NOA has produced/released one Super Mario 3D World ad, while NCL has released four?

 

[Mory Dunz]

If Vita 2012 hit 200K, Wii U should have no problem with that...I would hope.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Oh I dont know, 10k being a number most of those titles wish they could have sold being a factor perhaps.

I simply dont get why literally no one is buying an software. The quality is certainly there. Why aren't you buying? All talk like Pachter not unfairly says? Haha Can't imagine what nintendo thinks.

Can you say how many of those titles you consider "most of" them...?

As for your latter question, if we go by what people claim on here... the titles just aren't good enough for the connoisseurs that buy the Wii U.

 

[ZSaberLink]

Here's another good example I think, and an area NCL is better than NOA. Marketing/advertising.
Which region had the best Wii U launch ad IMO? NCL's. (Watch it HERE.)
Which region has the most Super Mario 3D World ads? NCL's.

NOA has produced/released one Super Mario 3D World ad, while NCL has released four?

Unfortunately Wii U sales haven't really increased there much either... it's better than here I guess, but still.

 

[liger05]

I guess PS4 saves the Vita from retailers not bothering with it?

 

[metalslimer]

A 4x-5x multiplier seems about right for next month with Wii U. Vita had some pretty insane bundles last year. It was also Vita's first holiday season. Wii U has already had a holiday season.

 

[CoffeeGames]

Unfortunately Wii U sales haven't really increased there much either... it's better than here I guess, but still.

Sure, sure. I'm saying, that IF the U.S. is the Wii U's most important region (based on history of home console sales and Mr. Iwata pretty much saying it), why are their efforts so horrible with it?

It makes no sense to me. As a consumer, and an investor.

 

[MarkusRJR]

Here's another good example I think, and an area NCL is better than NOA. Marketing/advertising.
Which region had the best Wii U launch ad IMO? NCL's. (Watch it HERE.)
Which region has the most Super Mario 3D World ads? NCL's.

NOA has produced/released one Super Mario 3D World ad, while NCL has released four?

Yeah NoA tends to have terrible marketing while NCL is much better. NoA tends to stick to specific themes and ideas for ads (generic family in sterile living room, games taking place in real life for a kid, etc.) and reuses them for multiple games. NCL also does this to an extent but they aren't nearly as bad, and the quality is noticeably better. There still are a few decent ads that come from them every now and then but the majority are unappealing and corny as fuck. I'm also getting sick of their "overly sterile family environment with generic family" commercials. Nearly every Wii and Wii U commercial sticks with that and it's really played out and feels super lazy.

 

[marc^o^]

As for your latter question, if we go by what people claim on here... the titles just aren't good enough for the connoisseurs that buy the Wii U.

Lots of connaisseurs are vocal about how great and unique exclusives like Zombi U or TW101 are. Sadly a miserable review from Gamespot has a thousand times more influence than some feedback of randoms Wii U owners. And as Nintendo's marketing team is ridiculously bad, people are missing gems.

 

[Mooreberg]

Looks like GTA V should have some longevity in terms of sales like GTA IV did.

I'd consider Battlefield 4 and AC4 as having terrible openings if it weren't for the fact that they seem like two of the "current gen" games that are going to benefit the most from the new consoles (BF4 especially with the player count difference).

I'm half expecting BF4, AC4, and Ghosts to be the best selling games on PS4 and Xbox One for 2013. The first party games on either system really are not in the same league in terms of popularity.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Did the Vita have anything release in November 2012 for its spike? If the Vita didn't have any big titles (AC3:Liberation was its biggest?), it may be possible for Mario to pull off a miracle, but people need to know about the system at the very least...

There was a COD bundle iirc.

On average, October contributes ~10% to the holiday quarter's sales. Under such a typical pattern, the Wii U would sell something ~500K for November+December.

 

[Warm Machine]

I think so, they just can't/don't want to/don't know how to compete with MS/Sony, that much is clear.

End of an era.

With the bar being raised so high with tech, OS, and services combined with massive risk and investment involved with a high powered device I can't see Nintendo ever competing again toe to toe.

They are going to find a back door in if they are going to do another standalone console.

 

[Little Green Yoda]

I simply dont get why literally no one is buying an software. The quality is certainly there. Why aren't you buying? All talk like Pachter not unfairly says? Haha Can't imagine what nintendo thinks.

Do we have tie ratio numbers for the Wii U? As well as historical comparison numbers for ~1 year old consoles?

 

[CoffeeGames]

Lots of connaisseurs are vocal about how great and unique exclusives like Zombi U or TW101 are. Sadly a miserable review from Gamespot has a thousand times more influence than some feedback of randoms Wii U owners. And as Nintendo's marketing team is ridiculously bad, people are missing gems.

Yeah, I actually addressed the ZombiU issue in a post last December, that was retweeted by multiple staffers at Ubisoft (they even gave me the ZombiU patch notes first hand, before any other site) when I posted it and it really surprised me to see them jump at it.

The fact NOA released the ZombiU bundle, and DIDN'T advertise that on The Walking Dead (or, anywhere else AT ALL on TV), really surprised me...
They had a target audience already established, and they completely ignored that target audience with that bundle. What game sold a friend of mine who is a big zombie guy on the Wii U? ZombiU.

We have now been through 2 seasons of The Walking Dead, and ZombiU is one of the best uses of the GamePad...and NOA didn't use it.
Europe did at launch, but not NOA. I really can't explain it, other than them purposely hoping the system fails?

 

[SporeCrawler]

There was a COD bundle iirc.

On average, October contributes ~10% to the holiday quarter's sales. Under such a typical pattern, the Wii U would sell something ~500K for November+December.

500k would be a fucking desaster for them. they really have to push it for christmas (where they are strong usually)

 

[MrCunningham]

Handhelds save Nintendo, yet again. The original GB and Pokemon picked up the slack for the N64, the GBA was a life preserver for the floundering GameCube, the Nintendo DS was a juggernaut in general, and now the 3DS seems to be the only unit pushing any numbers for Nintendo on the globe, right now. Makes me wonder why they still bother with home consoles?

 

[Anth0ny]

Yeah, I actually addressed the ZombiU issue in a post last December, that was retweeted by multiple staffers at Ubisoft (they even gave me the ZombiU patch notes first hand, before any other site) when I posted it and it really surprised me to see them jump at it.

The fact NOA released the ZombiU bundle, and DIDN'T advertise that on The Walking Dead (or, anywhere else AT ALL on TV), really surprised me...
They had a target audience already established, and they completely ignored that target audience with that bundle. What game sold a friend of mine who is a big zombie guy on the Wii U? ZombiU.

We have now been through 2 seasons of The Walking Dead, and ZombiU is one of the best uses of the GamePad...and NOA didn't use it.
Europe did at launch, but not NOA. I really can't explain it, other than them purposely hoping the system fails?

Nintendo doesn't market towards the 18-35 year old male demo anymore, apparently. While I'm seeing endless "Perfect Day" ads for PS4 and even Dead Rising Xbone ads during Walking Dead, and South Park, and Agents of Shield, and any given NHL/NBA game... I've yet to see a single Wii U commercial. I'm told they air on Nickelodeon and other "kids" stations, but I've yet to see any myself.

 

[John Harker]

Given the tough market, I dont think Beyond did that poorly. It really could have been much worse. It didn't click for me until maybe 40% in, but by the end I was really into it. Clearly meant to have a sequel so I hope it gets funded.

 

[SporeCrawler]

Handhelds save Nintendo, yet again. The original GB and Pokemon picked up the slack for the N64, the GBA was a life preserver for the floundering GameCube, the Nintendo DS was a juggernaut in general, and now the 3DS seems to be the only unit pushing any numbers for Nintendo on the globe, right now. Makes me wonder why they still bother with home consoles?

because they need more than one product om the market. what if that one handheld fails? 3s showed us that such things can happen.

 

[michaelius]

because they need more than one product om the market. what if that one handheld fails? 3s showed us that such things can happen.

Then they can go go third party and enjoy Call of Duty/GTA like sales with their games as 3rd party.

 

[Nightstick11]

3DD heating up, but we know we are all here to see Wii U numbers.

 

[ZenTzen]

those Vita numbers, if only Sony of America bothered to market the system, hell, just first party would be nice, like Tearaway for example, it has more of a mass market appeal and it looks gorgeous, heck, bring some old IPs to the system.

Remote play may help just a tiny bit, but thats not gonna last, and the system really needs some more high profile exclusives, if only they got a GTA like the PSP, instant system seller

 

[Deleted member 125677]

28 k Vita? 55k Wii U? not too hot

3DS and Pokemon!? :bow

USA now looks like Japan, 3DS outselling everything else combined

yeah I know, Pokemon month

 

[Shard]

With the bar being raised so high with tech, OS, and services combined with massive risk and investment involved with a high powered device I can't see Nintendo ever competing again toe to toe.

They are going to find a back door in if they are going to do another standalone console.

Reminds me of the original Wii actually.

 

[MrCunningham]

3s showed us that such things can happen.

I don't know how that 3 thing applies? The dedicated handheld market is a completely different beast from home consoles. Take out the Virtual Boy (which was axed prematurely) and Nintendo has had a firm grip on this market going all the way back to 1989. It doesn't matter how good the competitions handhelds look in comparison, because they always seem to take second place to Nintendo.

The PSP was a decent success worldwide, but Sony's second handheld has been a dud so far. Microsoft didn't even bother with a dedicated gaming handheld, instead they tried to go after that iOS money, which they haven;t had any success at.

Granted iOS and Android (mostly iOS) will continue to tighten their vice grips around Nintendo's monopoly, but until then, Nintendo is still the only one really making bank in the dedicated handheld gaming arena.

 

[Pancakes R Us]

Then they can go go third party and enjoy Call of Duty/GTA like sales with their games as 3rd party.

Exactly. Mario is big enough to be able to find success across multiple platforms. Mario Kart on 360/PS3/PC could sell a a huge number.