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[plagiarize]

First part, this is the first time Nintendo has a home console with tons of appeal in Europe, so you might wanna back off until Smash takes the stage.

Second part is fucking opinion. How do you quantify "more casual?"

sales?

what fighting games sell as well as the GT and NFS series?

Brawl?

the most casual fighter ever made?

 

[Sharp]

They're going to go to PSN/XBLA/WiiWare, where they're already going.

You're just wrong about Suda51. Please, by all means, find me a single open world game on the 360 that sold LESS than 100k. Anything. You can take a crap on a disc and sell 100k on the 360.

Anyone know what the worst selling game on the 360 is? Anyone have a list of the games that sold less than 100k? I promise you that list is shorter on the 360 than it is on the Wii.

Which is why Suda51 is talking about doing his next project on the 360.

I think the point here would be that Suda was able to spend a lot less on his Wii project than his 360 project. The 360 doesn't get nearly as many shovelware releases, because except for licensed games that the publishers are porting to everything, they will lose money if it bombs. PSN/XBLA/Wiiware is really the much better long-term solution to small games, I agree with you there, but a game like NMH doesn't really fit with any of their models (okay, maybe PSN).

 

[_Alkaline_]

It's not on the same production scale, correct. But its production values, which is not quite the same thing, are through the roof. It is extraordinarily polished--one of the most polished games I've played, very near Super Metroid--and I doubt very much whether MGS4 will top it in that respect. Hell, it's even 60fps, which is something I really wish more games would do these days. This is not the same as saying that it is anywhere close to as large in scope or execution, mind you, but I think you're being a little short-sighted if you say money = production values.

Exactly.

Just because MGS4 has more money put into it, doesn't mean that it's automatically a more polished game. Galaxy is the definition of polish imo.

 

[frankie_baby]

They're going to go to PSN/XBLA/WiiWare, where they're already going.

You're just wrong about Suda51. Please, by all means, find me a single open world game on the 360 that sold LESS than 100k. Anything. You can take a crap on a disc and sell 100k on the 360.

Anyone know what the worst selling game on the 360 is? Anyone have a list of the games that sold less than 100k? I promise you that list is shorter on the 360 than it is on the Wii.

Which is why Suda51 is talking about doing his next project on the 360.

i wouldn't be surprised if the worst selling 360 game has sold less than the worst selling wii game

 

[botticus]

~100K . . . Not great but still 3X the Wii sales.

Edit: Here is a synopsis of TTWO's NPD performance:
TTWO NPD March revenue $56.8M up 42% y/y.
MLB2k8 led but Carnival games was #2 at about 150K units beating out #3 Bully:SE 360 at about 100K units. Also MLB2k8 Wii outsold PS3 by 60k to 30k indicating the importance of making a good sport game. NBA2k8 was better than live and outsold it, but the Show is better that MLB2k8 and is crushing it. Maybe exclusives are bad for everybody. (madden was down this year also)

I'm sure if they had priced it appropriately, they could have gotten a few more sales. Like mine. Capcom is silly enough to price Okami at the same level it was priced two years ago, T2 managed to increase the price for their two-year old port (yes, it's $50 on 360 too, but that's relative to usual $60 new releases).

 

[Sharp]

i wouldn't be surprised if the worst selling 360 game has sold less than the worst selling wii game

This statement can be translated as, "I have no idea how badly the worst-selling Wii games have done."

Spoiler

Hint: 3k is too high.

 

[Lobster]

They're going to go to PSN/XBLA/WiiWare, where they're already going.

You're just wrong about Suda51. Please, by all means, find me a single open world game on the 360 that sold LESS than 100k. Anything. You can take a crap on a disc and sell 100k on the 360.

Anyone know what the worst selling game on the 360 is? Anyone have a list of the games that sold less than 100k? I promise you that list is shorter on the 360 than it is on the Wii.

Which is why Suda51 is talking about doing his next project on the 360.

Suda51 games bombed on the Ps2 which had 100 million userbase..

What makes you confident that they will sell on 360?

Sudas next project may be on the 360..but hes already working on a Wii game again!

 

[frankie_baby]

This statement can be translated as, "I have no idea how badly the worst-selling Wii games have done."

Spoiler

Hint: 3k is too high.

but we also dont know how bad the worst selling 360 games sold either

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

They're going to go to PSN/XBLA/WiiWare, where they're already going.

You're just wrong about Suda51. Please, by all means, find me a single open world game on the 360 that sold LESS than 100k. Anything. You can take a crap on a disc and sell 100k on the 360.

Anyone know what the worst selling game on the 360 is? Anyone have a list of the games that sold less than 100k? I promise you that list is shorter on the 360 than it is on the Wii.

Which is why Suda51 is talking about doing his next project on the 360.

Can we put an end to this "Small developers go to PSN/WiiWare/XBLA shit please?

While some devs may be small, they're damn sure not small ENOUGH to be satisfied with 50-150 meg games and meager profits tied to a review board who approves games. Would any of you want a Suda game that was bound to these restrictions?

Small developers belong on a console just as much as large ones. It's this "ship 'em to XBLA" mentality that shrinks the market.

 

[_Alkaline_]

They're going to go to PSN/XBLA/WiiWare, where they're already going.

You're just wrong about Suda51. Please, by all means, find me a single open world game on the 360 that sold LESS than 100k. Anything. You can take a crap on a disc and sell 100k on the 360.

Anyone know what the worst selling game on the 360 is? Anyone have a list of the games that sold less than 100k? I promise you that list is shorter on the 360 than it is on the Wii.

Which is why Suda51 is talking about doing his next project on the 360

Suda doesn't have the budget to work on his own on something big for 360. The Wii offered him the chance to show his creativity and rake in a profit. No More Heroes was very low budget and thus managing 100K+ sales in the US (about 175K worldwide i would say so far) is a solid success for him. I mean, his company even threw a party in celebration of the game's sales in the US.

And besides, Suda games are always incredible niche. Killer 7 bombed and bombed hard not only on GC but the ever-popular PS2. NMH was by far and away his best performing game ever.

 

[Lobster]

but we also dont know how bad the worst selling 360 games sold either

What we do know is that it was a Japanese exclusive game.

 

[Sharp]

but we also dont know how bad the worst selling 360 games sold either

Haha, much better. If Simple Series games were released on the 360 in Japan you might have a case, but developers simply don't release low-budget 360 exclusives in Japan, and in the US most software just doesn't sell that low. Maybe in PAL some do (Phoenix Games etc.) but are there any PAL-exclusive 360 games at all?

 

[Big-E]

Have the Show numbers been posted yet? Having the wii outselling the ps3 version of 2k8 I would hope suggests that the Show did better than 2k8 on the PS3. If this isn't the case, I weep for humanity.

 

[besada]

Suda51 games bombed on the Ps2 which had 100 million userbase..

What makes you confident that they will sell on 360?

Sudas next project may be on the 360..but hes already working on a Wii game again!

Because the 360 isn't the PS2 - the Wii is. Like the PS2, because it's the number one hardware console, it attracts the lion's share of shovelware, and it buries games in that pile.

But hey, I'm sure you're right. any day now Bungie, Epic, and a bunch of other devs will drop the other consoles and redirect everything to the Wii. You've been waiting on that since it came out, so I'm sure it's going to happen any day now.

 

[Jive Turkey]

I think this thread broke some posters. Are you people reading the things you write?

 

[_Alkaline_]

Because the 360 isn't the PS2 - the Wii is. Like the PS2, because it's the number one hardware console, it attracts the lion's share of shovelware, and it buries games in that pile.

But hey, I'm sure you're right. any day now Bungie, Epic, and a bunch of other devs will drop the other consoles and redirect everything to the Wii. You've been waiting on that since it came out, so I'm sure it's going to happen any day now.

 

[HK-47]

First, no it isn't.

Second, I thought that anyone could agree that racing games were much more casual friendly than fighters..The proof is in the sales of racing games vs fighting games.

First time with Smash onboard. First time since the NES?

 

[Davidion]

I think this thread broke some posters. Are you people reading the things you write?

I read what they wrote, and it's fucking hilarious. :lol

 

[frankie_baby]

Haha, much better. If Simple Series games were released on the 360 in Japan you might have a case, but developers simply don't release low-budget 360 exclusives in Japan, and in the US most software just doesn't sell that low. Maybe in PAL some do (Phoenix Games etc.) but are there any PAL-exclusive 360 games at all?

games do sell under radar though, especially cheap ones so those "simple wii" games can happilly chug away and sell a couple of dozen copies a week and sales mount up, ok still just a few thousand when all is said and done but at the end of the day we honestly have no idea how well the worst performing games on any system have sold

 

[NintendosBooger]

What happened to all of last month's NPD posters with their "It begins..." and their Darth Vader/Empire Strikes Back pics?

 

[Mithos Yggdrasill]

Whomever said 2008 was PS3's year got their consoles mixed up. It'll definitely be the year of the Wii. Mario Kart, SSBB, and Wii Fit will ensure Nintendo's console dominance for at least half of 2008, although we all know that these games will continue to sell superbly well into second half. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what they have cooked up for the holidays this year, but there's no doubt that they have another monster waiting to be unleashed on both casuals and hardcore gamers.

I don't suspect we'll see a steady stream of great third-party games on the Wii until 2009. Reggie himself said a while back that it would take 2-3 years for other developers to catch up. If this is true and Nintendo continues to pump out quality, fundamentally-sound, and FUN first-party games, then, I really don't see how the other two consoles will stop the Wii.

For Fall, I suspect that Wii Music will come out and it will be THE non-game for Christmas. The big mistery is which game will come out for the hardcore...

 

[Lobster]

Because the 360 isn't the PS2 - the Wii is. Like the PS2, because it's the number one hardware console, it attracts the lion's share of shovelware, and it buries games in that pile.

But hey, I'm sure you're right. any day now Bungie, Epic, and a bunch of other devs will drop the other consoles and redirect everything to the Wii. You've been waiting on that since it came out, so I'm sure it's going to happen any day now.

What?

Did you post this just to insult me or something?

First time with Smash onboard. First time since the NES?

First time with Smash onboard yes.

 

[Sharp]

Because the 360 isn't the PS2 - the Wii is. Like the PS2, because it's the number one hardware console, it attracts the lion's share of shovelware, and it buries games in that pile.

But hey, I'm sure you're right. any day now Bungie, Epic, and a bunch of other devs will drop the other consoles and redirect everything to the Wii. You've been waiting on that since it came out, so I'm sure it's going to happen any day now.

besada, Suda made Killer 7 for the GCN. It bombed incredibly hard. He then ported it to the PS2, where it proceeded to sell very slightly better but still bombed incredibly hard. I think the reason that NMH is selling so much better than any of Suda's other games is (A) because it's a much more accessible, fun game, and (B) because there are a substantial number of gamers who are looking for more mature experiences out of the Wii. But without advertisement and a demo the game would not sell any better on the 360, while costing Suda far more to make--and he was given a pretty fucking small budget after his other games' sales. With a demo and advertisements it might have sold better, but it would have cost Suda and his publisher even more. I'm one hundred percent certain that he'd love to be able to utilize the hardware of a system like the 360, but unless his publishers really think they have a chance of making a profit with NMH-like numbers I don't think they'll give him the resources he needs to develop such a game.

 

[jibblypop]

But hey, I'm sure you're right. any day now Bungie, Epic, and a bunch of other devs will drop the other consoles and redirect everything to the Wii. You've been waiting on that since it came out, so I'm sure it's going to happen any day now.

This is what I don't get. Why are wii owners constantly begging for these huge first person shooter games to suddenly ditch the other systems for the wii? It most likely won't happen since most developers of those games push graphics (and online to some extent) as the top feature. Two things that the Wii isn't specifically good at.

Having said that it's quite obvious that those games aren't as important in moving hardware as the concepts and games developed by Nintendo. The hardware sales are consistently proving that. I have a Wii because I find it has the types of games I want to play. However I'm not delusional. If I suddenly can't live without FPS games I'll just buy a 360 and not have this crazy idea that they will suddenly all come to the wii just because it has high hardware sales.

 

[_Alkaline_]

For Fall, I suspect that Wii Music will come out and it will be THE non-game for Christmas. The big mistery is which game will come out for the hardcore...

Well you've got, most likely, Kid Icarus and Animal Crossing. Then there's Pikmin 3, maybe a new Star Fox? But I agree, their needs to be another killer-app to maintain the Wii's momentum throughout the latter stages of 2008 (though it probably won't even need it since it has Wii Sports, Wii Play, Wii Fit, etc).

 

[MrPing1000]

Money money money.

 

[HK-47]

sales?

what fighting games sell as well as the GT and NFS series?

Brawl?

the most casual fighter ever made?

Stuff like Street Fighter, MK and Tekken used to be up there before the destruction of the arcade and the increasing insilure fighting game community shrunk the market. We shall see how the market reacts to a new SF that takes after the old school games.

 

[Lobster]

This is what I don't get. Why are wii owners constantly begging for these huge first person shooter games to suddenly ditch the other systems for the wii? It most likely won't happen since most developers of those games push graphics (and online to some extent) as the top feature. Two things that the Wii isn't specifically good at.

Because we aren't?

Hell I haven't even mentioned a thing about 3rd parties dropping 360/Ps3 and coming to Wii in this thread so I have no idea where his post came from.

Wii owners only want 3rd parties to stop feeding us shit and giving us good games. We don't give a fuck if they don't want to give us space marine shooter, we just want good games.

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

What happened to all of last month's NPD posters with their "It begins..." and their Darth Vader/Empire Strikes Back pics?

We fast-forwarded through Empire and skipped straight to the scene in Jedi where Luke chops off Vader's hand.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Where's Wollan?

 

[schuelma]

For Fall, I suspect that Wii Music will come out and it will be THE non-game for Christmas. The big mistery is which game will come out for the hardcore...

I could see that, but I could also see them holding back Wii Music for early 09 like they did with Wii Fit.

For the U.S I'm betting Wii Fit will still be massive, plus continued Wii Sports interest plus in all likelihood Animal Crossing which also has casual appeal.

 

[Lobster]

What happened to all of last month's NPD posters with their "It begins..." and their Darth Vader/Empire Strikes Back pics?

They posted those sort of pics?

Holy shit did they not watch the movies?

 

[Sharp]

Where's Wollan?

Hmmm, I could've sworn he posted in this thread but I just checked and he hasn't so far. Weird.

 

[Mithos Yggdrasill]

It's not worthwhile to spend a big budget on a big production for a Wii game, when people aren't buying the Wii for those games, and when you can achieve equal or greater success with game productions with average production values and average budget..

How the heck can you conclude that if not a single AAA Third Party game has come out on Wii? Third Parties simply haven't even tried. That's the problem. They are so skeptikals and immersed in their prejudgements that they have fear to fail. But they cannot be sure if they dont try at least one time.

RE4 Wii Edition sold well. Umbrella Chronicles too. Guitar Hero II too. No More Heroes too (for its genre, it did). Simply put on the Wii the right game and it will sell, exactly as it happens on other systems. Vina Pinata sold horribly on X360. Why? Was the console too hardcore for this game loved by the hardcore fans? Simply it happens that some games are too niche to find their audiences. It happens on every system. Third Party's motivations to not develop on Wii are only excuses. Ask why to Panther.

this entire post is baseless conjecture. That's not meant to be rude, but a fact. 2.7M gamers bought SSBB, a very traditional game. almost 2M people have bought SMG, a very traditional game. You of course will certainly point out that they're Nintendo games, but I would counter with the fact that beyond Nintendo games, they are superbly made traditional titles.
.

Agreed.

How do we know that?

.

To WrikaWrek: again, they haven't even tried. Capcom will test your point. If Monster Hunter 3 fails on Wii, I will admit you were right. But I bet it won't. Of course don't expect similar numbers that on PSP, but I think it will sell as good or better then on PS2.

 

[PhatSaqs]

What happened to all of last month's NPD posters with their "It begins..." and their Darth Vader/Empire Strikes Back pics?

They're tryin to explain to the girl that it's never happened before...

 

[speculawyer]

Carnival Games is a monster. :lol

Interesting that MLB2k8 doubled the PS3 version's amount. The Wii version received horrible reviews.

Yes, Carnival is a monster . . . it is a zombie . . . it just keeps on coming.

MLB 2K8 got crushed on the PS3 since Sony released a better game. :-/

VC/Kush really need bring up the quality of their game. MLB 2K6 was a disaster but they've had 2 years now since then.

 

[besada]

This is what I don't get. Why are wii owners constantly begging for these huge first person shooter games to suddenly ditch the other systems for the wii?

Because apparently Nintendomination isn't enough for them. Until they hear the lamentation of the 360/PS3's women, they won't be happy. Still butt hurt from the GC, I guess.

 

[Mithos Yggdrasill]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but that was a prediction, not a real number.

You aren't the first to be tricked.

Disappointed then. Thanks anyway.

 

[Shiggy]

Which is why Suda51 is talking about doing his next project on the 360.

His next project is Fatal Frame IV, isn't it?

 

[farnham]

Hardware LTDs by gamefront.de

Pos. System Einheiten
---------------------------------------------
1 PlayStation2 41.877.565
2 Game Boy Advance 36.093.054
3 Nintendo DS 19.127.750
4 Xbox 14.500.480
5 Gamecube 11.769.728
6 PSP 11.283.020
7 Xbox 360 9.871.432
8 Wii 8.780.678
9 PlayStation3 4.052.504


Will the Wii beat the 360 by July.... With this pace it looks possible...

 

[Segata Sanshiro]

This is what I don't get. Why are wii owners constantly begging for these huge first person shooter games to suddenly ditch the other systems for the wii? It most likely won't happen since most developers of those games push graphics (and online to some extent) as the top feature. Two things that the Wii isn't specifically good at.

I suspect largely for the same reasons that 360 owners are molesting children and PS3 owners are beating their wives.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

What happened to all of last month's NPD posters with their "It begins..." and their Darth Vader/Empire Strikes Back pics?

same thing that happened to the 360 had teh shortage in the Jan and Fed thread people.

Meh, let me stop feeding the fanboy fire that burns within

 

[PhoenixDark]

How the heck can you conclude that if not a single Third Party game has come out on Wii? Third Parties simply haven't even tried. That's the problem. They are so skeptikals and immersed in their prejudgements that they have fear to fail. But they cannot be sure if they dind't try at least one time.

RE4 Wii Edition sold well. Umbrella Chronicles too. Guitar Hero II too. No More Heroes too. Simply put on the Wii the right game and it will sell, exactly as it happens on other systems. Vina Pinata sold horribly on X360. Why? Was the console too hardcore for this game loved by the hardcore fans? Simply it happens that some games are too niche to find their audiences. It happens on every system. Third Party's motivations to not develop on Wii are only excuses. Ask why to Panther.

Agreed.

NMH didn't sell "well" on the Wii in the US. Guitar Hero sold well on every platform. The Wii's third party situation is not much different from the Gamecube's; why do you think developers aren't "trying"? If that's not the excuse it's that "oh well after the huge Wii buzz at E3 2006 developers started really working on Wii games, you'll see!" So where are the games? Developers look at the 360 and see the dominant demographic buys nearly everything except eastern RPGs. Developers look at the PS3 and see low sells, but realize that by the end of the year the system's user base will be large enough to sustain healthy software sales numbers. What do developers see when they look at the Wii? The same first party games dominating each month, with more (Mario Kart, Wii Fit) on the way. Sure you named a couple third party games that sold well, but what else?

It's the same situation. Remember a couple years ago when GAF was full of "I can't wait for a Star Wars Wii game/omg point and click adventures/etc" threads were everywhere? Where are those games, two years later? It's an honest question

 

[schuelma]

His next project is Fatal Frame IV, isn't it?

I don't think so. Grasshopper is developing and his name was mentioned as helping, but I doubt he has that large a role.

 

[Davidion]

His next project is Fatal Frame IV, isn't it?

He's working on it in some capacity. That, and he's already interested in making a No More Heroes sequel on the wii.

But hey, fanboy outrage is funnier when it's mixed in with a healthy dollop of stupid, so leave him be, for all our sakes. :lol

 

[besada]

I suspect largely for the same reasons that 360 owners are molesting children and PS3 owners are beating their wives.

Excuse me. I molest my wife and beat my children, thank you very much.

 

[Segata Sanshiro]

Excuse me. I molest my wife and beat my children, thank you very much.

As it should be. Phoenix Dark's parents never beat him, and just look at him.

 

[Chumly]

Because apparently Nintendomination isn't enough for them. Until they hear the lamentation of the 360/PS3's women, they won't be happy. Still butt hurt from the GC, I guess.

:lol :lol :lol

You sound like the typical 14 year old live kid.

 

[jibblypop]

Wii owners only want 3rd parties to stop feeding us shit and giving us good games. We don't give a fuck if they don't want to give us space marine shooter, we just want good games.

haha ya I guess for a second there he had me convinced that people were demanding that even though they weren't. I think when people say third parties might shift to the wii they are talking about Japanese companies like Square-Enix and people like that anyways. Who knows though? I own a Wii and I find there are too many games for me to buy already. I don't know how so many GAFFERS can afford to buy like 100 games a year.

 

[farnham]

NMH didn't sell "well" on the Wii in the US. Guitar Hero sold well on every platform. The Wii's third party situation is not much different from the Gamecube's; why do you think developers aren't "trying"? If that's not the excuse it's that "oh well after the huge Wii buzz at E3 2006 developers started really working on Wii games, you'll see!" So where are the games? Developers look at the 360 and see the dominant demographic buys nearly everything except eastern RPGs. Developers look at the PS3 and see low sells, but realize that by the end of the year the system's user base will be large enough to sustain healthy software sales numbers. What do developers see when they look at the Wii? The same first party games dominating each month, with more (Mario Kart, Wii Fit) on the way. Sure you named a couple third party games that sold well, but what else?

It's the same situation. Remember a couple years ago when GAF was full of "I can't wait for a Star Wars Wii game/omg point and click adventures/etc" threads were everywhere? Where are those games, two years later? It's an honest question

because they still think its a fad and their prediction gets proven wrong like every day...