Support NeoGAF

[ultratruman]

Yeah true, waking up families in the middle of the night and pointing rifles at them isn't really inflicting terror.

The Israeli military confirmed the footage as being authentic (if you read the article). How is this not terrorizing? One of the kids is legitimately traumatized (if you read the article).

I'm not saying it's right or legal that the IDF operates this way to investigate rock throwers, but the word 'terrorising' in this part of the world usually means much more than waking up kids. Imagine this potential consequences of doing these searches during the busy day however, retaliation would be genuinely terrifying.

 

[Coriolanus]

I'm not saying it's right or legal that the IDF operates this way to investigate rock throwers, but the word 'terrorising' in this part of the world usually means much more than waking up kids. Imagine this potential consequences of doing these searches during the busy day however, retaliation would be genuinely terrifying.

Waking up kids in the middle of the night at gunpoint and proceeding to question them in a foreign language, still at gunpoint is terrorizing. Don't even know what would compel one to argue otherwise.

 

[Air Zombie Meat]

I'm not saying it's right or legal that the IDF operates this way to investigate rock throwers, but the word 'terrorising' in this part of the world usually means much more than waking up kids. Imagine this potential consequences of doing these searches during the busy day however, retaliation would be genuinely terrifying.

It's not really a search though. What are they looking for, piles of rocks? It's a military operation to scare the shit out of children and their families. I suppose they think this will deter rock throwing.

 

[Jonm1010]

First of all soldiers are people too.

Second, where have you guys been the for the past fifteen to ten years? Did you just start following the news yesterday or something?

Anyway, since you can't be bothered to do it, here you go:

http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4701/child-suicide-bombers

http://www.idfblog.com/hamas/2013/0...arin-we-teach-our-kids-to-be-suicide-bombers/

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3979887.stm

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/4601244/n...blind-eye-child-suicide-bombers/#.VQXbWUIgZsM

Where have you been? I guess nose deep in propaganda and bullshit - training at the school of red herrings?

What does this have to do with the OP?

Furthermore where does this indicate that Palestinians, TODAY, are sending out suicide bomber children as a matter of policy? That this was then a justification to act in this way?

I swear the lengths that some people will go to defend this absolute abhorrent humanitarian tragedy that Israel is in full control to stop is fucking depressing.


.....And then you have this other joker - ultratruman - claiming that waking kids up at gunpoint late at night isn't terrorizing because of a bunch of inferencing whataboutism bullshit. What the fuck do you think the purpose is of going into homes at 130 in the fucking morning and pointing guns in peoples face is? It certainly isn't to make them feel safe or happy. Im pretty sure part of that is to, you guessed it, TERRORIZE members of the community to serve their ends. Whatever twisted, warped, fucked up ends they think this serves.

These threads absolutely boil my fucking blood at the sheer awfulness of the people in these things.

 

[Hackworth]

It's not really a search though. What are they looking for, piles of rocks? It's a military operation to scare the shit out of children and their families.

Kinda sounds like terrorism when you describe it like that.

 

[ultratruman]

Waking up kids in the middle of the night at gunpoint and proceeding to question them in a foreign language, still at gunpoint is terrorizing. Don't even know what would compel one to argue otherwise.

But nobody was hurt, nothing was broken, they didn't shout or demand anything and their guns were lowered the whole time etc.

I'm pointing it out because there will be no significant backlash for this incident, the IDF are careful to operate in such a way as to cause the least shock and condemnation while still keeping a repressive hold on the Palestinian people.

 

[Suikoguy]

I can be just how obtuse I want to be.
And it is my clear view, that both the palestinians and israelis are equally to blame for the situation and escalating violence.

That sense of entitlement must make you a joy to talk with.

But nobody was hurt, nothing was broken, they didn't shout or demand anything and their guns were lowered the whole time etc.

I'm pointing it out because there will be no significant backlash for this incident, the IDF are careful to operate in such a way as to cause the least shock and condemnation while still keeping a repressive hold on the Palestinian people.

Did you read the OP at all?

 

[Jonm1010]

But nobody was hurt, nothing was broken, they didn't shout or demand anything and their guns were lowered the whole time etc.

I'm pointing it out because there will be no significant backlash for this incident, the IDF are careful to operate in such a way as to cause the least shock and condemnation while still keeping a repressive hold on the Palestinian people.

Did you watch the video? I mean I know it is a lot to ask to watch a 54 second video before posting a bunch of declarative statements.

One of the soldiers guns was clearly pointed toward the kids on the couch.

 

[ultratruman]

Did you watch the video? I mean I know it is a lot to ask to watch a 54 second video before posting a bunch of declarative statements.

One of the soldiers guns was clearly pointed toward the kids on the couch.

rewatched the video multiple times, I don't see his raising his gun to the kid.

 

[jerry1594]

It has been going on for thousands of years, but you know exactly who started it and who is to blame?

The Israelites who walked in on the Canaanites, reduced their cities to rubble and took their land?

 

[genjiZERO]

First of all soldiers are people too.

Second, where have you guys been the for the past fifteen to ten years? Did you just start following the news yesterday or something?

Anyway, since you can't be bothered to do it, here you go:

http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4701/child-suicide-bombers

http://www.idfblog.com/hamas/2013/0...arin-we-teach-our-kids-to-be-suicide-bombers/

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3979887.stm

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/4601244/n...blind-eye-child-suicide-bombers/#.VQXbWUIgZsM

Did you really just use IDFblog and a think tank chaired by John Bolton as sources? Holy shit, you aren't going to last long around here.

 

[ultratruman]

Did you really just use IDFblog and a think tank chaired by John Bolton as sources? Holy shit, you aren't going to last long around here.

yes, child suicide bombers are a myth. don't believe MSM lies

 

[Jackpot]

You think evening up the kill count is the best solution for peace?

Where did I say that? I was pointing out how stupid it was to say "both sides are equally at fault" when one side is systemically slaughtering the other and negotiations are so one-sided that they're terrified of the Palestinians gaining some recognition in the UN.

Think before you strawman.

 

[sin2sin]

The Israelites who walked in on the Canaanites, reduced their cities to rubble and took their land?

This is quite possibly the best answer I have ever seen in the history of answers! Bravo

 

[Jonm1010]

rewatched the video multiple times, I don't see his raising his gun to the kid.

Then you are blind.

 

[Jonm1010]

yes, child suicide bombers are a myth. don't believe MSM lies

His sources are irrelevant to his original point. Bunch of red herring, goalpost moving bullshit. Furthermore they are mostly awful sources, several from propaganda outfits.

Why are you defending him? Furthermore what are you even arguing?

 

[EMT0]

I was working as a waiter for the Israeli-American Council Conference, followed by the actual dinner Netanyahu showed up at in DC before he was supposed to deliver a speech before congress.

The Israeli politicians that showed up to speak gave no fucks towards the Palestinians as people, painting them as a universally hostile populace, painted sunshine over everything Israel did, called it a force for good in the world, and then called the idea of a Palestinian state ridiculous.

I was biting my tongue the entire night. It helps that the Mossad were providing security, so I sure as fuck wasn't going to do anything stupid.

 

[UVG RAVEN]

His sources are irrelevant to his original point. Bunch of red herring, goalpost moving bullshit. Furthermore they are mostly awful sources, several from propaganda outfits.

Why are you defending him? Furthermore what are you even arguing?

Are you serious? Just do a little search on Google and see for yourself, since it seems that the last ten years you might have been to young to follow the news (or you just dind't care). And since when did BBC and NBCNews became "propaganda outfits"? Any news outlet that disagrees with your beliefs is automatically called a propagandist outfit? Come on. If NBCNews is a propaganda outfit, then this video should be disregarded, since it's from there right?

My point was that these soldiers weren't entering these houses just because it was a fun thing to do, but because there's a history a context behind it. But of course this isn't the way to solve the problem (and I've said it several times, I don't condone these actions; but I don't support the stoning of soldiers either, or the use of children or women in a war).

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

I don't think it's ok for kids or anyone to be throwing stones at people.
Again, I don't condone the soldiers' behaviour.

IDF infantry need to grow bigger, ahem, stones if they feel under threat by Rick throwing children.

You think evening up the kill count is the best solution for peace?

Israel is the one that needs to walk away from the fight. They are the bigger and stronger kid in this.

 

[NobleGundam]

How about if another Israeli soldier(s) raided one of their "follow" soldier's home, took his/her family into the living room for question, and then wake the other kids asleep AT GUN POINT over a fucking rock. Let's see how they like it. Disgusting shit..

 

[UVG RAVEN]

IDF infantry need to grow bigger, ahem, stones if they feel under threat by Rick throwing children.



Israel is the one that needs to walk away from the fight. They are the bigger and stronger kid in this.

Do you really think rocks don't hurt when someone throws them at you?

 

[victreeb3l]

Disgusting shit. I dont expect much else from the IDF.

 

[Yagharek]

It has been going on for thousands of years, but you know exactly who started it and who is to blame?

I don't care who started it. Israel should know better than to have its soldiers do this.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

Do you really think rocks don't hurt when someone throws them at you?

Not when you have a helmet and body armor and are inside an APC.

 

[David Incorporated Esq.]

rewatched the video multiple times, I don't see his raising his gun to the kid.

Then you are blind.

To be fair, they're holding their guns in a resting position, which happens to point down and a bit to the left. When they're standing near the boys the guns do point at the kids, but they're in resting position and not held in a firing position.

I'm not sure how much difference that would make to the person at the end of the barrel though.

 

[Pandaman]

The Israelites who walked in on the Canaanites, reduced their cities to rubble and took their land?

isn't it generally thought that the Israelites were always native to Canaan and that the biblical invasion is just a myth?

 

[Jonm1010]

Are you serious? Just do a little search on Google and see for yourself, since it seems that the last ten years you might have been to young to follow the news (or you just dind't care). And since when did BBC and NBCNews became "propaganda outfits"? Any news outlet that disagrees with your beliefs is automatically called a propagandist outfit? Come on. If NBCNews is a propaganda outfit, then this video should be disregarded, since it's from there right?

My point was that these soldiers weren't entering these houses just because it was a fun thing to do, but because there's a history a context behind it. But of course this isn't the way to solve the problem (and I've said it several times, I don't condone these actions; but I don't support the stoning of soldiers either, or the use of children or women in a war).

Again, you made the assertion that they are entering these homes due to child suicide bombings. Implying a direct link and thus another justification for these actions. Something the article doesnt mention. You have spent a lot of time arguing straw men, moving goalposts and posting red herrings but nothing is actually substantiating your initial assertion let alone justifying these actions because of those asseritions.

Ive been around A LOT in these discussions, haven't seen you much, but your initial posts are showing me that you have a lack of understanding about basic historical truths about this conflict. Quite the opposite that you seem to be asserting(seems to be a running theme).

Care to list for me all the child suicide bombings in Palestine in, lets say, the last year that would justify this the way you claim? And furthermore post how they are linked in such a way that would lead Israel to assume they are a networked operation that justifies this type of force?

I eagerly await your response.

 

[Jonm1010]

To be fair, they're holding their guns in a resting position, which happens to point down and a bit to the left. When they're standing near the boys the guns do point at the kids, but they're in resting position and not held in a firing position.

I'm not sure how much difference that would make to the person at the end of the barrel though.

No they are not aiming them but the guns are pointed at the kids. Which was my point. They aren't putting the barrels in their mouth or aiming down the sight but they also aren't exactly holstering them or have them pointed at the ground like the poster asserted.

 

[Shuggananas]

Not surprised at all. Most dangerous country in the world.

 

[Deleted member 231381]

The Israelites who walked in on the Canaanites, reduced their cities to rubble and took their land?

Verily, but the Canaanites did, in their turn, descend from their mountain strongholds upon the Akkadians and split them asunder such that their cities were founded in blood. They had it coming.

 

[genjiZERO]

Are you serious? Just do a little search on Google and see for yourself, since it seems that the last ten years you might have been to young to follow the news (or you just dind't care). And since when did BBC and NBCNews became "propaganda outfits"? Any news outlet that disagrees with your beliefs is automatically called a propagandist outfit? Come on. If NBCNews is a propaganda outfit, then this video should be disregarded, since it's from there right?

My point was that these soldiers weren't entering these houses just because it was a fun thing to do, but because there's a history a context behind it. But of course this isn't the way to solve the problem (and I've said it several times, I don't condone these actions; but I don't support the stoning of soldiers either, or the use of children or women in a war).

No, BBC and NBC aren't "propaganda outfits" - no one has said they were. But both IDF blog and the other are.

Furthermore, if you are going to make an assertion about "strapping bombs to children" even though it's utterly irrelevant to topic at hand it's up to you to back it up.

Finally, your "point" doesn't make sense. This is about soldiers busting into a house and waking up a child at gun point because he was allegedly throwing rocks. The "history" is irrelevant. And either you are using red herrings to distract from the article or you didn't read OP.

 

[Betty]

Not surprised at all. Most dangerous country in the world.

It's up there for sure... but Iraq, thanks to ol IS are still the reigning champ, and there are a few African countries you do not want to step in.

 

[Mxrz]

Horrible. Even worse seeing people justify it. Worst of all is knowing its our taxes that prop up these assholes.

 

[astroturfing]

no wonder Palestinian kids are some of the most traumatized kids in the world.. wasn't there a recent study that showed the majority of them suffer from PTSD? can't be good for the future of their people...

 

[Jonm1010]

no wonder Palestinian kids are some of the most traumatized kids in the world.. wasn't there a recent study that showed the majority of them suffer from PTSD? can't be good for the future of their people...

Exactly. It creates a vicious cycle of hate and fear.

 

[jerry1594]

Verily, but the Canaanites did, in their turn, descend from their mountain strongholds upon the Akkadians and split them asunder such that their cities were founded in blood. They had it coming.

Nuh uh

 

[sin2sin]

I love that everyone is thinking of this from a humanity perspective and not being blindsided by arguments like kids are used as human shields/blow themselves up/Israel should be able to do what it pleases.

Honestly the Jews who witnessed WW2 would see little difference between how the Jews were treated back then and how the Palestinians are currently being treated now. As highlighted by the link below:

http://youtu.be/s4qm8HTY3-E

 

[Shuggananas]

It's up there for sure... but Iraq, thanks to ol IS are still the reigning champ, and there are a few African countries you do not want to step in.

I mean as a threat to other countries or people, not the security inside the country itself

 

[Betty]

I mean as a threat to other countries or people, not the security inside the country itself

North Korea would take the crown then or again IS held Iraq strongholds and many African countries.

This is just shitty semantics though, Israel is of course doing a lot more than being a threat to Palestine.

 

[Condom]

It's a Palestinian recording the footage.

It's sad they do this but I'm sorry, I don't see any terrorising happening.

Do you even know what the word terrorism means? This is the definition of terrorism.

 

[cursedDice]

I love that everyone is thinking of this from a humanity perspective and not being blindsided by arguments like kids are used as human shields/blow themselves up/Israel should be able to do what it pleases.

Honestly the Jews who witnessed WW2 would see little difference between how the Jews were treated back then and how the Palestinians are currently being treated now. As highlighted by the link below:

http://youtu.be/s4qm8HTY3-E

Wow. Good on that guy to stand his ground and state his point. Having had his entire family exterminated by the Nazis makes him an excellent spokesperson for this message. He had people trying to shout him down and boo him, but he stood there, told them to shut up, and delivered his message.

 

[Coriolanus]

North Korea would take the crown then or again IS held Iraq strongholds and many African countries.

This is just shitty semantics though, Israel is of course doing a lot more than being a threat to Palestine.

None of those countries have anything even remotely close to the Samson Option.

 

[Toxi]

Do you really think rocks don't hurt when someone throws them at you?

What the hell does this have to do with IDF forces crashing a home in the middle of the night to question children at gunpoint?

 

[Sajjaja]

What the hell does this have to do with IDF forces crashing a home in the middle of the night to question children at gunpoint?

When one can't handle criticism, one simply changes the topic to something that might justify said actions. Nothing new.

 

[sin2sin]

Wow. Good on that guy to stand his ground and state his point. Having had his entire family exterminated by the Nazis makes him an excellent spokesperson for this message. He had people trying to shout him down and boo him, but he stood there, told them to shut up, and delivered his message.

I know right! I don't think I could ever handle such abuse and continue talking with such determination. The guy is a legend in my eyes

 

[Laughing Banana]

Isn't this because Palestinian soldiers use kids and women to attack people? Strap bombs on them, give them guns and hide in villages? I'm sure all those have something to do with it.
But still I do not condone what these soldiers are doing.

Man, those kids really do ask for that assault rifles to be pointed at them, huh.

 

[astroturfing]

Wow. Good on that guy to stand his ground and state his point. Having had his entire family exterminated by the Nazis makes him an excellent spokesperson for this message. He had people trying to shout him down and boo him, but he stood there, told them to shut up, and delivered his message.

yea that's Finkelstein right? (no time to click link)

he's an amazing man, some of his speeches have basically brought me to tears..

 

[Dai101]

yea that's Finkelstein right? (no time to click link)

he's an amazing man, some of his speeches have basically brought me to tears..

Yup. Norman Finkelstein.

 

[sin2sin]

yea that's Finkelstein right? (no time to click link)

he's an amazing man, some of his speeches have basically brought me to tears..

Same here! He's so clever and is the epitomey of compassion.