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[DaBargainHunta]

If I disagree, fine?! This is a discussion forum, what's the point of just ending your post like that?

Because you seemed to be taking my opinion personally. If I misread your tone, my apologies.

I really do disagree that this is becoming common and have to question the games you are playing. I own over 100 games for the PS2 alone, and looking over them, only 26 of them contain a solid dose of cutscenes...but several of those are RPGs where those scenes are expected. You will find smaller ratios on the other two systems. Really, just what ARE you playing?

When you say MOST, that would imply that a good 3/4 of the games on the market are like this (or even a bit over 50%). That just isn't true!

Well, not counting the obvious genres that aren't going to be hampered by this problem (sports, for example), "most" may not be such a gross exaggeration. Don't get me wrong, I am not anti-cutscene, I just want them in small doses, and I don't think it's too much to ask that they be entertaining and coherent. Personally, I think the best way to handle story sequences is during the gameplay itself (like Deus Ex), where it doesn't feel like such a jarring interruption. Another method I don't mind is the semi-interactive cutscenes in Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic. In an interactive medium such as video games, non-interactive cutscenes are like hearing the phone ring during a movie - they take you out of the experience IMO.

 

[ArcadeStickMonk]

I think it's a breath of fresh air that Darkie gets pissed off every night now days. This is like the third flame-approaching evening for you; what's happenening up there?

BTW, I feel that any half hour cutscene should just be avoided. Games are about gameplay.

 

[DaBargainHunta]

Games are about gameplay.

Amen!

 

[dark10x]

Games are about gameplay.

I agree, but in some cases, a game can be enhanced with the usage of cutscenes. I sure as shit don't want to play any shooters with cutscenes and dialog popping up constantly (ie - Shikigami no Shiro 2 with "demo" mode enabled)...but with something like MGS or BG&E (despite the ending), those scenes really give the experience more meaning. What the hell would Silent Hill be with absolutely ZERO plot or cutscenes? Make your character a faceless lump of polygons and take away ALL meaning from the experience? Do you really want that?

Cutscenes have their place, and in most games, they should seriously limit the usage of them...but it is unfair to suggest that games are ONLY about gameplay. The way a game plays is EXTREMELY important, but you're not thinking straight if you believe that to be the ONLY thing that matters in the grand scheme of things.

 

[belgurdo]

Games are about gameplay.

Not always. If gaming was still the early/mid 80s "do one or two things over and over until you flip the score or run out of cash/continues" types of affairs I doubt many people would have stuck with the medium as long as they have

 

[SolidSnakex]

Not always. If gaming was still the early/mid 80s "do one or two things over and over until you flip the score or run out of cash/continues" types of affairs I doubt many people would have stuck with the medium as long as they have

Yep, games had to evolve, and one way they have is by some of the adding a cinematic flair to them. I don't see why that's such a bad thing. Not every game has it, but for some it's a staple of it.

 

[speedpop]

As much as I just enjoy games for the gameplay, I do enjoy the usual cut-scene now and again.

Walking into ANY Hideo Kojima game, you are going to face cut-scenes whether you like it or not. Same could be said towards the FF titles and several RPGs to name a few. If no one enjoys cut-scenes and wants pure gameplay I suggest to crash in your PS2 and Xbox, buy a GC and dedicate yourself to Nintendo releases.

 

[Great Wasabi Man]

too many cut scenes you say?

I mean story is great MGS2 isn't that bad...espcially if it moves the game along instead of wandering around a leave while god or somone give you magically floating objectives.

 

[ArcadeStickMonk]

The way a game plays is EXTREMELY important, but you're not thinking straight if you believe that to be the ONLY thing that matters in the grand scheme of things.

Well, I certainly did buy a third copy of Silent Hill 2 to keep my 60 frame cutscenes didn't I? All I'm saying is that if I wanted to watch something for a half hour, I'd turn on a TV channel.

Then again, I don't play through a game for a third time because I only like the cutscenes, but vice versa... . I enjoy it when a scene adds or elevates to atmosphere or direction of a game, but it is all suplemental. Some developers forget this, and try and make me sit through thrity minutes of mostly talking heads before I can hit Solidus Sanke with a katana and complete the climax.

 

[Korranator]

Reality check, they MADE the game for me.

Sure, and I'm Santa Claus.....

 

[RevenantKioku]

A lot of games handle it very well. Xenosaga you can skip the cut-scenes, and MGS2 let you skip damn near everything, although they could have done skipping the codec's a bit better.
The annoying thing is when you can't skip or speed it up any.
Also, none of Xenosaga's cut-scenese felt long to me, but its all perspective.

 

[ArcadeStickMonk]

Reality check, they MADE the game for me.

Sure, and I'm Santa Claus.....

He was saying that cutscenes were what made his MGS2 experience, dingus.

 

[SolidSnakex]

"Some developers forget this, and try and make me sit through thrity minutes of mostly talking heads before I can hit Solidus Sanke with a katana and complete the climax."

Then just skip the cutscene.

 

[ArcadeStickMonk]

"Some developers forget this, and try and make me sit through thrity minutes of mostly talking heads before I can hit Solidus Sanke with a katana and complete the climax."

Then just skip the cutscene.

I said that they tried . I been skippin' cutscenes since before you were born (probably).

It shows a lack of respect for pacing and the fact that me an' Dacian ain't moved for nine hours and want this shit to be done with.

 

[Mashing]

I'm going to have to disagree. I love cutscenes. I liked watching the longass cutscenes in Xenosaga I because they were well directed and choreographed. I enjoy both in engine and FVM cutscenes. And despite what you may think, they are the best plot device to move the story foward.

 

[RevenantKioku]

I said that they tried . I been skippin' cutscenes since before you were born (probably).

It shows a lack of respect for pacing and the fact that me an' Dacian ain't moved for nine hours and want this shit to be done with.

Its no "lack of respect for pacing" its just not a pacing you appreciate.

 

[dark10x]

I said that they tried . I been skippin' cutscenes since before you were born (probably).

Actually, in his case, it's the other way around.

You just HAD to bring up that codec scene, though. I certainly didn't mind the info provided, but that was WAY too long and really did damage the pacing (which I thought was otherwise pretty good).

 

[SolidSnakex]

No, what it shows is that the series isn't for you. Like someone mentioned earlier, when you buy a Kojima game you go in knowing that they have a heavy focus on cutscenes. There's a market for that type of game obviously or the series wouldn't sell. He's making the game for those people, not people that don't enjoy the long cutscenes. For those people, there's nothing wrong with the pacing.

 

[Korranator]

He was saying that cutscenes were what made his MGS2 experience,

ahhh, I see.......

Well his opinion doesn't invalidate mine.

dingus.

Nice, and informative. Now pat yourself on the back for being so creative.

 

[Laurent]

Then just skip the cutscene.

It's hard for some people... They need to guess which button... And if they press the wrong one, it might zoom in... Then they get dizzy... Then they need to go to the bathroom - It's not good!

 

[dark10x]

Well his opinion doesn't invalidate mine.

Oh no? Your original post sure didn't come off like an opinion...

 

[Korranator]

Oh no? Your original post sure didn't come off like an opinion...

So I'm suppose to use IMO right after each post??? Please. They are my words, it should be a given that it's my opinion.

 

[RevenantKioku]

Well his opinion doesn't invalidate mine.

Your opinion is you're Santa Claus.
Rawk!

 

[Korranator]

No, what it shows is that the series isn't for you. Like someone mentioned earlier, when you buy a Kojima game you go in knowing that they have a heavy focus on cutscenes. There's a market for that type of game obviously or the series wouldn't sell. He's making the game for those people, not people that don't enjoy the long cutscenes.

Actually MGS was nowhere near as long winded. Although even MGS had too many cut scenes in it for my tastes. MGS2's demo kicked ass, and was a lot of fun. The series should be about exploring and kicking ass like the original Metal gear was on the NES. If Kojima could have keep the pace of the demo, going with light cut scenes to keep the story following, but allowing for actual game play, then I don't think this would be such a love it or hate it game.

 

[Korranator]

Your opinion is you're Santa Claus.
Rawk!

That made sense...... in your little mind.

Next...

 

[ArcadeStickMonk]

... then I don't think this would be such a love it or hate it game.

Dude!
I still think it's a great game!
No one should claim that MGS2 is right out.
Gameplay in it is phenominal.
Usually, I just quit after I defeat all the Metal Gears.
Super long cut scenes just keep me from enjoying the climax.

 

[SolidSnakex]

"If Kojima could have keep the pace of the demo, going with light cut scenes to keep the story following, but allowing for actual game play, then I don't think this would be such a love it or hate it game"

There would be just as much if not more (considering the series din't become really popular till the heavy cutscenes, i'd say more). Mainly because positions would be switched, the people who want a smaller amount of cutscenes would be happy, but the peopel who enjoy those long cutscenes would then be upset.

 

[Korranator]

There would be just as much if not more (considering the series din't become really popular till the heavy cutscenes, i'd say more).

Kinda like FF7, which the series has gone downhill since? Good Point.

 

[jett]

Certainly, Xenosaga takes the cake for overuse of cutscenes in video games, and also overuse of needless FMV that was just pre-recorded real time graphics. I guess since he was working with a DVD9 Takahashi didn't give a shit about optimizing the XS engine.

I'll say that MGS2 didn't have too many cut-scenes...it had a SHIT LOAD of codec interruptions. Are you sure some of you aren't confusing the two?

Anyway, MGS2's cut-scenes aren't all that professional-looking, at times they look downright amateurish by film standards, with the excessive zoom-ins, slow motion and whatnot. They are not God's gift from heaven. The CG in most games have better direction and editing, I'd say. I guess that compared to other real time cutscenes they are the best, but that's not saying much really. Most real time cutscenes are complete SHIT.

Kojima is no film director, that's for sure.

 

[RevenantKioku]

Kinda like FF7, which the series has gone downhill since? Good Point.

Except really, they haven't. Mechanically-wise they've improved greatly, and story-wise, well that's opinions all around.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Kinda like FF7, which the series has gone downhill since? Good Point.

In terms of what has it gone downhill? The series has never really been a shining example of great gameplay if you were a DQ gamer. Most of the love of the old games comes purely from nostalgia.

 

[firex]

I generally don't mind cutscenes the first time through, unless it either feels like too many (I think MGS was guilty of this with codec conversations on disc 2 of the game) or like it's totally pointless and does nothing to advance the plot. In other cases I can watch some cutscenes multiple times and enjoy them just because they're cool.

 

[Grubdog]

Pretty much every cutscene in every game ever that I can't skip bores me to tears, i'm playing a videogame, not watching a movie, it really annoys me. I hate that direction part of the industry is going in, I don't understand it at all.

Needs more gameplay.

 

[Comfort_Eagle]

Never been a fan of cutscenes. I just want to play the game. There really arent many games that have a good enough story for me to actually want to sit and watch something.

 

[Bizarro Sun Yat-sen]

I'd say the trend of longer/more events already peaked a couple years ago with games like FFX and MGS2, and right now there's a mild trend in the other direction. By the way, the 'needless' FMV of prerecorded events in Xenosaga was used to cut down on mid-event load times (which would otherwise be needed to load new BG or character data into memory for scene changes, etc.) that would disturb the flow of the event.

 

[etiolate]

Cutscenes need to dissapear from Platformers, pronto.

 

[dark10x]

Cutscenes need to dissapear from Platformers, pronto.

I'd agree in every case EXCEPT for the Klonoa games, where the story has always been a huge piece of the game.

 

[disabledHeliocentric]

When a cut scene is done really well it can enhance the game.

 

[djtiesto]

Cutscenes only really work in certain types of games, I think... Every 3D platformer nowadays has a bunch of cutscenes and a boring story, that's really unnecessary. Hell, cinemas in games got their start with Ninja Gaiden, from what I remember (even further back, if you consider Ms Pac Man chasing around Pac Man)... If you have a fairly engaging tale, it makes the game more worth it.

For "twitch" games, like shooters... having lots of cinematics really removes the whole sense of constant action and immersion. I usually skip the cinemas in Radiant Silvergun.

The worst offender was (although I loved the game) Xenogears... the text ... speed... went... by... sooooooo... slooooooooooow... with no option to speed it up.

 

[Oni Jazar]

I hope Kojima doesn't change a damn thing for MGS3. I (and many others) love the approach that the metal gear solid games take. If you dont like it then that's what the VR missions are for, but leave the original, over the top storylines and action sequences IN Metal Gear Solid.

Face the facts: MGS has always been a strong mix of narrative and gameplay. It's like saying, 'Oh I dont like this movie so it really shouldn't exist.'

 

[Tabris]

Skip the cutscenes if you don't want to watch them.

How hard is this concept to you?

I mean you keep on whining about MGS2. Well MGS1 had the same amount of cutscenes, and I don't see you whining about that.

Your actual problem is with the story of MGS2. So you didn't like the story? Great. Skip the fucking cutscenes.

 

[Tabris]

Also, you keep on mentioning Xenosaga. Just so you know, and I timed it, Xenogears has a longer cutscene than Xenosaga. Infact, in general, it has more cutscenes.

 

[jett]

I'd say the trend of longer/more events already peaked a couple years ago with games like FFX and MGS2, and right now there's a mild trend in the other direction. By the way, the 'needless' FMV of prerecorded events in Xenosaga was used to cut down on mid-event load times (which would otherwise be needed to load new BG or character data into memory for scene changes, etc.) that would disturb the flow of the event.

I know, but some of the FMVs were just of people standing around talking in just one background.

 

[jett]

Also, you keep on mentioning Xenosaga. Just so you know, and I timed it, Xenogears has a longer cutscene than Xenosaga. Infact, in general, it has more cutscenes.

True, Xenogears has an hour-plus cutscene near the end, but most of Xenosaga's cut-scenes go past the 20 minute mark. Really, when I played Xenogears it didn't feel like it had many cut-scenes...at least nearly all of them were nowhere near as long as Xenosaga's.