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[shantyman]

A picture says a thousand words:

 

[White Man]

EGM, are you sure Aero Glass is not in 5308? I swear it is.

Semi-aero glass, iirc. I don't think it's fully on. I think there's a special name for it but I can't recall it at the moment.

 

[EGM92]

EGM, are you sure Aero Glass is not in 5308? I swear it is.

I'm 100% positive that Aero is not fully implemented in these builds it's not planned until BETA 2 as MS employees have stated time and time again. They also stated that the look is pretty much final, so I'm not expecting any Whistler to XP kind of change.

Also Shantyman, you should really try the 5342 build if you can get it, its much more stable then 5308 and it uses less resoucres from my personal experience.

 

[shantyman]

I'm 100% positive that Aero is not fully implemented in these builds it's not planned until BETA 2 as MS employees have stated time and time again. They also stated that the look is pretty much final, so I'm not expecting any Whistler to XP kind of change.

Also Shantyman, you should really try the 5342 build if you can get it, its much more stable then 5308 and it uses less resoucres from my personal experience.

I can not get it- I am just a lowly MSDN member.

 

[BocoDragon]

I know its all pretty unrealistic, it just pisses me off that all the connectivity promised by the x360 is geared toward people who have seperate gaming and home theater set-ups.

Yeah, true.... it is pretty silly.... I mean 360s can only offically connect to Media Center PCs...... but the point of a Media Center PC is that it has all this home theater functionality, so if you have one, it's probably hooked up to your home theater already..... it's just strange how many people can actually benefit from this setup.

 

[gofreak]

Let's look a typical example. One of the first things I do whenever I install a new Windows version is download and install Mozilla Firefox. If we forget, for a moment, the number of warning dialogs we get during the download and install process (including a brazen security warning from Windows Firewall for which Microsoft should be chastised), let's just examine one crucial, often overlooked issue. Once Firefox is installed, there are two icons on my Desktop I'd like to remove: The Setup application itself and a shortcut to Firefox. So I select both icons and drag them to the Recycle Bin. Simple, right?

Wrong. Here's what you have to go through to actually delete those files in Windows Vista. First, you get a File Access Denied dialog (Figure) explaining that you don't, in fact, have permission to delete a ... shortcut?? To an application you just installed??? Seriously?

OK, fine. You can click a Continue button to "complete this operation." But that doesn't complete anything. It just clears the desktop for the next dialog, which is a Windows Security window (Figure). Here, you need to give your permission to continue something opaquely called a "File Operation." Click Allow, and you're done.

:lol

 

[Phoenix]

That's what I was thinking. Can it be more duh?!?

Then again, there isn't as much visual difference as there is in XP with the whole title bar being shaded.

Yeah, but in some of the pictures there is an (obvious bug) in that there is an in focus blue "back" arrow that is active. if the window isn't active, not of its controls should be active or in focus. Now if that's NOT a bug, then shame shame Microsoft that is a UI design faux paux.

 

[aaaaa0]

It is a fresh install, build 5308.

5308 is ancient.

 

[Mason]

Was that "rotating Windows in 3d space" ever going to have any kind of practical use? It looks like it's just for show.

 

[shantyman]

5308 is ancient.

Again, MSDN members only have access to that build.

 

[PotatoeMasher]

I've seen some discussion on channel 9 about the lack of updates for MSDN... We all know Vista isn't quite ready for primetime, but if they want us really working with WPF, XAML and the like, they need to be throwing more releases our way.

I know they're releasing much of the CTPs for XP, but if I'm gonna develop with bleeding edge technologies I want to have the platform at hand.

 

[aoi tsuki]

If only some really gifted people would get together and make an extremely powerful, customizable yet user-friendly Linux... that would be great (and no, I'm not talking about Lindows, kthx).

If you have a spare computer, go to www.ubuntu.org and download one of the Live CDs. i'd say that anyone who's been using computers for a decade or so can easily install one of the more popular Linux distros to their computer. Until you get to resolving hardware issues, the vast majority of everything, from installing the OS to upgrading apps, is handled within a familiar GUI.

i received an old laptop recently, an HP 4150 with 64MB of RAM (added a 128MB stick from another machine), a 366MHz Pentium II processor, and a paltry 6GB hard drive. The only thing i wanted to do with it was use it as a file storage for my digital computer, which meant being able to plug my flash card reader into it to dump the pics onto the laptop, and burn them with a CDRW in a USB enclosure. i haven't gotten the enclosure but the flash card reader, my USB flash drive, and surprisingly my Palm TX (after a little work) were all recognized. i added a gigabit ethernet card (internet access is essential for figuring out the various Linux quirks) so i could get online and browse my home network. Aside from sound not working (it's notably problematic on this laptop), everything works swimmingly.

i switched from Gnome to Xfce and noticed a significant improvement in speed. i've got Abiword for light word processing, and Open Office for Microsoft Office compatibility,though it's painfully slow on this old machine. Firefox came preinstalled and works just like the Windows version, but i'll be upgrading that shortly. i've got four desktops and no problem switching between them. Aside from playing music, i'm running many of the same or similar apps on this machine as i would on my desktop, though in some cases faster, In fact, once i get audio working and enable sharing with our network, i'll probably do a lot of my browsing and probably email on this machine. In fact, THIS MESSAGE IS COMING FROM INSIDE THE LINUX!

Don't get me wrong, i'm not going to replace Windows with Linux for everything. There's still a need to hit the console from time to time, especially when diagnosing issues. Ubuntu simplifies things a bit, but it still doesn't dompletely hide the need for backend stuff like OSX. And there's still a lack of corporate support for those of us who have to use certain apps or just want to play games. But it's definitely come a long way as a practical OS, if for nothing else than virus-free web browsing.

 

[Shogmaster]

A picture says a thousand words:

"BS" is only two letters.

 

[shantyman]

"BS" is only two letters.

Shog, you know as well as I do that 64 bit edition, Tablet Edition, and Media Center are all niche releases at best. The context of this discussion is consumer releases primarily I would say.

I'm defending MS in a lot of threads lately! Relax, my friend.

 

[shantyman]

I've seen some discussion on channel 9 about the lack of updates for MSDN... We all know Vista isn't quite ready for primetime, but if they want us really working with WPF, XAML and the like, they need to be throwing more releases our way.

I know they're releasing much of the CTPs for XP, but if I'm gonna develop with bleeding edge technologies I want to have the platform at hand.

I am not sure what you want... Since last summer they have released 4 different version of the the Vista beta to MSDN subscribers, with a ton of changes in between. Do you want nightly buolds like Firefox?

 

[Shogmaster]

Shog, you know as well as I do that 64 bit edition, Tablet Edition, and Media Center are all niche releases at best. The context of this discussion is consumer releases primarily I would say.

I'm defending MS in a lot of threads lately! Relax, my friend.

Niche releases maybe, but all those versions of OSX were just patches and minor upgrades (interesting that since 2000, all of them has been still OSX and not gone into 11 yet) that don't justify paying for them everytime either (I know not every single one of them you had to pay for, but the point stands).

I really don't get the point of that slide. That MS sucks shipping new products? They are teh slow and Apple is teh fast? MS has way more OSes out for public consumption (especially when you realise that there has been around 6 or 7 differing handheld Windows between 2000 and now) than Apple does while making them be compatible with way more hardware variations, but that's gonna be too hard to put into a neato slide I guess.

Whether you defend Windows lately or not, that pic is rather stupid.

 

[Futureman]

Niche releases maybe, but all those versions of OSX were just patches and minor upgrades (interesting that since 2000, all of them has been still OSX and not gone into 11 yet) that don't justify paying for them everytime either (I know not every single one of them you had to pay for, but the point stands).

I really don't get the point of that slide. That MS sucks shipping new products? They are teh slow and Apple is teh fast? MS has way more OSes out for public consumption (especially when you realise that there has been around 6 or 7 differing handheld Windows between 2000 and now) than Apple does while making them be compatible with way more hardware variations, but that's gonna be too hard to put into a neato slide I guess.

Whether you defend Windows lately or not, that pic is rather stupid.

Argue all you want, and in fact you make some good points, but at the end of the day...

OS X >>>>> Windows

so what the hell is the point?

 

[MrSardonic]

it's like they want me to buy a mac...and i will

 

[Shogmaster]

Argue all you want, and in fact you make some good points, but at the end of the day...

OS X >>>>> Windows

so what the hell is the point?

None for you I guess. *rolleyes*

OSX is purdy and all, but I see pros and cons to each OS, which I've been noticing more since I've been using OSX alot lately at my teaching job. If you feel OSX is better for you, by all means, knock yourself out. But not everyone is going to think OSX is better than XP (different, and better at somethings, not as good at others).

But at the end of the day, I still get to call out BS when I see them.

 

[RonaldoSan]

Oops. Nevermind.

 

[shantyman]

I would argue that the difference bween OS X 10.0 and 10.4 is at least as great as between Vista and XP, but that is just IMHO.

 

[goodcow]

I would argue that the difference bween OS X 10.0 and 10.4 is at least as great as between Vista and XP, but that is just IMHO.

Spotlight alone confirms this.

Start -> Search
*has to disable the fucking search dog*
*has to set everything to advanced to find what I want*
*types in a search querey*
*waits an obscenely long time*
*gets results*
*deletes a file from the results panel*
*search has to start all over, effeceitvely locking up, and using 100% of explorer's resources on a long list of results*

End result:
FUCK YOU MICROSOFT.

 

[Shogmaster]

I would argue that the difference bween OS X 10.0 and 10.4 is at least as great as between Vista and XP, but that is just IMHO.

And I'd argue that the difference between XP and XP:Tab PC Edition is greater than from 10.0 to 10.4 and XP to Vista combined (for laptops anyways).

 

[aoi tsuki]

Spotlight alone confirms this.

Start -> Search
*has to disable the fucking search dog*
*has to set everything to advanced to find what I want*
*types in a search querey*
*waits an obscenely long time*
*gets results*
*deletes a file from the results panel*
*search has to start all over, effeceitvely locking up, and using 100% of explorer's resources on a long list of results*

End result:
FUCK YOU MICROSOFT.

That's a little unfair given the amount of time between the release of XP and Spotlight, though i still don't understand how or why they managed to break XP's indexing service.

Google Desktop Search FTW.

 

[RonaldoSan]

FUCK YOU MICROSOFT.

Whatever. A Mac is no good for anything dependent. It couldn't host a webpage if it's life depended on it.

 

[shantyman]

And I'd argue that the difference between XP and XP:Tab PC Edition is greater than from 10.0 to 10.4 and XP to Vista combined (for laptops anyways).

I won't deny that. You certainly know more about that then me. I guess when I posted that picture it was to illustrate the differences in the standard, desktop OS from the 2 companies in this case.

That's a little unfair given the amount of time between the release of XP and Spotlight, though i still don't understand how or why they managed to break XP's indexing service.

Google Desktop Search FTW.

And for the gaping security hole!

How would a third party solution be better than something integreated into the OS? Vista's indexed searching in 5308 seems to work great to me.

 

[shantyman]

Whatever. A Mac is no good for anything dependent. It couldn't host a webpage if it's life depended on it.

WTF? Now you've just gone stupid. Do you not know OS X server exists?

 

[RonaldoSan]

Yes. How many websites are hosted on OS X Server?

edit. But that is not really my point. A normal Mac with OS X is not supposed to act as anything but a tool for the user. With Windows and Linux you can make dependent resources out of low-budget boxes.

 

[aoi tsuki]

I won't deny that. You certainly know more about that then me. I guess when I posted that picture it was to illustrate the differences in the standard, desktop OS from the 2 companies in this case.



And for the gaping security hole!

How would a third party solution be better than something integreated into the OS? Vista's indexed searching in 5308 seems to work great to me.

From what i've read, the security hole was in an older version of GDS. i don't have the "search across computers" option enabled, nor do i have Java enabled. i don't even let GDS or any of its programs access the net, nor do i view my results in the browser. i don't like the way it seamsless makes them appear as web results.

And i never said it worked better than Vista's search (i've never used Vista), just that similar capability is available now.

 

[teiresias]

If you have a spare computer, go to www.ubuntu.org and download one of the Live CDs. i'd say that anyone who's been using computers for a decade or so can easily install one of the more popular Linux distros to their computer. Until you get to resolving hardware issues, the vast majority of everything, from installing the OS to upgrading apps, is handled within a familiar GUI.

I'm trying to figure out how your link has anything to do with Linux, unless I'm just mysteriously getting sent to the wrong site by that URL.

 

[shantyman]

From what i've read, the security hole was in an older version of GDS. i don't have the "search across computers" option enabled, nor do i have Java enabled. i don't even let GDS or any of its programs access the net, nor do i view my results in the browser. i don't like the way it seamsless makes them appear as web results.

And i never said it worked better than Vista's search (i've never used Vista), just that similar capability is available now.

I did not mean to come across as negative as I sounded. GDS is fine program from what I have read but as Mac user I just use Spotlight/Quiksilver, so I never had any incentive to try it out.

 

[SFA_AOK]

I'm trying to figure out how your link has anything to do with Linux, unless I'm just mysteriously getting sent to the wrong site by that URL.

Heh heh, I think he meant: http://www.ubuntu.com/

 

[Crisis]

I'm trying to figure out how your link has anything to do with Linux, unless I'm just mysteriously getting sent to the wrong site by that URL.

The actual URL is http://www.ubuntu.com I think the URL used to be something like unbuntulinux.org or something to that effect.

 

[aoi tsuki]

I'm trying to figure out how your link has anything to do with Linux, unless I'm just mysteriously getting sent to the wrong site by that URL.

Doh! i meant to post www.ubuntu.com.

I did not mean to come across as negative as I sounded. GDS is fine program from what I have read but as Mac user I just use Spotlight/Quiksilver, so I never had any incentive to try it out.

No harm done.

And i hear Copernic Desktop Search is a good, alternative to GDS. It's also free. http://www.copernic.com/en/products/desktop-search/index.html