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Pineapple Pizza Mafia |OT| The War On Fruit Pizza
- Thread starter Sophia
- Start date
Burb, they think MY claim is totally something scum would do. I doubt you'll convince town of that line of reasoning.
I'm struggling to see any of the three vanilla claims as something scum would do. Unless the claimer is a ninja, who then can do things without causing movement, which I'll mention in my TL;DR post.
Right now WAMD is the one ringing most alarm bells out of you three, though.
Put your vote where your mouth
keyboard?
hey_monkey
Banned
Or you two could be the experienced scum creating a big ol narrative.
As Palmer said, would be remiss if I didn't mention it.
Is it me, or do these two posts from Dragonz somewhat contradict each other? At least motivations seem to change.
I want to go through all of D2 (at page 17 right now) before I make any votes.
Oh look who suddenly attacks Burb when he brings up WMAD being scum. But yeah, I'm the lunatic for thinking Dragonz has a defense team over here.
hey_monkey
Banned
Sure, I raised a point about Burb AND Palmer, but cool, whatever, put me on your conspiracy board, LL. Just shoehorn it on in there wherever it'll fit. 👍🏼
Don't you worry mate, i got a nice little spot just for you.
Please give me a nice compact post about why you think Swamped is the number 1 scum. Don't respond with just "it's somewhere out there", let's have you do something else but banging the turbo drum.
It's somewhere out there though, i worked really hard on that summary. I had gifs and visual aid and everything.
Then quote that post here.
Because honestly, you are right now just creating smoke-screen, and if not for the highlight command, I would scum read you.
Right, it was this post?
This post was never focusing much on swamped though, it seems to have been mostly about Dragonz, with you even voting her instead of swamped.
This post was never focusing much on swamped though, it seems to have been mostly about Dragonz, with you even voting her instead of swamped.
So to add more detail:
It all started with Palmer's unveiling. It put scum at a tough spot. If Palmer lives he comes off as a strong/important voice as a semi-confirmed townie since his bold play left a lot of people thinking town. If they kill him, they potentially waste their NK on a vanilla town. There best shot at this point was to downplay his claim and throw some doubt or even better get him lynched by town.
At this point Dr. Worm and Dragonz reactions to Palmer's unveiling were the most suspect. It seemed as through they wanted to set up a bandwagon, but wanted a townie to take the first step in putting up a serious vote. Nobody bit on their trap so they backed off, but left enough there to cast doubt and come back to later on.
Then comes their next attempt at starting a bandwagon. Darryl's weird obsession with Sawneeks wording in the early game. It seemed like Darryl was trying too hard to find something to get others to latch on to, but again failed (probably because the text between their argument was too boring and too much and most people just skipped their posts). Also some people called him out on his argument, after which he disappeared.
From previous experience, Scum have a way of hiding whenever there seems to be too much heat growing on them and they also tend to twist wards and tunnel hard on phrasing. Important to note that Dr. Worm has defended a lot of people in this game so far, but has defended Darryl.
Also, at this point in the game Dragonz also had a vote on Sawneeks. It seemed like a jokevote, but it was on Sawneeks for so long that if a bandwagon had started I don't think Dragonz would have removed that vote. Even though Dragonz did say that Sawneeks and Natiko are probably town, Dragonz didn't actually remove the vote on Sawneeks. Also I had scum call me most likely town in Day 1 and then vote against me at the end of the day anyway.
Dragonz read list consisted of considering Hey_Monkey potentially scum when Monkey is behaving mostly like Town. Also read Sawneeks as town, but said "Strong player, whether that be town or scum". Gave 30years a Scum read as well. Only person listed as clear town is SkyOdin. All the other reads felt like an attempt to either start a bandwagon or have a reasoning out there to jump on one.
Blarg's read list 'forcing' people to make reads on their possible scum teammates probably got scum shook, and this is one terrible excuse to get out of it. I've only played one mafia game, but it doesn't seem like sacrificing their own teammates is ever a good scum plan.
And all of this leads to Swamped, the godfather (godmother?)
I didn't know this last game, but apparently Godfathers come off as town if they're investigated. So it would make sense for GF to be someone who talks enough to pique the interests of some investigative towns, and then use their influence on them to get bandwagons going. Swamped has definitely been talking a lot, and has defended both Dragonz and Darryl throughout the day, While seems to have attacked Natiko and Sawneeks, which is where I think scum was attempting to start their bandwagons.
Too much here to be coincidence. Lets start with the most likely scum and then work our way down my list once they flip mafia.
Vote:
VOTE: WhereAreMahDragonz
Here is is
Yeah, I would much rather lynch Dragonz first because that would make me more sure about a Swamped lynch.
But i only have one day left, so i'll take what i can. I'll vote for either.
Is it this one?
Somehow you've wedged me into a conspiracy because I called out a lack of conviction behind Sawneek's post, which you claim was me tunneling, bandwagoning, etc, yet you've also fit me into the same conspiracy for having disappeared immediately after for the entire day. I just can't win here. You're trying too hard to prove something and you've lost perspective.
I agree with Burb in that I wouldn't be taking you seriously if you weren't red-texted. This is policy lynch levels of obfuscation
I hope you realize your entire theory is based off the nonsense conclusion that scum did all of this out of "fear" of Palmer and wanted a bandwagon on him despite none of them ever voting for him on D1 which ended with him tied for most votes. Hell, Swamped could unvote or switch to someone with less votes and you end up with a Palmer lynch which is the supposed goal framing your entire analysis. Instead Swamped votes for her own teammate and causes a no lynch which is not in their best interest.
Do you still think Skyodin is town "clear" town?
hey_monkey
Banned
What happens to your theory if Palmer is scum, Lifeline?
NOTE: These points were written as I read the D2 pages on, so some of the talking points might be fairly LTTP now.
Time to do some D2 digging.
So I missed the part where BB claimed vanilla too. That means we had three vanilla claims during Day 1. The question is would scum claim vanilla during D1? Scum Palmer still makes no sense doing it, and Dragonz and BB well the only theory I can think of is scum goon claiming vanilla for the sake of it.
This post reads very manufactured. Do you really think scum would waste an NK on one of the less active players of N1 just to frame you? Why wouldnt they have went for a more active player like hey_monkey instead? This post feels like artificial defence.
Other people called BB out of this too. I doubt if BB was scum, that the scum team NKd SexyFish just to support the agenda, but maybe BB tried to create it retroactively to make him seem more towny.
This response post seems slightly aggressive, to say the least. Now, Ive used aggressiveness as scum tells in games before, but those havent seem to been been correct as usually as I would have hoped. But Ill still take a mental note about this.
On the one hand I agree with this post Palmer made, but on the one hand it slightly rings alarm bells. Its basically reversed role fishing, scum could have hoped for any other vanillas to claim, so the scum could make sure they would be able to NK only power roles. But this is countered with the game being role madness, so I sligtly doubt a scum Palmer would have expected anyone, or maybe 1 at most, to counter claim him.
This kind of speculation only really helps scum, as described above.
This made me thing about Dragonz claim and timing. The timing was late, and there are points supporting why scum would claim vanilla at that time. Maybe scum only has powers that seem very scummy, and so claiming them would make them look more dubious. Or maybe Dragonz wanted to cast extra shade on Palmer, another vote leader at the time. But then, if palmer would have flipped town vanilla, that would have made Dragonz look bit worse today, maybe? Unless town would decide that having 3 vanilla in a role madness game seems likely.
All good points about Dragonz.
Something about this post seems like dangerous thinking a little. The implications here are that the scum team somehow made Lifeline into a confirmed town, which doesnt seem like a likely power, unless Lifeline has something very specific going on with his role. Also, I think that there are valid reasons for scum to NK SexyFish.
This reasoning is broken. If you were worried about being the only Vanilla, then you would have thought that Palmer was being a liar. Lynch all Liars is generally a fairly good startegy.
I feel that Launch is tunneling a little too much with this point. Its not impossible for swamped to not have known the vote count at that point, I have falled guilty of doing that once or twice too.
This was a mistake on my part, really. I was at that time just waiting for Sawneeks to answer. You misunderstanding was unfortunate, but I didnt want to shoot it down, because I wanted to first see how Sawneeks would react to it. I think her reaction felt towny at that time, but I was on the wrong for not really explaining my stance better. Im sorry.
The problem with this logic is that if all 3 were telling the truth, town would be effectively setting itself for a lynch chain lasting from D2 to D4 at worst case scenario. All possibilities have to be considered, or we might be losing lot of time.
Agreement here. Trying to solve games using role PMs wordings is just lazy. And since Lifeline said his role PM starts with that, it seems like a moot point anyway. (And sorry swamped, I am here now).
No way are WAMD and BB both scum, unless the scum team decided to go super bold for no real reason, especially since both of the two claiming could have easily sabotaged the other (so like, BB claiming could have made Dragonz claim not be believed, or vice versa).
Nothing more to add to this trying to win by role PM scummying. Natiko, you are better than this.
A Ninja could potentially make this ordinary claim, and still be able to move during the night phases without a problem.
Something about this post feels contradictory to the post quoted from Dragonz above. Theres not any direct consistency here in her motives ?
Seems like a believable claim for now. I personally hate millers (being casted in that role twice now), and I can see Natikos frustration about it. But you really should have claimed it immediately at the start of D1, its the optimal play for that role really. So keeping quiet about it until now casts some doubt.
Some good points made about Swamped. I still stand with her not knowing the vote count being a valid reason, but she was saying something completely contradictory just 4 minutes before deadline. Surely she would have stayed on top of the votes for that timespan?
So wait. You withheld the poisoning information, and only said this after Blarg made a guess about it? You sound like you are sure you got poisoned, so why on earth did you stay quiet about it? What the fuck man.
Time to do some D2 digging.
So I missed the part where BB claimed vanilla too. That means we had three vanilla claims during Day 1. The question is would scum claim vanilla during D1? Scum Palmer still makes no sense doing it, and Dragonz and BB well the only theory I can think of is scum goon claiming vanilla for the sake of it.
This post reads very manufactured. Do you really think scum would waste an NK on one of the less active players of N1 just to frame you? Why wouldnt they have went for a more active player like hey_monkey instead? This post feels like artificial defence.
Other people called BB out of this too. I doubt if BB was scum, that the scum team NKd SexyFish just to support the agenda, but maybe BB tried to create it retroactively to make him seem more towny.
This response post seems slightly aggressive, to say the least. Now, Ive used aggressiveness as scum tells in games before, but those havent seem to been been correct as usually as I would have hoped. But Ill still take a mental note about this.
On the one hand I agree with this post Palmer made, but on the one hand it slightly rings alarm bells. Its basically reversed role fishing, scum could have hoped for any other vanillas to claim, so the scum could make sure they would be able to NK only power roles. But this is countered with the game being role madness, so I sligtly doubt a scum Palmer would have expected anyone, or maybe 1 at most, to counter claim him.
This kind of speculation only really helps scum, as described above.
This made me thing about Dragonz claim and timing. The timing was late, and there are points supporting why scum would claim vanilla at that time. Maybe scum only has powers that seem very scummy, and so claiming them would make them look more dubious. Or maybe Dragonz wanted to cast extra shade on Palmer, another vote leader at the time. But then, if palmer would have flipped town vanilla, that would have made Dragonz look bit worse today, maybe? Unless town would decide that having 3 vanilla in a role madness game seems likely.
All good points about Dragonz.
Something about this post seems like dangerous thinking a little. The implications here are that the scum team somehow made Lifeline into a confirmed town, which doesnt seem like a likely power, unless Lifeline has something very specific going on with his role. Also, I think that there are valid reasons for scum to NK SexyFish.
This reasoning is broken. If you were worried about being the only Vanilla, then you would have thought that Palmer was being a liar. Lynch all Liars is generally a fairly good startegy.
I feel that Launch is tunneling a little too much with this point. Its not impossible for swamped to not have known the vote count at that point, I have falled guilty of doing that once or twice too.
This was a mistake on my part, really. I was at that time just waiting for Sawneeks to answer. You misunderstanding was unfortunate, but I didnt want to shoot it down, because I wanted to first see how Sawneeks would react to it. I think her reaction felt towny at that time, but I was on the wrong for not really explaining my stance better. Im sorry.
The problem with this logic is that if all 3 were telling the truth, town would be effectively setting itself for a lynch chain lasting from D2 to D4 at worst case scenario. All possibilities have to be considered, or we might be losing lot of time.
Agreement here. Trying to solve games using role PMs wordings is just lazy. And since Lifeline said his role PM starts with that, it seems like a moot point anyway. (And sorry swamped, I am here now).
No way are WAMD and BB both scum, unless the scum team decided to go super bold for no real reason, especially since both of the two claiming could have easily sabotaged the other (so like, BB claiming could have made Dragonz claim not be believed, or vice versa).
Nothing more to add to this trying to win by role PM scummying. Natiko, you are better than this.
A Ninja could potentially make this ordinary claim, and still be able to move during the night phases without a problem.
Something about this post feels contradictory to the post quoted from Dragonz above. Theres not any direct consistency here in her motives ?
Seems like a believable claim for now. I personally hate millers (being casted in that role twice now), and I can see Natikos frustration about it. But you really should have claimed it immediately at the start of D1, its the optimal play for that role really. So keeping quiet about it until now casts some doubt.
Some good points made about Swamped. I still stand with her not knowing the vote count being a valid reason, but she was saying something completely contradictory just 4 minutes before deadline. Surely she would have stayed on top of the votes for that timespan?
My make a wish foundation wish is to lynch Dragonz.
Yeah, and from what i heard there's no cure, so don't waste a doc on me.
So wait. You withheld the poisoning information, and only said this after Blarg made a guess about it? You sound like you are sure you got poisoned, so why on earth did you stay quiet about it? What the fuck man.
I've seen more scum poisoners than neutral poisoners in games here.
Add the implication now that the "was given pineapple pizza" heavily implies it's a scum action.
As I explained before, claiming Miller would not only remove any chance of me eating a NK for one of our useful PRs but it also very likely would have got me lynched on a D1 that ended with no clear vote leader(s). Literally the only way not claiming backfires is if a PR outs themselves after checking me, but I obviously would never let it get to that point. I'm vanilla in all situations except one (being checked), so I played like a vanilla with a caveat.
I don't feel strong enough about any of the three vanilla claimers so far to vote for them. Palmer feels like he is playing as town, BB I can't help but to feel "scum wouldn't be this stupid" and Dragonz is at least contributing, although she is the most distrustable of the three due to the timing of her claim, and the inconsistent motives.
I need to take a new look of Swamped's posts, Launch's point about her peeked my interest.
But for now, I'm going to put my vote on one of the coasters.
VOTE: StanleyPalmtree
Your vote on Palmer was lazy in D1, and most of your posts are fairly devoid of content. I know you can do better.
I need to take a new look of Swamped's posts, Launch's point about her peeked my interest.
But for now, I'm going to put my vote on one of the coasters.
VOTE: StanleyPalmtree
Your vote on Palmer was lazy in D1, and most of your posts are fairly devoid of content. I know you can do better.
Yea, no turbo please. I'm still going over some of these posts. I don't fully understand everything that has happened in the last day. The arguments against WhereDragons and Swamped are both fair.
I don't see how Swamped could have mistaken the vote count. If she thought it was between 30 and BB, her vote was for BB. The only significant vote afterwards was for Where. So, it was between 30 and BB, with a single vote hitting Where suddenly triggering a panicked last-minute recalculation?
It was at the last minute with seconds remaining. It is possible to have been a controlled tie. The tinfoil hat in me can't help but wonder if this was an intentional attempt to tie, possibly to create artificial distance between Swamped and Where.
I did something like that before as scum.
I don't see how Swamped could have mistaken the vote count. If she thought it was between 30 and BB, her vote was for BB. The only significant vote afterwards was for Where. So, it was between 30 and BB, with a single vote hitting Where suddenly triggering a panicked last-minute recalculation?
It was at the last minute with seconds remaining. It is possible to have been a controlled tie. The tinfoil hat in me can't help but wonder if this was an intentional attempt to tie, possibly to create artificial distance between Swamped and Where.
I did something like that before as scum.
hey_monkey
Banned
I don't understand why a turbo would be in best interest of town. I don't understand why not revealing why a role PM might have been misinterpreted if you're already going to die wouldn't be of interest to town. I don't understand why any information that might have been given to a targeted player that wasn't public wouldn't be of interest to town. I don't understand why tunneling in on two people who haven't been the shadiest players is of interest to town when the whole theory that's based on dissolves completely if Palmer is scum.
Lifeline's behavior honestly makes me question the mod text. This is just my second game on GAF but it's the scummiest damn thing I've ever seen.
Yes, he's put together some other things. They may turn out helpful. But all of the above just leaves me goddamned flabbergasted. If he really is town, I can only guess that if he's gonna die, he's decided only to give a shit about himself.
If he was poisoned, it may indicate that he had one right person day one... or it might be that they wanted us to think he did so we'd chase it. With as manic as he's been, I'd be more inclined to believe the latter.
I'm gonna make that my last post on Lifeline for now because it's been a hell of a distraction for nothing.
Lifeline's behavior honestly makes me question the mod text. This is just my second game on GAF but it's the scummiest damn thing I've ever seen.
Yes, he's put together some other things. They may turn out helpful. But all of the above just leaves me goddamned flabbergasted. If he really is town, I can only guess that if he's gonna die, he's decided only to give a shit about himself.
If he was poisoned, it may indicate that he had one right person day one... or it might be that they wanted us to think he did so we'd chase it. With as manic as he's been, I'd be more inclined to believe the latter.
I'm gonna make that my last post on Lifeline for now because it's been a hell of a distraction for nothing.
hey_monkey
Banned
I do not offer this as a defense of ANYONE or ANYTHING that happened at end of day one - it is absolutely only my perception. But for my part, Dragonz' sudden claim made me incredibly angry (it felt so opportunistic!) and also made me frantically recalculate, or attempt to, everything that had happened. It felt like utter chaos between trying to figure out what was going on, reloading, and trying to post. I went back and forth on her and Palmer and attempted the last minute vote on her because of the timing.
Now, the more seasoned players, who are used to the last-five-minutes frenzy? May have reacted totally differently. That's something only y'all vets can answer.
hey_monkey
Banned
Anyway, I'm out for a while. I'll update my reads later as promised. I'd like to request a count if possible?
I mean, i've been telling you for a while to stop going after confirmed towns. Also would like your opinion on Dr. Worm and that scum move BB and I brought up last page.
If BB flipped Vanilla, Dragonz would have been next to be lynched. A tie and Swamped distancing herself from Dragonz was a great mafia move.
Although I don't think the tie with Palmer by Natiko was planned. More like a nice bonus having town do something like that.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
DAY 2 CURRENT VOTE TALLY:
StanleyPalmtree (3)
Palmer_v1 1018
Burbeting 1130
Lifeline 1134
Swamped (2)
LaunchpadMcQ 650
Lifeline 657 748
isaacnukem 851 855
isaacnukem 855
Lifeline 911 1134
acohrs (2)
hey_monkey 910
SkyOdin 1056
BlackBuzzard (1)
Dr. Worm 640
SkyOdin 708 791
isaacnukem (1)
hey_monkey 858 910
WhereAreMahDragonz 885
Dr. Worm (1)
Palmer_v1 659 778
BlackBuzzard 1071
Burbeting (1)
Darryl 697
Natiko (1)
acohrs 960
Palmer_v1 (0):Blargonaut 849 1019
Blargonaut (0):Palmer_v1 778 1015
oreomunsta (0):BlackBuzzard 872 1071
WhereAreMahDragonz (0):Lifeline 748 911
No active vote for Day 2: 30yearsofhurt, Blargonaut (has previously voted), Natiko, oreomunsta, Sawneeks, StanleyPalmtree, Swamped
Day 2 Postcount: 30yearsofhurt 10, acohrs 9, BlackBuzzard 23, Blargonaut 32, Burbeting 24, Darryl 12, Dr. Worm 24, hey_monkey 63, isaacnukem 4, Lifeline 76, LaunchpadMcQ 34, Natiko 12, oreomunsta 2, Palmer_v1 69, Sawneeks 7, SkyOdin 35, StanleyPalmtree 8, Swamped 15, WhereAreMahDragonz 29
Day 2 ends:
Automated vote tally here
10 votes for majority
StanleyPalmtree (3)
Palmer_v1 1018
Burbeting 1130
Lifeline 1134
Swamped (2)
LaunchpadMcQ 650
isaacnukem 855
acohrs (2)
hey_monkey 910
SkyOdin 1056
BlackBuzzard (1)
Dr. Worm 640
isaacnukem (1)
WhereAreMahDragonz 885
Dr. Worm (1)
BlackBuzzard 1071
Burbeting (1)
Darryl 697
Natiko (1)
acohrs 960
Palmer_v1 (0):
Blargonaut (0):
oreomunsta (0):
WhereAreMahDragonz (0):
No active vote for Day 2: 30yearsofhurt, Blargonaut (has previously voted), Natiko, oreomunsta, Sawneeks, StanleyPalmtree, Swamped
Day 2 Postcount: 30yearsofhurt 10, acohrs 9, BlackBuzzard 23, Blargonaut 32, Burbeting 24, Darryl 12, Dr. Worm 24, hey_monkey 63, isaacnukem 4, Lifeline 76, LaunchpadMcQ 34, Natiko 12, oreomunsta 2, Palmer_v1 69, Sawneeks 7, SkyOdin 35, StanleyPalmtree 8, Swamped 15, WhereAreMahDragonz 29
Day 2 ends:
Automated vote tally here
10 votes for majority
Ahemmm.
Two things
1. I'm a confirmed town
2. I'm not going to get Stanley lynched, this is just a pressure vote to get him to quack.
3. I'm still voting for Dragonz or Swamped at the end of the day
4. I can be convinced to vote for Dr. Worm instead
5. I think banana peppers are the better sweet edition to a pizza than pineapples
6. but I like pineapples too.
Ahemmm.
lmao. i'm telling you, if he wasn't red-texted i would have gone in on him so hard already. i've always found that extreme self-consciousness over bandwagons was a dead-end road. it's something better to look at in retrospect after you can see the patterns.
even as town, engaging in bandwagons is essential to keeping pressure properly applied. a vote by itself is nothing if it can't persuade others.
Vote: Swamped
30yearsofhurt
Member
Jesus, how many bandwagons do you want to jump on?
Nomadic Sparks
Banned
WTF is Blargnaut
e: as in where are they?
They are like a majestic Growlithe I must pet. Majestic and completely insane
e: as in where are they?
They are like a majestic Growlithe I must pet. Majestic and completely insane
I know it was an accident, but please do not edit your posts, Nomadic.
Day 2 votes
blackbuzzard (1)
dr. worm 640
skyodin 708 (791)
swamped (4)
launchpadmcq 650
lifeline 657 (748)
isaacnukem 851 (855)
isaacnukem 855
lifeline 911 (1134)
darryl 1143
lifeline 1144
dr. worm (0)
palmer_v1 659 (778)
burbeting (0)
darryl 697 (1143)
wherearemahdragonz (0)
lifeline 748 (911)
blargonaut (0)
palmer_v1 778 (1015)
palmer_v1 (0)
blargonaut 849 (1019)
isaacnukem (0)
hey_monkey 858 (910)
oreomunsta (0)
blackbuzzard 872 (1071)
iaaacnukem (1)
wherearemahdragonz 885
acohrs (2)
hey_monkey 910
skyodin 1056
natiko (1)
acohrs 960
stanleypalmtree (2)
palmer_v1 1018
burbeting 1130
lifeline 1134 (1144)
dr.worm (1)
blackbuzzard 1071
Majority is 10
Day 2 ends in:
Day 2 votes
blackbuzzard (1)
dr. worm 640
swamped (4)
launchpadmcq 650
isaacnukem 855
darryl 1143
lifeline 1144
dr. worm (0)
burbeting (0)
wherearemahdragonz (0)
blargonaut (0)
palmer_v1 (0)
isaacnukem (0)
oreomunsta (0)
iaaacnukem (1)
wherearemahdragonz 885
acohrs (2)
hey_monkey 910
skyodin 1056
natiko (1)
acohrs 960
stanleypalmtree (2)
palmer_v1 1018
burbeting 1130
dr.worm (1)
blackbuzzard 1071
Majority is 10
Day 2 ends in: