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[SimpleDesign]

How the heck did the Bush administration allow this torture to go this far in the first place ?

Dick Cheney has no soul, duh?

It really is a shame that man is still alive.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

Dick Cheney has no soul, duh?

It really is a shame that man is still alive.

I will be raked over the coals for this but dude, seriously? Wishing that this man was dead? That is simply wrong.

 

[The Lamonster]

GO JOE SESTAK!

 

[NetMapel]

I will be raked over the coals for this but dude, seriously? Wishing that this man was dead? That is simply wrong.

I think he meant that it's horrifying men like these still exist in our modern society.

 

[SimpleDesign]

I think he meant that it's horrifying men like these still exist in our modern society.

Yup.

 

[NetMapel]

I have confidence that the vast majority of people are sane and kind. However, there is like this 5-10% of human population that's just crazy insane. It's really strange how a lot of those people seems to be able to gain vast political power in human history again and again...

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

Yup.

Ok, my bad bro.

 

[gutter_trash]

I will be raked over the coals for this but dude, seriously? Wishing that this man was dead? That is simply wrong.

Cheney is not a man, he is a woose who sends others to die while he avoided combat all his life.

All those on top who had served are moderate when it comes to extreme measure while the one who never served "Cheney" is all okay for extreme measures

 

[Tamanon]

I have confidence that the vast majority of people are sane and kind. However, there is like this 5-10% of human population that's just crazy insane. It's really strange how a lot of those people seems to be able to gain vast political power in human history again and again...

Nah it's not that strange. A lot of times, one of the main impediments to gaining massive power and influence is a conscience.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

Cheney is not a man, he is a woose who sends others to die while he avoided combat all his life.

All those on top who had served are moderate when it comes to extreme measure while the one who never served "Cheney" is all okay for extreme measures

I am not a fan of Cheney but I don't agree with many who think of him in Hitleresque way's. Not saying people on GAF have made the comparisons. However, the sentiment is there for many outside of GAF.

 

[PantherLotus]

I am not a fan of Cheney but I don't agree with many who think of him in Hitleresque way's. Not saying people on GAF have made the comparisons. However, the sentiment is there for many outside of GAF.

You need to stop doing this. You're building a strawman for to justify your ridiculous defense of the undefensible. Stop saying "well some people feel this way" every other post. It makes no sense and only hinders your cause.

This shit is fucking constant, and so annoying.

 

[SouthernDragon]

Cheney and Rumsfeld are fucking monsters.

 

[Snaku]

We're spreading democracy, and we're going in dry.

 

[Mercury Fred]

Cheney and Rumsfeld are fucking monsters.

Agreed. I'd vote for the death penalty for both of them along with Bush, Rice, Rove and Wolfritz after each are found guilty of war crimes. It's fucking preposterous what they've done.

 

[PantherLotus]

We're spreading democracy, and we're going in dry.

Of all the times a rape joke isn't funny.

 

[Snaku]

Of all the times a rape joke isn't funny.

Who's joking? Someone should tell them that freedom isn't an std.

 

[laserbeam]

Ugghhh... Obama really should get a team together and investigate this whole torture deal thoroughly and prosecute whoever involved. I'm not just talking about the soldiers doing those dirty acts, but the high-ups who may know about what has happened. It is criminal that Obama is trying to sweep this under a rug and ignoring it. How the heck did the Bush administration allow this torture to go this far in the first place ?

The stuff like these rapes would not be administration approved actions just like the fact the vast majority of women in the military get raped. These are cases of sick minded people with too much power in the field and the superiors who turn blind eyes.

The fact so many Officers turn their eyes and let this shit happen is the problem. Need to start cracking some officers heads and court martials

 

[PantherLotus]

The stuff like these rapes would not be administration approved actions just like the fact the vast majority of women in the military get raped. These are cases of sick minded people with too much power in the field and the superiors who turn blind eyes.

The fact so many Officers turn their eyes and let this shit happen is the problem. Need to start cracking some officers heads and court martials

Wait, did you just say the 'vast majority' of women in the US Military get raped?

 

[Trurl]

You need to stop doing this. You're building a strawman for to justify your ridiculous defense of the undefensible. Stop saying "well some people feel this way" every other post. It makes no sense and only hinders your cause.

This shit is fucking constant, and so annoying.

Agreed, the appropriate way to construct a strawman is in capslock. ;-)

 

[Snaku]

Wait, did you just say the 'vast majority' of women in the US Military get raped?

Last I heard, something like an upwards of 30% are raped.

 

[SouthernDragon]

A good majority face harassment, but "only" 30% get raped.

Which is 30% too fucking many.

 

[laserbeam]

Wait, did you just say the 'vast majority' of women in the US Military get raped?

Rape is a spreading epidemic that gets drowned out by Superiors or Women afraid to speak out due to punishments. Between 2005 and 2006 alone the number of rapes by fellow soldiers went up 24%.

 

[PantherLotus]

Agreed, the appropriate way to construct a strawman is in capslock. ;-)

I love being held accountable. Thank you, and I deserve it.



Also, you earned your Golden Schmuck for the day.

 

[PantherLotus]

Rape is a spreading epidemic that gets drowned out by Superiors or Women afraid to speak out due to punishments. Between 2005 and 2006 alone the number of rapes by fellow soldiers went up 24%.

I will never, ever minimize rape anywhere, but dropping "VAST MAJORITY" in a conversation begs for proof or correction.

 

[laserbeam]

I will never, ever minimize rape anywhere, but dropping "VAST MAJORITY" in a conversation begs for proof or correction.

Yeah its probably an overstatement but at the minimum as someone said 1 in every 3 female soldiers is raped and those are the ones who come forward.

 

[speculawyer]

I will be raked over the coals for this but dude, seriously? Wishing that this man was dead? That is simply wrong.

He said it is a shame he is still alive. It is not really wishing he was dead.

And he's right.

Dick Cheney is a dick. He voted against banning plastic guns (Really? Can you help terrorists more?). He voted against a symbolic resolution calling for the release of Nelson Mandela . . . he said Mandela was a terrorist. He supported Apartheid. He voted against the MLK holiday. He is currently publicly supporting torture. He got 5 deferments when he had a chance to serve but then had no problem sending many other kids to their deaths. The man is truly a dick. And a complete coward.

Note: General Powell and General Patraeus both agree that Gitmo should be closed and we should NOT waterboard prisoners.

 

[speculawyer]

The stuff like these rapes would not be administration approved actions just like the fact the vast majority of women in the military get raped. These are cases of sick minded people with too much power in the field and the superiors who turn blind eyes.

The fact so many Officers turn their eyes and let this shit happen is the problem. Need to start cracking some officers heads and court martials

I agree that it is a serious problem . . . but raped? I think it is mostly sexual harassment (far too much sexual harassment) but many rapes do occur. But vast majority? I doubt that.

 

[NetMapel]

The stuff like these rapes would not be administration approved actions just like the fact the vast majority of women in the military get raped. These are cases of sick minded people with too much power in the field and the superiors who turn blind eyes.

The fact so many Officers turn their eyes and let this shit happen is the problem. Need to start cracking some officers heads and court martials

Sorry, what I meant is to prosecute all those involved in these horrid acts, however higher up in the chain it might be. Just hypothetically speaking here, though doubtful it's anywhere near the truth, but say Cheney knows about the rape, he should be prosecuted for his in-action in this matter. Bush might not know the exact details of what happened in those jails, but somebody in his administration must know and decided to let it go. Those are exactly the people we need to investigate into and prosecute their butts.

 

[PantherLotus]

It wouldn't be that hard to show that Cheney is/was attempting to defend torture and asked for the 'full release of the records' (which for this argument will include the allegations of rape) for one of two reasons:

1. If the record shows that there were indeed rogue soldiers raping prisoners, they can be further painted as individuals acting alone. But why defend torture to make that point? To separate Abu Grahib from waterboarding?

2. He knows they can never be released and makes it look like Obama is trying to hide something.




Either way, if this story proves more than a sensationalistic British piece, I'm taking up the march for a full accounting on torture and our actions over the past 8 years. We -ALL- need to stand together for this cause.

 

[GaimeGuy]

if the stories about the rapes of underraged prisoners are true, I... I can kind of see why the obama admin would want to not release the pictures. :/

Then again, the truth should be revealed, no matter how painful.

on the other hand, the pics would REALLY rile up people against us (and rightfully so). But the right thing to do for us would be to acknowledge the mistakes and wrongdoings of the past, not sweep them under a rug, however much damage they may do.

anyways, these pictures sound worse than anything from abu ghraib

 

[PantherLotus]

Sestak Confirms He Plans To Take On Specter; Poll Shows Uphill Fight
By Brian Beutler - May 27, 2009, 7:19PM

Rep. Joe Sestak (D-PA) appeared on CNN moments ago and confirmed what I first reported earlier today--that he intends to jump into the Pennsylvania Democratic Senate primary against Sen. Arlen Specter (D-PA), pending the blessing of his family.

Sestak has recently begun reaching out to donors in his state, informing them of his plans and asking them to contribute to his campaign in advance of the June 30 FEC filing deadline.

We've followed Sestak's rising star with great interest for months now.

With a $3 million campaign war chest, and a decorated military career behind him, he seemed for a long time to be the Democrats' most compelling potential opponent to either Specter, who was until recently a Republican, or Pat Toomey, who was challenging Specter in the Republican primary from the right.

When Defense Secretary Robert Gates released his Pentagon budget outline this spring, Sestak (a Navy Rear Admiral) played surrogate, defending the plan from critics who were characterizing it as a weak-on-defense spending cut. He was omnipresent. But for the most party, when asked about his political ambitions, he played coy.

Then Specter switched parties--and Sestak's disposition quickly changed. Suspicious of Specter's motives, and unhappy that his once clear path to the nomination was suddenly obstructed, Sestak turned up the temperature on both the Senate's newest Democrat and the party establishment, which wasted no time throwing their support behind the supposed incumbent.

Over the implicit objections of many in his party, he said he'd be undeterred if he ultimately decided to run, and told me recently that Specter would have to move into the Democratic mainstream on a number of issues if he wanted to avoid a primary challenge.

Apparently that move didn't happen swiftly enough.

On MSNBC tonight, he said his official announcement would come in the not too distant future--perhaps a matter of weeks

 

[mckmas8808]

I was under the understanding that the people that raped those prisoners were already thrown in jail.

 

[Cheebs]

Barack Obama is going to go all out campaigning for Specter. Sestak doesn't stand a chance with the entire Obama machine behind Specter.

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

I hope Sestak wins.

 

[mckmas8808]

WASHINGTON (Reuters) -- The number of U.S. workers filing new claims for jobless benefits dropped by 13,000 last week, the Labor Department reported on Thursday, but so-called continued claims hit a new record as the recession took a further toll on job prospects.

Initial claims for state unemployment insurance benefits declined to a seasonally adjusted 623,000 in the week ended May 23 from a revised 636,000 in the prior week. It was the second straight week in which initial claims fell.

Analysts polled by Reuters had forecast 630,000 new claims for benefits last week compared with a previously reported 631,000 in the preceding week.

Some 5.7 million U.S. jobs have been scrubbed from payrolls since a severe recession began in late 2007, battering labor markets as companies cut current employees and hold off on hiring.

The number of people staying on benefit rolls after drawing an initial week of aid increased by 110,000 to a higher-than-forecast 6.79 million in the week ended May 16, the most recent period for which the data was available. Analysts had estimated continued claims would be 6.74 million.

Continued claims have set new records in every week since Jan. 24 and now are more than double the level they were at a year ago.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/05/28/news/economy/initial_claims.reut/index.htm?postversion=2009052809


Not bad at all.

 

[ratcliffja]

if the stories about the rapes of underraged prisoners are true, I... I can kind of see why the obama admin would want to not release the pictures. :/

Then again, the truth should be revealed, no matter how painful.

on the other hand, the pics would REALLY rile up people against us (and rightfully so). But the right thing to do for us would be to acknowledge the mistakes and wrongdoings of the past, not sweep them under a rug, however much damage they may do.

anyways, these pictures sound worse than anything from abu ghraib

I think the photos should absolutely remain hidden. This sort of thing will do nothing positive. However, I also think that an investigation should be made to find out the source of these atrocities and punish anyone responsible.

 

[besada]

I was under the understanding that the people that raped those prisoners were already thrown in jail.

Only a single soldier is still in prison from Abu Ghraib. No officers saw any jail time. The withholding of the pictures has allowed the military to white wash the entire affair without having to worry about public outrage over what is essentially a cover-up of war crimes ordered at some of the highest levels of the U.S. government.

So long as Abu Ghraib is "just" pictures of guys in hoods and stacked in piles while hill-billy soldiers point and jeer, we can all pretend that it was just a bunch of bad apples, which is the story sold to us by the Bush administration and now being retold by the Obama administration.

Here's a short list of the people who took the fall:
http://www.salon.com/news/abu_ghraib/2006/03/14/prosecutions_convictions/

You'll note there are no convictions for rape. So long as the American people didn't see it, they can pretend it didn't happen.

 

[Kifimbo]

That is not how the United States of America behaves.

It is. The truth hurts. As a Canadian, I can't believe how my opinion of the USA changed in the last 3-4 years. Sadly, Obama isn't doing much to change that (I didn't expect him to changed much anyway).

You'll note there are no convictions for rape. So long as the American people didn't see it, they can pretend it didn't happen.

This.

 

["God's Beard!"]

A good majority face harassment, but "only" 30% get raped.

Which is 30% too fucking many.

Yeah well at least we know our soldiers are equal opportunity offenders and didn't rape prisoners out of hatred or anything. They just like to rape people.

 

[PantherLotus]

TPMDC Morning Roundup
By Eric Kleefeld - May 28, 2009, 9:00AM

WaPo: Sotomayor Has Experience With Tough Confirmations
The Washington Post looks back at Sonia Sotomayor's 1997 confirmation hearings to the Second Circuit Court of Appeals, which was a contentious process due to rumors that she could later be nominated for the Supreme Court. Sotomayor performed strongly, the Post says, though interestingly enough there was a tense exchange with Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-AL) -- now the head Republican on the Judiciary Committee -- over an apology she gave to a convicted defendant who was given a mandatory five-year sentence.

Obama's Day Ahead: Meeting With Mahmoud Abbas, And Hillary Clinton
President Obama will be leaving Los Angeles at 10:35 a.m. ET, and is scheduled to arrive back at the White House at 3:15 p.m. ET. At 4 p.m. ET, he will have a one-on-one meeting with Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas in the Oval Office. They will hold an expanded meeting at 4:45 p.m. ET. At 5:30 p.m. ET, Obama will meet in the Oval Office with Sec. of State Hillary Clinton.

Biden's Day Ahead: Stimulus, And Meeting With Obama And Abbas
Vice President Biden will hold an Economic Implementation Cabinet Meeting, at 10:45 a.m. ET in the Roosevelt Room. In the afternoon, he will hold conference calls with governors and mayors from across the country, to discuss stimulus implementation. At 4:45 p.m. ET, he will join the expanded meeting of President Obama and Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas. At 9:30 p.m. ET, he will speak at the Sons of Italy Foundation's annual National Education & Leadership Awards gala in Washington.

Report: Senate GOP Likely Won't Fight Sotomayor
The Politico reports that despite any right-wing chatter against Sonia Sotomayor, Senate Republicans will not actually put up much of a fight barring some unforeseen skeletons in her closet. "The sentiment is overwhelming that the Senate should do due diligence but should not make a mountain out of a molehill," said a top Senate Republican aide. "If there's no 'there' there, we shouldn't try to create one."

Pelosi Appeals To China For Help On Climate Change
Speaking at Tsinghua University in Beijing, Speaker Nancy Pelosi appealed to China for cooperation on addressing climate change. "We are all in this together," Pelosi told students and faculty. "The impact of climate change is a tremendous risk to the security and well-being of our countries."

Boxer, Franken Set Up Fundraising Committee
Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-CA) and apparent Sen.-Elect Al Franken (D-MN) have set up a joint fundraising committee, Boxer-Franken 2009, which is set to hold a fundraiser in July. The committee will allow the two politicians to pool their fundraising resources, give donors to an opportunity to both support Boxer's 2010 re-election campaign and Franken's ongoing legal battle for the Minnesota Senate seat.

Biden Jokes About Obama And Teleprompters
While giving the commencement address at the U.S. Air Force Academy, Vice President Biden ad-libbed a joke after his left teleprompter fell down. "What am I gonna tell the president?" Biden said. "I'm gonna tell him his teleprompter is broken. What will he do then?"

Obama Tells Big Donors: If Not For You, We Wouldn't Be In The White House
President Obama thanked the donors at a big DNC fundraiser last night in Beverly Hills. "If it weren't for you," he told movie producer Jeffrey Katzenberg, "we would not be in the White House." Fun fact: one of the celebrity attendees was actor Kiefer Sutherland, who is of course the star of the right-wing favorite TV show 24 -- and is also the grandson of the late left-wing Canadian politician Tommy Douglas, considered by many to have been the father of universal health care in his country.​

 

[capslock]

Investigations will show that this wasn't the act of a few bad apples. This behavior was intructed. Soldiers don't do these things unless ordered. Isn't it weird that these things happend in both guantanamo and abu ghraib? And they were documented. Documented in THOUSANDS of pictures.

Rumsfeld signed off on this, and the soldiers were punished for it.

I agree that accountability goes higher up, but what kind of a soldier carries out an order for rape?

 

[ralexand]

Do you guys really believe that Rumsfield and Cheney approved of those actions.

Get real.

 

[gkryhewy]

I like Joe Sestak, but he's an intellectual lightweight and he's got the entire DEM leadership stacked against him. Wasting your time, Joe.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/05/28/news/economy/initial_claims.reut/index.htm?postversion=2009052809

Not bad at all.

:lol Every week, it's 625k+ and gets revised upwards. You could find the bright side of black hole, my friend.

 

[PantherLotus]

Moths to the Flame

To take the public conversation on its face, a key dynamic in the Sotomayor story is that Republicans can't easily level what would otherwise be legitimate criticisms because some will see them as evidence of prejudice or hostility toward a Latina woman. In other words, the GOP is hamstrung on this battle and has to fight it with one rhetorical arm tied behind its back.

In theory, that could be a problem. But a couple days in, it's actually playing really differently. While elected Republicans are keeping their powder mainly dry and avoiding -- in all but a few cases -- racial charged remarks. But you can't say that for professional Republicans. We've heard that her taste for 'ethnic' food might throw into question her judicial reasoning, that she's a product of affirmative action, that she's a racist, that she's challenging English language dominance by insisting on an alien Spanish pronunciation of her name, that she belongs to a scary group called 'la raza' that might want to help Mexico reconquer the southwestern United States and make it Mexican again and on and on. All told, there's a chorus from the right that Sotomayor is a scary Mexican, understood in the sense of 'Mexican' as anybody with a Spanish last name who isn't actively working to keep the Cuban embargo in place.

And to the extent that there's political calculation at work it seems more likely that it's the realization that any Latina nominee would bring out the rightwing crazies like moths to a flame. They simply can't help it.

--Josh Marshall

:lol

 

[3rdman]

This recent discovery of rape occurring at Abu Ghrab is nothing new...I remember hearing Seymour Hersch say the exact same things at a press conference at the time the that the first photos got out. He too mentioned that photos existed. Why didn't this get any real exposure then, I don't know...

 

[Trurl]

I love being held accountable. Thank you, and I deserve it.



Also, you earned your Golden Schmuck for the day.

:lol
I can't stay mad at you. :-(

 

[ronito]

Mr. Strict Constructionist speaks again:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/05/28/antonin-scalia-judges-mak_n_208531.html

Not only do state-court judges possess the power to "make" common law, but they have the immense power to shape the States' constitutions as well

Can we please stop playing this constructionist charade?

 

[eznark]

What are the lefts talking points on her douche bag ruling?

 

[PhoenixDark]

http://www.gallup.com/poll/118378/Majority-Americans-Continue-Oppose-Gay-Marriage.aspx

Today, the latest USA Today/Gallup poll finds 69% of Americans in favor of military service by openly gay men and lesbians.

oh yea

 

[Father_Brain]

Barack Obama is going to go all out campaigning for Specter. Sestak doesn't stand a chance with the entire Obama machine behind Specter.

I like Joe Sestak, but he's an intellectual lightweight and he's got the entire DEM leadership stacked against him. Wasting your time, Joe.

Not sold on Sestak either, but you could say the same about Ned Lamont... and he still won the CT primary.

Yes, Specter will probably be the nominee, but it's by no means a foregone conclusion. And it's not a bad thing that he'll have to face more pressure from within the party.