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Retard Pack > Premium Pack
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FirstInHell
Banned
Are the mods ever going to crack down on the endless drivel that are the XBox pricing posts?
Oh I totally agree with you that sales of the Premium pack this Fall will give MS more revenue, but not necessarily (and not in my opinion) more profit.Mrbob said:
Core systems aren't as glamorous now for MS revenue-wise, but they do have the potential to sell more than the Premium packs (for the simple reason they're cheaper), and over the long run, the profit potential for Core owners is HUGE.
The problem I have with this choice by MS is that the Core pack goes after an audience, that in my opinion, has NO interest in the 360 this Fall.
PhatSaqs said:
Depending on which model you buy... yes they are. I made the Monster comparison because it was made in another thread, I myself build my own high quality cables for a fraction of the cost. I won't argue the point further because looking for year-old test patterns at AVS is not fun, but yes the pack-in component cables are shit.
Are you ever going to stop crying about them?FirstInHell said:
I really didn't intend for this to be a complaint thread anyhow. People were bagging on the Retard Pack in all other threads, and I mostly wanted to point out that it's not a bad deal at all....and in many ways could be considered a better deal. If launch day comes and you've got $400 in your pocket, I don't see why you should feel bad about getting either SKU.
THIS AM WINNER
SAVE MONIES
fortified_concept
Banned
So will a wireless controller cost 82$ to be complete or they're gonna include the rechargable battery pack and the wire in the individual controllers?
If the video hookups are not the same, then fuck the Retard Pack. And fuck Microsoft for being so god damned greedy as to not even let people use their old cables, which they paid as much as 20-40 dollars for last generation. I don't wanna flip out, but jesus this nickel and dime shit is now officially ridiculous.....I thought it was kinda reasonable before but the video cable lockout just seems like the straw that broke the camel's back. At this point, I wouldn't even be surprised if the old headsets were incompatible with the new controllers....MS said they were at E3, but then MS said a lot of things at E3.
No kidding. I think the battery pack situation has been explained like 3 times and we still have people asking about it (no offense to fortified_concept). Backwards compatibility will only confuse people more.Cerrius said:
fortified_concept
Banned
border said:
OK plz one more time. The wireless controllers which will be sold separately from the console will they have the battery pack and the wires included or you'll have to buy them individualy? It's kinda difficult for me to believe that you'll have to spend 82$ on a controller so can you confirm?
fortified_concept
Banned
sangreal said:
Thanks man.
I can understand not supporting old controllers if you have improved the technology and want to make it standard, but yeesh....there has been no leap in video cables. The ones everybody paid for a year ago are just as good, but are locked out only for the sake of selling new ones. It's maybe the most shameless money-grab so far.
If I had paid closer attention to how much they were charging for cables I guess I would have realized there was no way in hell they would let you use old cables. Not only do they lock out old users, but they have the balls to charge more for the new cables. They just slipped those price hikes in real slyly -- "Ooops, and by the way the 1st party HD cables now cost two times as much as they ever did on Xbox! And we jacked up the price on S-Video cables by 50%!"
If I had paid closer attention to how much they were charging for cables I guess I would have realized there was no way in hell they would let you use old cables. Not only do they lock out old users, but they have the balls to charge more for the new cables. They just slipped those price hikes in real slyly -- "Ooops, and by the way the 1st party HD cables now cost two times as much as they ever did on Xbox! And we jacked up the price on S-Video cables by 50%!"
border said:
I'm in the same boat as you, I've got a pretty good 5.1 system that I spent nearly $1,500 on and I've got a 32" 2 1/2 year old Sanyo TV that doesn't take composite cables. So where exactly does this leave me? I've got my TV hooked up right now with the Xbox Advanced AV pack using a S video cable. Are you telling me I'll have to buy a seperate 360 S video accesory to play the 360 on my tv that doesn't take composite cables? My only choices are to hook up via RCA or S video, and I'm not daring to fuck with my receiver at this point because it was hard enough for me to figure out how to hook all that shit up in the first place.
What about my old Xbox Live headset? It still works damn good after nearly 3 years of use, what do I do with it now? I'm pretty friggin pissed about this whole situation and MS better listen to it's old and possibly new customers because many people are ticked off.
I'm waiting for HD TV prices to come down before I plunk down cash for a 50" TV, so for now my old 32" Sanyo will have to do.
Dragona Akehi
Retired
You know what's frightening? When MS gets away with all this, all while Sony watches.
Well first of all you are a little mixed up. Component cables are the HD-cables. Composite is the same thing as RCA cables. If you buy the Retard Pack you will have to pay $30 for S-Video to get optical audio ($10 more than you paid for it with Xbox). If you buy the Premium Pack, you can use the optical out on the HD-cables that are included with the system and you can use the yellow connector with your RCA jack. Of course you'll lose the ability to use the S-Video jack, so you are kinda screwed either way.JayFro said:
They haven't gotten away with it yet. A lot of this stuff is gonna make for a pretty hard sell. Is the video output jack on PS3 at least confirmed to be the same as the one on PS2?
Dragona Akehi
Retired
border said:
No, but I still worry.
While I don't think Sony would be changing the AV slot anytime soon, the wireless controller BATTERY AND LINE CHARGER are absolutely-fucking-recockulous, and I can see something similar happening.
And us poor sods will be forced to buy at least some of it.
Teh Retard: http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/6527/xbox360pack29if2rp.jpg
Looking at PS2 vs. Xbox why wouldn't you expect the core system to become the eventual standard Xbox 360?
The 85/15 launch breakdown should give you early adopters no comfort. Remember that the original Duke controller was in 100% of the initial Xbox systems sold (100/0 breakdown) and yet the mainstream consumers chose the controller-S in the end. The controller-S became the standard Xbox controller even though the Duke was the only controller on the market for the first year. The way that MS initially distributed the system didn't influence or control what the mainstream consumer eventually chose. In a similar way the Xbox core system with wired controller and no HDD very well may become the default standard Xbox over this generation. And why wouldn't it? Since when did the mainstream consumer care about "value?" The Xbox was a better value than the PS2 and yet the mainstream chose PS2 over Xbox by a huge margin.
-Did the mainstream consumer care that the Xbox had a HDD standard and the PS2 didn't?
-Did the mainstream consumer care that the Xbox could load games much faster than the PS2?
-Did they care that you could download massive level expansions for the Xbox games and you couldn't for PS2?
-Did they care that Xbox games could stream data off the HDD to allow for larger worlds and store greater details on the HDD to remember the location of people and items in those worlds?
-Did the mainstream consumer care about added expenses like having to buy a crappy memory card for the PS2?
-Did the mainstream consumer care about having only 2 controller ports by default?
No! So why wouldn't you expect the core system to eventually become the default standard Xbox 360?
As someone on this message board pointed out, when the mainstream consumer picks up Madden for his core Xbox 360 console it's going to play perfectly fine on the core console, he's going to be able to log onto Xbox Live with the free silver membership and download all of his roster updates at no cost, and he's never going to see any reason why he needs a HDD. Now some of you might say "that's great, see the Xbox 360 is giving people choice and catering to everyone's needs," but you're forgetting something. That Madden gamer, he represents the majority. We the people who see value in the HDD and the potential it opens up for games and functionality of the console represent the minority. The mainstream "Madden gamer" outnumbers us 10:1 and so the HDD may just be here at launch to just lead us the faithful hardcore gamers into the next-gen with Xbox 360. Whether the HDD will be well supported by game developers over the Xbox 360's life is uncertain and completely depends upon what the mainstream gamer chooses. Just as the Duke controller was slowly phased out of the market so too may the HDD, eventually. As I pointed out before it doesn't really matter what percentage of Xbox 360 owners buy a HDD system at the launch of the console, what really matters is what percentage end up having a HDD system by the end of the generation.
The existence of the core console has created great reason for fear, uncertainty, and doubt with regards to the future of the HDD. Everyone who runs out and buys a HDD or Xbox 360 premium edition at launch should do so only with the understanding that there are no guarantees that that HDD will be well supported and regularly used by developers over the next 5 years. Judging by how the mainstream consumer chose the PS2 over the Xbox there is a very good possibilty that the core console will in fact end up as the default system for Xbox 360 owners.
Looking at PS2 vs. Xbox why wouldn't you expect the core system to become the eventual standard Xbox 360?
The 85/15 launch breakdown should give you early adopters no comfort. Remember that the original Duke controller was in 100% of the initial Xbox systems sold (100/0 breakdown) and yet the mainstream consumers chose the controller-S in the end. The controller-S became the standard Xbox controller even though the Duke was the only controller on the market for the first year. The way that MS initially distributed the system didn't influence or control what the mainstream consumer eventually chose. In a similar way the Xbox core system with wired controller and no HDD very well may become the default standard Xbox over this generation. And why wouldn't it? Since when did the mainstream consumer care about "value?" The Xbox was a better value than the PS2 and yet the mainstream chose PS2 over Xbox by a huge margin.
-Did the mainstream consumer care that the Xbox had a HDD standard and the PS2 didn't?
-Did the mainstream consumer care that the Xbox could load games much faster than the PS2?
-Did they care that you could download massive level expansions for the Xbox games and you couldn't for PS2?
-Did they care that Xbox games could stream data off the HDD to allow for larger worlds and store greater details on the HDD to remember the location of people and items in those worlds?
-Did the mainstream consumer care about added expenses like having to buy a crappy memory card for the PS2?
-Did the mainstream consumer care about having only 2 controller ports by default?
No! So why wouldn't you expect the core system to eventually become the default standard Xbox 360?
As someone on this message board pointed out, when the mainstream consumer picks up Madden for his core Xbox 360 console it's going to play perfectly fine on the core console, he's going to be able to log onto Xbox Live with the free silver membership and download all of his roster updates at no cost, and he's never going to see any reason why he needs a HDD. Now some of you might say "that's great, see the Xbox 360 is giving people choice and catering to everyone's needs," but you're forgetting something. That Madden gamer, he represents the majority. We the people who see value in the HDD and the potential it opens up for games and functionality of the console represent the minority. The mainstream "Madden gamer" outnumbers us 10:1 and so the HDD may just be here at launch to just lead us the faithful hardcore gamers into the next-gen with Xbox 360. Whether the HDD will be well supported by game developers over the Xbox 360's life is uncertain and completely depends upon what the mainstream gamer chooses. Just as the Duke controller was slowly phased out of the market so too may the HDD, eventually. As I pointed out before it doesn't really matter what percentage of Xbox 360 owners buy a HDD system at the launch of the console, what really matters is what percentage end up having a HDD system by the end of the generation.
The existence of the core console has created great reason for fear, uncertainty, and doubt with regards to the future of the HDD. Everyone who runs out and buys a HDD or Xbox 360 premium edition at launch should do so only with the understanding that there are no guarantees that that HDD will be well supported and regularly used by developers over the next 5 years. Judging by how the mainstream consumer chose the PS2 over the Xbox there is a very good possibilty that the core console will in fact end up as the default system for Xbox 360 owners.
Drinky Crow
Banned
This bears repeating.
I fail to see why I should be happy that I can 'expand' my 360 by adding a $100 WiFi adapter that Nintendo and Sony are both including out-of-the-box...
And I hate the fact that to have BC I need the HDD, but with the segmented userbase COMBINED with MS' stance that games can't require the drive, it's pretty much useless otherwise, aside from being an oversized memory card.
Oh and :lol at the people who use microtransactions as justification for still bothering with the damn HDD. "So the reason I should get the HDD is so I can spend more money on the games I already bought? Score!".
And I hate the fact that to have BC I need the HDD, but with the segmented userbase COMBINED with MS' stance that games can't require the drive, it's pretty much useless otherwise, aside from being an oversized memory card.
Oh and :lol at the people who use microtransactions as justification for still bothering with the damn HDD. "So the reason I should get the HDD is so I can spend more money on the games I already bought? Score!".
They tried to buttfuck Europeans with the price on the first Xbox launch, of course they're happy. They are used to ridiculously overpriced electronics as well. That's Microsoft they slinked out of America to announce this news -- if they'd tried this at E3 you would have heard an audience of people going "Rabble rabble rabble rabble rabble".sangreal said:
I don't know what the prices on Xbox1 accessories are in Europe, but if they are trying to get away with 33-200% price hikes on all accessories, I think Major Nelson is in for a short honeymoon there too.
That breakdown is, in all likelihood, not true. It's from a shitty fansite editorial, and has yet to be attributed to anyone in Microsoft PR. The idea that Microsoft can just regulate SKU distribution like that is insane. What happens if stores order 50% Premium and 50% Retard? Are they just going to tell major retailers to go fuck themselves and slash their orders by 35%.
I'm sure there will be incentives for retailers to help MS achieve whatever ratio they are hope for but nothing written in blood. To be honest, I think MS is going to have to work their asses off to get retailers to stock the Premium Bundle beyond the first week. Retailers must really hate multiple console SKUs by now -- I think they've gotten burned almost everytime it's been done in the past few years (and that was without gambling a $100 price hike).
This is so true. Sure, EBs and GameStops will get more Premiums than Cores, they cater to the hardcore crowd. But Wal-Mart, Best Buy, Circuit City, etc.? They'll say 'screw that' to the more expensive pack, and carry way more Cores. They sell to casual walk-ins, and the lower price point looks great in their weekly flyers.border said:
Agent Icebeezy
Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
---- said:
Wow, I don't think it could be put better than this right here. Bravo on this post
---- said:
Exactly.
Pretty much, my attitude - as a developer I am going to target my software to the market. If the market mostly doesn't have something, I won't even bother writing the code to support it - because what benefit does it grant me? Very little is what.
Why does Macintosh have so little software support compared to the PC? Because they only have like 5% of the market. Same deal here and everywhere else. If it's not supported and there is no monetary benefit - why bother?
Thanks again for doing this to us MS. You made this guy just wait. I don't need to rush into next-generation. Now I have to wait and see what Sony has to offer me.
Agent Icebeezy
Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
Ponn01 said:
I play online, I know the levels will be there to download. Ill be ready
The premium pack is funny, they basically say "well you are getting your money's worth! we've thrown in lotsa stuff!"
Just not the stuff you need. it's stealth nickel and diming. The pack ins are just their to act as decoy pack ins, the premium pack might deserve the retard pack moniker even more than the retard pack itself.
Anyway, I'm waiting a year and by then, the lineup wil most likely have stabilised and an HDD-equipped model without all the shit should have emerged by then, maybe a wired pad/HDD/communicator for cheap-ish.
Just not the stuff you need. it's stealth nickel and diming. The pack ins are just their to act as decoy pack ins, the premium pack might deserve the retard pack moniker even more than the retard pack itself.
Anyway, I'm waiting a year and by then, the lineup wil most likely have stabilised and an HDD-equipped model without all the shit should have emerged by then, maybe a wired pad/HDD/communicator for cheap-ish.