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Rewatching Star Trek DS9; still the best trek.

Slicker than your average

Slicker than your average

Banned
Every couple of years I'll rewatch this. Always amazing; even some of the weaker characters are well written and have great arcs.

I'll usually watch the pilot
Skip to season 2 episode 23? One with garack severely ill
And the the last episode of season 2 and then every episode after that.

If you haven't seen season 1 and 2 they are still good and required viewing to see the characters develop and form friendships.

Quark hands down best character in majority of TV.
 
Trunx81

Trunx81

Member
SNW is better than it has the right to be.

Never been a big fan of DS9, the stationary aspect didn’t click with me. But I was a huge TNG fan and loved the ships. Maybe that’s why. Though there are some amazing storylines.
 
dsp

dsp

Member
Slicker than your average said:
Share your crack.
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dc42763b10f4e6d6481001fb4de7e0c2e3e13cb6.gif
 
AJUMP23

AJUMP23

Parody of actual AJUMP23
Every time we have a ds9 thread I tell myself to go watch the dominion war because I missed all of that due to my area losing it in syndication.

TNG
Original
Ds9
Enterprise.

After that it doesn’t matter really
 
Paltheos

Paltheos

Member
jshackles said:
I love DS9, but I gotta say that Voyager was the better show overall. Sorry OP.
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I respect allot of opinions wrt favorite Trek. Maybe you love the variety of interesting plots of TNG, or maybe you love the overarching storylines of DS9, or maybe even the ambitious if campy stories of TOS. Sure, whatever. Voyager being a favorite from anyone who watched all the Trek shows hitherto is never one I've fully understood.

It's a show run by people leftover from TNG (plus some DS9, although it was still airing concurrently) that usually failed to live up to its premise, in part because it sometimes recycled rejected TNG scripts (and TNG was really running on steam by that last season too) and more generally because it didn't particularly care about the continuity of a stranded ship in the middle of nowhere and just styled itself too much as a second TNG.

The doctor and 7 are good characters too but the rest of the cast? Not really. Janeway's insane, Harry's wetter than a drowned blanket and even sadder that one, Chakotay would love to tell you a story about his people (whichever Native American tribe he's supposed to be from). Just to name a few. Oh, right. Neelix is awful.

The show has some good episodes too (the first stellar episode that comes to mind is the clown one), but the average is just not where it should have been.
 
jshackles

jshackles

Gentlemen, we can rebuild it. We have the capability to make the world's first enhanced store. Steam will be that store. Better than it was before.
LOL I didn't realize Voyager was so hated by Trek fans. I've rewatched it recently, and it holds up incredibly well. For reference, DS9 is my second favorite show in the series, I was kinda just giving OP some shit.

I think the reason it resonates so well with me is that it's equal parts serious and silly. DS9 is great, but can be emotionally exhausting at times especially near the end / Dominion War stuff where a lot of episodes are extremely heavy and very few are lighthearted or low stakes.

Meanwhile, I feel like Voyager has a better and more consistent balance throughout the series. One week we're watching as Kes decides to give Neelix one of her lungs as he's on his deathbed, and the next week we're tuning in as Captain Proton is taking over the holodeck. Or we're time traveling back to the 1990s to meet up with Sarah Silverman. Some episodes narratives are born from crisis, while others are really lighthearted and silly.

I'll agree that Neelix is kind of the worst (though he grows on me once Kes leaves the show), and Chakotay is... problematic in current year. I think Janeway is a good captain, and probably the one we see make the most difficult decisions in all of Trek. Harry is the "every man" who I think grows into a really likable character. Same with Paris, he starts off a scoundrel, but we see his character develop eventually into a husband and father.

The show has excellent overarching ideas about themes of isolationism, coping with reality, hope, and overcoming long odds with teamwork. It's the reason I think Voyager is the best show. That, and Jeri Ryan was way hot.
 
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Paltheos

Paltheos

Member
jshackles said:
and Chakotay is... problematic in current year.
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Just for the record, I don't dislike Chakotay for being an ethnic stereotype. I don't like him because he's boring.

Regarding the Native American background, I think Chuck of sfdebris hypothesized that the writers deliberately didn't specify a tribe so they could cram in whatever fortune cookie line or misc. doodad for him to pull out that episode that they felt like.

That, and Jeri Ryan was way hot.
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Amen, brother.
 
ReBurn

ReBurn

Gold Member
I didn't like DS9 when it first aired but I ended up binging it when it hit Netflix and I ended up loving it, warts and all. It's still my favorite Trek. I'm really liking the stories in Strange New Worlds but the supporting cast is so weak. It's hard for me to like the Ortegas character.
 
A

abercrombie

Member
DS9 also my most favorite of the Treks. The series got in to serialization of episodes and fleshed out the universe a lot. On a re-watch I was surprised by how much Klingon lore was represented in the series. Loved the characters and nuanced conflicts. So many good things about the show, it really held up over time.
 
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Trogdor1123

Trogdor1123

Member
jshackles said:
LOL I didn't realize Voyager was so hated by Trek fans. I've rewatched it recently, and it holds up incredibly well. For reference, DS9 is my second favorite show in the series, I was kinda just giving OP some shit.

I think the reason it resonates so well with me is that it's equal parts serious and silly. DS9 is great, but can be emotionally exhausting at times especially near the end / Dominion War stuff where a lot of episodes are extremely heavy and very few are lighthearted or low stakes.

Meanwhile, I feel like Voyager has a better and more consistent balance throughout the series. One week we're watching as Kes decides to give Neelix one of her lungs as he's on his deathbed, and the next week we're tuning in as Captain Proton is taking over the holodeck. Or we're time traveling back to the 1990s to meet up with Sarah Silverman. Some episodes narratives are born from crisis, while others are really lighthearted and silly.

I'll agree that Neelix is kind of the worst (though he grows on me once Kes leaves the show), and Chakotay is... problematic in current year. I think Janeway is a good captain, and probably the one we see make the most difficult decisions in all of Trek. Harry is the "every man" who I think grows into a really likable character. Same with Paris, he starts off a scoundrel, but we see his character develop eventually into a husband and father.

The show has excellent overarching ideas about themes of isolationism, coping with reality, hope, and overcoming long odds with teamwork. It's the reason I think Voyager is the best show. That, and Jeri Ryan was way hot.
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The problem with voyager is that it didn’t make sense at the start. They started with “food” issues as they didn’t have enough power for the but could still warp. So they brought Neelix on. The whole, Kes is a psychic wizard thing was just stupid too. Harry was good, Tom was awesome, chakotay was great, Jane was ok but they started out with an Iron Lady approach which they ruined later. 7 of 9 was incredible, Jeri Ryan wins everything.

Tuvok was forgettable. The dr was good too, but kind of ruined later too
 
Xenon

Xenon

Member
willothedog said:
DS9 is just a poor B5 rip-off.
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Similar concepts and there is no doubt the writers lifted things as the shows went on but DS9 was very different from B5.

STNG is the best DS9 had its moments and I would even say a deeper cast, partly because they lifted some from NG. But Trek at its heart is exploration and episodic storytelling. DS9 became a serial show in the end. This got much worse after voyager. It's one of the reasons why i'm not a fan of Enterprise.
 
Darkmakaimura

Darkmakaimura

Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
I love Deep Space Nine and I love Voyager. The Next Generation is probably the best Star Trek. I even really love Enterprise. Captain Archer is one of my personal favorites.

This is going to sound like heresy but my least favorite is the original series. I just find it too campy and outdated but I love the movies based off the original series and the characters.
 
ResurrectedContrarian

ResurrectedContrarian

Suffers with mild autism
TNG is top, a beautifully handled series with very few poor episodes after S2.

DS9 is wonderful, the end of an era for me. It's much more uneven than TNG, and frankly is at least 50% forgettable or even embarrassing episodes, but the highlights are worth it. The worst parts are things like the groan-inducing romance between Odo and Kira where he follows her around like a sad puppy, totally ruining the interesting and unique character they started with, who at first had a priest-like commitment to law and order that made him strikingly different from the rest of the humanoid crew.

Voyager... no thanks, I hate every single character. But the nicest thing I can say is that at least it was Star Trek in some sense.

There was no Star Trek after Voyager, it fully died.
 
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Paltheos

Paltheos

Member
ResurrectedContrarian said:
TNG is top, a beautifully handled series with very few poor episodes after S2.

DS9 is wonderful, the end of an era for me. It's much more uneven than TNG, and frankly is at least 50% forgettable or even embarrassing episodes, but the highlights are worth it. The worst parts are things like the groan-inducing romance between Odo and Kira where he follows her around like a sad puppy, totally ruining the interesting and unique character they started with, who at first had a priest-like commitment to law and order that made him strikingly different from the rest of the humanoid crew.

Voyager... no thanks, I hate every single character. But the nicest thing I can say is that at least it was Star Trek in some sense.

There was no Star Trek after Voyager, it fully died.
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I mostly agree, although I'd describe TNG more as peaking in seasons 3-5 before slowly declining to the end (season 7 is not very good). DS9 is so uneven - it's unbelievable how you can watch a fantastic episode and the very next one can be utter dogshit. I think the consistency gets a little better later in the run but those early seasons are a coin toss. It's a big reason why I put it below TNG (although there are other reasons). Season 1 DS9 might also be worse than season 1 TNG, somehow, but it also has "Duet", one of the best episodes of Trek period, and "Emissary", which is actually a good series premiere.

Voyager hate goes a bit far - there are some good episodes and characters (7's story can be good, even if Voyager ruined the Borg in every other way, and the Doctor is just... fantastic). If anything deserves absolute vitriol, it's Enterprise. Voyager may be 2nd or 3rd rate most of the time, but Enterprise is just a shambling corpse of the contemporary Trek production. I'm not sure there's a single episode in its entire run that I loved, and most of the time I spent watching it was snarking at how awful everything was.
 
Ownage

Ownage

Member
Even though it may not be 100% canon, it's based 100% on canon - check out Star Trek Online, the ftp loot boxes game. It was fantastic to see DS9 and Voyager campaigns. It'd be cool if Enterprise would get into it - they got a raw deal.
 
Pallas

Pallas

Member
Loved the dominion arc in DS9, I enjoyed the series as a whole more than TNG, I’ve watched Voyager but hadn’t finished it, it’s pretty interesting too.

Dax is probably my favorite character and Gul Dukat was a pretty great antagonist.
 
K

Kraz

Banned
Voyager is the most rewatchable. It's the ship I would like to serve on the most. I would try to share Mortimer Harren's station with the little window on the lower decks and Tom Morello from Rage Against the Machine.
Then TOS
I'm really liking Strange New Worlds. The sets and design too.
Lower Decks
DS9 some cool scenes and eps, but mostly stick to clips for those buzz. Found it too slow and don't like Bajorans all that much.
I didn't ever really click with TNG, not that I hated it, but just never really like it. Although it was at a time I didn't watch much tv.

The rest I haven't really watched much of than one season. Discovery was repulsive.
 
ManaByte

ManaByte

Member
Hudo said:
Neither Voyager nor DS9 are "the best Trek" when Next Generation exists. Simple as.
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The first two seasons of TNG aren't that good. There are a handful of decent episodes. The show didn't find its footing and come out from under TOS' shadow until Yesterday's Enterprise in S3 and then the big S3 cliffhanger with BOBW.
 
Hudo

Hudo

Member
ManaByte said:
The first two seasons of TNG aren't that good. There are a handful of decent episodes. The show didn't find its footing and come out from under TOS' shadow until Yesterday's Enterprise in S3 and then the big S3 cliffhanger with BOBW.
Click to expand...
I agree taht the first two seasons aren't that good. But I still think TNG is the best Trek.
 
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D

Deleted member 1159

Unconfirmed Member
If you were 11 years old and Sisko fuckin punches Q, and launches a thousand torpedoes at the Klingons and mines the wormhole…Janeway? Get outta here. 7 was hot tho…
 
D

Deleted member 1159

Unconfirmed Member
So let’s actually have a fight here: Wrath of Khan vs Undiscovered Country lets gooooo
 
Oberstein

Oberstein

Member
Uh... what happened?

When did Voyager become the best ST? A few years ago, no one would have dared say that.

Between the Kazons who are bad copies of the Klingons, Janeway who literally does shit in the Delta quadrant and should go straight to a cell back in Starfleet, Harry Kim who doesn't grow and remains an ensign in 7 seasons, Janeway and Paris who become fish at warp 10 and go back to normal without a hitch, ... need I go on?

Ok, thankfully there's the Doctor and Seven, who isn't just a bimbo, give good moments, but there are a lot of episodes that are pretty boring to watch today.

By contrast, take Jem'Hadar... apart from one crappy episode, they're marvels to watch again. The Hippocratic Oath, Rocks and Shoals, By Inferno's Light, and so on and so forth. Every time, it was incredible.

We also talk a lot about "In the Pale Moonlight", but "Inter Arma Silent Leges" is an extraordinary episode. I'm not sure you'll find anything like it in VOY.

I'm not saying that VOY is rotten from A to Z, but the two series aren't in the same league.
 
Lord Panda

Lord Panda

The Sea is Always Right
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