Support NeoGAF

[Deleted member 30609]

well, I'll give you that. but Jones never really needed to emote to that level.

Jones also has the advantage of being much more human-like in proportion, meaning that the scenes where he interacted with actual people seemed more convincing to me.

granted, the scene where

Spoiler

Neytiri (spelling?) held Jake at the end absolutely blew me away. Whereas the earlier scenes with Grace (that was her name, the female scientist? I'm blanking on it) weren't as convincing, to me.

Still, you know, it's splitting hairs. Avatar looked amazing ( <-- understatement).

 

[Zeliard]

I don't know, I think Davy Jones might still be number one for me. You need to watch those movies again. On the whole, Avatar has much, much better CG, but Jones as a singular is still absolutely phenomenal.

Davy Jones and even the District 9 prawns benefit greatly from their films using a small color palette and them having completely alien faces that ultimately have a very small range of emotions, relatively-speaking. The District 9 aliens are hugely impressive for their cost, and they might be the "pound-for-pound" CGI king right now when you take that into account, but they still on the whole aren't anywhere near as impressive to me as something like Neytiri.

They also do considerably more in general on the Avatar CGI characters with time-of-day lighting effects and other things like glistening, wet skin after a jump in water, or juices flowing down Jake's face when he bites into some exotic Pandoran fruit, or the checkered shadowing when Jake and Neytiri are enveloped in those woven hammocks. And so on. There's just a lot more going on with the CGI in Avatar, which should be expected as they're using far more advanced technology.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I don't see how someone can say Davy Jones is less realistic.

I think at this point it's more about what the script and the actor. It's no longer about CG realism.

I don't think he looks "less real", but...well, let me put it this way. Watching him, I thought, Jesus these effects are incredible. Watching Avatar, I thought, wow this is an incredible performance by Zoe. Wait, that's CG?

 

[Combine]

The fight scene early on in the morning with the torch in the dark from a visual perspective has absolutely stunning. I couldn't believe how good it looked.

So true man, the lighting is simply phenomenal, and that's excluding everything else. Seriously, there are so many awe-inspiring jaw-dropping moments in this movie. And of course

Spoiler

when Neytiri jumped in out of the shadows. WOW

Also regarding Neytiri

Spoiler

another scene where she was incredible was the morning after (hehe), when she was trying desperately to wake Jake up and started dragging him away from the incoming bulldozers. That was incredibly believable. So many times I completely forgot these were entirely CG characters. Simply amazing.

 

[ToxicAdam]

You know a great piece of CG? Was when they show Sully wheeling himself into a room with his emaciated legs showing. I sat there for the entire shot trying to figure out how the hell they did it. It wasn't until I got home when I could look it up that I learned it was CG.

 

[Zeliard]

The legs were prosthetics, weren't they?

Please tell me they were, because I stared at them closely in my second viewing, and they looked fucking real.

Avatar's CGI is ridiculous but there's no way. And even for prosthetics they're hugely impressive.

 

[TacticalFox88]

How the hell did Cameron convince the CGI team to

Spoiler

render out the entire final battle. Holy fuck, that must've taken months if not years to complete with Pandora in the background and all the other CG effects going on.There were dozens of Scorpions and a Dragon, and there were HUNDREDS of Banshees fully rendered out and not simply pasted.

 

[Justinian]

How the hell did Cameron convince the CGI team to

Spoiler

render out the entire final battle. Holy fuck, that must've taken months if not years to complete with Pandora in the background and all the other CG effects going on.There were dozens of Scorpions and a Dragon, and there were HUNDREDS of Banshees fully rendered out and not simply pasted.

Magic. Or the Force.

 

[Zeliard]

How the hell did Cameron convince the CGI team to

Spoiler

render out the entire final battle. Holy fuck, that must've taken months if not years to complete with Pandora in the background and all the other CG effects going on.There were dozens of Scorpions and a Dragon, and there were HUNDREDS of Banshees fully rendered out and not simply pasted.

And everything was crystal-clear, too.

 

[evilpigking]

Just saw it. Pretty damn good. There was no real moments in the film when I felt like it was dragging. The story was fairly simple in my opinion but that is in no way a negative because they aced it.

The world and the lighting especially were amazing. My only criticism is that the foreshadowing is really obvious for many events.

 

[Ether_Snake]

I don't think he looks "less real", but...well, let me put it this way. Watching him, I thought, Jesus these effects are incredible. Watching Avatar, I thought, wow this is an incredible performance by Zoe. Wait, that's CG?

Yeah but that's because Jones is a pirate with an octopus for a head, it was a caricature of sorts. Neytiri is supposed to be a convincing alien creature. Jones is a cursed/transformed pirate.

I think realism-wise, Pirates was pretty much as realistic as Avatar. What makes Avatar incredible is the overall package. It doesn't start and end with the characters, the whole world around them is there to keep you constantly in that "wow, awesome CG" mindset until you no longer think about the CG. In pirates, you aren't exposed to a continuous CG environment and characters enough so to forget about the CG completely. It comes and goes.

EDIT: BTW I'm guessing if they make a sequel, there will be a third party involved (another alien race), forcing the Navis and the humans to work together against them or something. That or some cataclysm. I don't know I can't imagine a sequel where it's just more war/survival with humans VS Navis.

 

[Dead]

Question

How many of you who that were down on the Na'vi designs have changed your minds after seeing the movie?

 

[Deleted member 30609]

the scene where Jake was visiting all the other clans, with the open-plains and the coast?

OH MY GOD MY EYES SO BEAUTIFUL

Question

How many of you who that were down on the Na'vi designs have changed your minds after seeing the movie?

They work. I was very down on them prior to seeing the movie (I was a total skeptic), but after seeing the movie, after the first half-hour or so, I was totally along for the ride. It's a non-issue, they work really well.

 

[Justinian]

The world and the lighting especially were amazing. My only criticism is that the foreshadowing is really obvious for many events.

I think this is the reason most people said they enjoyed it more the second time. The foreshadowing isn't an issue.

 

[Combine]

Question

How many of you who that were down on the Na'vi designs have changed your minds after seeing the movie?

I was not "down", but I was not sold either. After the movie, I wasn't just sold, I wanted to buy them all up!

 

[Zeliard]

Question

How many of you who that were down on the Na'vi designs have changed your minds after seeing the movie?

Film Critic David Edelstein is one who was converted during the process of watching the movie:

The Na’vi are blue and ten feet tall and have long waists, reptilian tails, wide golden eyes, and wider noses. At first I found them an eyesore … but then about halfway through, the humans’ features began to seem puny and pallid, and by the end I was thinking Neytiri was kind of a dish if you’re into Amazonians. Jake feels the same way.

Neytiri, seducing non-believers one person at a time. Behold the power of Zoe Saldana, and a crackerjack CGI team.

 

[TacticalFox88]

Question

How many of you who that were down on the Na'vi designs have changed your minds after seeing the movie?

I was indifferent before I saw it, but then I was like OMFG this is so awesome. Dammit I want a novel and a proper Video Game adaptation.

 

[Ether_Snake]

I was indifferent before I saw it, but then I was like OMFG this is so awesome. Dammit I want a novel and a proper Video Game adaptation.

James Cameron is making the novel. For the game adaption, originally he wanted to make an MMO.

 

[TacticalFox88]

James Cameron is making the novel. For the game adaption, originally he wanted to make an MMO.

An MMO? Hell no. Fuck that. AVATAR game with Uncharted's style mixed in with the movie's set pieces would be GOTF.

 

[Loxley]

James Cameron is making the novel. For the game adaption, originally he wanted to make an MMO.

God dammit I was thinking this exact thing, a free-to-play tie-in MMO with a couple micro-transactions (buy a flashier looking banshee?) would have been perfect*. What's more, after having seen the movie now, I would totally have dove into that for while, being an MMO player.

*Edit: "perfect" referring to the whole correlation between the film and an MMO "avatar", if that wasn't already obvious.

Anyway, hot damn this just might be my favorite movie this year. What a way to cap off the decade. Much like The Matrix ended the 90's with a big "Let's see you do better than this", I feel Avatar is doing that exact thing for 2010-1019

I'll admit I was one of the (many) doubtful people about this move, but man, after having seen it in 3D, consider my mind = blown. Cameron you genius you.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Yeah but that's because Jones is a pirate with an octopus for a head, it was a caricature of sorts. Neytiri is supposed to be a convincing alien creature. Jones is a cursed/transformed pirate.

Nah, that's not what I'm saying at all. Neytiri was a ten foot tall blue cat-woman.

My point was, with Jones I thought it was a convincing effect. With Neytiri I though the effects became transparent and the performance just came through. Jones didn't quite get over the hump, for me. I can't put my finger on why, except to describe how I responded emotionally to the performance. I was never aware of the effects involved with Neytiri. I was with Jones, and it had nothing to do with character design.

Question

How many of you who that were down on the Na'vi designs have changed your minds after seeing the movie?

I was ripping on the design constantly before seeing it. No issues after. Crow has been served and munched, thank you very much.

 

[Zeliard]

After watching the movie twice it's difficult to imagine how someone could have screwed up a video game version of this. I mean my god, the movie itself basically sets everything up for you. Two very different sides in conflict, a huge, gorgeous, unique environment, awesome mounts and mechs, crazy ass alien monsters roaming around and even the entire final battle - all of that is already in the movie. How do you fuck that up, Ubisoft?

 

[hoos30]

Question: my wife wears glasses. I have a contact lens in my left eye. How is 3D going to work for us? Anyone else with vision issues seen Avatar? How do the 3D glasses work with regular glasses?

You put the glasses over the glasses. It's a dark theatre; no one can see that you look ridiculous.

 

[TacticalFox88]

After watching the movie twice it's difficult to imagine how someone could have screwed up a video game version of this. I mean my god, the movie itself basically sets everything up for you. Two very different sides in conflict, a huge, gorgeous, unique environment, awesome mounts and mechs, crazy ass alien monsters roaming around and even the entire final battle - all of that is already in the movie. How do you fuck that up, Ubisoft?

There's your answer. In a perfect world, ND would make a Avatar game. But alas we do not.

 

[Dead]

I wasnt a total fan of the designs either, but I definitely have no problems with them after seeing the movie

Jakes look in the final battle is actually kind of badass I thought :lol

 

[jett]

Okay bitches, I gathered some courage tonight and went to watch Avatar again, only this time in Dolby3D, because, hell, I'm a believer of second chances.

James Cameron has done two pretty amazing things in less than a week. First he made me a believer of 3D and now he has made me like Dolby3D. Or at least not hate it. I didn't get any headaches with Avatar, I had zero issues with the picture quality. The 3Dness was just as good as RealD, maybe Dolby has a little more "pop-out", but just slightly. But more importantly, the color reproduction was much better in Dolby, and I think the image looked sharper as well. So yeah, it truly depends on the movie. The only negative thing is the same as always, those damned glasses. They just aren't instantly comfortable(although you do get grown accustomed them), and the spectacles are too small to cover your entire field of view, meaning that you always see the crap black frame around the outer part of your eyes. But again, James Cameron does the impossible, and you will still lose yourself in Pandora and forget about the glasses.

I think I loved Avatar even more the second time around, I didn't have any preconceptions about the movie and was just able to enjoy the ride fully. I wants my extended blu-ray edition NAO. One thing I didn't notice before is that every single screen and photograph in the movie has 3D depth. Cameron really believes in this shit.

p.s. Brimstone, between 2K/48fps and 4k/24fps I'll go with my man JC and take the first option.

 

[Zeliard]

I wasnt a total fan of the designs either, but I definitely have no problems with them after seeing the movie

Jakes look in the final battle is actually kind of badass I thought :lol

He does look badass with the war paint on.

They also got the right actor to portray him - Worthington's got that kinda battle cry voice that fits perfectly. Someone with a softer voice, like Hayden Christensen (gah!), would have messed the part of Avatar Jake up pretty badly.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Nah, that's not what I'm saying at all. Neytiri was a ten foot tall blue cat-woman.

My point was, with Jones I thought it was a convincing effect. With Neytiri I though the effects became transparent and the performance just came through. Jones didn't quite get over the hump, for me. I can't put my finger on why, except to describe how I responded emotionally to the performance. I was never aware of the effects involved with Neytiri. I was with Jones, and it had nothing to do with character design.

It has to do with the fact that it was a pirate, with an octopus head, going harrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr matey. He's a living caricature. You're just not conscious of exactly what wasn't as convincing, but it was certainly not the realism. A 10 foot tall blue cat-alien can be more convincing, she's an alien, she can look like that. A pirate doesn't have an octopus for a head. Pirates, in your mind, aren't supposed to look like that. Nothing should in fact.

I mean watch this, realism-wise it's perfect: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtILnnS54EM&feature=related

The one thing that didn't work quite well for me with Jones is that his voice was not even slightly transformed, so it didn't quite match with the bulky look of the character. Also the lack of nostrils.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I wasnt a total fan of the designs either, but I definitely have no problems with them after seeing the movie

Jakes look in the final battle is actually kind of badass I thought :lol

The blue chick was pretty awesome in war paint, too.

It has to do with the fact that it was a pirate, with an octopus head, going harrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr matey.

I am not describing your reasons, or your reaction. I am describing mine, and that is not it. Get this in yur hed.

A squid head going harrrrrrrrrrrr is not any more or less fantastical than a ten foot tall, alien blue cat-woman going hisssssssssssssss over her mates body. Not to my mind.

You don't understand what I'm saying, which may be my fault for not communicating it properly.

But as a performance, I found Neytiri so convincing that the CG became so transparent that all I saw was the performance of the actor. That was not the case for Davey Jones. Mind you, he looks awesome. And I loved the Pirates movies more than most on GAF. But Neytiri unquestionably raised the bar on what a CG character could be. For me.

 

[DMczaf]

Pfft, they all don't hold a candle to Michelle Rodriguez in blue eye shadow....er war paint

 

[MetalAlien]

They probably smell funny. Can't wait until the technology gets here to convey that!

 

[Zeliard]

I also feel dumb for saying this but I didn't quite make the Avatar = Na'vi-human hybrid connection until the second time I saw the movie. I didn't think they were completely Na'vi or anything - I just never really thought about it at all the first time around.

In the second viewing I started to really notice the specific differences between the Na'vi and Avatars, like how the Avatars have 5 fingers instead of 4, as well as much smaller eyes and faces.

 

[fallengorn]

Just got back from watching in IMAX. Wasn't a fan of the Pocahontas storyline going in, but I got drawn in and didn't mind it at all. The effects were amazing. There was one moment I noted as looked "exceptionally real," which thinking about it now, detracted from the overall experience since I was pretty into the film for most of the time.

 

[LeMaximilian]

I'm nominating the shot where Jake leads the Sea Tribe down the cliff facing riding Banshees with the waves crashing against the rocks as...the single most impressive digital shot ever.

 

[Dartastic]

I'm going to go see it at the Metreon IMAX 3D screen soon. My eyes haven't liked 3d movies in the past, and I really, really hope that they don't mind this. =(

 

[Dead]

I'm nominating the shot where Jake leads the Sea Tribe down the cliff facing riding Banshees with the waves crashing against the rocks as...the single most impressive digital shot ever.

Yeah, insane as it is 100% CG yet is 100% photo-real

 

[GhaleonEB]

I also feel dumb for saying this but I didn't quite make the Avatar = Na'vi-human hybrid connection until the second time I saw the movie. I didn't think they were completely Na'vi or anything - I just never really thought about it at all the first time around.

In the second viewing I started to really notice the specific differences between the Na'vi and Avatars, like how the Avatars have 5 fingers instead of 4, as well as much smaller eyes and faces.

Yeah, their feet are different as well. Lots of small differences.

 

[Loxley]

I'm nominating the shot where Jake leads the Sea Tribe down the cliff facing riding Banshees with the waves crashing against the rocks as...the single most impressive digital shot ever.

Not since King Kong beating the shit out of a bunch of T-Rex's has my face looked like this...



...while watching a 100% digital shot. I was completely in awe during that entire final battle, but that scene in particular definitely sticks out.

 

[Justinian]

Yeah, their feet are different as well. Lots of small differences.

Not to mention Grace's avatar is the most human looking of all probably because it was an earlier creation.

 

[koam]

HOT FUCKING SEX.

Cameron, I never should have doubted you.

 

[Dead]

An interview with Cameron about the VFX

http://www.awn.com/articles/3d/cameron-geeks-out-avatar/page/4,1

Also, about an extended cut, an interesting tidbit:

BD: What plans to you have for an extended director's cut for the Blu-ray/DVD?

JC: It's in discussion. I haven't figured out exactly how I'm gonna approach it yet. We might do something where we create an interactive DVD that's got a pathway so you could watch the movie the way it was released or watch it with other scenes in it or maybe do your own version with more of this or less of that.

 

[Justinian]

BD: What plans to you have for an extended director's cut for the Blu-ray/DVD?

JC: It's in discussion. I haven't figured out exactly how I'm gonna approach it yet. We might do something where we create an interactive DVD that's got a pathway so you could watch the movie the way it was released or watch it with other scenes in it or maybe do your own version with more of this or less of that.

OMG YES. THIS is forward thinking. Is it actually possible though?

That said, I do think the theatrical version is the definitive one in Cameron's books if he is willing to say this.

 

[Dead]

OMG YES. THIS is forward thinking. Is it actually possible though?

That said, I do think the theatrical version is the definitive one in Cameron's books if he is willing to say this.

Through seamless branching, it is definitely possible.

 

[MDSLKTR]

Don't do drugs when watching this movie... Holy fuck.

 

[Justinian]

Don't do drugs when watching this movie... Holy fuck.

Still waiting for julls to come in and enlighten us with his experience :lol .

 

[Yamauchi]

Watched it yesterday.

Simple thoughts: It's the most beautiful thing I've ever seen on screen. I can't even put into words my feelings about the CG. Let's just say that I often looked at the backgrounds searching for flaws, but there was never a moment that I thought they didn't look photorealistic. The characters were great, too, with the exception of the scientist chick's avatar. What it really felt like was a damn good videogame.

The story was good but very cliche.

Spoiler

Hey, a world called Pandora with a world-spanning biological system that absorbs memories and can control wildlife? Sounds like... the Destination: Void series by Frank Herbert. And yeah, I knew Jake was going to become a Navi within the first 10 minutes, but I didn't know how.

All in all, though, it gets an "A" from me. Waiting for the sequels now.

 

[Dead]

BTW I really hope the Blu-Ray will be 1.78:1 and that they don't pull some bullshit where only the future 3D edition will have that AR while the first edition will have the Scoped AR

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

just watched the charlie rose interview and Cameron said the movie was about 30 minutes longer before they edited it. Pleeeeeeasssee let that be the extended cut

 

[Dead]

just watched the charlie rose interview and Cameron said the movie was about 30 minutes longer before they edited it. Pleeeeeeasssee let that be the extended cut

Is it online?

 

[Loxley]

For those who didn't see it, Sam Worthington was on Conan last Friday (it may or may not have been posted in here already).

I have to say, he seems like a really cool guy (and visibly nervous). I do like his answer when Conan asked him how he beat out all these big well-known stars for the role of Jake; "I'm cheap". And according to Wikipedia, that's actually true. Cameron wanted an unnown actor "to keep costs down" :lol

Well, it worked out in spades. I thought Worthington was perfect.