poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
Yeah I did think that part was kinda weak, I wasn't really sure if that was intentional though.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
I_D
Member
I wasn't expecting Twin Peaks to suddenly appear up in the middle of the show. That diner episode was some of the best content I've ever seen on Netflix.
The rest of the show is pretty average, otherwise. The acting is alright, the CGI is passable, the soundtrack does its job, etc.
The show is pretty much what I expect from AAA Netflix shows, which is to say 'watchable, but not memorable.'
The rest of the show is pretty average, otherwise. The acting is alright, the CGI is passable, the soundtrack does its job, etc.
The show is pretty much what I expect from AAA Netflix shows, which is to say 'watchable, but not memorable.'
Fbh
Member
Finally watched the first episode. Thought it was a pretty solid adaptation so far.
The visual style is pretty damn ugly though. Who thought letterboxing AND stretching the image was a good idea.
"Yes I'd like for it to look as if I was stretching the image to fit my whole screen....but also I want it to not fit my whole screen. Worst of both worlds, that's what I like"
The visual style is pretty damn ugly though. Who thought letterboxing AND stretching the image was a good idea.
"Yes I'd like for it to look as if I was stretching the image to fit my whole screen....but also I want it to not fit my whole screen. Worst of both worlds, that's what I like"
The Wheel of Fortune
Member
I love the way they adapted the Diner part. Lovely stuff! That episode in particular was definitely some of the best TV content I've watched in years.
I liked the way they made the villain seem more purposeful in his own mad way vs the unhinged psychopath we all saw in the comics, even if it meant the brutality ended up being scaled down quite a bit. I'm also loving the casting so far (except for the Lucien --> Lucienne swap, although I'm over that now); all of the actors were fantastic in the diner scene. Finally some good content from Netflix, fucking hell.
I liked the way they made the villain seem more purposeful in his own mad way vs the unhinged psychopath we all saw in the comics, even if it meant the brutality ended up being scaled down quite a bit. I'm also loving the casting so far (except for the Lucien --> Lucienne swap, although I'm over that now); all of the actors were fantastic in the diner scene. Finally some good content from Netflix, fucking hell.
slade
Member
Watched up to episode nine. The last two episodes have been a bit of a slog after the really strong opening episodes.
The only other criticism, I'll level at this show is that DC really needs to sort out all of the bullshit they pull with character's they own. Characters should be able to appear in multiple properties. I don't care that they want to use John Constantine for Justice League Dark or whatever other stinker they want to make. That shouldn't keep him from being used in this show.
The only other criticism, I'll level at this show is that DC really needs to sort out all of the bullshit they pull with character's they own. Characters should be able to appear in multiple properties. I don't care that they want to use John Constantine for Justice League Dark or whatever other stinker they want to make. That shouldn't keep him from being used in this show.
FunkMiller
Member
The fa t they’ve stripped out all mention of DC really undermines a lot of the context of The Sandman‘s stories. A massive shame, but par for the fucking course with the morons at WB.
Alx
Member
I don't really miss the links to the DC universe, most of them felt like cameos that weren't that important to the general story (Martian Manhunter, Etrigan, Element Girl,...). If anything it was jarring to see characters with colorful super-hero costumes in a darker fantasy/realistic world. Constantine is the only one that felt at his place there.
Last edited:
ManaByte
Member
If they have plans for a character elsewhere (like Constantine with JJ Abrams) they won't let it be used by someone else. Hamada was fucking pissed that Kilar allowed Martian Manhunter in ZSJL, as they had plans for him AND Darkseid (New Gods) but HBO Max releasing that killed those projects.
Marvel does the same thing. There were apparently a lot of Marvel characters they wanted to put into She-Hulk, but they were shot down as there were other plans for them.
Fools idol
Banned
watched first 2 episodes and gave up. Load of shite. The audience this is aimed at is not me. /old
ManaByte
Member
It's an adaptation (pretty faithful too) of a 33 year old comic.
Last edited:
LaughingStock
Member
I think it's a pretty average adaptation. Morpheus is a whiny cunt. He looks like he's about to break down in tears anytime. He has no authority. Mathew constantly disobeys him.
I hate what they did to Lucien and to John Constantine. That impostor stole John's origin story. John is a known character. They should have used him or created a new character.
Briennifer wasn't as bad as I'd assumed. But I didn't like how they changed to confrontation with choronzon. The oldest game is more about how you react to what is being said. You can't hesitate. Morpheus wins in the comics because choronzon is caught by surprise and doesn't know what to answer and hesitates. In the show, Morpheus sits on his ass for 5 minutes before saying something. My wife looked at me and said "Hope? That makes no sense".
The diner episode was meh. Suddenly everyone was gay. The guy that played John D was great though.
There is a fan-made adaptation of the diner episode that is very low-budget but more faithful.
Episode 6 was almost word for word faithful to the source material. And I have to admit I liked Death.
I hate what they did to Lucien and to John Constantine. That impostor stole John's origin story. John is a known character. They should have used him or created a new character.
Briennifer wasn't as bad as I'd assumed. But I didn't like how they changed to confrontation with choronzon. The oldest game is more about how you react to what is being said. You can't hesitate. Morpheus wins in the comics because choronzon is caught by surprise and doesn't know what to answer and hesitates. In the show, Morpheus sits on his ass for 5 minutes before saying something. My wife looked at me and said "Hope? That makes no sense".
The diner episode was meh. Suddenly everyone was gay. The guy that played John D was great though.
There is a fan-made adaptation of the diner episode that is very low-budget but more faithful.
Episode 6 was almost word for word faithful to the source material. And I have to admit I liked Death.
Last edited:
Insane Metal
Member
The dude playing the Sandman is spot on.
Fbh
Member
4 Episodes in and I'm still enjoying it.
I like the style and how different each episode feels (read the comic but many years ago so it wasn't as fresh anymore). Pretty good performances too.
My only 2 issues so far is that while the dude playing Sandman is doing a good job with the acting, I think they could have made more to give him that sort of "otherworldly" look he has in the comic (also not sure why he teary eyes all the time). Here he really just looks like an emo dude.
And the visual style is still absolutely horrible, I really don't get it. The episode in Hell had some cool VFX shot but it's ruined by the muddy, blurry and stretched image that looks like this was one of those pirated movies that got recorded with a camera in the movie theater.
I like the style and how different each episode feels (read the comic but many years ago so it wasn't as fresh anymore). Pretty good performances too.
My only 2 issues so far is that while the dude playing Sandman is doing a good job with the acting, I think they could have made more to give him that sort of "otherworldly" look he has in the comic (also not sure why he teary eyes all the time). Here he really just looks like an emo dude.
And the visual style is still absolutely horrible, I really don't get it. The episode in Hell had some cool VFX shot but it's ruined by the muddy, blurry and stretched image that looks like this was one of those pirated movies that got recorded with a camera in the movie theater.
Last edited:
Razorback
Member
The episode with the immortal guy was great. I thought that would be the start of a new story arc and was disappointed to find out it was only a one-off. There was so much to explore with that concept. First we get Death explaining how dying is a natural part of the human experience and is necessary. Even babies aren't spared from it. Then we get the story of a guy who clearly is loving the hell out of his immortality, disproving the idea that we need death to enjoy life or give it meaning. I thought the Endless where going to have to deal with that and wonder if they've been killing everyone for eons for no good reason.
Oh well. I also enjoyed the first story with the guy with the ruby. I thought the concept of people going through a revolution after becoming perfectly honest was really cool, but I didn't understand why they started mutilating themselves. Seems like they want to force the idea that the guy is a villain and don't want to deal with the consequences that perhaps his philosophy is right. The story with the Vortex I didn't care for so much. And yes the show is gay as hell to the point that it makes you wonder if it's thematically relevant to the narrative, but it doesn't really seem to be.
Oh well. I also enjoyed the first story with the guy with the ruby. I thought the concept of people going through a revolution after becoming perfectly honest was really cool, but I didn't understand why they started mutilating themselves. Seems like they want to force the idea that the guy is a villain and don't want to deal with the consequences that perhaps his philosophy is right. The story with the Vortex I didn't care for so much. And yes the show is gay as hell to the point that it makes you wonder if it's thematically relevant to the narrative, but it doesn't really seem to be.
Last edited:
Wildebeest
Member
The episode with the immortal and death were the closest to the comic book.
Out of curiosity, what do you think the themes of the show are, from the perspective of a newcomer?
Razorback
Member
Well my main takeaway is something that's actually said by the characters in the show. It's about these super powerful characters realizing that they actually exist to serve mankind and not rule over it. It's humanity that gives them power and the reason they even exist in the first place, because we believe in them.
DKehoe
Gold Member
I took it to more be about Death talking to Dream about how important she thinks it is to feel a connection with humanity and then we see Dream learning from a human what it means to him to be alive and the two develop a friendship. Those two parts didn't follow each other in the comic but I thought they paired up quite well.
Razorback
Member
Interesting, so by pairing those two stories together I made a connection that perhaps wasn't in the source material, and I guess unintended by the show.
Wildebeest
Member
I watched a video where people were struck by that message, but maybe didn't think about what it means. For instance, they seemed to think that the dreams and nightmares in the Dreaming were "human" and that Dream was just dumb to act imperiously to them. Sandman is something where people notice different things each time they read it. I would actually say that some other themes were put across more aggressively in the show than that one.
LaughingStock
Member
Episode 6 7
There's a suspicious lack of diversity among the evil characters. It's so on the nose.
There's a suspicious lack of diversity among the evil characters. It's so on the nose.
Last edited:
LaughingStock
Member
sankt-Antonio
:^)--?-<
Watched until episode 6/7 - what a disjointed mess of a show.
Oh he lost his tools, then he gets them, then they don’t mean jack shit. What is the point of all this again ?
I don’t mind gender swaps or representation but here it’s so needlessly on the nose.
Oh he lost his tools, then he gets them, then they don’t mean jack shit. What is the point of all this again ?
I don’t mind gender swaps or representation but here it’s so needlessly on the nose.
sol_bad
Member
But if you change Gault to a white character it's suddenly not woke writing 101?
I finished the season last night and I enjoyed it as a whole. The pacing definitely did slow down during the Rose/Vortex story. I'm not sure how they could have improved the pacing as I feel that everything we saw was needed. I really hope it gets a season 2 and does not get a budget cut.
LaughingStock
Member
If Gault was a white man he would be evil. That's the woke writing.
I had to stop watching. Morpheus toxic masculinity was on full display. He should just give the keys to Lucienne and let her run the place. She's obviously more capable.
The diner and death episodes are the only good ones. The show is woke garbage. I'm out.
NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
sol_bad
Member
You didn't answer my question. If the script was kept the exact same but Gault was played by a white actor, would it still be woke?
Vicetrailia
Banned
I liked the show, the build up, the characters, and the motivations, but all the climatic fights suck.
Last edited:
FunkMiller
Member
Gault’s not even from the comic, so it’s a poor character regardless of colour. Brute and Glob were far better antagonists in that scenario. They were unremitting bastards. Though, as they were also white, the woke moaning would have no doubt happened anyway.
FunkMiller
Member
People complaining about Sandman being too woke is rather like complaining that Lord Of The Rings has too many short people in it.
BadBurger
Many “Whelps”! Handle It!
Sorry for the late reply, I was just cruising through the thread to catch up and just noticed you quoted me. I guess your notification got lost in the storm.
But to answer your question: yes, I have been a huge Gaiman fan since I was a teen and first read his Sandman comics. The comics were already older than I was at that point in time, but it made such an impression upon me that I became a huge fan of the old Vertigo comics label as a whole. As I mentioned here or in some other thread I even read the novelization years later because I love Sandman so much. His novella "The Ocean at the End of the Lane" is one of my favorite works of modern fantasy.
So I'll respond with this: don't assume things about people just because they might have a perfectly reasonable aversion to some adaptation of material they cherish. I mean, you just made some reaching assumptions about me, even though I bet I could recite many of the most famous Sandman panels from the comics or novel verbatim. That's how many times I re-read them.
All that said/typed, and as an old fan of Gaiman, I can recognize how he changed over the years and has been retconning some of his work via adaptations (this and American Gods). People sometimes change. It's his right, he's the creator - I am more than cool with that. And yes I know he has been working with the showrunner(s). It doesn't mean I have to automatically agree with his changes just because I am a fan or because he created all of this.
It sounds hypocritical to ask, I know, but after reading what you typed I'm compelled to ask if you were actually a fan of his works prior to seeing this show and if you've actually kept up with him and the evolution of his views over the years like us real fans have. Because it doesn't sound like it. It seems to me that you're instead merely jumping in now to browbeat others - which is something I never expected to see from you frankly.
I'd be happy to be wrong about you, but those are the vibes I'm getting.
Braag
Member
I finished watching this yesterday and despite not knowing the source material all that well I liked almost everything about the series.
But as mentioned above about John Constantine, for some reason that gender swap of a well known established character annoyed me.
Wildebeest
Member
John Constantine was a character from Swamp Thing. Johanna Constantine was an original character from Sandman, they just time shifted her to double up her role. There is a theory that they couldn't use John Constantine because some awful scumbag is sitting on the screen rights for him and refuses to share.
FunkMiller
Member
Yeah. You're wrong. I read Sandman in the early 90s off the back of my love for Batman and DC. Have read a majority of his books, and even got lucky enough to meet him with Terry Pratchett at a book event about a thousand years ago.
Anyone is free to dislike whatever changes have been made to Sandman, but the complaints that those changes have only been done for ‘wokeness’ is bloody crazy if you like Gaiman’s work - particularly all the homophobic horseshit in this thread.
FunkMiller
Member
LaughingStock
Member
A dream of a thousand cats? I love that story.
Facism
Member
FunkMiller
making me use up my daily quota of fire emotes.
FunkMiller
Member
Dream of a thousand cats is pretty much purrfect (sorry).
Nice to hear McAvoy in it too, especially as he’s so good as Morpheus in the Audibble version.
Calliope remains a self indulgent piece of pretentiousness as much in live action as it is in print. Hilarious that they’ve made Madoc (the villain) really woke
Nice to hear McAvoy in it too, especially as he’s so good as Morpheus in the Audibble version.
Calliope remains a self indulgent piece of pretentiousness as much in live action as it is in print. Hilarious that they’ve made Madoc (the villain) really woke
Last edited:
LaughingStock
Member
A dream of a thousand cats was a perfect adaptation. And the animation style was sweet.
I can't for the life of me remember reading Caliope. Can't tell if it's a good adaptation. But it was a nice episode. They even made fun of wokeness.
Why can't all episodes be like this two?
I might give season two (if there is one) a chance. I like these stories and characters.
I can't for the life of me remember reading Caliope. Can't tell if it's a good adaptation. But it was a nice episode. They even made fun of wokeness.
Why can't all episodes be like this two?
I might give season two (if there is one) a chance. I like these stories and characters.
BadBurger
Many “Whelps”! Handle It!
OK, so you are a make believe fan just pretending so you can talk down to others. I once gave Gaiman a ride in my car myself. No, in fact he's my uncle who works for Nintendo.
Was fun, but welcome to the ignore list.
Last edited:
FunkMiller
Member
SkylineRKR
Member
I think diversity isn't my biggest issue, I liked this version of Constantine for example, its the fact lots of the forced sex scenes and romance add nothing to the plot except for scoring woke points. Its too on the nose. A lot of the scenes here involving Corinthian for example are just there for the sake to show off how diverse they are. I felt they were stupid. And I have the same issue with straight people scenes, remember that fucking retarded sex scene from Heavy Rain?
About the gender swapping and all. Well we all know what happens when we're going to change Blade into a white guy, or change Phoenix into a guy. Its pretty much a one way street.
About the gender swapping and all. Well we all know what happens when we're going to change Blade into a white guy, or change Phoenix into a guy. Its pretty much a one way street.
DAHGAMING
Gold Member
Just finished it, was abit slow untill about E3, but it picks up and the Diner episode is great. I slowly lost intrest when Rose came into it, stuck with it but it never picked up again for me.
I never read the comics but is there loads of gay and crossdressing characters in it ? I dont mind it normaly but it seemed over the top in this, we get the point 1 scene of cock to arse is enough and the amount of times we had to see that cunt drag queen dream done my head in.
I never read the comics but is there loads of gay and crossdressing characters in it ? I dont mind it normaly but it seemed over the top in this, we get the point 1 scene of cock to arse is enough and the amount of times we had to see that cunt drag queen dream done my head in.
lostinblue
Banned
Yes. The show is too inclusive for it not to be distracting. It's actually worse than if they toned it up a little
Everyone is gay, some in a distracting uncalled for way.