SteveWinwood
Member
so did we not see the same thing or are you just ignoring what's there
like its right there i dont know how you can miss it unless you're blind or haven't actually looked at any of this
I think I know which one it is
Skyrim Workshop Now Supports Paid Mods
- Thread starter Sendou
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like its right there i dont know how you can miss it unless you're blind or haven't actually looked at any of this
I think I know which one it is
Games aren't expected to have a high rate of failure. Unless we start expecting mod creators to the same amount of QA that goes into games.
thelatestmodel
Junior, please.
The ones that do will start to sell instead of give. That's the whole problem, it kills all the good will and makes it all about money.
Not happening.
Good will don't pay the rent.
If people want to remain hobbyists, they can still remain hobbyists. People that want to make the transition don't have, as krejlooc pointed out, constantly be rewarded for their work with more work, but instead, hamburgers.
Take responsibility and do not pay for content if you don't think the content is worth the price.
Time will tell. I expect a lot of games to launch in the future with workshop support for paid mods only.
balladofwindfishes
Member
I'm wondering why they didn't just add a donate button and make payment optional? They wouldn't have this huge mess on their hands and it would actually be a pretty nice progression in the mod scene to have officially endorsed and EULA kosher tip jars.
Hyperzephyrian
Banned
Yeah that would of made a lot more sense and people really wouldn't have gotten angry about optional donations.
Fuck, I can see this happening easily.
It all started with horse armours. I'll stick with my indie games when shit hits the fan.
Vincent Grayson
Member
Or turning the Workshop into just another fucking wasteland like the app stores on iOS and Android, where finding anything good takes a fucking miracle and huge portions of the content are blatant ripoffs with *just enough* changed to not get them booted.
They've incentivized the worst fucking behavior and ruined a perfectly good thing.
I am not opposed to allow modders to ask for/receive compensation. I'm opposed to the utterly shit way Valve and Bethesda decided to do it, and the incredible gall on both their parts re: level of support and % of the profits they'll be walking away with.
That wouldn't make any sense.
Fantastapotamus
Wrong about commas, wrong about everything
Oh noes. Valve gives Modders the option to earn some money? Shame them. Shame on you Valve. I want my mods for free, shame on you for giving people an option to get some money for things they put time and effort in. Woe is me
Hm, I'm usually a fan of a lot of things Valve tries but I'm not really behind this one.
Don't get me wrong, I love modding and all the work that modders do to improve and expand a game's life and value. I'm also not against them receiving something for their hard work and enthusiasm, either. But I don't know if this is the system I'd get behind.
There's simply too many problems for me to really support it. I think I have to echo other people that suggest a "Pay what you Want" method only instead of having the creators list their own value. For me, I can not see buying a mod. Unlike a game, I'm just not assured that there will be support for a mod nor that it will work with all the other things I add to a game. With Skyrim, I've spent weeks getting it setup, tweaking/adding/removing mods until it's stable enough to function.
And even still, the game runs worse than if I left it vanilla. Despite my efforts to try and completely get rid of the infinite load bug, it still happens--and regularly too. I've found workarounds which let me still play but had a game natively carried that bug, I would have asked for a refund and told people to avoid it for being broken. I also have occasional crashes to desktop and it's definitely mod related.
I live with these simply because I understand that injecting so much extra into the game is going to produce unstable results. But it's all free and, if I want something that is stable, I can always run a clean playthrough without having lost anything.
I don't think I can be assured of this support with mods. And even if I'm just paying, say, a dollar for one--that's still a dollar wasted if it's incompatible and I can't play my game with it.
Had this been reserved for the Nehrim's of the mod scene then maybe I would consider it--but only after the game was "finished" by the developer and I knew they wouldn't release an update that would break any purchased mods I may wish to run.
Which is unfortunate because the idea is noble even if I simply cannot support the execution.
There's this as well. There's been a few mods that I followed and used that came to a crashing halt over personal issues and modding drama. Throwing money into the mix seems like it'll only exacerbate those issues. Which is a shame because some of the best mods are large scale community created pieces.
Don't get me wrong, I love modding and all the work that modders do to improve and expand a game's life and value. I'm also not against them receiving something for their hard work and enthusiasm, either. But I don't know if this is the system I'd get behind.
There's simply too many problems for me to really support it. I think I have to echo other people that suggest a "Pay what you Want" method only instead of having the creators list their own value. For me, I can not see buying a mod. Unlike a game, I'm just not assured that there will be support for a mod nor that it will work with all the other things I add to a game. With Skyrim, I've spent weeks getting it setup, tweaking/adding/removing mods until it's stable enough to function.
And even still, the game runs worse than if I left it vanilla. Despite my efforts to try and completely get rid of the infinite load bug, it still happens--and regularly too. I've found workarounds which let me still play but had a game natively carried that bug, I would have asked for a refund and told people to avoid it for being broken. I also have occasional crashes to desktop and it's definitely mod related.
I live with these simply because I understand that injecting so much extra into the game is going to produce unstable results. But it's all free and, if I want something that is stable, I can always run a clean playthrough without having lost anything.
I don't think I can be assured of this support with mods. And even if I'm just paying, say, a dollar for one--that's still a dollar wasted if it's incompatible and I can't play my game with it.
Had this been reserved for the Nehrim's of the mod scene then maybe I would consider it--but only after the game was "finished" by the developer and I knew they wouldn't release an update that would break any purchased mods I may wish to run.
Which is unfortunate because the idea is noble even if I simply cannot support the execution.
There's this as well. There's been a few mods that I followed and used that came to a crashing halt over personal issues and modding drama. Throwing money into the mix seems like it'll only exacerbate those issues. Which is a shame because some of the best mods are large scale community created pieces.
SteveWinwood
Member
wait what's preventing a future game allow free mods off of steam
oh yea
nothing
oh yea
nothing
Valve has said multiple times that Steam will eventually just become a payment / download middleware and they don't want to be editorially involved anymore.
Their whole goal is to make it a "free for all".
Seems kind of strange to look to modding to pay the rent. Since you know for the most part mods have been free.
Bornstellar
Member
Because collaboration now means you get less of a cut. Because resource sharing means that others could be distributing something you could be making a buck off of.
This really isn't that hard. As someone who has done nothing with Skyrim (yet) other than create / test mods, this is a disaster for the ecosystem.
Juniez? Ohai.
... Please don't make your weapon pack paid-only.
Based on the reaction over the new system, I don't think the destruction of my inbox will be worth the couple hundred bux max that it'll generate (split between two, no less) + I doubt the black mesa mod's steam release will support paid mods
That seems dumb. Surely the best way to go about this is to get some groundswell, make it to v1.0, stop, leave that free forever and make a new paid branch that will still be updated.Sadly there's already several mods that I've used that're now only available as paid mods. The old version was removed from the Workshop aswell as Skyrim Nexus. :/
If someone does that, they're... Kind of cheeky cunts, in my opinion.
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
Reminder that all the good mods are on Nexus anyway and Steam Workshop was never very good to begin with.
How would this affect the NMM? I preferred to it to the other mod managers and Steam Workshop (having one mod manager for all games is nice - even if a game specific mod manager did a better job), but it isn't like I won't use anything else.
Plus, I just spent hours putting together a list of Skyrim mods and now i'm going to have to go through it again to update the links. ;_;
I've also noticed a number of modders seem to hate it because they think other modders will steal their work (or build a mod based of theirs) and charge money for the work they are doing...
Plus, I just spent hours putting together a list of Skyrim mods and now i'm going to have to go through it again to update the links. ;_;
I've also noticed a number of modders seem to hate it because they think other modders will steal their work (or build a mod based of theirs) and charge money for the work they are doing...
Bornstellar
Member
Tell that to the Skyforge weapons guy. He hasn't done anything with his mods in years but just went and took down the free versions in favor of making the same stuff paid.
This is already happening.
The latest updates to Isoku and Chesko's mods are exclusive to paid workshop.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Something tells me that the majority of the money is going to Bethesda/Zenimax, since, you know, they own the rights to the game.
I think this is a cool idea, but I am skeptical about its long term effects. A lot of mods in the past would certainly not have been nearly as successful as they were if they had cost money, even if there was an extremely easy and accessible way to pay.
I imagine we're going to see a lot of people trying to make a quick buck like we're seeing with early access, too.
It would be awesome if we got some amazing new things out of this, but I'm quite wary at the moment.
For now, yes. Anyone looking to sell on Steam Workshop is not going to make the same mod available on Nexus for free.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Something that free yesterday is now pay for. Oh noes I'm such an evil person I want modders to starve all I want is free stuff I'm a huge strawman, look at me.
Give me a break. This is exactly how Sims modding started going downhill. This entire ordeal could have been accomplished with a simple tip button, rather than making a mod that's been around since early Oblivion modding cost the same as an entire professionally made expansion pack.
For. Now.
They would also be able to trade it for something else of similar value, like a game, or straight up sell it.
Fantastapotamus
Wrong about commas, wrong about everything
Yeah, I guess that's the problem. People want free stuff. And if said free stuff suddenly isn't free anymore they freak out cause they feel like getting it for free before somehow entitles them to getting it free forever.
Don't buy it if you think it is a bad deal. Problem solved.
SteveWinwood
Member
so report them
i dont understand how this is so fucking hard
the value is constantly going down due to drops and sales
it's not like you can just get five bucks out of it again
This kind of this is precisely the difference between skyrim modding and things like hats for TF2. Hats independent creations that change the game superficially. I just don't see how it is going to enable cool mods when so much is dependent on the works of others. The store will need some form of dependency tracking (with pricing) because as soon as you start charging for this people are going to expect to do less work integrating a mod.
superseohyun
Member
so the author of FNIS posted this:
i wonder how will he react for paid mod which based on FNIS?
i wonder how will he react for paid mod which based on FNIS?
There are a lot of dumb modders out there. Or ones that don't actually give a shit.
Or plain dickish, whatever.
I do seem to recall FAMGUY mentioning something along the lines of paid cosmetics or maps? I might've been imagining things, though. Regardless, still really looking forward to your stuff.
And in the event that BM does have paid workshop support, you could always have a paid version and a free version. It'd serve as a flashier "donate" button
We're already seeing large quantities of quality mods being removed in favour of only having a paywalled version.
Yay. :/
Personally, I don't think this will be the death knell of free modding. It's simply a system that I wouldn't engage in given its current form. A number of things already are well beyond what I would ever value as a purchase. The Shadow Scale Set would be an example. It's $2.50 for a suit that you have to enable through console commands and doesn't even have a female version available. That said, I never used custom armour in the first place.
I simply am not a fan of trying to open up a mod free market for the reasons I mentioned before (support/stability/completion of features).
On the other hand, I don't have any interest in using Early Access or the like either because I don't trust the practice. I'll probably continue to mod, I'll just stick to what's free. Should some post-apocalyptic scenario arise where all mods have suddenly moved over to some sort of steam marketplace app service then I can pretty safely just not mod at all (though I doubt such a future would ever be borne as people won't stop making Elder Scroll armours and releasing them for free in order to simply share their creations with an enthusiast community).
SteveWinwood
Member
its almost like this is in the q&a released
balladofwindfishes
Member
This doesn't work either. Yea I won't buy it, but unless I send a message me not buying it is meaningless. If there's no uproar tied to not buying it than buying it is less effective.
What is the mod maker supposed to take from his mod not selling? That his mod is bad? That he didn't add enough to it? That people are opposed to mods for profit?
Don't tell people to just shut up and not buy something, that never works effectively without a message and never will work effectively without a message behind it.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, I wonder what they plan to do with this...
Mods being free is what allows them to get by with so much "re-purposing" of code and assets. I doubt Valve will be doing a thorough analysis of everything sold through the mod shop to make sure it's legit.
"Oh fuck my frame rate has gone down to 15FPS, lemme get a refund... Oh fuck it's only a Steam wallet refund. Okay never mind let me get this cool Magic Animation mod... Oh fuck it's conflicting with my files. Okay okay it's cool I'll just get this armour mod... Oh fuck it's not even finished yet!"
SteveWinwood
Member
im sure the comments will let them know dont worry
The mods will on your Steam inventory. While not tradable right now, I think they will be eventually.
Fantastapotamus
Wrong about commas, wrong about everything
I'm confident that enough people will let them know what they think. The internet is not known for restraint.
Out of curiosity though, how many times have you written a mail to a company, explaining why you didn't buy their product and if you never did that, why do you think it's necessary here?
Honestly I am willing to engage in large scale mods that offer a significant or extensive changes. But paying for all those tiny sword or armor mods piecemeal seems like a hassle to me. The pack currently offered seems a bit steep based on what it is offering.
This might encourage modders to get together and offer a large mod, but now that it isn't free inevitably you're going to get issues with attribution or not being able to use some mods with others simply because now there is a tiered system.
Yeah. I think a better way would be to just add a fee to let you enter the paid mod section.
You pay say £10 or whatever and it lets you download as many of the "premium" mods as you want. The modders then get a cut from the total by the amount based on DLs they get and based on their feedback scores.
Also, if you pay for a mod and then remove it, if you want to re-download it at a later date do you have to pay again? What I mean is does it add to your steam inventory that you've paid for something similar to DLC?
Abinash117
Member
It could open up legal issues were a mod that has a different IP gets a price tag either knowingly by modder or unknowingly when so random dude steals it and puts a price tag on it, right? I read the Q&A, but it doesn't seem that it will prevent s company from suing anyway. Also would it address the people that steal that mod that has different IP stuff, puts a price tag up, and that mod doesn't get a notice( for whatever reason) .
Netherscourge
Banned
Nevermind, I read it wrong.
Edit- typing on a phone is a PITA.
Edit- typing on a phone is a PITA.
That's actually not a bad idea, that could at least separate the junk from quality mods.
I'm sure they have a system in place so that you don't buy the same mod twice even if you unsub a mod. If that's not the case it would be a big mistake on their part.
ed: Yeah it goes to your Steam inventory I think.
SteveWinwood
Member
dmcas save them they won't get sued
yeah where'd you read that one
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
Nope, you can't cash it out.
Is this confirmed? Because that makes this way slimier. People will probably be funneling mod money into tf2 keys then selling them on reddit or whatever.
Netherscourge
Banned
Nevermind, I read it wrong.
Refunds go to your wallet.
Refunds go to your wallet.
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