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[ManaByte]

For a time, Marvel was doing great. They had a healthy Spider-Man movie franchise and the potential for a healthy X-Men franchise.

Then Daredevil, which was improved upon with the R-rated director's cut.

Then came Hulk, which some loved and others didn't.

While this was happening DC was living in their Schumacher crap-delusion and released Catwoman.

Then Elektra...it couldn't be saved.

At the same time, DC/Vertigo had Constantine which turned the tide where a DC comics movie was good and the Marvel one out at the same time was shit.

Now we have Batman Begins and a shitty Fantastic Four coming.

Tom Rothman is allowing his grudge against Bryan Singer drive the X-Men franchise into the ground faster than you can say Shumacher, and Singer is filming a love letter to Richard Donner.

Ghost Rider with Cage as Blaze? :lol

All Marvel has left is Spider-Man 3, which we know will be good because Sony hasn't been retarded as Fox and allowed Raimi to do his thing. And as shocking as it sounds, Artisan may be on the right track with Punisher 2 by setting it in New York with Jigsaw being the villain.

What can Marvel do to turn things around? Right now DC has great animated series based on their characters, and with Nolan on Batman, Singer on Superman, and Whedon on Wonder Woman they seem to have finally grown a brain with their movies.

Will Quesada need to slap someone around?

 

[hXc_thugg]

Daredevil could have been such a god movie. I will never recover from the disappointment.

 

[ManaByte]

Daredevil could have been such a god movie. I will never recover from the disappointment.

Well the director's cut is better. Less Elektra because all the stuff they added didn't have her in it and they cut out the love scene.

 

[kgHavok23]

you forgot everyone's favorite: The Punisher!

*_*


on a side-note...are they making a Flash movie? I'd like that, I always thought he was a cool character, if done correctly.

 

[Kuroyume]

Don't forget Blade 3... I haven't see that one but I've heard bad things about it...

 

[Dan]

Mana, you're slipping. I thought for sure this thread was about this article where Avi Arad lays out plans for about 3 dozen shitty Marvel movies. Somebody stop him, please.

 

[KidGalactus]

Well Mana,


First off, what we're basically seeing with Marvel's movies is the result of them burning too brightly. They've pretty much exhausted all thier 'a' material.

This will effectively do one of two things,

1) Destroy them (likely).

2) force them to handle the licenses more respectfully. Developing lower key characters with potential into new franchises (Blade) as well as adapting the guys we know and love.


Also. I don't see where Quesada's in a position to help. How is he any better than the hollywood types. He's an idiot that's running marvel's print branch into the ground, just the same treatment Avi and his goons are givin the movies. I don't care what anyone says. Comics is a niche market, so rejecting your audience while SIMOLTANEOUSLY alienating new (potential) readers is suicide.


And don't think I'm giving DC the all clear either. Batman was phenomenal and christ, I can't lie. It got me really excited for Superman, but they run the exact same risks as marvel. Rushing all the big guns to the door is a mistake. Right now aren't we looking at Bats, Supes, Wonderwoman?

Right away? This is the same thing Marvel did.


Idunno. I love the movies. All of them. Even the bad ones, I have a degree in comics and seeing these guys turn gold nuggets into dog turds hurts me deeply.


-Kid

P.S. JLU rocks!

 

[Rorschach]

How come you have to pretend to be a comics fan, Manabyte? I have no idea what the purpose of it would be. You don't have to be the king of all things geek, you know.

 

[Rlan]

The Question was so awesome in JLU. I'd love to see him pop up somewhere

 

[Hero]

I want Batman Beyond and X-Men:TAS (early 90's FOX version) on DVD.

 

[ManaByte]

How come you have to pretend to be a comics fan, Manabyte? I have no idea what the purpose of it would be. You don't have to be the king of all things geek, you know.

I stopped reading all things Marvel whe Quesada took over. I tried to get into Spidey and X-Men in 2001-2002, but it just came off as crap to sell the upcoming movies really.

I am pretty much exclusively DC now with just Bats and Supes with the occasional JLA.

 

[nomoment]

At best, Constantine was a very AVERAGE flick. Do you guys really love bad dialogue and impenetrable plots that much?

DC's got to make at least two good films in a row before they get out of the doghouse. Superman Returns is looking good, though.

 

[nomoment]

I stopped reading all things Marvel whe Quesada took over. I tried to get into Spidey and X-Men in 2001-2002, but it just came off as crap to sell the upcoming movies really.

I am pretty much exclusively DC now with just Bats and Supes with the occasional JLA.

Based on your Jason Todd comment in one of the recent comics threads, I'd really doubt you're up to snuff with anything DCU.

 

[Error]

It was about time DC turn their shit in the right direction, I don't want Marvel to do bad really they have 2 franchises that I love to death and those are Spiderman and Xmen, but now is DC time to shine.

and I agree with nomo with Constantine, average flick at best and they could have make a totally awesome movie and probably a series, because the Hellblazer graphic novels are amazing

 

[ManaByte]

It was about time DC turn their shit in the right direction, I don't want Marvel to do bad really they have 2 franchises that I love to death and those are Spiderman and Xmen, but now is DC time to shine.

and I agree with nomo with Constantine, average flick at best and they could have make a totally awesome movie and probably a series, because the Hellblazer graphic novels are amazing

Well a movie directly from Hellblazer would be boring because the comic is more thought provoking than your average comic book movie is expected to be, so the changes they did were understandable for a movie.

 

[KidGalactus]

Re: The question on JLU


Supergirl-"What, have you been going through my trash?"

The Question-"Please... I go through everyone's trash"

 

[nomoment]

Well a movie directly from Hellblazer would be boring because the comic is more thought provoking than your average comic book movie is expected to be, so the changes they did were understandable for a movie.

Again, the movie wasn't awful because it wasn't close enough to the Hellblazer comics. It was awful because of the TERRIBLE DIALOGUE, MISCAST OF THE LEAD, and a completely IMPENETRABLE PLOT. When Gabriel shows up near the end of the film (a perfect example of some of the awful, cliche dialogue), nothing has even been explained. We're left to ASSUME reasons for half of the things going on!

The only thing really going for Constantine is the film's amazing sense of atmosphere, and cool effects. That's it. DC really dropped the ball on this one.

 

[Shinobi]

DC's been punking Marvel's ass in the TV series department for 15 years now...nothing's changed there.

 

[Rorschach]

DC's been punking Marvel's ass in the TV series department for 15 years now...nothing's changed there.

Quoted for quote's sake.

DC's been punking Marvel's ass in the TV series department for 15 years now...nothing's changed there.

Batman TAS
Batman Adv
Superman Adv
Batman Beyond
Justice League
Justice League Unlimited



Man, imagine if Dini had let them sell out and made the changed Fox wanted. It's too bad about what happened to the Teen Titans, though. I think the upcoming JLU episode is probably going to be the end of the Dini/Timm DC toons. Timm can kiss my ass for EP on TT.

 

[Ash Housewares]

Again, the movie wasn't awful because it wasn't close enough to the Hellblazer comics. It was awful because of the TERRIBLE DIALOGUE, MISCAST OF THE LEAD, and a completely IMPENETRABLE PLOT. When Gabriel shows up near the end of the film (a perfect example of some of the awful, cliche dialogue), nothing has even been explained. We're left to ASSUME reasons for half of the things going on!

The only thing really going for Constantine is the film's amazing sense of atmosphere, and cool effects. That's it. DC really dropped the ball on this one.

the movie was god awful and near unwatchable, there was only one interesting scene and all the characters were incredibly dull

 

[Rlan]

Teen Titans does pretty well with itself considering the huge departure. The Action sequences are really nice. See the last 3 part episode "The End".

I will however be EXTREMELY dissapointed if Superman Returns cannot keep the action of Superman TAS or JLU. Some of those hits seem so brutal and hard, like they should be. I want pavement being torn up, I want heads being crushed, I was action that doesn't look like it's been done by wires, dammit!

 

[Cold-Steel]

Spider-Man 3 should turn out great.

The Punisher 2 will probably be better than the first one, but won't do very well in theatres (simply due to the fact that The Punisher isn't exactly 'mainstream' material).

Fantastic Four? Hit or miss at this point, but it's leaning towards miss.

 

[Seth C]

To be fair, Spider-Man may make more money than three Batman movies combined, and Superman looks pretty awful so far.

 

[Cold-Steel]

To be fair, Spider-Man may make more money than three Batman movies combined, and Superman looks pretty awful so far.

Spider-Man is more likeable than Batman.

Not to rain on any Batman fans (I LOVE Batman), but Spider-Man and Batman have different methods of how they come across as heroes. Batman's methods employ fear - something that generally isn't kid friendly.

Spider-Man and Batman are both everyday heroes. They both recognize their exceptional status / abilities and use them to maintain the peace.

It's the same way with Superman as well. Comes across as a boy scout, but that's why he's so likeable. He represents everything that is right.

 

[G4life98]

ManaByte For a time, Marvel was doing great. They had a healthy Spider-Man movie franchise and the potential for a healthy X-Men franchise.

Then Daredevil, which was improved upon with the R-rated director's cut.

for as much as it was panned i was a financial success

Then came Hulk, which some loved and others didn't.

see daredevil

Then Elektra...it couldn't be saved.

bad movie but it seems to have turned a profit as well http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=elektra.htm

Now we have Batman Begins and a shitty Fantastic Four coming.

Tom Rothman is allowing his grudge against Bryan Singer drive the X-Men franchise into the ground faster than you can say Shumacher, and Singer is filming a love letter to Richard Donner.

Ghost Rider with Cage as Blaze? :lol

All Marvel has left is Spider-Man 3, which we know will be good because Sony hasn't been retarded as Fox and allowed Raimi to do his thing. And as shocking as it sounds, Artisan may be on the right track with Punisher 2 by setting it in New York with Jigsaw being the villain.

What can Marvel do to turn things around? Right now DC has great animated series based on their characters, and with Nolan on Batman, Singer on Superman, and Whedon on Wonder Woman they seem to have finally grown a brain with their movies.

Will Quesada need to slap someone around?

While marvel movie quality has taken a hit lately most of the movies have went on to do good buisness and I dont really see marvel having that big of a problem making more movies in the furture.

DC has always had the advantage over marvel when it came to television animation because of warner's in house studio and guys like Dini who didni put everyone in powersuits just to sell toys ( im looking at you avengers cartoon).

I eventually see marvel starting their own animation studio, much like the movie distrubution deal they hav with paramount and should help quality by giving them more control.

the movie buisness is big enough for both DC and Marvel.

 

[Rlan]

Marvel had some sort of company for their 1990's animation didn't they? For their X-Men, Spider-Man, Fantastic Four, Iron Man, and Hulk shows?

 

[explodet]

Hey, remember the Avengers and the Silver Surfer animated series?
I think after those fizzled Marvel decided to take a break from shows like that for a while - I think X-Men Evolution was their next series that gained any sort of popularity.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

The X-Factor for DC is V for Vendetta. Assuming that they are involved, that is. I'm not sure how that property was managed.

Likewise, along with Catwoman you had League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, which is ABC and therefore Wildstorm and therefore DC.

 

[Kung Fu Jedi]

To me Marvel is putting too much stuff out. I know they want to leverage all their properties, but some of them are not really all that well known amongst the mainstream audience. For instance, The Punisher, Ghostrider, Iron Fist, and Fantastic Four to an extent. If you asked the average movie goer who Spider-man is, they could tell you his name, and ablities, etc. But outsidt of comic book fans, most people don't know much about the F4.

Superman and Batman are clearly DC's strongest characters, and after running them into the ground in the theater, they are trying to resurrect them. Batman Begins is a great start, and Superman Returns looks like it's on track as well. Rumors have a Flash movie in the works starring Ryan Renolds, who I think would do a great job. I'd also love to see a Green Lantern movie too.

Don't forget, DC has Smallville too, which has helped them on TV. Marvel had that awesome animated Spider-man on MTV, but it disappeared after a season.

Oh, and don't judge F4 until it comes out, who knows it might be decent. I personally do think it looks like shit, but reviews may convince us otherwise.

 

[GG-Duo]

http://www.mtv.com/shared/movies/interviews/a/arad_avi_062005/

 

[borghe]

it should be noted that the problem isn't so much marvel as it is who is in charge of their movies. Sony knows to leave Raimi alone. Fox, as much as Rothman wanted to kill X-Men, Singer prevailed in spite of it, and by the time X2 rolled around Rothman couldn't do too much about the Singer-crew.

at this point I agree that marvel is making too much, and just attaching anyone to the movie they can. the problem is unlike raimi and singer, they aren't getting people who the characters are endearing to or are inspired by. Marvel needs to hold out. They want a Silver Surfer movie? Great, but wait for someone to come along who is dying to do a silver surfer movie.

marvel needs patience. they want a dozen movies in production at any given time, but they then aren't able to monitor the quality closely enough on so many projects. reign it in a little and they'll see it pay off big time.

 

[Ponn]

They want a Silver Surfer movie? Great, but wait for someone to come along who is dying to do a silver surfer movie.

From the interview with Avi it sounds like they have that person lined up and are going to wait for him. To be perfectly honest and really out of character for me and the fact that I love compelling stories, great acting, great scripts and everything else I still am hoping it is someone like Michael Bay. For one it would get his ass away from my goddamn Transformers movie and screwing that up. For the other, Silver Surfer is a pretty easy character. He really doesn't need alot of work in the story part, nowhere near a Spiderman or Batman. The one thing the movie does need and needs alot of is someone that will make it fantastic in the effects department. As much as I hated the prequels because I thought Lucas concentrated too much on effects and CG I actually would like that mentality for the Silver Surfer movie. I could probably watch a good hour of him just surfing through the cosmos if it's done beautiful.

Captain America i'm not sure about. The premise is alright, cause he is a man out of time at first. And i'm sure they have plans for a good half a hour of just him wandering around the city and many laughs at him adjusting. Overall I don't think it can ever be more then just a generic movie.

 

[KidGalactus]

Man, imagine if Dini had let them sell out and made the changed Fox wanted. It's too bad about what happened to the Teen Titans, though. I think the upcoming JLU episode is probably going to be the end of the Dini/Timm DC toons. Timm can kiss my ass for EP on TT.

What's this now?!

 

[Guileless]

Timm can kiss my ass for EP on TT.

Yeah what does that mean?

 

[karasu]

Blade never gets any credit, but it sparked this entire trend!

 

[Forgotten_Taco]

Hey, remember the Avengers and the Silver Surfer animated series?
I think after those fizzled Marvel decided to take a break from shows like that for a while - I think X-Men Evolution was their next series that gained any sort of popularity.

Silver Surfer was actually putty good. The Averngers sucked, I firmly believe an Avengers series without Captain America and Iron Man is destined to be shit.

 

[G4life98]

Silver Surfer was actually putty good. The Averngers sucked, I firmly believe an Avengers series without Captain America and Iron Man is destined to be shit.

Dont forget the very original battle armor all the avenger wore...i was like mattel made the cartoon.

 

[ManaByte]

http://www.mtv.com/shared/movies/interviews/a/arad_avi_062005/

Next up is the August 2006 release of "Ghost Rider," the big-budget Nicolas Cage movie Arad refers to as a "morality tale." The film faces the huge challenge of making a fiery, murderous, flaming-skull-headed creature sympathetic to audiences. Arad says it will have a PG-13 rating and a "Southern rock" soundtrack and ethos, and that one scene will feature the motorcycle-riding protagonist facing the unlikely challenge of a tidal wave.

"I remember seeing 'The Perfect Storm,' how the whole wave was CGI. You're going to see something [similar] in 'Ghost Rider.' " While he reveals that Ghost Rider will, at some point, be entirely submerged, Arad vows that the infamous grinning skull will continue to flame on. "Nothing can extinguish it," he smiles. "It's hellfire."

:lol :lol :lol

"The Ant-Man is also in there, a 'Honey I Shrunk the Superhero' kind of story," Arad says.

:lol

Also in the mix is "Silver Surfer," an ambitious project that Arad insists will move along "pretty fast. Silver Surfer, from a spectacle standpoint, is second to none. It's 'Independence Day' meets Marvel, times 10."

:lol

"Galactus is a force of nature, not a being. That's all I'm saying."

Galactus = THE NOTHING!

As for a sequel to 2004's "The Punisher," Arad confirms that Jigsaw will be the villain and that, with the first movie, "blood and intestines should have been blown out on the wall, because that's the Punisher." He added that the sequel will be among a handful of Marvel films with an R rating.

" 'Punisher,' of course. Maybe 'Cloak and Dagger.' I think 'Shang Chi' we can do PG-13, and 'Iron Fist' maybe an R. 'Luke Cage,' I don't know. Big studio movie. We'll try and do PG-13."

Cloak and Dagger? Shang Chi? Those are massive blockbusters right there, Avi!

Arad says the recent reinvigoration of Batman and DC Comics' upcoming slate of Superman and Wonder Woman movies doesn't scare him. "You know what we are?" Arad says of his company. "We're the best storytellers you'll find. And to us, our characters are alive."

He's lost it.

 

[Forgotten_Taco]

Dont forget the very original battle armor all the avenger wore...i was like mattel made the cartoon.

I had until you reminded me. That show really sucked. Ant-man was the leader as I recall, truly a great man...

Captain America i'm not sure about. The premise is alright, cause he is a man out of time at first. And i'm sure they have plans for a good half a hour of just him wandering around the city and many laughs at him adjusting. Overall I don't think it can ever be more then just a generic movie.

If I was maing a Captain America movie(s) I'd make the first one his entire back story and take place solely in the World War II era. At the end of the movie I'd go with the story from the first issue of Ultimates minus the whole Alien/Skrull angle. In the second movie would be him finding him his place in the world where everyone he ever knew is dead or dying. After you get to know him in the 1st movie his adjusting the present seems more powefull to me.

Still it's hard to make such a corny character like Captain America good, but when you do it's really good. A pity Frank Miller never wrote for him, I remeber really liking Miller's portrayl of Cap' in his Daredevil run.

 

[ManaByte]

 

[Polari]

Spider-Man 2 was honestly a truly dreadful film. Fuck all those "me-too" critics. A superhero movie where said superhero is a whiny bitch throughout the film is NOT OK with me.

On the other hand, Superman and Wonder Woman are both wonderfully superly lame.

Still, Batman and Constantine (funniest movie I've seen this year, seriously, even if they messed it up). DC for the win.

 

[Error]

Also in the mix is "Silver Surfer," an ambitious project that Arad insists will move along "pretty fast. Silver Surfer, from a spectacle standpoint, is second to none. It's 'Independence Day' meets Marvel, times 10."

As for a sequel to 2004's "The Punisher," Arad confirms that Jigsaw will be the villain and that, with the first movie, "blood and intestines should have been blown out on the wall, because that's the Punisher." He added that the sequel will be among a handful of Marvel films with an R rating.

Arad says the recent reinvigoration of Batman and DC Comics' upcoming slate of Superman and Wonder Woman movies doesn't scare him. "You know what we are?" Arad says of his company. "We're the best storytellers you'll find. And to us, our characters are alive."

 

[The Take Out Bandit]

Blade never gets any credit, but it sparked this entire trend!

Word!

Too bad Blade sucked, good thing Blade 2 rocked!

Edit: Oh yeah, Constantine sucked fat dick. But you non-comic reading jabronis wouldn't know that, keep on keepin' on re-re.

 

[Shinobi]

Man, imagine if Dini had let them sell out and made the changed Fox wanted. It's too bad about what happened to the Teen Titans, though. I think the upcoming JLU episode is probably going to be the end of the Dini/Timm DC toons. Timm can kiss my ass for EP on TT.

What's the full story behind this?

 

[Jim Bowie]

Mana, you're slipping. I thought for sure this thread was about this article where Avi Arad lays out plans for about 3 dozen shitty Marvel movies.

Dr. Strange is also in the works
Dr. Strange is also in the works
Dr. Strange is also in the works
Dr. Strange is also in the works
Dr. Strange is also in the works
Dr. Strange is also in the works
Dr. Strange is also in the works
Dr. Strange is also in the works
Dr. Strange is also in the works

Oh my GOD, guys. Dr. Strange.

All I have to say is, if it's Tim Curry, it's the best movie ever.

btw

Remake?!?!

 

[Dan]

What's the full story behind this?

False. Justice League Unlimited is greenlit for a third season of thirteen episodes.

 

[karasu]

Spider-Man 2 was honestly a truly dreadful film. Fuck all those "me-too" critics. A superhero movie where said superhero is a whiny bitch throughout the film is NOT OK with me.

On the other hand, Superman and Wonder Woman are both wonderfully superly lame.

Still, Batman and Constantine (funniest movie I've seen this year, seriously, even if they messed it up). DC for the win.

ugh

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Word!

Too bad Blade sucked, good thing Blade 2 rocked!

Edit: Oh yeah, Constantine sucked fat dick. But you non-comic reading jabronis wouldn't know that, keep on keepin' on re-re.

Wow, I have exactly the opposite opinion.

Blade was good, Blade 2 had a plot hole the size of the moon, not to mention the ugliest digital effects ever.

And Constantine, while fucking with the character a lot, was still quite the good movie. I consider it the Earth-2 version.

 

[lordmrw]

Spider-Man 2 was honestly a truly dreadful film. Fuck all those "me-too" critics. A superhero movie where said superhero is a whiny bitch throughout the film is NOT OK with me.

Someone obviously hasn't read many Spider-Man comics. For a long time Peter was torn over the fact that while he does good as Spider-Man, it fucks up his life as Peter Parker. They absolutely nailed that in the second movie.

 

[Baconäger]

Wonder Woman will suck.